Do you see adult games as porn or as games?

[DawnCry]

Overall I kind of want to see the opinion of those that wanna answer. Basically I want to see a bit more into the paradox of adult games, because some people take it more as porn and just want to choose what happens while others would prefer just to play a game.

Both points are directly against each other, because for it to be a game it means that the player loses a good portion of their control over the game, albeit it doesn't have to be too much. However it may be necessary to talk about what could be considered near each of the postures.

-In visual novels:
*We would be more near a "porn" view of it if the story just follows the sexual adventures of the protagonist and it's just based on it, usually we have a MC that has sex with multiple girls, however there is no conflict based on having a harem or it's really easy to solve. Basically we just follow the sex story of the MC from the beginning to end.

*We would be more near a "game" view of it if in the story happens any of the following conflicts:
+Harem issues: Getting a harem isn't easy, it's not only hard to persuade but to maintain it, having a favourite will make the others mad and you have to be careful over it.

+Rivals: Basically the risk of NTR, overall I personally believe that to make a good game you can just add a hard-lock at the beginning, as "Jealousy" makes directly asking if NTR should be on or off and then for those that have it activated less option based and more as a consequence.

+Dominating the main character: Basically the MC is pushed to be the submissive one in the relationship, overall it's related to being a risk and trying to make the MC accept it or fight back and fight for dominance.

Basically I would define a visual novel more like a game when there is some sort of threat, be it harem management, rivals or a character that has the hots for you but wants to be the dominant one. Overall there is an issue that has an effect on us and managing it badly would have consequences, heavy consequences.

-In gameplay based games:

I would say that having a gameplay is a clear indication that it is a game, so at most I would like to talk about risk management and the gameplay.

*Little to no risk in the game: Overall in this type of games the point is having an interesting story focused on the MC and his adventures while having a gameplay aspect that is complementary to the game and helps make it more enjoyable, a few examples would be:

+Sengoku Rance: I would say this is a clear example of little risk in the game, overall the game is quite light hearted albeit at some times it can be more heavy (Kouhime and Uesugi clan being a few examples), overall almost anyone will have an issue related to sex scenes.

+Kamidori alchemy meister: One of the best games made by Eushully, overall the sex feels more like a complement, the story and gameplay are what try dominate the game, it has a no risk value because you just need to follow your route and you cant go wrong. A nice game I would say.

*Moderate-extremely high risk: In the game there can happen bad things however just because it happens doesn't mean it's a game over.

+Big bang age: Daibanchou: In this game we would be at the moderate level of risk, sometimes we would have to choose between getting x character or y and the other will be raped or join the enemy side, sometimes we will have to act to rescue a character and we will have to even be careful about how we conquer a nation because it can be the death of some characters.

+Kichikuou rance: High level of risk, time is of essence, having too much sex with some harem girls can break them or make them go crazy and there are risks everywhere, you have to rescue some girls since the beginning of the game and be careful of what characters you get in the team, because if you arent careful bad things will happen.

+Leane of legitimate crown: Extremely high level of risk, albeit it has different difficulty levels, you have a bastard king that wanna make a harem with the female officers in your army and the enemies that if they defeat a female general you will have to rescue her soon, if not she will be raped and she may even join the enemy.


Overall in this example of risk management I have used strategy games, because of that the main issue is more related to NTR compared to other problems. However other problems like harem management and characters wanting to make you submit to them are equally interesting as a risk factor.

So going back to the point the questions would be:

1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

1a. If you take them as porn, would you hate having to deal with risk management? would you be okay with it if you can directly deactivate it?

1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

Examples:
-Fetishes
-Context of the game
-Gameplay
-Game pictures and girls
-Animation
-Risk management
-Realistic interactions
-Humour
-Writing
-Attention to detail

4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).


To end I find it right to add my own answers to the questions I asked:

1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

I take them more like games, personally I don't like to just see pure porn but I value many things, including romance and having risk management. Option based games are totally different from risk management and I dislike it a lot, mainly because it serves to just define routes and just to let the player choose the type of porn they wanna see, I'm more into consequences and actions.

1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

I prefer risk management, overall I like at least high intensity however I want the MC to be rewarded too by being successful, for me an optimal game would be one in which I can manage to get a harem or end alone, basically I need opposite poles and shades of grey in the middle.

