You know, there is a common mistake used in many narratives like comics, series, or video games and that is making us believe that any main character should end with another main character. It would be more realistic for a LI to suddenly show she got a boyfriend that up until she presented him to the MC was never part of the game. Or just tell the MC she got a boyfriend, someone who the MC won't meet because is not part of the group in which the MC and the LI are. These are the things that usually happen in real life, it is more common for people to find partners outside of their group than making all members of the group end with others from the group as if the main characters are the only people on Earth. Those would show better than the LIs have lifes outside of the MC.
Do you prefer to play Harem games with or without male competition?
- Thread starter hakarlman
- Start date
- Sep 18, 2021
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But why should this be the case at all?
It's one thing in a story to suggest that the MC shouldn't necessarily be THE CHOSEN ONE who gets everything their way, and the goals, aspirations, and life experiences of other characters should be valid as well - meaning the hero might not get the girl (or guy, or whatever) no matter how badly they want them. Bittersweet endings can be just as fulfilling (if not more so) than totally happy ones, after all.
But games are a different animal, especially in cases where a player is given the power to self-insert into the story. Any story that allows player choice at all is by definition implying that the desires of the player supersede those of the main character or the people around them, and the more robust that choice is, the more that expectation exists. The farther the game goes to allow you to shape the main character (by changing their name, appearance, backstory, preferences, etc), the more players may (rightfully) expect the game to make good on those choices.
This is part of why people complained about Telltale games not validating player choice - if no matter what choices you make the story winds up in the same place anyway, why make choices at all? The value of a narrative choice-driven game over a normal book or movie is being able to affect the plot yourself. If you can't affect the plot, why are you playing?
If a dev wants to tell their story and their story alone, why are they making a game? Just write a book or a movie. Making a game with narrative choice comes implicit with the expectation that player choice matters.
And in that context, player expectation matters. If players want to pursue a specific love interest (especially in a porn game), then they should be able to do so with the expectation that they are going to succeed. It may require them to make the right choices or perform the right actions, but if they play well, the payoff should be the reward they desire.
There's an argument to be made that not every character needs to be pansexual and available to allow the MC to romance everyone they meet (so yes, it's perfectly valid to have a lesbian character who is open right from the start that she's not interested in a male MC), but if the game allows you to pursue a LI option at all it should probably be done with the expectation that it's going to lead to success, not a last-minute rug pull where the person you're romancing suddenly meets someone else and runs off with them instead.
Like it or not, most people play games for some degree of escapism (and power fantasy). And most of us have already lived through awkward social interactions and failed relationships and crushes that never panned out. The last thing the average person wants is to go on a magical fictional adventure and still get dumped and run late on the rent and have to deal with all the other crap they deal with in real life.
You can show that supporting characters have a life outside of the main character in plenty of ways without completely tearing control away from the player. Like it or not, at the end of the day, we are reading a story about the main character, so yes, most of the supporting cast should revolve around them to some degree. Because the main character is by definition the interesting fulcrum point around which fate and destiny and interesting stories revolve. Otherwise we'd be reading (or playing) a story about those other people instead.
It's the same reason why so many RPGs wind up being about THE CHOSEN ONE who is destined to master magic and fight through armies to save the world rather than about Bob the Farmer who spends 20 years growing crops before getting eaten by a dragon. Because while there are way more Bobs in the world than CHOSEN ONES, most of us don't find Bob's story all that interesting.
- Nov 15, 2020
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I would say both stories are extremely boring, but Bob the Farmer is the only one that could still surprise you in a positive way. The Chosen One can't fail. He must win. So the story is already fully clear from the start.
When it comes to porn games, there are power fantasy games like that which work. For example Midlife Crisis, where the power trip is smoothened by the presence of humor. Or games which have the (I think realistic) view that not all LI's may be ok with the MC's incest harem.
However, one way or the other, a Chosen One fucking all the girls without any opposition or adversity is completely and utterly boring and not even sexy.
Bob the Farmer on the other hand who has to make careful choices whether to pursue LI 1 or LI 2 but can't have both, *is* an interesting character to play. If you make to many mistakes and don't get either LI, then it's also more rewarding if you do finally get either LI. But of course the LI in question must be worth the effort and that's also not an easy task for both writer and graphics artist.
