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Kaitol

Newbie
Jul 29, 2017
92
96
Mmmm. Run into a bit of a wall in this triple distortion run at day 22, 2x4 or 5 vanilla commander can't get any defiles to break the last couple of T2's, only making 9 EE a day and can't generate enough angst to progress Fury or Shield more than a few percent towards generating 5 EE. Should I just pass days to buy upgrades so I can field a beefy enough commander to possibly brute force them? Don't have a clue how I'm going to hit some of the final requirements yet either.
corr1.png
 

Sinistrem

Member
Feb 18, 2018
193
403
Okay, so I've pinpointed the problem with my forsaken's portrait.

After downloading an external portrait pack it turns out that the game tries to call "smug" and "used" portraits, which don't exist in vanilla, resulting in black squares. After adding those missing portraits the game now works fine, although having a mix between vanilla and modded portraits feels less than ideal.

Why does that happen only with one specific forsaken while the rest work fine? Why did it start happening mid run? I'll never know.
I'm not even sure whether I should report it as a bug or something.
Maybe the game should have a check that allows those extra portrait types to be utilized by modders but use other portraits available in vanilla when no external portrait pack is available (i.e. using lewd instead of used if used is not present, using joy/focus instead of smug if smug is not present). Although it's weird that none of my forsaken use the neutral portraits, you'd expect that to be the most common one but they all seem to either be scared shitless or smug like they own the place.
 
Nov 9, 2022
20
53
Maybe the game should have a check that allows those extra portrait types to be utilized by modders but use other portraits available in vanilla when no external portrait pack is available (i.e. using lewd instead of used if used is not present, using joy/focus instead of smug if smug is not present)
That is indeed what it's supposed to do; Forsaken are supposed to replace Lewd with Used and Joy with Smug if those portraits are found. Definitely a bug. Immediate fix would be to copy Lewd and Joy and renamed them Used and Smug so you don't have two different portrait styles.
 
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Sonsuka

Member
Aug 29, 2017
198
74
You know, I just realized. QOL add. the arrows binded to the left and right on keyboard <- -> would be hella nice especially when you have multiple pages of forsaken or adding custom Chosen. Very low on the totem pole of things needed, but would be nice quick add.
 

dekeche

Member
Aug 5, 2018
163
71
is this worth trying?
If you like strategy and corruption, it's good. Might be a little complicated at first, but that largely comes from needing to figure out how to use the tools you've been given to accomplish the set goals. I think the .txt files do a decent job of outlining what those tools are, what the obstacles you'll face are, and what your goals are. What's lacking is an exact "how to" guide on everything.

A little tip for starting out; a good early game goal is to get a basic 4 duration, 2 capture commander out on day 12. Being able to surround chosen early on and buff their trauma and circumstance levels up allows you to play them off of eachother. Which gives you a good opportunity to break T1 and T2 vulnerabilities. So, it's a fairly important early game goal and milestone to reach for. And it's easy enough to achieve - just get and keep each chosen at >200 angst after a battle, and make each battle last as long as possible (Chosen appear based on turns taken, and days past. Longer battles = more chosen earlier = more EE gain between battles.)
 

Kaitol

Newbie
Jul 29, 2017
92
96
Starting to think a loop 1 triple distortion might be too much for me. Their vulns are all set and I can activate one around day 40, but if I do it makes another impossible. If I tempt one, it makes negotiation impossible by zeroing her angst. If I negotiate with the other, it causes a rivalry between the tempted and the negotiator which delays her arrival so long I can't get the orgasm+ combo going.

Don't even want to think about how I'd get a 15 turn surround for rampancy on someone so resistant to PLEA and PAIN when I'm so far behind the economy curve.
 

alex2011

Conversation Conqueror
Feb 28, 2017
7,716
4,461
Starting to think a loop 1 triple distortion might be too much for me. Their vulns are all set and I can activate one around day 40, but if I do it makes another impossible. If I tempt one, it makes negotiation impossible by zeroing her angst. If I negotiate with the other, it causes a rivalry between the tempted and the negotiator which delays her arrival so long I can't get the orgasm+ combo going.

Don't even want to think about how I'd get a 15 turn surround for rampancy on someone so resistant to PLEA and PAIN when I'm so far behind the economy curve.
Try getting an aversion, it seemed pretty easy to pull a triple distortion win on compared to others. I have only managed a double distortion and single normal combined triple win with temptation. I have avoided rampancy entirely because of the damage they inflict on my thrall count and negotiation has been hit or miss with getting a double distortion one death win or a loss because the other two got away.