2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

I feel like the tendency to make games as accessible as possible will have to end at some point, overall it limits a lot the creativity and possibilities in the game. However that doesn't mean that we don't have many good games, Summertime saga would be one of the best games that tries to be as accessible as possible, it does a good job in all aspects so it deserves it's success.

If I had to pick a favourite... I would choose Trials in tainted space by fenoxo, having bad endings, being able to rape or be raped, adventures and sex... my only issue would be how almost everyone feels like they are polyamorous or don't take relationships seriously. But for the rest I can say again that it is a really great game.

In fact, I don't believe that the success of most games is something "accidental", overall they have a really good level of coding and a concept good enough even more it is complemented with attention to detail and multiple scenes.

3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

1. Context: I tend to prefer medieval or sword and magic settings in games, even better if they have magical creatures, be it animal like girls (such as catgirls for example) or more monster like.

2. Attention to detail: This is my particular obsession, if I don't see that the game has unique menus, that the creator bothered to change the default things, I will have a bad first impression.

3. Fetishes: Overall I have my personal absolute bans, basically I just ignore games that have a fetish that forms part of that list, overall I only have some really heavy ones there (such as vore, gore, scat, horror...), if the game doesn't have my absolute bans I can play it.

4. Writing: I understand that not many developers are english natives and I don't go on that difference between english/engrish, but rather I say it related to making the scenes a bit logical, not something that would fit a "suddenly, pineapples" style.

5. Risk management: Albeit I put it a bit down it's kind of what makes me feel like the game is a game, victory without challenge is really meh for me. There are many ways to make a game be a challenge, just don't use the grindy ones...

6. Gameplay and stats: I love to have unique stats of the game, especially related to sexual experience and their fetishes, being able to find the information related to a girl and develop her in certain directions is a personal like of mine. Another thing is the gameplay that can be related to that or don't, overall I like exploring and obtaining unique items, I have a personal liking for RPG's but strategy based ones are really nice too.

4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).

If it's an extreme ban I wouldn't even play the game, would just don't enter it, however that doesn't mean that just because it isn't in my extreme ban I like all the other fetishes, one personal dislike that I have is "unavoidable NTR", overall I can understand using it as a resource at the start of the game, however I would totally skip it if it was an option. In fact I appreciate the skip scene option a lot because liking risk management games means that you may be forced to have some scenes that you dislike, I can tolerate that it happened but I would truly appreciate not having to see and read it.

 

[Deleted member 1706148]

1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

It depends. If the game has actual gameplay like rance or kamidori as u mention before then i take it as a "more of a game". Games w/o rpg/combat elements in it or even VNs i consider "less of a game, but not quite as a porn" that just my opinion.

1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

I prefer more gameplay & a good story in games i play (erotic or not). tbh i don't even mind if there's little perverted stuff in a erotic game for as long as the story satisfy me. Also, im not much of a risk taker :/

2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

I'm okay w/ it for now & as for my favourite games, there's a few of them in my signature

3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

I agree w/ u... wait... maybe i'll put "humor" over "risk management" & "gameplay & stats" over "writing".

Cause like u said before, not all dev out here are native english speaker so as long as gameplay & stats in the game then i'm okay w/ it.

4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).

I pretty much agree w/ everything u have said. I'm in a love & hate relationship w/ ntr and there are more times that i hate it more than i like it so having an option is nice. (& yes, i'm a complicated cat xD)

 

[DawnCry]

I pretty much agree w/ everything u have said. I'm in a love & hate relationship w/ ntr and there are more times that i hate it more than i like it so having an option is nice. (& yes, i'm a complicated cat xD)

Being complicated is normal . I'm very complicated myself, overall I don't like NTR but I value a lot the implications of having it in a game, except when it's pure choice based (routes), in that case it would be the same for me having it and not having it.

 

[Hagatagar]

Overall I kind of want to see the opinion of those that wanna answer. Basically I want to see a bit more into the paradox of adult games, because some people take it more as porn and just want to choose what happens while others would prefer just to play a game.

As a short answer, I would say if you masturbate to it, it's porn.

-In visual novels:
[...] Basically we just follow the sex story of the MC from the beginning to end.

This fits most of the VNs. The story often just feels like filler material between the more elaborate sex scenes.
And take a look at all the VNs where the main girl takes longer to 'conquer'. You almost always have other girls who want to get banged so you don't have to wait too long for a sex scene.

