Can you give some general training advice? I haven’t read the training guide but I plan to, but any info it doesn’t cover that can be explained?
Java Corrupted Saviors [Release 56] [CSDev]
sorry I’m late to respond to this, but why do some of my chosen have two categories of resolve that can be broken while light only has one? They all have at least one tier 4 break.
- Mar 20, 2019
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No worries! If things are still based on your screenshots then the reason is that t4 morality breaks affect the resolve damage of the other chosen on the team
Since you have all the upgrades unlocked including "Attack +" thats the 1% damage youre seeing Light
"Threaten +" on the other hand affects the other two chosen besides the chosen you impregnated
ie. Since Light is impregnated, Fairy and Reaper will take Resolve damage from threaten +, not Light.
If Fairy was the one impregnated though, Light and Reaper would take resolve damage from threaten + instead.
tl;dr Light's impregnation is why, it wont affect her personally, but it affects her teammates and that's what you're seeing besides the Attack + one
- Mar 20, 2019
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One personal tip I would give to anyone playing campaign mode is on the first loop to try and t4 dignity break the chosen that has dignity as her minor vulnerability, if you do so and convert her to an forsaken she will have a really high disgrace (around the 65+ range) and from there, try to get her to a two damage fighting style like Wild (INJU/EXPO). if you're lucky she might come with that style already, otherwise train INJU and EXPO expertise on her as much as you can. Like guy231 said forsaken around 70% you'll get some low cost forsaken and for me that is really beneficial since you have an 4+ commander with decent damage as early as day 10 or sooner if you conserve EE in preparation of using the forsaken instead of early game upgrades.
Another thing for distortion forsaken, especially tempted forsaken, is try to promote a friendship with them and one or two of their teammates, this way you can train them without breaking them, or in tempted forsaken case, losing their bonus since they'll be more accepting in consideration for their friends. Its one of the reasons why I don't view positive relationship between chosen a bad thing like when I initially played the game, have to be more careful about who you sacrifice tho
- Mar 20, 2019
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Hearing your advice about tempting chosen with dignity minor and confidence core is really helpful! I've always wanted to do more with my tempted forsaken so I want to try this out myself ty!
I apologize for asking so many questions, but the training guide didn’t seem to cover everything. When you say break them, what do you mean? Also, I’ve noticed when messing around in cheat mode to just get a feel for what training is like that no matter what I tried I couldn’t quite get anyone to high hostility or any of the other corruption values really high (I know higher isn’t better necessarily, I just wanted to try).
I’m still not sure I really fully get the training process. Definitely needs a comprehensive tutorial at somepoint.
Do you know what the obedience bonus for having a chosen with a friend is? I'm trying to figure out exactly how much deviancy I can give a tempted forsaken and still get them to learn the tempt defiler action.Hearing your advice about tempting chosen with dignity minor and confidence core is really helpful! I've always wanted to do more with my tempted forsaken so I want to try this out myself ty!
- Mar 20, 2019
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It varies from how well you're treating their friends and their relationship beforehand, When they're at unbreakable friendship and just captured its 20+ obedience bonus per friend, if you treat their friend well that increases and if you treat their friend awful then it gives an obedience bonus because they want you to spare them, I need to go back to my other saves and see the max it will go but I know that sacrifcing their friend gives you -99 obedience debuff or something close to that range
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- Mar 20, 2019
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No worries! I agree the training guide doesn't cover everything so I'm happy to share what I know from experience, maybe after I have some free time after working on the art pack and my mod I will try to make a forsaken training tutorial with some saves to help out
When I mean break them I mean like getting their vulnerability to the next tier when they were chosen,
ie. Inseminating a chosen for the first time is breaking their t2 morality, Broadcasting the chosen for the first time is breaking their t2 dignity, hypnotizing the chosen is breaking their t4 innocence, those sorts of things you do through your battle against them
If you want someone to have high hostility, you can get them at a high starting point if you break that chosen's t4 morality (break all their morality vulnerabilities, get them to do violence-t1, inseminate them-t2,get them to slaughter-t3,impregnate them-t4)
and the second thing is try to do this to a chosen who has morality as a minor vulnerability, this will guarantee some high values corruption values when they become a forsaken,
the same process can be used for the other corruption values like Obedience, Dignity, Deviancy, and their vulnerability counterparts Confidence, Disgrace, Innocence
From actual training, it may sound redundant but try to do actions that raise hostility only pick hostility based actions if you can, doing the last tier of training actions (the one's that gives the forsaken their defiler abilities) usually gives an high amount from the first action, but the third tier of training actions can do this pretty well also
Each training action you do has value attached to it like the Force Orgasm training action (70% Deviancy 60% Obedience)
If that value is way higher than the forsaken's corruption it usually increases that forsaken't corruption otherwise, doing other training actions that raise deviancy after forces orgasm will add on top of that 70% Deviancy, you can see all this in training menus where it says
"Current Intensity/Current Corruption"
Basically, raise the current intensity higher than the current corruption and you will typically raise their corruption values
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I also ran into a situation where my Forsaken ran out of motivation to do anything and training them became impossible. Systems a little complex compared to the demon comanders tbh, who you just throw into a fight and they do ridiculous multipliers from the start.
