Java Corrupted Saviors [Release 54] [CSDev]

[Kalloi]

I was updating my post quite a bit as I was testing/checking stuff. I have some weird issue where this site is duping part of posts sometimes, might be because I edit shit so much to fix errors. You seem to have caught my post at a weird moment lol.

oh okie, no worries that kind of thing has happened to me quite a bit haha, thanks for clarifying!

The part in bold was a misunderstanding/miscommunication. It says "You can not receive EE for breaking those vulnerabilities", which is partially true, the break itself doesn't give EE, but the friend/rivalry scene afterwards from the break does. That line made me believe that those rivalry/friend scenes would no longer occur at all because they give EE.

ohh I get you now, when I was learning the game I took it in a direct sense and only thought about vulnerabilities and not about the relationship events. But from your explanation of it I can certainly get why you and potentially others got that conclusion as well,

That's good to know that later breaks can fuck up a friendship, I didn't know they were weighted in that way, I think that should be explained for sure. They make it sound like initial relationship fuck ups are pretty bad. There's a lot of shit explained oddly or not at all in this game that can really make it difficult to understand all of the systems. Like I thought friendly relationships were a bigger deal, which pretty drastically changes strategy viability. I thought the only downside to a Chosen starting with her T2 minor broken was that she couldn't benefit from that relationship at that point. I didn't know she could still end up with friendships and the EE from the scene from it. A bunch of shit like that in game adds up and skews things to make things unnecessarily difficult.

Tldr: The game needs a better tutorial. I've proven the guide is too vague on some issues and can be misunderstood, lmao.

I'm glad to have helped out!
Yeah I really agree that the additional part of about the relationship mechanics should be in the guide as well as the potential uses of friendship, I can understand to a degree why the guide is only advertising /talking about rivalries over friendship, especially for newcomers since they impact the order the chosen arrive, the EE of relationship events, the downtime events, and the difficulty of the final battle.
Antipathy can really make the final battle more approachable for people getting there for the first time and in general rivalries are more preferable for newcomers trying to get the first win

But friendship does have it uses, especially when it comes to campaign mode, distortion forsaken, and defeating "pure" chosen in the final battle and turning them into forsaken.

This may be useful only for players who are experienced and don't necessarily need the guide at this point, but I believe at the very least and direct explanation of the relationship is needed

Another thing about relationships:

The only time friendships are permanent is when they have "unbreakable bond/friendship" which is when the game looks at the possible relationship events and realizes that it's no longer possible for the relationship to become negative

ie. if you had 3 positive relationship events and there's 1 only left, the game will realizes this and the two chosen will have an unbreakable friendship.

This same concept is also true in the opposite way for negative events with that relationship making them bitter enemies.

So you have a window until relationships are truly set in stone, distortions also can trigger relationship events as well

Overall I can understand to a degree why the tutorial is written the way it is, the last thing you want to do is overload a newcomer with all the information possible when they should just be given simple objectives to go towards while learning the flow of the game, but in your case where you have a good handle of the flow of the game and now you need/can to learn the specifics of the mechanics, then it ends up only confusing people/giving them the wrong idea like you said.

Some small addendums in the guide like that friendships/rivalries can still be reversed until they have unbreakable bond/bitter enemies and other other things would be really helpful

And also a seperate document or section at the bottom of the guide that details the specifics of most of the mechanics of the game would be really good as well

 

[Kalloi]

What are the raw numbers on Tempt, several hundred million per trauma and several thousand million angst? And once I've tempted 10 times or so, can I finally break Morality/Confidence to set up this Orgy, or are multiple different Aversions not possible and I should reroll.

What do you mean by raw numbers if you don't mind me asking?

The number of times you tempt after the initial tempt only reduce the amount of pleasure needed for to trigger a temptation defeat in the final battle, that's it


If you're asking can you have an aversion and temp on the same chosen, then no you can't do that

You still can't break morality or confidence on a tempted chosen unless you want to ruin the distortion, but it is possible to have different distortions at once like tempt and aversion on two different chosen on the same team

Orgy doesn't actually count towards any t2 break, so as long as you plan it out, you can trigger the conditions for tempt and aversion.

ie. If two chosen are in a broadcast + defiler action and you add the final chosen to it to make an orgy, then it will not count as breaking their t2 dignity/broadcasting on that last chosen since it's an orgy at that point

 

[FruitSmoothie]

Man I wish the game had more viable playstyles and more freedom in what to do. The dev seems to be working on additional endings, but I haven't seen anything mentioned about early/mid game as much. The skill path is pretty linear with everything having prereqs. You end up buying everything up to the 100 tier pretty much always.