As for getting move+ combos like force orgasm+, try to extend your battles by getting as many longer captures and surrounds as you can to raise the chance of having two or more Chosen ready to be surrounded and to keep any on the battlefield busy so they can't finish the extermination. I have also noticed it buffs the number of turns if you repeatedly pull the same surround action multiple times. Example, I recently had a battle where the first force orgasm lasted one turn, but the next one shot all the way up to 21.
 

Khaitoh

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2018
1,302
859
So, manage to re-do my save from Day 1 and Broke all 3 (Muwehehehe).
Only Steadfast was Distorted since the other 2 with some vuls broken deemed it impossible. (Since I needed to break their Cores for Day 15 Event.)

Anyways, I know Day 15 is equal to how many Core Vuls are broken, but what about Day 30 and 45?

Next would be about Forsakens.

Also about corruption from training, is Hostility increase non-existent? Most training only Increase Obedience, some Deviancy and a very few for Disgrace. What contributes to this? Also what contributes to a Forsaken's starting corruption level in the first place?

About the Punisher effect, does Earnest Breeder means the targetted Chosen would have up to -40% Hostility when they become a Forsaken?

Also would ask about Training Intensity and Modifiers since they sometimes doesn't reflect what's stated in training guide.txt in some cases but would need some testing done. Like, if they Increase Obedience and Disgrace, they should Increase Inju and Expo respectively right? But why would sometimes they would take Points from Hate / Plea too, and sometimes don't?
Was it supposed to be explained by this line:

"Also would ask about Training Intensity and Modifiers since they sometimes doesn't reflect what's stated in training guide.txt in some cases but would need some testing done. Like, if they Increase Obedience and Disgrace, they should Increase Inju and Expo respectively right? But why would sometimes they would take Points from Hate / Plea too, and sometimes don't?
"

since I didn't get it XD

Would also ask why is it importing always starts at Day 1. Does it only save the Chosen you would encounter (order of second and first might differ iirc)? If yes, why isn't there a multi-delete function so I can have a save of Loop 1 Day 1 instead of deleting 20+ saves one by one. Is this because the game is somehow heavily-tied with Save.SAV? I mean I somehow got my save before corrupted (mainly reason I had to re-do my run tbh) and a corrupted save makes it that there's only blank space after running both Exe and App file. So I guess the game first checks the Save File and then "loads" it whether it was successful or not, else it would create the game's base "settings" and make a Save.SAV file. Not really sure if that's just how Java Games are tbh though XD
 

Sonsuka

Member
Aug 29, 2017
198
74
Try getting an aversion, it seemed pretty easy to pull a triple distortion win on compared to others. I have only managed a double distortion and single normal combined triple win with temptation. I have avoided rampancy entirely because of the damage they inflict on my thrall count and negotiation has been hit or miss with getting a double distortion one death win or a loss because the other two got away.

As for getting move+ combos like force orgasm+, try to extend your battles by getting as many longer captures and surrounds as you can to raise the chance of having two or more Chosen ready to be surrounded and to keep any on the battlefield busy so they can't finish the extermination. I have also noticed it buffs the number of turns if you repeatedly pull the same surround action multiple times. Example, I recently had a battle where the first force orgasm lasted one turn, but the next one shot all the way up to 21.
Redoing my Run^ I agree. I did a negotiation and 2x temptation first loop, triple aversion second, doing 1 temptation 2 aversion on third. These combo all work. The third one is a little harder to do and you got finesse the orgy with forced orgasm on the temptation chosen for the 10k INJU and do it third.
 
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Sonsuka

Member
Aug 29, 2017
198
74
Also for CSDEV. I was just wondering, have you considered doing "unique" or like different demon lords you can choose at beginning of campaign. Like some might get a *small* bonus to one action over the others and then the default one. I know you can "create" any body technically so it is unneeded really, but would be kinda cool to choose between different Demonlord and they would get different minions like tentacle one would get tentacle minions to appeal to different people. Of course that does sound like a pain text wise though.
 

alex2011

Conversation Conqueror
Feb 28, 2017
7,716
4,461
Also for CSDEV. I was just wondering, have you considered doing "unique" or like different demon lords you can choose at beginning of campaign. Like some might get a *small* bonus to one action over the others and then the default one. I know you can "create" any body technically so it is unneeded really, but would be kinda cool to choose between different Demonlord and they would get different minions like tentacle one would get tentacle minions to appeal to different people. Of course that does sound like a pain text wise though.
From what I can tell, the demon lord is never really defined as a separate being. The demon lord exists separately lore wise, but every time a description comes up, it is always while using a created body which can already serve the purpose you described depending on exactly what upgrades you give a commander body (not sure if the approach/meet interaction bodies are commanders or not, so I didn't describe them as commanders).

Also glad you got the distortion thing worked out.
 

