Ren'Py Desert Stalker [v0.17.1.2 2024-12-30] [Zetan]

[Wolf Larsen]

that's a bit of a misrepresentation, when you consider you're talking about a grand total of 3-4 scenes in the entire game...
actually, not even that.. it's parts of scenes.. because every one of those scenes can also be played out without sharing... so it's not like you are losing out on a scene if you play it without the sharing. there's no actual loss of content, just loss of options you don't like anyway... much like you can enjoy Asha's scene in the intro and still get to play it even if you're not into watersports, or you can finish on Ain instead of Zahra in the massage scene, if you so choose.

?

I don't even know if we can even have a conversation about this since the moderator decided to delete my comment and told me to stop criticizing the game.

But about the rewrites, the protagonist's dialogue with his younger daughter, in the beginning, was changed so that only he can touch her to "only people that he allows can touch her". The codex of the game was also rewritten to the fact that it's normal to share the women of one's house with visitors.

This is the "writing on the wall" that another user asked me about. Of course, it's my personal opinion.

 

[muschi26]

so it's not like you are losing out on a scene if you play it without the sharing

From a certain point of view I think it could be argued that, even if you aren't losing a scene, you are losing content by opting out of sharing. E.g. if the game had not sharing, the boob-job that Zahra gives to Igor would have been given to Zaton instead (or the dev times spent creating those animations would have been repurposed toward some other content), so ultimately the player who chooses not to enable sharing is still getting “less” than if sharing wasn't in the game to begin with.

 

[Paz]

From a certain point of view I think it could be argued that, even if you aren't losing a scene, you are losing content by opting out of sharing. E.g. if the game had not sharing, the boob-job that Zahra gives to Igor would have been given to Zaton instead (or the dev times spent creating those animations would have been repurposed toward some other content), so ultimately the player who chooses not to enable sharing is still getting “less” than if sharing wasn't in the game to begin with.

In general it's not a tit-for-tat in that case. It doesn't mean that if the Igor part was not in the game, the Zaton part would be twice as big. It could very well be 50 renders of Zaton riding a camel in the desert for all we know.
There's not a quota of "sex renders" we allocate on each update where sharing and other kinks have to fight for a share of the pie.

That said, your premise of "if this didn't exist, the time could be spent to other things I enjoy more" may be sound, but it's also flawed in the sense this can be said about any kink in the game. Hell, any aspect of the game.

- "Why does the dev spend time on gory scenes, people don't like it and it's a waste of time".
- "Why is watersports in the game, eww. Maybe the dev could use the time to make something else."
- "Why is the MC a rough idiot, I'd prefer more wholesome love."
- "Why is the MC having a loving path? Plenty of games for that, make it rough only."
- "Why is the MC even leaving the house in the first place? He should stay there 24/7 and sex everyone. Pointless roaming around renders."

You see, if we based our thought process on all of these we'd end up making a big ball of nothing.

 

[Kellermann]

From a certain point of view I think it could be argued that, even if you aren't losing a scene, you are losing content by opting out of sharing. E.g. if the game had not sharing, the boob-job that Zahra gives to Igor would have been given to Zaton instead (or the dev times spent creating those animations would have been repurposed toward some other content), so ultimately the player who chooses not to enable sharing is still getting “less” than if sharing wasn't in the game to begin with.

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Non-sharing person here. I never felt like I was losing out because there happens to be optional content included that I don't watch. It's all part of the story that the dev is trying to tell, but thankfully we are given the ability to not see things that may be questionable to some. I much prefer that method than to be forced to see something I don't like. Just give me options and I am content. Perfect world, all devs would cater to my specific wants and desires, but sadly that world does not exist...yet.

 

[muschi26]

In general it's not a tit-for-tat in that case. It doesn't mean that if the Igor part was not in the game, the Zaton part would be twice as big. It could very well be 50 renders of Zaton riding a camel in the desert for all we know.
There's not a quota of "sex renders" we allocate on each update where sharing and other kinks have to fight for a share of the pie.