I wish I could see exactly how other people play to see if I can spot other playstyles, need some speed run videos, lol. When I play, I feel like I pretty much have to follow a step by step guide and do exactly what the game wants me to do to have time to clear it. Is the game really always that strict? I feel like I can only mess around in maybe the last few days of a run, but some of the New Game + (New City) stuff even reduces the days until the final battle to remove that time. I haven't really seen a viable time to train the Forsaken for example because the main girls would fall behind. Does it get easier in later loops? I found it odd that training the girls uses up a whole day. I thought the Forsaken would be what allows you to have more free time, not less.

Maybe my idea of a "proper game clear" is just too high? I want to always be able to capture all 3 girls. Game would be a lot easier if I was willing to throw 2 of the girls in the trash instead of turning them into Forsaken.

Hmm, might be the highest surround turns I remember getting for a single surround that early. Orgy by day 42ish OP. I've lasted that long before but it usually takes more surrounds.

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[Kalloi]

Man I wish the game had more viable playstyles and more freedom in what to do. The dev seems to be working on additional endings, but I haven't seen anything mentioned about early/mid game as much. The skill path is pretty linear with everything having prereqs. You end up buying everything up to the 100 tier pretty much always.

I wish I could see exactly how other people play to see if I can spot other playstyles, need some speed run videos, lol. When I play, I feel like I pretty much have to follow a step by step guide and do exactly what the game wants me to do to have time to clear it. Is the game really always that strict? I feel like I can only mess around in maybe the last few days of a run, but some of the New Game + (New City) stuff even reduces the days until the final battle to remove that time. I haven't really seen a viable time to train the Forsaken for example because the main girls would fall behind. Does it get easier in later loops? I found it odd that training the girls uses up a whole day. I thought the Forsaken would be what allows you to have more free time, not less.

Maybe my idea of a "proper game clear" is just too high? I want to always be able to capture all 3 girls. Game would be a lot easier if I was willing to throw 2 of the girls in the trash instead of turning them into Forsaken.

Hmm, might be the highest surround turns I remember getting for a single surround. Orgy by day 42ish OP. I've lasted that long before but it usually takes more surrounds.

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I typically aim for corrupting all 3 chosen in playthroughs as well and while it definitely seems like an hard challenge at first, the difficulty lessens significantly as you continue to play, especially if all you want is to corrupt the 3 chosen on a team, in that sense the playstyles have the potential to be formulaic since you can just promote a rivalry between all three chosen and pick up antipathy for a easy final battle.

But the difficulty picks up significantly again once you begin pursuing more and more specific goals.
Having specific objectives like defeating an uncorrupted chosen, defiling a chosen solely by your own commander or defeating a team when they're all friends are the sort of things that reinvent the difficulty curve and your overall playstyles, at least for me anyway.


Personally the mid-late game is always interesting if I aim for a distortion with one or two chosen, doing this makes some upgrades I typically ignore far more viable than even the go to one's like networked consciousness. basically it encourages different playstyles in that sort of way,

For training forsaken and deciding when you have time for it, it also coincides with how comfortable you get with the game,
When you're stockpiling EE for a particular upgrade or commander, a lot of the days in that time feel like fodder days where it's basically a waste to use a commander since you know you're not going to get any good breaks or angst in that time and that could potentially mean one more day of waiting, why not spend those days training your forsaken instead? That's how I see it at least. Same for when a chosen has a large chunk of angst that will lead to a base damage increase, I might as well use that day for training so the next day that extra base damage will payoff. And if I want to focus on training forsaken, I'll just aim for an imago quickening as fast as I can, not expecting convert all 3 for that loop.

In my experiences, try to get the training in early in a campaign, either with an imago quickening or otherwise, later loops do give you more time, but mostly because you're going up against 2 superior chosen at once with increased damage mitigation and you realize you can't do anything until you have some decent EE.

From your recent screenshot and advice, I think you're getting to the point where you have a good grasp of the game so its only a matter of time before you start to optimize your runs and

I would definitely like to see other people's strategies/videos on here or in general because tbh some of the strategies I got was from here, even if it only a small change to my own playstyle.


tl;dr As you get more comfortable with the game, game becomes incredibly easy. But with that ease your objectives will be more specific and in turn, difficult. And from there the difficulty and different playstyles will come from how you can accomplish these objectives without fucking yourself over

 

[Kalloi]

Also new update is out!