*We would be more near a "game" view of it if in the story happens any of the following conflicts:
+Harem issues: Getting a harem isn't easy, it's not only hard to persuade but to maintain it, having a favourite will make the others mad and you have to be careful over it.

In this aspect, Japanese VNs are far superior to the western ones. You have to carefully navigate through all the decisions and activate the right 'flags' and avoid the 'bad flags' to get the right girl or the harem ending.

Basically I would define a visual novel more like a game when there is some sort of threat, be it harem management, rivals or a character that has the hots for you but wants to be the dominant one. Overall there is an issue that has an effect on us and managing it badly would have consequences, heavy consequences.

Yes, in nearly none of the VNs there are any stakes at all.
'What? You sleep with you sister AND you mother? Well they're hot, so it's okay.' 'I don't mind you having 3 other girlfriends besides me.'
Something like this is typical for porn.
That's why VN are not really games.

+Sengoku Rance:

First time I got angry at a game for 2 reasons:

Spoiler: Just me rambling

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1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

You could also ask 'Do you like music? But answare only with yes or no.'

That depends massively on the type of adult game.
VNs or many RPGM are mostly porn, the sex scenes are what everybody wants.
This also applies to all games in which you control the sex act yourself like in Illusion games.

Games like FreeCities or brothel simulators are not really porn, because the management aspect is such a big deal.

1a. If you take them as porn, would you hate having to deal with risk management? would you be okay with it if you can directly deactivate it?

1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

I have the feeling this should be the other way around. First comes the type of game (VN, RPG, managment) and then the content (sex).
It's like asking what kind of gameplay you like in medieval games (Kingdom come: Deliverance and Crossroads Inn are two completely different games but both take place in medieval times).

2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

Everyone should be less prude about sex based games. They are games, not reality.
The big publishers are so meticulous about their games because they don't want to come across any laws or opinions.
And the little developers pay too much attention to the comments of some players.

3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

Again, this depends on the game type. Story driven games, management games and sex games are completely different things and therefore the priorities are very different.

4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).

I can read the tags and if I still play the game, I expect this content to appear. To be warned about something like that always feels like a spoiler and breakes the immersion.


Somehow I get the feeling players of VN whine too much about existing or missing fetish in games.
They don't seem to care much about the game itself or the story and just want a kind of 'sandbox VN', where they can choose the things they like. Trying to manipulate the developer to change the game to their tastes.
That kind of thing is one of the reasons wy so many blockbuster movies suck, because the studios change the movies depending on the reactions of a small audience in the test screenings.

 

[I'm Not Thea Lundgren!]

It depends on the game, most of the adult games I play are just that, games, and while they have adult elements I see them as games.

 

[Buddawg]

1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

... Both is an absolute must. Im here to play porn games. If i was more concerned about games, id be playing games. If i just wanted to jackoff, id watch porn. Adult games gives the chance to get turned on while being interactive and THATS the key. Its needs both. Gameplay so I dont just skip things cause its boring. Porn so I dont just play any other kind of game out there.
Im not here to watch a comic strip of porn, and Im not here to play a game without the chance to be enticed and turned on.
Its a balance, and if either is missing or is subpar, I will comment on it when reviewing the game.


1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

...No clue what your intent with this question. But why must one exclude the other? One thing I do NOT want, is excluded content. Unless it actually has a valid story point. Excluding something cause its counter to the storyline you picked, cool. Excluding to create "choice" is the dummest thing you can do (ex. having a choice between two hookups, but you can only choose one of them, and neither choice has ANY effect on story).


2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

...Overall, its pretty meh. Mostly you get ppl who can create code, then maybe able to make a story or dialog, and rarely one with actual graphics he himself creates. The first part is ofc a must, but everyone after that is severely lacking in most games in one or more departments. I dont really do "favorite", I enjoy what I play thats it.
What to change, the cashgrabbers that dont make games for the games sake. Programmers procrastinating or making more than one game at a time instead of finishing the first.


3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

...First at content/fetishes. No point in playing a game that does nothing for me. Then the next step is checking how far along the game is. Just released, dont wanna bother, toooo many quiters around. Then visuals, because I have no clue what the game is about or other at this point. THEN we get into the game itself. First thing i notice is dialog, if its engrish.. youve already lost me. Then storyline, is it worth it, is it engaging. Now youre barely in the game, so now comes interactions, instasex for no reason, im out. Humor, details, animations.. are flavor, not essentials.