That said, your premise of "if this didn't exist, the time could be spent to other things I enjoy more" may be sound, but it's also flawed in the sense this can be said about any kink in the game. Hell, any aspect of the game.

- "Why does the dev spend time on gory scenes, people don't like it and it's a waste of time".
- "Why is watersports in the game, eww. Maybe the dev could use the time to make something else."
- "Why is the MC a rough idiot, I'd prefer more wholesome love."
- "Why is the MC having a loving path? Plenty of games for that, make it rough only."
- "Why is the MC even leaving the house in the first place? He should stay there 24/7 and sex everyone. Pointless roaming around renders."

You see, if we based our thought process on all of these we'd end up making a big ball of nothing.

Oh I agree with you 100%. Ultimately, it's just people saying, “Spend less time making stuff I don't like and more making the stuff I do.” It's just that the usual answer to this—“You're not losing out because you can avoid it”— I feel also misses the point somewhat, for the reasons I just mentioned. Essentially, I was just playing Devil's advocate.

 

[micmitja]

From a certain point of view I think it could be argued that, even if you aren't losing a scene, you are losing content by opting out of sharing. E.g. if the game had not sharing, the boob-job that Zahra gives to Igor would have been given to Zaton instead (or the dev times spent creating those animations would have been repurposed toward some other content), so ultimately the player who chooses not to enable sharing is still getting “less” than if sharing wasn't in the game to begin with.

well i dont know what igor got in that scene nor i care for, but rest got nice 4some instead + Kateryna is moving in with us, i would say its good deal

 

[Wolf Larsen]

Hell, any aspect of the game.

The thing is, Desert Stalker was kind of a harem with no hints of sharing, until the decision was made to make sharing a thing, thus the rewrites, right? You made sharing optional, that's less bad, but I ask you, what "breaks" the harem kink? Sharing.

I'm not telling you how to write the game, but it's a bit of a false equivalency with your examples there, in my opinion. Making a game for a straight-male audience, but then putting tons of gay scenes wouldn't make a lot of sense, for example.

And the fact that there is no quota for the type of content that is made, meaning that you could very well drop an update with sharing scenes only, just reinforces the idea that people that abhor sharing or similar content should not be invested that much in this game IMO. Because you're making no guarantees that could very well happen.

 

[Cynicaladm]

I don't even know if we can even have a conversation about this since the moderator decided to delete my comment and told me to stop criticizing the game.

sorry to hear that... seems unnecessarily harsh. I don't mind discussing the game and it's development, especially in a mature way and with a constructive conversation going, as long as it's fact based.

But about the rewrites, the protagonist's dialogue with his younger daughter, in the beginning, was changed so that only he can touch her to "only people that he allows can touch her".

That was changed to remove potential inconsistencies

The codex of the game was also rewritten to the fact that it's normal to share the women of one's house with visitors.

I am fairly positive that that's not what happened... I wrote the library entries, and the whole hospitality rules including also, potentially, sharing the sexual favours of slaves and/or members of the family was always going to be part of the worldbuilding. If nothing else, it's the foundation that makes it so that Zaton can get away with doing the things he does.
A rewrite may have occurred (can't remember rewriting that particular entry).. but the content was always in that direction.

From a certain point of view I think it could be argued that, even if you aren't losing a scene, you are losing content by opting out of sharing. E.g. if the game had not sharing, the boob-job that Zahra gives to Igor would have been given to Zaton instead (or the dev times spent creating those animations would have been repurposed toward some other content), so ultimately the player who chooses not to enable sharing is still getting “less” than if sharing wasn't in the game to begin with.

