Gamedevs should work together with 3D artists

[morphnet]

Still has nothing to do with the original scenario this thread is about, which is without investors.

Also that wasn't my link, it was yours. You came up with it and said "here look what I else found on the website".

But I'm not surprised you're starting to lose track of all the excuses you've come up with.

You must be registered to see the links

" In my earlier article,

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, I discuss a way to establish what your Upfront would be - in the spreadsheet attached to that post, you can find what your Upfront should be under "Asking Budget". Keep in mind that if the game fails commercially, the remainder of your Upfront is the only money you'll have - having safe margins on this amount makes a huge difference. "

It was a link in the article YOU linked, it was there is explain information in the article YOU linked. Are you saying people should read your links but not understand them?

Easy:

Saying something is NOT common is completely different from saying it doesn't exist.

I was also searching for what YOU said to which was projects with zero funds looking for freelance good digital artists to start using rev-sharing / commission only.

I actually mixed that up with other screens that I took out of the OP yesterday, because I wouldn't think you're stubborn enough to keep arguing against the huge amount of resources disproving your assumptions.

You are lying, you literally quoted me and the link AND added "but hey let's look at how old the oldest entry is.." so you knew exactly which page it was.


you were over selling like you have been this whole time and NOT reading like you have been this whole time.

In any 1st world country with employee rights. If you scroll up you'll have a good read about this. In many countries employers have to reduce hours by law.

Scrolled up.. saw pictures you posted....

But even if not - people manage to switch jobs, even in 3rd world countries. They're doing it right now, in this very second you're here, whining in a forum, that it's sooo impossible in reality.

So now it's not cutting down hours, it's switching jobs completely....
In the hopes a porn game MIGHT make $5k a month....

Also didn't you say earlier...

When the other project is done and one returns fully to the main job, the monthly comissions from the finished project will add up.

All the succesfull devs and artists have found ways to make their side-hustle happen.

and thousands more dev's were not successful or are not able to make a living off their side project and the ratio is NOT in their favor to start with and now you are trying your best to make it more risky for them

Why don't you make up another example, with a guy who has 5 wives and 15 children and who couldn't even develop a game if he was gifted 3k a month and a house to live in, because it's still not enough to pay for his family? This way you can keep pointing at the sheer impossibility of becoming self-employed no matter the opportunities.

I'll give him another 1k! Oh shoot, his mother is in hospital in a country without good healthcare and he has to pay another 2k a month for he treatment. Now he can't become a game dev again! Poor Robert.

Maybe self-employment and taking up on a risky job like being a game developer isn't for anyone? Why would you even try to bring a group of people into the conversation who are naturally unqualified for the job, due to their life circumstances? Ah yeah, I forgot: because you've been throwing one thing after another in the way just to avoid facing the facts.

You don't need to fix it, it showcased your behaviour perfectly fine.
That's exactly how you behave here - embarrassing, I know. The cool thing is you don't have to, you're free to stop making a fool of yourself anytime.

Maybe click the link to the guide in the OP

Also I didn't switch qualifications. Mentioning that you have a degree in the field you've been working in for a decade isn't switching anything.

That being said, I'll stick with what I announced earlier: I won't engage in further conversations with you. It's just a waste of valuable lifetime. You're just guessing into the blue without any actual knowledge of subjects and it's tiresome to sift through your fantasy constructs and correct all the mistakes.

I'm just going to lump the resting of your rambling together here, you seem to be having a episode there or something.....

Your problem is you aren't grounded in reality, from your sales pitch to your replies all are exaggerated.

Not common becomes does not exist, bad idea becomes impossible to do, might make a little money become more and more money comes in etc. etc. etc.

Let's do a quick overview of your "idea"

Games are bad, they can be good with good graphics and animations

Dev must find a good artist, enter a rev-sharing contract with them

they can work a lot or a little doesn't matter

when money starts to comes in cut hours at main job or quit main job and find part time job or job with less hours

5k is a realistic goal for a good game

make 5k, split it 3.5k dev 1.5k artist

profit

I think many game devs would actually benefit a t o n by working together with an NSFW 3D artist. Not only would the development time of the game speed up like insane - the game developer could focus on the technical aspects and the writing instead of bothering with stuff he isn't good at -, but the game would also be just a triple A experience in terms of sex scenes. Which, in theory, can even make up for not the best writing and gameplay mechanics.