4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).

...That REALLY depends. Forced gay sex, chastity, guro etc, yeah you lost me. Forced footplay, ntr, while its an instant turnoff, it wont make me quit. Not all fetishes are horribad. But when you get the extremes, and they are not passable.. im out. Vanilla to medium hard fetish, its okish but if its main focus of the game and its not my type, Im already not playing it.

 

[DawnCry]

1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

... Both is an absolute must. Im here to play porn games. If i was more concerned about games, id be playing games. If i just wanted to jackoff, id watch porn. Adult games gives the chance to get turned on while being interactive and THATS the key. Its needs both. Gameplay so I dont just skip things cause its boring. Porn so I dont just play any other kind of game out there.
Im not here to watch a comic strip of porn, and Im not here to play a game without the chance to be enticed and turned on.
Its a balance, and if either is missing or is subpar, I will comment on it when reviewing the game.


1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

...No clue what your intent with this question. But why must one exclude the other? One thing I do NOT want, is excluded content. Unless it actually has a valid story point. Excluding something cause its counter to the storyline you picked, cool. Excluding to create "choice" is the dummest thing you can do (ex. having a choice between two hookups, but you can only choose one of them, and neither choice has ANY effect on story).

Those questions are just preferences, it's just asking what is the most important thing for you.

For example saying that you prefer overall gameplay over risk management it would be just a preference, that doesn't mean that you refuse the other type and in fact the questions are more like a guide for people to express their opinion on multiple points.

Nothing more, nothing else mate, saying that they are equal is an option too. I just found this point interesting and wanted to read multiple opinions.

 

[Rogulair]

Definitely Porn.

 

[Sphere42]

I don't believe the two to necessarily be opposed to each other. Porn fundamentally is a "topic" or what you'd call "content" in gaming, while being a "proper game" I would tie to "mechanics". Mass Effect is very compelling as a cutscene movie, heck even some wiki articles are great on their own. On the flip side you can sink years of your life into something like chess or whatever the surviving "classic" shooters are despite them not receiving any content updates in decades.

And in both porn and gaming variety also matters. Sometimes you want to watch a BBC MILF gangbang with both free, other times you want a fully interactive cuddle simulator.

For largely pragmatic/practical reasons my own priority list for scavenging usually is fetishes>art/writing style>mechanics>non-porn content. But that is an empirical approach based on limited download speeds, time to play and the failings experienced in the past. It is very easy to tell from the promo CGs whether a game is a generic rape fest and the engine/genre labels usually give a fairly good indication of the gameplay mechanics. Art style you can also judge from the demo screens and writing will rarely improve past the opening scene. Oh and obviously fetishes/sexual content are very easy to search for online in plain text while everything else is very inconsistent, vague, subjective or poorly documented.

Ultimately my very definition requires both. If I merely wanted porn I'd stick to r34 or the panda, if I only wanted games I'd browse Steam or something. Note all of this only applies to the "typical" games on here, i.e. those with a significant focus on pornographic content.

 

[DawnCry]

I don't believe the two to necessarily be opposed to each other. Porn fundamentally is a "topic" or what you'd call "content" in gaming, while being a "proper game" I would tie to "mechanics". Mass Effect is very compelling as a cutscene movie, heck even some wiki articles are great on their own. On the flip side you can sink years of your life into something like chess or whatever the surviving "classic" shooters are despite them not receiving any content updates in decades.

And in both porn and gaming variety also matters. Sometimes you want to watch a BBC MILF gangbang with both free, other times you want a fully interactive cuddle simulator.

For largely pragmatic/practical reasons my own priority list for scavenging usually is fetishes>art/writing style>mechanics>non-porn content. But that is an empirical approach based on limited download speeds, time to play and the failings experienced in the past. It is very easy to tell from the promo CGs whether a game is a generic rape fest and the engine/genre labels usually give a fairly good indication of the gameplay mechanics. Art style you can also judge from the demo screens and writing will rarely improve past the opening scene. Oh and obviously fetishes/sexual content are very easy to search for online in plain text while everything else is very inconsistent, vague, subjective or poorly documented.