 

[subli]

Yeah, big orgies are insane. I remember getting something like 1 500 000 000 000 trauma from a single 10 turn orgy once.

 

[KrazyBob]

What do you mean by raw numbers if you don't mind me asking?

The amount of angst and trauma removed by the +15 energy downtime activity following a tempt action. I assume its A LOT.

Orgy doesn't actually count towards any t2 break, so as long as you plan it out, you can trigger the conditions for tempt and aversion.

For some reason I thought Orgy was just a name given for having all chosen in the same defiler action, rather than its own button.

Going for multiple distortions on prebroken chosen in my first playthrough was always going to be a challenge.

 

[FruitSmoothie]

I typically aim for corrupting all 3 chosen in playthroughs as well and while it definitely seems like an hard challenge at first, the difficulty lessens significantly as you continue to play, especially if all you want is to corrupt the 3 chosen on a team, in that sense the playstyles have the potential to be formulaic since you can just promote a rivalry between all three chosen and pick up antipathy for a easy final battle.

But the difficulty picks up significantly again once you begin pursuing more and more specific goals.
Having specific objectives like defeating an uncorrupted chosen, defiling a chosen solely by your own commander or defeating a team when they're all friends are the sort of things that reinvent the difficulty curve and your overall playstyles, at least for me anyway.


Personally the mid-late game is always interesting if I aim for a distortion with one or two chosen, doing this makes some upgrades I typically ignore far more viable than even the go to one's like networked consciousness. basically it encourages different playstyles in that sort of way,

For training forsaken and deciding when you have time for it, it also coincides with how comfortable you get with the game,
When you're stockpiling EE for a particular upgrade or commander, a lot of the days in that time feel like fodder days where it's basically a waste to use a commander since you know you're not going to get any good breaks or angst in that time and that could potentially mean one more day of waiting, why not spend those days training your forsaken instead? That's how I see it at least. Same for when a chosen has a large chunk of angst that will lead to a base damage increase, I might as well use that day for training so the next day that extra base damage will payoff. And if I want to focus on training forsaken, I'll just aim for an imago quickening as fast as I can, not expecting convert all 3 for that loop.

In my experiences, try to get the training in early in a campaign, either with an imago quickening or otherwise, later loops do give you more time, but mostly because you're going up against 2 superior chosen at once with increased damage mitigation and you realize you can't do anything until you have some decent EE.

From your recent screenshot and advice, I think you're getting to the point where you have a good grasp of the game so its only a matter of time before you start to optimize your runs and

I would definitely like to see other people's strategies/videos on here or in general because tbh some of the strategies I got was from here, even if it only a small change to my own playstyle.


tl;dr As you get more comfortable with the game, game becomes incredibly easy. But with that ease your objectives will be more specific and in turn, difficult. And from there the difficulty and different playstyles will come from how you can accomplish these objectives without fucking yourself over

I have a pretty hard time wasting a turn training Forsaken with how much unresolved trauma girls can recover at certain points in the game. It's not just losing a turn, it's potentially losing EE income, that bugs me. Makes for an even smaller window where training Forsaken is a viable alternative to building trauma. Anybody know the exact math for all the EE income from unresolved trauma btw? If I knew what numbers I don't want the girl to fall under, it would be easier to decide if I can get away with training Forsaken instead. I'm always too scared the EE income is going to drop (Especially starting at the +15 landmark).

I was going to suggest an upgrade that reduces the amount of unresolved trauma the girls heal by at end turn, but that could also fuck up them reducing minor vuln trauma you might want them to reduce... Bleh.

I do wait for Networked Consciousness, that's about the only mid game upgrade I find exciting, the rest are meh. I mean, in some comps Reality Sealing can get up to 20% or so reliably, but it's usually more like 5-10% if you're trying to train all 3 girls at the same time in every battle. I usually don't reserve my EE completely for anything else until end game. I mean, I only spend about 5-7 EE a turn mid game, so I still have an income coming in and get to all the shit eventually.

 

[wibblywarble]

I can't for the life of me seem to get a 10 turn orgy going. The highest I've gotten is 7. I'm going for a innocence/dignity distortion. Any general advice for getting one that lasts that long? I've given them SO much trauma, I have a +47 damage bonus and pretty much all the upgrades. I just can't get a 10 turn orgy going.