You can take breaks as you want, you can do it in your own pace and you can explore all sorts of kinks.

Optimally these projects run on the side. Like I said, the creation phase has no time pressure. People can just work 2 hours a day on the side while staying in their stable income job until the initial release.

Make 5k a month, give 30% to the artist, that's 1500 extra bucks for him on the side and 3500 for you. For a part-time project that's absolutely fantastic, and 5K is a realistic goal for a good game. With excellent animations from an actual 3D NSFW artist, 5k is probably even pessimistic, given that you'll leave a lot of other developers in that area behind.

Is this idea pitched to a specific game or dev? Nope, it's pitched for a majority (context of thread 3d, graphics only/animations only, graphics and animations)

I think many game devs would actually benefit a t o n by working together with an NSFW 3D artist.

No one is saying it's impossible to be self employed, no one is saying it's impossible to make a living of making games or making porn games.

I am saying your "idea" is terrible as a pitch for a large group of dev's.

I am saying that you are selling your "idea" in a deliberately misleading and dishonest way.

I am saying that you are deliberately leaving out all the other criteria needed for success trying to make your pitch look better than it is

I am saying you are deliberately misleading people about the chances of success.

Instead of giving an honest overview, listing pro's and con's, listing success stories AND failed stories and showing the pitfalls to avoid.
Instead of offering alternatives and showing your research into market trends and into the success and failures in certain areas
affecting porn games.
Instead of adding links and guides and articles, or adding a proper comprehensive overview...

Instead of any of this you make wild claims, share misleading information and frame it in a dishonest way.
So yes, I am saying you are full of BS and no one should listen to your pitch.

 

[Fuchsschweif]

EDIT:
Unfortunately still every image-creation skills are worthless (in sense of creating a financial outcome) when you don't fit the taste of the audience. I think, you can immensively increase the probability to make a successful game, when you put your well made images in a college setting, have a alpha-male MC who starts to generate a Harem and other men are only there to be put to the ground.
Games, that don't follow this scheme can be successful, but it is much harder.

I don't think so, it's rather that you'll naturally find your audience. The game comes first, then you attract the people who are into it.

One of the most successful NSFW developers is NLT Media and the MC in their games is usually at the teenage age, not an alpha (just a normal and kind guy) surrounded by not few mature women. Regarding the setting, that ranges from being stuck in a huge mansion in a storm on mountain up to a tropical island where you hunt for treasures with a lot of caves and ancient magic.

That (and their fantastic animations) puts them on the very top. The setting you described is often used and popular, that's right. But I've seen many really well performing developers doing completely different stuff.

 

[M$hot]

While I agree with some of the sentiment ('Gosh this game concept "looks" dope, if only the graphics weren't dang pixel art') And I'm not going into the whole "revenue sharing is an industry standard" debate, I still see some issues.

I would feel bad asking them to work for free, so the worst deal I'd offer them is a hybrid "30% with a base $2000" or something. The idea of asking someone to give me 2 hours every day for 6 months in a project they will never believe in or care about as much as I do? Gives me cold sweats. I'd feel somewhere between guilty and dirty. If I have faith it will be worth $10k a month and $30k from Steam sales (150k over a year), why wouldn't I just front the costs? I think the percentage with that confidence is low, and the percentage of those that aren't delusional is not that big either.

And I've had this conversation with other people before, the higher the number we're talking about, the more alternatives there are. Spending $3 for a microtransaction, sure, what else could you really do with that? A cup of coffee? What about 200k? What else could you spend that on (and in my mind realistically you are spending to develop an adult game, not investing) It could be 6 months traveling the planet, it could be a wedding and a chunky downpayment on a house, it could be a Maserati, it could be invested in Coca Cola stock and get a steady $536 a month in dividend payments. The list goes on. So just how passionate does someone have to be to invest that deeply and choose to spend it on developing an adult game above ALL alternatives.