Ultimately my very definition requires both. If I merely wanted porn I'd stick to r34 or the panda, if I only wanted games I'd browse Steam or something. Note all of this only applies to the "typical" games on here, i.e. those with a significant focus on pornographic content.

Would recommend that you read my first post before answering, overall you totally missed the point mate. The topic isn't about if an adult game is porn or a game.

"Porn fundamentally is a "topic" or what you'd call "content" in gaming, while being a "proper game" I would tie to "mechanics" "

By using your words as reference, the difference I make is that if you define adult games as porn, it would mean to get the content without needing any mechanic, while if you define adult games as a game it would mean that you require those mechanics. This is the point of the conversation.

Overall the view I used is based more on conflict, mechanics and gameplay. But I don't take a game as such because it has mechanics, a porn game can perfectly track the love points you get with a girl during the story, so the ones that actually define if we are in a game I took only the conflict and gameplay.

Conflict is the key I use to divide visual novels, because while in some we never have any true conflict but just a storyline to follow, in others we have to deal with issues, be it harem problems, rivals or characters that want to make our MC be submissive towards them.

 

[Sphere42]

By using your words as reference, the difference I make is that if you define adult games as porn, it would mean to get the content without needing any mechanic, while if you define adult games as a game it would mean that you require those mechanics. This is the point of the conversation.

I don't agree with your definition, to me the two are separate components and both are required to be deserving of the label "porn game" in my opinion. Many visual novels are just picture books not actual games.

Overall the view I used is based more on conflict, mechanics and gameplay. But I don't take a game as such because it has mechanics, a porn game can perfectly track the love points you get with a girl during the story, so the ones that actually define if we are in a game I took only the conflict and gameplay.

But there are different ways the two components can interact. "Porn as a reward" with no sexual element to the preceding gameplay (and "porn as punishment" i.e. Game Over Rape) would still qualify as porn games, but a different type of porn game than sex simulators (Honey Select) or sex-themed traditional gameplay (Corruption of Champions, sex combat RPGM titles etc.).

And in case you were aiming at the personal psychology of how we approach a title, that also varies a lot. For Makina I couldn't be bothered to slog through all the poorly written "corruption", grabbed the CG rip and watched a video of the ending out of morbid curiosity more than any real attachment and don't feel like I lost anything from doing so. On the other hand something like Rogue-like or Rain's Rave just wouldn't be the same without the sex-focused interactivity of directing persistent characters around.

I am still struggling to relate the bulk of your post to the question you asked in the title and the poll. Reduced to that level the answer can be "both" (required by definition IMO), "neither" (each on their own is not sufficient) or a detailed explanation of which aspect I focus on depending on genre, individual features of a specific product or simply my mood at the time. Fairy Picturebook has no story worth mentioning, a very grindy dungeon-based potentially SFW gameplay loop which I can get hooked on for a while, and a fairly detached touching simulator with some rather quirky dress-up and fetish options. The dungeoneering game would still be playable (albeit nothing special) without any of the porn, meanwhile the touching simulator on its own without any need for dungeon grinding would still qualify as a "porn game" to me because it has significant interactivity.

So what exactly is the point of your question and especially the poll?

 

[DawnCry]

I don't agree with your definition, to me the two are separate components and both are required to be deserving of the label "porn game" in my opinion. Many visual novels are just picture books not actual games.


But there are different ways the two components can interact. "Porn as a reward" with no sexual element to the preceding gameplay (and "porn as punishment" i.e. Game Over Rape) would still qualify as porn games, but a different type of porn game than sex simulators (Honey Select) or sex-themed traditional gameplay (Corruption of Champions, sex combat RPGM titles etc.).

And in case you were aiming at the personal psychology of how we approach a title, that also varies a lot. For Makina I couldn't be bothered to slog through all the poorly written "corruption", grabbed the CG rip and watched a video of the ending out of morbid curiosity more than any real attachment and don't feel like I lost anything from doing so. On the other hand something like Rogue-like or Rain's Rave just wouldn't be the same without the sex-focused interactivity of directing persistent characters around.