I intensely dislike this line of reasoning.. and I am not having a go at you in particular.
It is based upon the notion that the dev should only ever devote time to the restricted range of content, scenes, panels or whatever else, that specific players have in mind... entirely discounting what the dev is wanting and willing to work on.
It is also putting the notion out there that the Dev has to somehow justify how he spends his time and how he allocates his resources (time, hardware, software), and should only work on the things you (generic "you") like, or else be shamed/guilt tripped into doing just that...which is preposterous and just not how any of this works at all. It's just a nonsensical stance to have... that same time spent on putting together that half a scene that someone might not like (and others do like it just fine), he could have just spent sleeping in.
The same argument could be made if you dislike spanking, fisting, golden shower, anal, blowjobs or fight scenes, because you, or someone else, might not be into any or all of those... because if you don't like anal, why is the Dev not giving you more blowjobs?...
Yet this argument is somehow only ever made when it pertains to sharing, ntr or any other variation of the more polarising genres/content...
it's just not a very good argument and whenever I see it made, I just wish for the Dev that has to read it, to just reply that he'll just spend more time going to the gym, the movies or wherever else he cares to go and that he doesn't owe anyone any specific amount of time.
because if you think about it, that's what it comes down to...people trying to tell the Dev that out of the hundred of hours he puts in the game, spending a fraction of them on content they find objectionable somehow devalues the entire content of the game... and that's just a shitty way to go about it.

 

[Cynicaladm]

The thing is, Desert Stalker was kind of a harem with no hints of sharing, until the decision was made to make sharing a thing, thus the rewrites, right? You made sharing optional, that's less bad, but I ask you, what "breaks" the harem kink? Sharing.

only if you decide to go down that route.. if you don't your harem fantasy remains pristine and intact.. the notion that the mere existence of the option to not go that route somehow ruins it is moronic...
it's like saying that you are somehow less of a badass at playing FIFA with your favourite footbal team because the option exists to win the championship also with other teams in the game.

And the fact that there is no quota for the type of content that is made, meaning that you could very well drop an update with sharing scenes only, just reinforces the idea that people that abhor sharing or similar content should not be invested that much in this game IMO. Because you're making no guarantees that could very well happen.

except that has never happened, and we have given nobody any reason to think that that might even be a possibility, so again, we are in the realm of "yeah.. but it's possible"... which just isn't an argument.
By that token it's possible that ZetanDS goes to live in an ashram and never finishes the game..so why bother playing it at all?

 

[Kellermann]

This 'perfect world' topic makes me think...is there anything I would want included in game that I haven't seen yet?
I don't know. I feel like DS has given just about everything I could possibly want in an AVN.

If I had to pick something, I'd say I might like to encounter an adversary who is truly up to the task of being MC's arch nemesis and physical equal on the battlefield. Maybe a fallen or rival male Stalker. I thought General might have been the one but Zion took care of that.
I'll see how the Lord Abrax situation unravels, time will tell.

it's possible that ZetanDS goes to live in an ashram and never finishes the game..

Bro, why do you keep planting these seeds of misery in my brain?

 

[Wolf Larsen]

so why bother playing it at all?

Precisely. To become a patron, and a supporter of the game, trust is necessary, right? If there is no guarantee, even something like, "sharing will never become a major thing, the priority will always be the scenes with no sharing", do you agree with me that the risk of supporting the game (which always exists, the developer could get hit by a meteor tomorrow, as you said) gets bigger for the people that hate this type of content?

That was my original post, I don't recommend people that hate sharing or netorase getting invested in this game. By all means, the developer should make the content that they want to make, but you must assume the risk of alienating part of your audience when going to certain types of fetishes.

 

[Paz]

If I had to pick something, I'd say I might like to encounter an adversary who is truly up to the task of being MC's arch nemesis and physical equal on the battlefield. Maybe a fallen or rival male Stalker. I thought General might have been the one but Zion took care of that.
I'll see how the Lord Abrax situation unravels, time will tell.

Hmmm

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[Cynicaladm]

Precisely. To become a patron, and a supporter of the game, trust is necessary, right? If there is no guarantee, even something like, "sharing will never become a major thing, the priority will always be the scenes with no sharing", do you agree with me that the risk of supporting the game (which always exists, the developer could get hit by a meteor tomorrow, as you said) gets bigger for the people that hate this type of content?

That was my original post, I don't recommend people that hate sharing or netorase getting invested in this game. By all means, the developer should make the content that they want to make, but you must assume the risk of alienating part of your audience when going to certain types of fetishes.