Free solo development is basically like riding a kickbike, little chance at a moonshot, you won't move that fast but a crash/crashes won't do much damage either. You've exclusively spent/wasted your own time and money. I run my own business (completely out of this industry) and managing employees, keeping them motivated without letting them take advantage, letting them know they are appreciated without giving them the thought to keep your success hostage, it's a job in itself. So I can part-time the specialization that I used to do full time and hired people for, but I've added the part time job of manager, so my hours are still the same. Now I just spend 50% of the time doing stuff I don't enjoy because I'm a slave to the income it generates for me to live comfortably.

Sorry, that may have gotten a bit offtrack, I hope it made sense.

 

[Fuchsschweif]

I would feel bad asking them to work for free

It's not considered working for free in the industry. It's rather seen as an investment. The promise of earning ongoing comissions over several years is tempting and something that can easily be underestimated, especially by people not familiar with such models from the casual working world.

Many artists generate a decent side-income from that, others can even completely live off it, when they for instance go all in with selling assets and other digital products in their niche.

If a project you've been working on performs really well, you'll easily earn more than

"30% with a base $2000"

that with 50% and base $0. Because those extra 20% will easily amount up to 2k and beyond. So if a project looks promising in terms of sales, giving away 10%-20% for 2k fixed is a bad deal. If Patreon makes $1000 a month and you get $200 instead of $500, it takes only 6 months until you lost $1800 of revenue. Another month and your deal turns into the negative.

I wouldn't view this as strict. If both are bloody beginners, which I assume by your description, it's a mutual project to grow and get something for their portfolios. There's no need to overcompensate as some sort of shame-fee, because you team up with people on the same level. You'll be all broke at this point probably.

If I have faith it will be worth $10k a month and $30k from Steam sales (150k over a year), why wouldn't I just front the costs?

That's another story. If you're faithful that this are numbers actually available to you, then you'll probably already be sitting on a lot of money from past projects and in that case you could pay someone loan, yes.

But the comission only model isn't only used on low budget projects, it's also actually popular amongst high budget projects for the very same reason I described above. Experienced artists know that, and if they are being offered a position in your project where they do basically 50% of the entire game - the entire visuals -, they most likely won't agree to a contract where they get fixed money for a lower comission percentage in return (well, depends on the exact numbers). Comission always beats direct money on profitable projects.

Things change of course when you're not indie anymore but an actual game design company with many more employees than just a handful. The more people working on the same thing, the more likely it is to pay a monthly loan and nothing else.

What about 200k? What else could you spend that on (and in my mind realistically you are spending to develop an adult game, not investing)

That's the very definition of investment. You put it into the development of a game, and when it's released the money flows back until it generates net profit for you.

But yes, people who do art and people who like to develop games, even from the technical side, are usually very passionate about it. It's much more fun than burning 200k for travelling the world. For artists their job is not just a necessity to survive as it is for many people in casual jobs. They do what actually fullfils their soul.

I would always choose to invest new money into gear or education with which I can create better things than flying to some sunny isle and lie around on a beach. That lasts only two weeks while the former lasts a lifetime.

 

[Living In A Lewd World]

I don't think so, it's rather that you'll naturally find your audience. The game comes first, then you attract the people who are into it.

One of the most successful NSFW developers is NLT Media and the MC in their games is usually at the teenage age, not an alpha (just a normal and kind guy) surrounded by not few mature women. Regarding the setting, that ranges from being stuck in a huge mansion in a storm on mountain up to a tropical island where you hunt for treasures with a lot of caves and ancient magic.

That (and their fantastic animations) puts them on the very top. The setting you described is often used and popular, that's right. But I've seen many really well performing developers doing completely different stuff.

I would define Alpha Male as the man who can defy any problems and get all the girls he likes to himself and protect them from the evil (other men). The appearance can actually be quite different, even the good old "Old Dirty Bastard" might be possible, but I currently can't remember an example that made this successful.