I am still struggling to relate the bulk of your post to the question you asked in the title and the poll. Reduced to that level the answer can be "both" (required by definition IMO), "neither" (each on their own is not sufficient) or a detailed explanation of which aspect I focus on depending on genre, individual features of a specific product or simply my mood at the time. Fairy Picturebook has no story worth mentioning, a very grindy dungeon-based potentially SFW gameplay loop which I can get hooked on for a while, and a fairly detached touching simulator with some rather quirky dress-up and fetish options. The dungeoneering game would still be playable (albeit nothing special) without any of the porn, meanwhile the touching simulator on its own without any need for dungeon grinding would still qualify as a "porn game" to me because it has significant interactivity.

So what exactly is the point of your question and especially the poll?

Mate it's really simple, I have noticed that you have a tendency to go in circles rather than focusing on the point.

"Many visual novels are just picture books not actual games", the irony is that what I'm talking about is within what you say and give it no importance, you see those visual novels that following your words are picture books and not actual games? that's what I labelled as porn games for the sake of discussion.

It's a question of if you as an adult game player prefer those "picture books" over a game with "gameplay and conflict" and just to explain what you want to explain over it.

I just believe that you overthink about things so you end up missing what people talk about. Hope this time is clear enough.

 

[Deleted member 229118]

So going back to the point the questions would be:

1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

Games.
I use hentai tv, hentai to read, motherless or xvidoes for porn.

1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

Gameplay based ones are preferable.
Risk Management can be good as long the risk can be easly managed gameplay wise.
For example: keeping a girl relationship up to prevent her from cheating on you is fine.
Having to agree with everything she says and obey her every word is not.
Having her raped because i didnt walk her home?
Only fine if we get a warning about the fact she is going through rape alley.
So basicly risk Management is fine as long it doesnt require constant effort.
Minnor busy work(like changing ammo during a fire fight and not playing an entire militery campaign)
And anything that requires a walkthrought failed as a game.

2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

Too many visual novels.
If i want to read.
Hentai 2 read will suffice.
Or mcstories.
Or any of the thousent of other site's who's stories are flat out better.

Favorite at this moment is a coint flip between stationmaster and superpowered.
Stationmaster is free cities(best texted based game ever but i played it to death) with animations.
It is a buggy mess but it allows for so much freedom.
What i would change is being able to have slave's wear cloth's while fucking.
It is more a turn on fucking someone with a skirt on then off.
Also like to see the ability to have slave's deside what to wear.
So i can get a suprised how my slave's are dressed.

Superpowered is a game that give you a big cast of woman, A large selection of fetishes, A decent story.
What i would change:
1: Allow us to rename the main character.
Malaficus is a vastly superior name to billy.
2: Have billy understand he is a villian and stop pretending he is a hero.
3: Have using powers to control others accauly give you evil points.(right now only insanity does so)
4: Expand mind control(favorite fetish tho i understand why baal the dev doesnt do so. It is overpowered already. Having billy make smart use of mind control would remove all challange from the game)

3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

Examples:
-Fetishes
-Context of the game
-Gameplay
-Game pictures and girls
-Animation
-Risk management
-Realistic interactions
-Humour
-Writing
-Attention to detail

Priority list:
1: Fetishes.
2: Context of the game.
3: Gameplay.
4: Character personality.
5 Writting.
6: Attention to details.

4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).

Unavoidable scenes are auto delete.
It brings me back to risk Management.
I am fine with bad stuff happening because i fucked up.
I hate being forced through something i shoud be able to avoid.
Cutscene incomptent needs to die out.


To me the most important part of a game is the gameplay.
Without gameplay i might as while go and watch/read porn.
The problem with good gameplay is that finding the right balance of work vs reward is very difficult.
Too much work and it becomes a grind to little and it becomes meaningless.
For example: In superpowered the better the power the more expensive it is.
This create a nature gameplay choice: Do i got for cheap first or grind money and get the best?
Likewise the game early game is grinding as hell but once you unlock your first real power you be to busy to notice the grind(mind controling a dozen or so girls takes time and effort but the rewards are worth it)
The game has a lot of anti grind mods.

Where in imperial gatekeeper the gameplay is simply but fun.
You pretty much balance doing your job vs molesting the girl who's password you are checking.

Of station master where i spend more time trying to build a good station then fucking.
Or lab rats 2 where putting togather sets of cloths for my slave's to wear is the most fun part of the game.

Games dont need to be complex but they do need to be fun.
And fun is subjective.
For me management games are fun.
Rpg are to linear and visual novels arent games.
As for strategy games.
I used to like them but then i discovered Managment games.
I am more interested in building then moving 500 apm to destroy building.