I would say that trust is earned over time and over consistent communication and development.
Anybody who bothers keeping up with the game, here or on the discord, knows what's up and what to expect.

for one thing, the chances of the MC crossdressing, putting on a wig and being pegged are so low that it does not need to be said except to fuck with Kellermann
for the same reason, we don't feel the need to make grand statements of what the game might or might not have.. the game speaks for itself and anybody who has doubts 11 releases in, I can't help but finding them a bit unreasonable or insecure, I'm not sure which.

 

[Paz]

Precisely. To become a patron, and a supporter of the game, trust is necessary, right? If there is no guarantee, even something like, "sharing will never become a major thing, the priority will always be the scenes with no sharing", do you agree with me that the risk of supporting the game (which always exists, the developer could get hit by a meteor tomorrow, as you said) gets bigger for the people that hate this type of content?

That was my original post, I don't recommend people that hate sharing or netorase getting invested in this game. By all means, the developer should make the content that they want to make, but you must assume the risk of alienating part of your audience when going to certain types of fetishes.

I have a genuine question. Does it lessen your experience that such content is simply there, tucked away, never to be encountered apart from that initial question on whether you like to enable it or not?

Or the fear that you some day will wake up to updates that have nothing but sharing, and no other content for you to enjoy?

Honestly, if our plan was the latter in premeditated fashion, that would be a looong and lousy con. Develop a game for 2 years, spend countless hours on it, make equally thousands renders just to bait people and throw a curveball in the end.
I can't help but feel that people blow out of proportion stuff that makes up for less than 5% of the game.

 

[Kellermann]

Hmmm

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Now that you mention it, I do remember that guy. Definitely looks like he could go toe to toe with our intrepid MC. Although, the more I think about it, the more I like the idea of a rival male Stalker. Perhaps one that is completely devoted to the queen if your MC is not. Or vice versa...plots against the queen if you are a total simp for her. He may plot a takeover of not only the queen and her realm, but of your villa. That could lead to interesting confrontation. If someone threatens your family, you are going to be out for blood.

for one thing, the chances of the MC crossdressing, putting on a wig and being pegged are so low that it does not need to be said except to fuck with Kellermann

Dude.

 

[muschi26]

This 'perfect world' topic makes me think...is there anything I would want included in game that I haven't seen yet?
I don't know. I feel like DS has given just about everything I could possibly want in an AVN.

Anything I'd want to include in this game specifically? or in any game?
Assuming asking for more of things which were already featured isn't allowed, then,

In this game, I would want:

• impregnation and pregnancy content
• cum swamp/cum play between two girls
• a threesome scene that was more “even” in terms of attention
• tribadism
• rough/intense sex where Zaton's back and shoulders are covered in bite and scratch marks afterwards

In any game, I would want:

• all the way through
• alien/parasite infestation without disgusting body modifications, and in a game which isn't text-based
• bestiality with male human on female animal, if only because it doesn't seem to exist yet—gotta comply with rule 34, yo

 

[Stil996]

... I can't help but finding them a bit unreasonable or insecure, I'm not sure which.

Why are you saying that like you think they are mutually exclusive...
But back the more important point...

...the chances of the MC crossdressing, putting on a wig and being pegged are so low that it does not need to be said...

WTF, you mean I've been wasting my time with this game!!! .

A Dev should always pursue their own kinks, fuck the opinions of the cheap seats (the expensive ones too), trying please everyone just dooms the story into being bland homogenized crap, trying to avoid pissing people off is just insanity, it will never happen in a million years.

 

[Wolf Larsen]

I have a genuine question. Does it lessen your experience that such content is simply there, tucked away, never to be encountered apart from that initial question on whether you like to enable it or not?

Or the fear that you some day will wake up to updates that have nothing but sharing, and no other content for you to enjoy?

Both, actually. The first one is not a deal-breaker if the content is truly very "well-separated", which includes how the dialogue is handled. But I would say that it does lessen the experience, because you may be losing a substantial amount of content, or you could also use the "immersion issues" argument (which also has to do with how the dialogue, and the scenarios, are handled).