Forsaken system is extremely repetitive, boring and slow, so I just kind of ignore it until it gets better.
One thing about training is that it's much easier to use as something to round out a chosen that you made in campaign to be a specific way, rather than training a forsaken from scratch. For example, here is a forsaken I ended up with a while back:
You might think that this is a great result, but there's some issues:
1. This tempted chosen has no friend. Because of this, even if you raise her obedience to 39%, she can't learn the tempt defiler actions.
2. Deviancy is so high it's actually not possible for this chosen to be trained to increase her obedience or disgrace high enough to make up for the low obedience even if you could fight every single training action into one session.
So while this forsaken seems great, because of decisions made during the campaign it's actually not possible to train her to learn the special defiler actions. It's important to plan out your chosen during the campaign to end up with forsaken that are close to what you want, and then train them to round out rough spots. It's often not possible or at least not practical to train a forsaken into anything you want from scratch.
You might think that this is a great result, but there's some issues:
1. This tempted chosen has no friend. Because of this, even if you raise her obedience to 39%, she can't learn the tempt defiler actions.
2. Deviancy is so high it's actually not possible for this chosen to be trained to increase her obedience or disgrace high enough to make up for the low obedience even if you could fight every single training action into one session.
So while this forsaken seems great, because of decisions made during the campaign it's actually not possible to train her to learn the special defiler actions. It's important to plan out your chosen during the campaign to end up with forsaken that are close to what you want, and then train them to round out rough spots. It's often not possible or at least not practical to train a forsaken into anything you want from scratch.
- Nov 7, 2019
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I know people have done early game guides before but it seems like there's an influx of new players so I figured I would start doing a day-by-day. I only had time to do through Day 3 for now but I'll try to add on when there's time if this sort of thing is helpful.
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Is Tempting bugged in the latest release? I have a Chosen who supposedly I should be able to Tempt, but I can't get it to trigger. Look at Paladin in this save. Also, I haven't tickled/sodomized her, but if I use a Suppressor/Defiler she detonates. Is confidence secretly broken on her or something?
- Mar 20, 2019
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EDIT: CSDev just sent a message after looking at your save and telling me the issue I had with tempted chosen was dealt with some time ago so disregard this post if you've read this lmao
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- Oct 14, 2020
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I'm planning on adding a cheat which gives you all the achievement bonuses from campaign mode (even in a single play game), so the bonuses there might not feel quite as overpowered as having infinite EE. Regarding Forsaken, they're meant to be the main way that you get stronger in later loops in campaign mode. It can be hard to make a regular Forsaken that's better than an equivalent Demon Commander, but once you start getting Superior Forsaken (and the later Forsaken types that aren't implemented yet), they'll be much stronger.
The relationship system actually doesn't distinguish gameplay-wise between Chosen whose tier 2s you broke and Chosen whose tier 2s came pre-broken.
The guide probably over-emphasizes how important relationships are because of how, in the original Release 1, trying to create rivalries was pretty much the only interesting goal the players could set for themselves. In the current version, friendships and rivalries each have their own benefits and drawbacks, so you can pick based on what your goals are (and based on your personal taste). Rivalries give you more EE, but it's only about a day's worth. In other words, if you're having to delay your plans by more than a day, or if you want to use both Chosen as leverage against each other to make them more obedient as Forsaken, or if you think that the extra hesitation turns might benefit you more than the decreased Resolve in the final battle, then it's a completely legitimate choice to deliberately make them friends.