 

[Sphere42]

"Many visual novels are just picture books not actual games", the irony is that what I'm talking about is within what you say and give it no importance, you see those visual novels that following your words are picture books and not actual games? that's what I labelled as porn games for the sake of discussion.

Except you asked about porn games in general rather than visual novels specifically so I assumed you merely used those as an example.

It's a question of if you as an adult game player prefer those "picture books" over a game with "gameplay and conflict" and just to explain what you want to explain over it.

Except the moment you add meaningful choices, which a lot of visual novels obviously do, they fit into my definition of a "game" again which is where I got confused.

The other aspects of my replies are still relevant though, I cannot give a fixed priority list of individual elements. Get Mity to write and illustrate a "picture book" and I'll probably enjoy it a lot even if it's mostly softcore because the art style and writing (in relation to the original Avatar cartoon) are what make it compelling to me. Convert Rain's Rave and I will lazily flip through the CG. But I would absolutely love a completely plot-free non-rapey fully interactive tentacle breeding simulator too, for entirely different reasons. So, trying to go through your list:

Spoiler: 1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

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Spoiler: 1a. If you take them as porn, would you hate having to deal with risk management? would you be okay with it if you can directly deactivate it?

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Spoiler: 1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

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Spoiler: 2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

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Spoiler: 3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

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Spoiler: 4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).

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[DawnCry]

Sphere42 thanks for the answers, overall perhaps it could be easier if I said nukige vs adult games?.

In nukiges it's usually a very basic story that serves to deliver the sex scenes. Perhaps an example would be more useful, do you know the imouto paradise games?, Funbag fantasy perhaps?.

Overall the question that is the main point of the discussion is if you prefer games like that or more gameplay based ones like let's say sengoku rance or perhaps kamidori alchemy meister (I would say it's quite answered in your post, but feel free to add anything you want)

If I have to talk about VN's there are very few that actually manage to make me interested, many times they are really route based without feeling even near a normal story, rather than a VN I personally prefer a sandbox + special date events.

 

[Droid Productions]

If I have to talk about VN's there are very few that actually manage to make me interested, many times they are really route based without feeling even near a normal story, rather than a VN I personally prefer a sandbox + special date events.

Yeah, that's my preference as well; Kinetic novels feel like the worst of all worlds, neither real porn nor real games.

Sandboxes with special events (tied to a timeline, or just unlocked by progression) at least feel like games. The other things I'm looking for is an emotional connection to the other characters. This is something normal porn falls down on, it's rare that I actually care about anyone in a porn movie enough that she's anything other than eye-candy, but in a *game* I can often feel some degree of connection in the character.

 

[Thr3L]

1. Do you take adult games more like porn or games?

to me it's as much porn as it is a game, just like manga hentai are porn and manga, idk one without the other it wouldn't be an adult game.

1a. If you take them as porn, would you hate having to deal with risk management? would you be okay with it if you can directly deactivate it?

1b. If you take them as a game, do you prefer gameplay based ones or risk management ones? if the second what would be your intensity of the risk to be optimal?

i don't really know how to respond to that overall i take them as interactive stories, i like to see the impact of my choices and often make multiples save to see what other choices would have done to the story.

2. How do you feel about current adult games in the english market? do you have a favourite game? is there something that you would love to change?

i feel like there is more and more games beign developped and it's nice to see, my favorites games are sumer time saga,beign a dik, dream of desire, harem hotel, mythic manor, taffy tales and waifu academy.

if i would change something it would be the visual art, too much use daz 3d or Honey Select, it doesn't bother me that much but it's nice to see some variety, in a weird way the more you play different games the more the 3d models feels like actors.

3. If you are asked to choose between game a) and b), could you make a priority list of what would you take into account to take your choice?

-coherent universe
-visual appeal (wich is very subjective)
-Animation is a big plus but only if the rest follow
-Humour (can be really fun is the story is subject to it)
-haracter with well defined personallity, i don't want them be be bland or forgettable
-lots of interactions, even if it doesn't change the overall story i want to interact and not reading large block of text before beign able to do or say anything.

4. Are you bothered if a game has unavoidable scenes with fetishes you dislike but that you can skip them? (basically characters will acknoledge that it happened, just that you aren't forced to see the scene itself).

i couldn't care less, if it's something i'm not into well i'm not going to be aroused but i would still watch the scene.