It is true that some people dislike the game even if this type of content is said to be avoidable, but you're talking to someone who invested hundreds of dollars in a game (not this one) that had tons of (optional) straight-up NTR content (including netotare), just to give you an idea.

And I have seen it happen, more than once (I can't give examples here because of the cross-promotion rule), which is not as far-fetched as you put it, it's that the game may lose the balance between the two types of content, a lot of time this optional content gets bigger and bigger, maybe because of patrons, maybe because the dev feels like it. It may not be premeditated, but it happens.

I mean, if you are refusing to even make this statement that sharing will never be the priority, or that sharing will be reduced to X amount of content per update, this does raise my eyebrows. Plus the dialogue changes for "consistency", and the addition of that journal entry for the same reason... are also off-putting to me, in a game that started looking like a harem when I played for the first time.

 

[incog44]

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Non-sharing person here. I never felt like I was losing out because there happens to be optional content included that I don't watch. It's all part of the story that the dev is trying to tell, but thankfully we are given the ability to not see things that may be questionable to some. I much prefer that method than to be forced to see something I don't like. Just give me options and I am content. Perfect world, all devs would cater to my specific wants and desires, but sadly that world does not exist...yet.

You mean questionable like fucking your own daughters but not wanting to see them fuck other people? Weirdo.

 

[Paz]

Both, actually. The first one is not a deal-breaker if the content is truly very "well-separated", which includes how the dialogue is handled. But I would say that it does lessen the experience, because you may be losing a substantial amount of content, or you could also use the "immersion issues" argument (which also has to do with how the dialogue, and the scenarios, are handled).

It is true that some people dislike the game even if this type of content is said to be avoidable, but you're talking to someone who invested hundreds of dollars in a game (not this one) that had tons of (optional) straight-up NTR content (including netotare), just to give you an idea.

And I have seen it happen, more than once (I can't give examples here because of the cross-promotion rule), which is not as far-fetched as you put it, it's that the game may lose the balance between the two types of content, a lot of time this optional content gets bigger and bigger, maybe because of patrons, maybe because the dev feels like it. It may not be premeditated, but it happens.

I mean, if you are refusing to even make this statement that sharing will never be the priority, or that sharing will be reduced to X amount of content per update, this does raise my eyebrows. Plus the dialogue changes for "consistency", and the addition of that journal entry for the same reason... are also off-putting to me, in a game that started looking like a harem when I played for the first time.

Fair enough. For what it's worth, the whole codex entries thing is -as with other entries- a world-building thing, hence the consistency. Zeta is sexually liberated, you have people fucking on the streets and even a temple for this. You can't have those with a sexually repressed society. And with that casual sex worldview, sharing is a byproduct.
We didn't create the lore to justify sharing, we included sharing because it makes sense in that world.

As for me refusing to make such a statement, there are multiple reasons for this.
1. I am not the main creator, and while I do have input in the game, it's his story (whether you presume sharing is a large part in said story or not is besides the point).

2. The way we approach scenes and the kinks included in them is "does it fit the story and the scene? Does it blend well?". If yes, we try to include it. And that goes for any kink, not only sharing in particular.
That means, while we don't intend for sharing to have any pivotal role in the game, I can't outright exclude that some update among the many might have more of it over the course of the game.
Will it happen? No idea. Will it not happen? Equally no idea.
So, I'm not gonna say that it will appear up to X% in any given update and then we have to scrap a scene because "we promised".
Most updates had 0 of it, others more. It's how it is.

3. Personally, I absolutely loathe the notion that every thread has to have a "No NTR" sign on the front page with big neon letters to avoid "but what if the developer decides to do it????!". It doesn't happen for any other kink and I find it silly as fuck. So I won't be doing anything that propagates this.

I know the above doesn't do much to calm your concerns, nor was my intention to do so. I just wanted to provide a honest view on how we approach making this game.
We've made sure that any and all kinks are completely avoidable for people that do not like it, but that's the extent we'll go.

We are not going to make a statement about the MC not going around pissing on everyone's face in the future in case people not in watersports fear it might happen for some reason, and this here is pretty much equivalent.