What are you talking about? I only said that having male rival main characters that could end with the LI won't make the game realistic because pairing all main characters of the same group among them is far from realistic. I never said MC choices shouldn't have an impact, I only said the idea of the male rival just because it is different than what most games do and it is almost never used does not means it is realistic. It is like those series with a group of characters with the same number of male and female friends and people expect to ship those characters to make everyone start a relationship inside the group, and because some people like that idea they make the false affirmation is realistic, when in fact such a thing rarely happen on real-life.
Anyway, the idea I had in mind was more for games that allow the MC to make options and end with one LI and at the same time after choosing that LI it can still show what happens with others LIs. But such a thing is incompatible with modern western games released patch by patch, it was more prominent in old Japanese games that were released as a completed game so there is no handicap in making choices at the beginning, in the middle game based on the player choices define what LI will have the ending and have the rest of the game with that LI in particular. Having multiple saves for multiple LIs was expected in those games, I remember some that had no lewd content before choosing the LI ending, only romantic scenes with choices, and based on the punctuation of those choices move to a bad ending or the endgame with the chosen LI. During that point the player has already chosen what LI wants is the point to show how other characters end when they don't end with the MC.
But that won't work with games with patch-by-patch updates taking years to become completed.
- Sep 27, 2017
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I dont like guys at all, why should i want to see them in games without the ability to shoot, burn or otherwise kill them on sight?
Its even more annoying if those things want my girls.
Harem is not about competition, thats ntr shit. Harem is for fun, thats also why many drama-harem games fail.
Monos who play harem want to live a fantasy, have fun on the way and tons of sex scenes involving the protagonist and 1-4 of the girls in the end.
Polys who play harem just want to do what they like, have fun and tons of sex scenes including all out orgies.
NTR fans want competition...and lose.
Its even more annoying if those things want my girls.
Harem is not about competition, thats ntr shit. Harem is for fun, thats also why many drama-harem games fail.
Monos who play harem want to live a fantasy, have fun on the way and tons of sex scenes involving the protagonist and 1-4 of the girls in the end.
Polys who play harem just want to do what they like, have fun and tons of sex scenes including all out orgies.
NTR fans want competition...and lose.
Yeah. Someone should make a game where you actually compete with other Male NPC to harem fuck the girls. I don't think it has actually been done?
- May 30, 2017
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I didn't play that much games but I think more games need this spice with competition, makes your efforts more interesting. And I mean not those horny bastards from ntr having nothing good except dick but actually normal or cool guys who can make most girls fall for them instead of forcible behaviour. The only game with such competition I played is Artificial Academy 2 where you can make male competitors for your liking.
- Sep 27, 2017
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Erm, normal guys ARE horny bastards and cool guys dont go after girls, they are gay...
No competition is liked by insecure men who are afraid to lose.
Real men like competition and beating them.
Ntr fans like competition and losing.
The thing is, each category of people is fine and I am generalizing a lot here. I am sure there are tons of "real" men in all three groups.
But I wanted to meet you in your language.
- Sep 27, 2017
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Well, i'm a real lesbian, hence my opinion on any males in any games is even lower then my opinion about their existence in general ^^
And i prefer to integrate "competing" girls into the harem as well instead of "fighting" with them.
So no, competition is only for people who want to lose, if you cant lose you dont need competition, its just an annoyance.
It's a bit worrying that you have a lower opinion about males just because you are a lesbian. Just as much as it would be weird if I have a lower opinion of you, because you are not in my "hunting" portfolio.
Maybe you don't know what winning feels like. Imagine an athlete telling you it's less fun with competition. Competition ist part of it.
You will not be met with the "annoyance" if you just do it right. So the annoyance is really the insecurity I talked about. You think you might not be enough. You are afraid of the competition. That is absolutely fine and there is no stigma needed to it.
Who said a chad is better than a beta? They are both people and other things count much more.
But if you ask me who is the chad between an ntr lover, who goes into his kink, facing the backlash of a whole community, with a smile on his face versus someone like you who tries to hide his insecurity and fears?
The ntr guy is definitely the chad. Not saying you are less than him in any way. Just different.