 

[anne O'nymous]

It depends on the game, most of the adult games I play are just that, games, and while they have adult elements I see them as games.

Mostly the same.

Take a movie like Top Gun. Despite it's (at its time) torrid sex scene, it's not a porn movie. And the same apply for games. It's not because there's sex inside that it's inevitably a porn game.
Before being a matter of gameplay, I think that it rely on the story. If the said story is cheap or focus only on the sex, then it's a porn game. But if the story try to tell us something (even if it fail), then it's an adult game.

Which lead to the main problem of this survey : its lack of an "it depend" option.

 

[ChaosOpen]

Overall I kind of want to see the opinion of those that wanna answer. Basically I want to see a bit more into the paradox of adult games, because some people take it more as porn and just want to choose what happens while others would prefer just to play a game.

While there are a handful of visual novels that I would classify as "games," one example that springs to mind is Utawarerumono which I greatly enjoyed, you also have sims such as Teaching Feeling, but most are just "click the mouse until the credits roll," that's not a game, it's a power-point presentation. Though some visual novels do attempt to put in gameplay they tend to do it very poorly and I wish they wouldn't even bother; it tends to be terribly balanced or monotonous. Though I find myself referring to them as "games" simply out of habit than what I really think of them.

I personally view them as 18+ love stories, we all know that successful romance will end with sex, might as well include it, and I'm a bit of a sucker for a good romance story. The thing is, the fact that it has to be a good romance story really makes it hard to respect a lot of visual novels and I end up calling them porn because that ends up being the only good part about the game.

The amount of time until the sex starts doesn't really affect how I view it, they are banging each other within the first hour in

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and continue throughout the length, I don't view it as porn. I'd say School Days is probably the most realistic depiction of a high school love triangle I've ever seen. Makoto is like every young high school male, he just wants to lose his V card like everyone else, problem is following his success he managed to find himself way over his head in a situation most adults aren't handled to equip, and he has no idea what to do about it. It was a messy clusterfuck full of easily avoidable mistakes, but if words can describe one's high school sex life it would be those.

There is also the other end of the spectrum

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was almost 10 hours of uninterrupted suffering with a few sex scenes. From the characters to the writing to the plot, there was nothing good about the game, the only thing it had going for it was the sex scenes where suddenly there was a dramatic spike in writing quality. It doesn't make sense to call it anything but porn.

So, while I don't normally consider them "games," it isn't the same shit I watch on HentaiHaven either, the most accurate description is "romance stories with sex." That probably why they are called "visual novels."

Rivals: Basically the risk of NTR, overall I personally believe that to make a good game you can just add a hard-lock at the beginning, as "Jealousy" makes directly asking if NTR should be on or off and then for those that have it activated less option based and more as a consequence.

I just wanted to add something, I hate NTR rivals in games, mostly for their execution, I never get the feeling that this person has any business being a romantic rival. I mean, can you really call a guy who will rape my crush then corrupt her with his sexual prowess isn't so much a romantic rival? It seems like even if she falls in love with me he could still rape her. This is further shown in the H-scenes, normally there are only a couple vanilla scenes with the MC while the huge majority of the CGs are devoted to the other guy. I've played my fair share of "avoidable NTR" games where I'd clear the good route and only unlock 1-2 of the 10-20 CG scenes and can't help but get the feeling that the creator really didn't want me to take that route. I find that more often than not if a creator included NTR, it is because he wants you to take the NTR path. And the only good NTR game I've ever seen was

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, which I think only worked because it was a Yaoi game, as you can't have the netori guy actually wanting a three-some the entire game with the MC not wanting him to enter their relationship rather than being kicked out of the relationship so the Netori uses his partner against him to force him to relent.

 

[Joshua Tree]

That a bit as asking do you see an adult movie as a porn movie, or an movie for adults?

Looking at threads on this site. You will find complaints about lack of sex in porn games. But the gist of things can be, it's a game for adults, and doesn't necessary need to be an awful lot of sex/porn. It can just be a game with mature themes (and yes, nudity and sex, but doesn't necessary need to be the primary elements of the content).

It's kinda hard to answer how you see adult games. Because "Leisure Suit Larry" is an adult game. And so is, I guess any games sold that doesn't meet the PG-13 rating. A "porn" game will always have porn content, but an adult game doesn't.