Kaitol

Newbie
Jul 29, 2017
92
96
So, one thing I've always wondered about and was recently reminded of, it's implied that a pregnancy between a Chosen and a Demon Lord is special, but you never get to see one come to fruition, because if the mother becomes a Forsaken it just turns into a regular demon, and if she's a sole survivor she gets neutralized. Is that ever intended to be expanded on or will it always stay a vague life-ending threat to horrify Chosen with?
 
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alex2011

Conversation Conqueror
Feb 28, 2017
7,716
4,461
So, one thing I've always wondered about and was recently reminded of, it's implied that a pregnancy between a Chosen and a Demon Lord is special, but you never get to see one come to fruition, because if the mother becomes a Forsaken it just turns into a regular demon, and if she's a sole survivor she gets neutralized. Is that ever intended to be expanded on or will it always stay a vague life-ending threat to horrify Chosen with?
If the mother doesn't become a Forsaken, the consequences are the military has the pregnancy aborted, killing the mother if necessary to abort the pregnancy. I actually had my aversion win with all three getting pregnant and turning on the military to prevent it, destroying military bases all the way up to the final battle to prevent the military getting to them. Then it was only a matter of winning the final battle, which was easy.

Impregnated Chosen have a scene where they basically panic about it that explains in their words what the military will do if they find out the Chosen are pregnant with the demon lord's child.

There's not much to expand on here, it would have to be rewritten so that either the military doesn't kill the pregnant Chosen or the demons born to Forsaken mothers would need a bit more writing and some gameplay mechanics to allow them to be anything other than lore.


It does make me wonder something about the developer's thoughts on the situation, though. CSdev At the point where they are basically already fighting their own side, would it not just be an instant win even without doing the final battle? Shouldn't that just automatically convert them on the day they turn against the military to protect their own lives? I know that might sound unbalanced, but it is already somewhat difficult to get their barrier down and impregnate them anyway, so maybe that can serve as the counter, the difficulty in getting them pregnant could make for an interesting win condition.
 
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Sinistrem

Member
Feb 18, 2018
193
403
How do forsaken damage bonuses work with multipliers?
I assume that both disgrace/reputation and expertise damage values are just multipliers (I.e. if you have x1.5 damage from disgrace and x1.5 damage from expertise it will result in 1.5*1.5=2.25 damage multi), but what about stuff like "+50% damage " from superior forsaken bonus or "+50% plea/inju" from negotiation distortion?

Are those extra multipliers like:

total_damage = disgrace_multi * expertise_multi * superior_multi * distortion_multi

or are they added like

total_damage = (disgrace_multi * expertise_multi) + superior_multi + negotiation_multi
 
Sep 10, 2019
37
31
having scenes in the archive is great - now all I need is a cheat option that unlocks all of them for a saved set of chosen becasue I'm still way too dumb to play this game
 

Khaitoh

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2018
1,302
859
If the mother doesn't become a Forsaken, the consequences are the military has the pregnancy aborted, killing the mother if necessary to abort the pregnancy. I actually had my aversion win with all three getting pregnant and turning on the military to prevent it, destroying military bases all the way up to the final battle to prevent the military getting to them. Then it was only a matter of winning the final battle, which was easy.

Impregnated Chosen have a scene where they basically panic about it that explains in their words what the military will do if they find out the Chosen are pregnant with the demon lord's child.

There's not much to expand on here, it would have to be rewritten so that either the military doesn't kill the pregnant Chosen or the demons born to Forsaken mothers would need a bit more writing and some gameplay mechanics to allow them to be anything other than lore.


It does make me wonder something about the developer's thoughts on the situation, though. CSdev At the point where they are basically already fighting their own side, would it not just be an instant win even without doing the final battle? Shouldn't that just automatically convert them on the day they turn against the military to protect their own lives? I know that might sound unbalanced, but it is already somewhat difficult to get their barrier down and impregnate them anyway, so maybe that can serve as the counter, the difficulty in getting them pregnant could make for an interesting win condition.
I believe lore-wise is that, even if they do destroy their city's military, the other Chosen, specially the Superior Ones or that One Chosen who "appears" during the "event" when 2 Chosen became Forsaken and one dying, would kill them even if they haven't fallen yet if they intend to give birth to the demons. So why not just abort them then? what I think the plausible cause is that you can't unless you kill the mother. The biggest question still is, why does the Demon becomes a normal one after the mother Becomes Forsaken when they got Impregnated as a Chosen... Why did the change only happens on birth?
The most plausible reason I can think of is the Demon child "adapts" to whatever the Mother can take as a safe delivery thus somehow getting weaker after their Mothers become Forsaken.