- Sep 27, 2017
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Thats not the reason...i never felt save around guys, even before i knew any difference or learned to talk i started to scream as soon as i saw or heared any guy, family included. I avoided them whenever possible...sadly we had no girls only school and there i learned the hard way to trust this instinct even more...today i run a woman shelter with big sis and get daily 6-14 more reasons to think even lower about guys and seeing the popularity of rape, prostitution and corruption tags in games will not improve it.
However, i play games for fun and to calm/distract my mind, its more stress than fun to see guys around my girls - the exact opposite of the desired effect.
What do you think i am? Some preschool girl? I know how winning feels, but why should i want it in an adult game? Okay, gimme a 4x, shooter, rpg, ..., there i prefer my enemys on the hightest level. But in adult games i prefer just to have fun or a good/deep story. Reality has enough girls who say no to polys like me and even more are not into girls...in harem games girls mostly dont say no ^^
I dont see any appeal in competition when it comes to sex or adult games and even less in ntr (all 3 meanings)
I may be able to trick my mind far enough to ignore playing a male protagonist, but competing with guys is just ridiculous for me and i dont want some used sluts
However, i play games for fun and to calm/distract my mind, its more stress than fun to see guys around my girls - the exact opposite of the desired effect.
What do you think i am? Some preschool girl? I know how winning feels, but why should i want it in an adult game? Okay, gimme a 4x, shooter, rpg, ..., there i prefer my enemys on the hightest level. But in adult games i prefer just to have fun or a good/deep story. Reality has enough girls who say no to polys like me and even more are not into girls...in harem games girls mostly dont say no ^^
I dont see any appeal in competition when it comes to sex or adult games and even less in ntr (all 3 meanings)
I may be able to trick my mind far enough to ignore playing a male protagonist, but competing with guys is just ridiculous for me and i dont want some used sluts
Games can be done well with or without competition. One of my favorite harem games is Hunie Pop; it's addicting, fun, simple, and there's no competition in it. However, Hunie Pop is about where the harem games stop for me. If there's no competition there's no real gameplay there.
Why am I giving flowers to Riley Reid in Online Girl? There's no reason for it. You could skip that mechanic entirely and have the same exact experience. I can't remember the name of the game, but it was about a modern dude going either back in time or to a fantasy world and having to lead an army with rock paper scissor mechanics. There is nothing to lose (literally, when you lose they just make the rock paper scissors easier). There is no reason it couldn't have just been a VN without the "gameplay" because there is nothing the "gameplay" actually does.
A great example of what I mean is most LOP games, but we'll take Living With Temptation for specifics. Each stat does something and lets you access another thing like a scene or an array of scenes. However, there's competition. You want to do your best and do well because if you don't, your LI gets with someone else.
My two biggest criteria to meet for a harem style game is Gameplay, or Realistic Relationships, and most harem games fail on both fronts.
Why am I giving flowers to Riley Reid in Online Girl? There's no reason for it. You could skip that mechanic entirely and have the same exact experience. I can't remember the name of the game, but it was about a modern dude going either back in time or to a fantasy world and having to lead an army with rock paper scissor mechanics. There is nothing to lose (literally, when you lose they just make the rock paper scissors easier). There is no reason it couldn't have just been a VN without the "gameplay" because there is nothing the "gameplay" actually does.
A great example of what I mean is most LOP games, but we'll take Living With Temptation for specifics. Each stat does something and lets you access another thing like a scene or an array of scenes. However, there's competition. You want to do your best and do well because if you don't, your LI gets with someone else.
My two biggest criteria to meet for a harem style game is Gameplay, or Realistic Relationships, and most harem games fail on both fronts.
It's commendable that you run a shelter for women in need, but I do hope you talk to them differently. When reading what you wrote in the last few messages, throwing up on men, ntr fans and "sluts", it's easy to worry about them.and i dont want some used sluts
You yourself stated, girls are not into other girls, hence you. So you can't have them. That is why you go to competitionless harem games to get a change.
A place where you can finally win.
Good for you. I have nothing to add to that. I hope you find the very best Harem games for you.
My only advice is don't lock down on people and don't try to make yourself bigger than others.
Have a great day.