There are unfortunately quite some examples, that show that one has a much harder life, when doesn't follow most of the scheme. It is still not impossible but takes much more time and skills, that go beyond pure image production.

I know from at least one dev, who was quite good in image production and produced a school-setting-game with beautiful looking girls who were not meant to be only to the MC got not that much commercial success but rather death threats (see Rising Bliss: https://f95zone.to/threads/rising-bliss-v1-0-2-studio-mystic.105635/).
And a dev, that I personally like very much, who creates beautiful images and is a hilarious writer doesn't make much more than 200 Dollars since he started in 2019 (https://f95zone.to/threads/the-anomalous-dr-vibes-v0-18-1-drvibes.20377/)
The most successful game-dev who produced a game with a female MC, I know is EvaKiss with currently 2500 paying members. So she is not even in the Top 50 of Patreon-Adult-Devs (https://f95zone.to/threads/our-red-string-ch-12-full-eva-kiss.48813/) (I actually just saw, that she only came over the 2000 subscribers mark, with her second game with male and female MC) and she does much more than producing interesting and good looking images. Especially Good Girls Gone Bad was quite a complex and creative game. Other devs who make female centered games are far below that line.
If you make a pure lesbian game your probability to get a commercial success is even more reduced.
The most succesful dev I know in this regard is probably "Naughty Road" who had on Patreon ca. 1.500 subscribers at their peak (currently 900): https://f95zone.to/threads/light-of-my-life-ch-1-7-v1-0-0-naughty-road.29628/. But their game lived more from the story than from the images they produced. But other lesbian games, even with very good images have much less subscribers.
And another community, that has to be mentioned here is the gay-game-community, where one can find many great artists, but where it is very hard to live from anything they produce. The most successful example here is probably "Aaryn" who started his Patreon in 2019 and has currently roughly 600 to 700 monthly subscribers (ca. 1100 at the peak). And also this game lives probably heavily from the story, it tells.

 

[M$hot]

It's not considered working for free in the industry. It's rather seen as an investment. The promise of earning ongoing comissions over several years is tempting and something that can easily be underestimated, especially by people not familiar with such models from the casual working world.

Many artists generate a decent side-income from that, others can even completely live off it, when they for instance go all in with selling assets and other digital products in their niche.

If a project you've been working on performs really well, you'll easily earn more than

Like I just said though, I am very much not taking part in the 'what is industry standard' debate. I personally would feel like I am asking someone to put in hours for zero pay that may become a higher number, may not. You saying its not, sure, who knows, I just know how I'd feel, and the personal answer is scummy.

that with 50% and base $0. Because those extra 20% will easily amount up to 2k and beyond. So if a project looks promising in terms of sales, giving away 10%-20% for 2k fixed is a bad deal. If Patreon makes $1000 a month and you get $200 instead of $500, it takes only 6 months until you lost $1800 of revenue. Another month and your deal turns into the negative.

I wouldn't view this as strict. If both are bloody beginners, which I assume by your description, it's a mutual project to grow and get something for their portfolios. There's no need to overcompensate as some sort of shame-fee, because you team up with people on the same level. You'll be all broke at this point probably.

The numbers were demonstrative, I feel there should be a base level until the revenue split catches up to/surpasses the base. And If the Patreon makes $1000, I would make $700 while the artist is making $2000, so in those 6 months they'd be having an additional 10.8k (12000 instead of 1200), not a loss.

Now if the Patreon is making 50k a month, sure, they'd be missing out by getting "only" 15k instead of 25k. But I reckon this deal is better than going full rev-share in 99% of cases when it comes to adult games. And I don't care about their portfolio, I care about my game, so I should be paying as someone receiving efforts undertaken exclusively for my taste.
After all, the artist gets no say if they are just here to make me art. It's not overcompensating, it's fair. And why would I try to find someone at my level if I want a good result?

That's another story. If you're faithful that this are numbers actually available to you, then you'll probably already be sitting on a lot of money from past projects and in that case you could pay someone loan, yes.