 

[picobyte]

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is out.
Edit: ah, beat met to it.

Also new update is out!

 

[subli]

I can't for the life of me seem to get a 10 turn orgy going. The highest I've gotten is 7. I'm going for a innocence/dignity distortion. Any general advice for getting one that lasts that long? I've given them SO much trauma, I have a +47 damage bonus and pretty much all the upgrades. I just can't get a 10 turn orgy going.

A strong commander with 2 extra captures, and networked consciousness. Use the extra captures on the other two chosen, prioritize keeping all three surrounded all the time, even at the expense of not doing all the surround actions you might want with each one.

 

[wibblywarble]

A strong commander with 2 extra captures, and networked consciousness. Use the extra captures on the other two chosen, prioritize keeping all three surrounded all the time, even at the expense of not doing all the surround actions you might want with each one.

I tried that but I couldn't quite get it to work. I made sure to hit each of them with a strong commander and tried to keep them as tied up as possible constantly, they barely had any time to do anything. I'm not quite sure how the duration of the orgy is calculated.

 

[subli]

I tried that but I couldn't quite get it to work. I made sure to hit each of them with a strong commander and tried to keep them as tied up as possible constantly, they barely had any time to do anything. I'm not quite sure how the duration of the orgy is calculated.

When you start doing the same defiler action that's already in use (whether with two girls or a full orgy) they all escape when the first one would escape. So if there's 12 turns left until one escapes, 10 turns until one and 8 turns until the third escapes then it would be 8 turns until they all escape.

 

[wibblywarble]

When you start doing the same defiler action that's already in use (whether with two girls or a full orgy) they all escape when the first one would escape. So if there's 12 turns left until one escapes, 10 turns until one and 8 turns until the third escapes then it would be 8 turns until they all escape.

Gotcha, I think I was under the incorrect assumption that it merged the total surround durations into a lower number or something. That knowledge should help.

 

[FruitSmoothie]

When you start doing the same defiler action that's already in use (whether with two girls or a full orgy) they all escape when the first one would escape. So if there's 12 turns left until one escapes, 10 turns until one and 8 turns until the third escapes then it would be 8 turns until they all escape.

I was wondering why the fuck they'd all cancel so quickly. I thought there was just a naturally high chance for them to cancel it or it could automatically cancel when extermination was finished or something. Add it to the list of things not explained well, damn. Combine that with some of the girls being able to break out of surrounds with detonate or reduce the amount of time the other girls are surrounded for, and orgies are a nightmare to pull off later on. I'm sure there's some condition or exception with how those abilities work I'm not aware of as well : p

This bullshit, 3+7 surround turns gone.

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Did this just for how obnoxious it is to make these 3 have a long term orgy. I think I'm going to break shit I don't want broken yet so I can't keep the save, but it was worth it. Actually it might work out since I've already started working on breaking Vassal's final Innocence Core, wow. I was just trying to be a dick here, I didn't realize I'd pretty much already set up the finale with rivalries already, lmao. Hopefully she beats her current friend to breaking it cause I want to keep this.

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Did I break the game or is there some limit to how many T3's can unlock per day to be broken? All the girls should have unlocked the ability to break their T3 from that, but they're still showing "Reach 10.0G", even though they have 10.0P+, lol. Is this what happens when you completely skip over G's and go to P's in unresolved trauma in one day? Shit, now I don't want to continue in case this is a bug. Well at least now I know turn end EE is tied into the highest level of vuln broken because all these girls still only get +15 EE each instead of +30 EE even with all that unresolved trauma (Unless it's tied to the remaining days or something, who knows).

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P.S: Not sure if it's a bug, but the back button can disappear in some cases. Might have something to do with the other two girls being captured and not having moves, but I'd like to examine the captured girls sometimes. Gotta check if I need to retreat/cancel the gangbang before they break stuff sometimes.

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[daru]

Read guide, read tips, played 3 campaigns, failed all of them...
Every time I play this I get tilted, idk what I'm supposed to do.

 

[subli]

What exactly is going wrong?

 

[wibblywarble]

How do you increase the resolve damage multiplier before the final battle? I noticed some have things like 1% and some have 4%, but I have no idea how to increase it.

 

[subli]

Breaking T4 vulnerabilities I think

 

[daru]

What exactly is going wrong?

Everything? idk, can't break vulnerabilities or do anything.
Maybe I should try single player with cheats, just to see stuff