- Sep 27, 2017
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LOL, dont worry about that. I hate gutter ralk, disrespect and insults...its just the basic english communication i learned over the years online. But my german is very different and i dont talk much about myself or my own preferences/views/opinions/believes with the shelter girls...okay, if some asshole hurt a girl i call it an asshole because it is an asshole, but thats it. I am not some christian, i dont force my opinions and believes into weakened minds instead of helping them to start thinking for themself.
Following that logic all the girls would be useless and the games deleted.
Of course i prefer lesbian protagonists, but most of them are dripping pink romances or pick your girlfriend scenarios, the lesbian harem games are so fucking rare, i couldnt even find 10 on this whole site.
My winning place is the real life, i have enough girls just one call away, but i cant call them into my office and i mostly play those games between councelling, paperwork and appointments at work. As said, i play to calm my mind, so i dont want/need any stress or annoyance in games. Especially no guys.
Wow, my english must be worse than i thought. I never make myself bigger or stroke my ego, but i cant look up to people beneath me and my opinions and believes are flexible enough to listen to others, but they are still mine to keep, adapt or discard in the end. Thats also one of the cores i try to teach the girls here. Most of them were abused and trained to be weak minded pushovers until they broke and ended here. This forum calls it corruption...
With male competition but you NTR the other competitors ^^
Like Ash is NTR Gary in pokemon games xD this guy was really thinking he's a badass, but what a looser xD
Like Ash is NTR Gary in pokemon games xD this guy was really thinking he's a badass, but what a looser xD
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- Oct 12, 2020
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I have read quite a few interesting views here.
I think no one has the absolute truth and wanting to have competition doesn't make you a cuck, nor a GigaChad because "you're not afraid of challenges".... In a porn game.
And on the other side too. The fantasy of having no competition and simply not wanting to have competition doesn't make you the biggest Alpha Male/Woman for not wanting to share nor does it make you a snowflake, fragile and insecure.... For a porn game.
Regardless of the gender of the protagonist I play with, I don't like having competition, regardless of the gender of the competition. While I am a romantic, one of the main reasons is that I'd rather have the feeling that the only love option for all the girls in a game is the MC, rather than having the feeling that I'm "forced" to romance them all and not be wrong in the choices I make so that the girls don't go with the competition. That's my comfort zone when it comes to playing visual novels. And I obviously don't play things that make me the least bit uncomfortable. Maybe this is where that part of me playing to forget about the real world comes in. Maybe. There are other reasons. Some of them a bit banal, others a bit more "serious"... But I don't want the text to be too long.
If someone wants competition in a harem game or is looking for that challenge, that's fine.
I like challenges, but my way of looking for challenges in games is in conventional games. RPGs, shooters, strategy, terror, etc. Where the only way I feel betrayed is when my teammate shoots me by mistake. Heh.
So... Yes. I only feel comfortable when there is no competition in a harem game.
I think no one has the absolute truth and wanting to have competition doesn't make you a cuck, nor a GigaChad because "you're not afraid of challenges".... In a porn game.
And on the other side too. The fantasy of having no competition and simply not wanting to have competition doesn't make you the biggest Alpha Male/Woman for not wanting to share nor does it make you a snowflake, fragile and insecure.... For a porn game.
Regardless of the gender of the protagonist I play with, I don't like having competition, regardless of the gender of the competition. While I am a romantic, one of the main reasons is that I'd rather have the feeling that the only love option for all the girls in a game is the MC, rather than having the feeling that I'm "forced" to romance them all and not be wrong in the choices I make so that the girls don't go with the competition. That's my comfort zone when it comes to playing visual novels. And I obviously don't play things that make me the least bit uncomfortable. Maybe this is where that part of me playing to forget about the real world comes in. Maybe. There are other reasons. Some of them a bit banal, others a bit more "serious"... But I don't want the text to be too long.
If someone wants competition in a harem game or is looking for that challenge, that's fine.
I like challenges, but my way of looking for challenges in games is in conventional games. RPGs, shooters, strategy, terror, etc. Where the only way I feel betrayed is when my teammate shoots me by mistake. Heh.
So... Yes. I only feel comfortable when there is no competition in a harem game.