Kalloi is correct about what you need to do to set up an Orgy between a Tempt Chosen and a soon-to-be-Aversion Chosen. As for the raw numbers on the Tempt downtime, it's 1 billion of each trauma and 10 billion ANGST. It can be up to double that if two Chosen who like each other do the downtime together, and it can be doubled again if all three Chosen like each other and do it together. It's also subject to the Luxuries multiplier in campaign mode.
The exact formula for downtime decisions is complicated and involves factors like "how much do I like my partner and how much do I want to do the action she's doing, and is her ANGST bigger enough than mine that I should be helping her out?" However, as a rule of thumb, every point of ANGST is worth 1/10 of a point of trauma for the calculation. This means that if the added ANGST yesterday is more than 10 times the trauma they resolved with their last action, then they're actually more likely to do sinful actions today, even if you don't damage them at all.
Only one can unlock per day, but the others will keep getting unlocked on subsequent days. This is meant to give the player a little more control over the order of the breaks. So, for example, if you've got a Chosen with Minor Morality and Core Innocence, and they're sitting at 15T FEAR and 12T DISG after a big Orgy, you might be able to use the last few turns of combat to Slime them and get their DISG higher so that Innocence breaks first.
This, on the other hand, is a bug I forgot to fix. It'll be fixed in the next version.
I think the main issue here is that the system is suffering from a lack of actions to use. Ideally, T3 Mor Chosen should be fine with having dominant, sadistic sex with you, T3 Con Chosen should be submissive even if they aren't sexual, and T3 Dig Chosen should be huge teases even if they don't like you enough to go further. But the actions to get those ideas across aren't implemented yet. It'll get better as more gets added.
I'm late with this, but thanks for the bug report. Kalloi brought it to my attention so I could fix it in 29b.
Unfortunately, I don't even know how I'd go about programming an auto update feature.
Very nice little writeup. To add to this, Forsaken at 0% Disgrace start out at a 1000 EE cost (which is obviously absurd). It gets cut in half for every +10% Disgrace. Forsaken damage also decreases linearly with Disgrace down to zero damage at 100% Disgrace. So, going from 80% Disgrace to 90% Disgrace cuts both the EE cost and the damage in half. Going from 70% Disgrace to 80% Disgrace cuts the EE cost by half but the damage only by a third. The ideal tradeoff between cost and damage will vary depending on where you are in the loop, which is why it's good to keep Forsaken with various Disgrace levels around.
I can answer this as well. It's the downtime action that determines how much EE you get, and the downtime action is picked before the damage is resolved (because the choice of downtime action is what determines how much damage is resolved).
It looks like you dealt enough TICK damage to break her T3 Confidence, but it isn't actually broken until she uses Detonate. If you Tempt her before she Detonates, then she'll be set on the Temptation path and she'll stop wanting to use Detonate. But managing to Tempt her without using a Commander capture might be tricky. Basic Commanders (meaning non-Forsaken ones without Suppressors, Defilers, or Punishers) don't trigger Detonate, so that might be your best bet.
So, I used a basic commander, using the same tactic that I've used in previous games to get Tempt going (unlock fantasize, wait until they fantasize themselves to 100k pleasure). In this screenshot, you can see the examine feature shows that Tempt is still available (she hasn't detonated). In the second screenshot, I try to surround her with 100k pleasure and Tempt isn't available.
- Oct 14, 2020
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You're right, that's a bug. I believe I've found what's happening here. The option menu for having the Thralls take an action immediately after a surround doesn't share the same code as the normal one, and the bug is in that menu specifically. If you do a different action this turn, then the Tempt option should show up next turn. Sorry for the trouble, it'll be fixed in the next version.
How exactly does personality effect a Forsaken’s Fighting Style? I kinda wanted to make one with a PLEA Fighting Style so I created and Tempted a Superior Chosen.
He started with PLEA/EXPO style so I unlocked him for Single Play and I did a lot of training to increase his PLEA and decrease his EXPO but even at 81K PLEA and 30K EXPO his style still won’t change.
Would I have to Hypnotize a Chosen to get the Fighting Style I want?
He started with PLEA/EXPO style so I unlocked him for Single Play and I did a lot of training to increase his PLEA and decrease his EXPO but even at 81K PLEA and 30K EXPO his style still won’t change.
Would I have to Hypnotize a Chosen to get the Fighting Style I want?