Lore-wise, what I can think that could happen is, Demon Lord just "Captures" the 3 Chosens and make them breeding stocks, which will only make stronger Demons, which without the Commander upgrades should probably just be like a Normal Commander. Now, what would that put on the table? a Limited Number of Commanders per birth that has the base stats of one with at most 2 surround turn captures like a base commander with upgrade (without the other addons). What's different from it from a created Commander is they don't die the next day unless killed by the Chosen. Now, non-game mechanic-wise, you now have an Army of Demons that can surround the Chosen Ones into infinity and Beyond if one base commander with upgrades can catch and keep them surrounded for 2 turns, imagine getting them surround by groups of them, and an Orgy is guaranteed by the time the third one appears lol. But even with that, they still seem underwhelming to be a threat for the Chosen to be confined by the Military and all, Unless what they can give Birth is YOUR Perfect Demon Lord Body with all Suppresor, Defiler and Punisher upgrades in one which can capture a Chosen until they are a broken pile of used goods you can just kill which you can theoretically can do in the first place but just decided to make it fun and entertain yourself by corrupting the Chosens.

So yeah, the game is basically just you trying to corrupt the Chosen within 50 days, and failing just makes you jump in an parallel timeline to start over again since you ain't a sore loser who would just destroy the world thus having to face new Chosen with a Chance of facing the same ones. :HideThePain:
So yeah, basically the Demons born from a Chosen are just plot holes of the story, like how you restart from Scratch upon entering a new city.
Bet the Demon Lord, You, is also the one who informed people that a Demon and a Chosen's Baby would bring disaster to the world just for the lols when the Military turn against the Chosen, and vice versa.

Just started Loop 2 and now I'm in a dilemma on how to break their core vuls before Day 15 Event without breaking their Distortion Plan. I really think what makes this game hard is, in the way that the game tries to make this balanced by if one is weak against certain types, the other would be stronger, sometimes results in a combination where one can be easily re-surrounded, while others fail on getting enough trauma for the next one. So keeping them surrounded is the hardest part xD
Still, overcoming this is a worthy challenge! Or maybe not. It's complicated :HideThePain: (HELP!)
 
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Kaitol

Newbie
Jul 29, 2017
92
96
how to break their core vuls before Day 15 Event without breaking their Distortion Plan.
That's the fun part of distortions. You often can't. Out of like, six distortions so far only one had it line up to flub the interview. Basically you have to give up on hitting the milestones and have poor EE generation in return for only needing two T2 breaks to "beat" a girl. There are items that make it easier. A single negotiation or rampancy distortion can win you a run though even if you're completely incapable of hitting resolve normally, just have her kill whoever it makes her hate than exploit the distortion.
 

alex2011

Conversation Conqueror
Feb 28, 2017
7,716
4,461
I believe lore-wise is that, even if they do destroy their city's military, the other Chosen, specially the Superior Ones or that One Chosen who "appears" during the "event" when 2 Chosen became Forsaken and one dying, would kill them even if they haven't fallen yet if they intend to give birth to the demons. So why not just abort them then? what I think the plausible cause is that you can't unless you kill the mother. The biggest question still is, why does the Demon becomes a normal one after the mother Becomes Forsaken when they got Impregnated as a Chosen... Why did the change only happens on birth?
The most plausible reason I can think of is the Demon child "adapts" to whatever the Mother can take as a safe delivery thus somehow getting weaker after their Mothers become Forsaken.

Just started Loop 2 and now I'm in a dilemma on how to break their core vuls before Day 15 Event without breaking their Distortion Plan. I really think what makes this game hard is, in the way that the game tries to make this balanced by if one is weak against certain types, the other would be stronger, sometimes results in a combination where one can be easily re-surrounded, while others fail on getting enough trauma for the next one. So keeping them surrounded is the hardest part xD
Still, overcoming this is a worthy challenge! Or maybe not. It's complicated :HideThePain: (HELP!)
That actually adds to the reasons to join the demon lord, not only is the military against the current loop's Chosen, but those Chosen would also be fighting other teams if they manage to survive long enough and I bet those other Chosen would come in increasingly stronger teams as each is beaten down until the pregnant ones are neutralized. As far as we know, the only one who can beat a Chosen besides another Chosen (this includes Forsaken) is the demon lord. From what I can tell, the pregnant Chosen are going off of instinct at that point, specifically survival and motherly instinct, which tells them to do whatever it takes to protect their child and themselves. At the point of pregnancy, at least the last time I managed it, they were already worn down to aversion distortion level with active distortions, so I don't know if they would have done the same with just being where they were on vulnerabilities without the distortion.

What distortion are you going for and what is the current vulnerability situation?
 
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