But the comission only model isn't only used on low budget projects, it's also actually popular amongst high budget projects for the very same reason I described above. Experienced artists know that, and if they are being offered a position in your project where they do basically 50% of the entire game - the entire visuals -, they most likely won't agree to a contract where they get fixed money for a lower comission percentage in return (well, depends on the exact numbers). Comission always beats direct money on profitable projects.

Things change of course when you're not indie anymore but an actual game design company with many more employees than just a handful. The more people working on the same thing, the more likely it is to pay a monthly loan and nothing else.

And I think most artists would actually much prefer me to pay them a flat fee. Unless they have deep faith in my project and the money it will bring it, they'd probably make more going with hourly/per render basis going by the ocean of abandoned AND barely funded games we have on this site. 99% of projects on this site don't make money, to forego a fixed paycheck for what may be? I can't see it. Sure in the industry, but not on F95.

I also don't think the visuals are 50%, writing, coding, bugtesting, managing, financing and visuals, isn't the artist only doing 1/6th? It's the most important 1/6th probably, but I don't think it splits in middle that easily.

That's the very definition of investment. You put it into the development of a game, and when it's released the money flows back until it generates net profit for you.

But yes, people who do art and people who like to develop games, even from the technical side, are usually very passionate about it. It's much more fun than burning 200k for travelling the world. For artists their job is not just a necessity to survive as it is for many people in casual jobs. They do what actually fullfils their soul.

I would always choose to invest new money into gear or education with which I can create better things than flying to some sunny isle and lie around on a beach. That lasts only two weeks while the former lasts a lifetime.

It's only investment if there is a positive ROI you can reasonably expect. How many of the games on this website were/are running a profit? And I'm not talking about $37 a month from Patreon kind of profit, I mean if they threw 200k at it, would they see a return higher than that? 99% chance you won't, so calling it an investment rather than just paying for something seems very optimistic. "When its released the money flows back", I'd need 10K sales when its available for free on a pirate site to break even, so that feels unlikely.

And my point was regarding the fact that the more* money something will cost, the more alternative ways to spend it there are, and we are spending, not investing. And its pretty big to assume I'd find an artist that is very passionate about the things I want from them. I totally believe they can be very passionate people, but they're being asked to make what works for me, so unless we have very similar tastes they're probably not going to feel very fulfilled working on it. And a 200k 6 month trip across the world wouldn't "last only 2 weeks" by its very definition It would be 26 weeks. And yeah, 26 weeks just laying on the beach doesn't sound super fun.

But from the way you are approaching this subject, I don't think we're going to fully agree on much. So let me conclude with:
'I am glad you are passionate about more appealing adult games, no issues with someone advocating for higher quality. Have a good one!'

 

[Fuchsschweif]

There are unfortunately quite some examples, that show that one has a much harder life, when doesn't follow most of the scheme. It is still not impossible but takes much more time and skills, that go beyond pure image production.

I think the devil lies in the detail. You say the first creator failed because he implemented NTR, but take a look at Nenad who makes NTR-heavy games:

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He makes $1480 a month from Patreon alone. He also had a lot of pledges on "Buy me a coffee" on top, idk why that page is currently down.

So, what's the difference? The first game you shared uses the old fashioned Illusion models. I played many games with them and if I stumble over a new game having them, it's almost a no brainer not to play it. Simply because the market is oversaturated with these models, and most devs aren't able to do custom animations, so you see the same standard sex poses in every single game a thousand times recycled.

Nenad on the other hand has completely unique models and artstyle and uses a different engine. So of course effort matters!

Very few games can be really successful these days with the old Illusion stuff. Eternum is one example, but Eternum does not only excel with absolute peak writing and a very interesting story, the models are also custom and don't just look like the standard ones. Compare this, your first game:



Eternum:




That's obviously a different league, not only with the models but image composition, colors, lighting, shadows and so on. That's why I emphasize to work with someone knowing their craft in terms of visuals.

Your second example has the same problem, standard models thrown into standard scenes without any effort to create a cinematic atmosphere:



This is a game I wouldn't even download after the screenshot, simply because I feel oversaturated by the many games I've played with the exact same atmosphere and models. If I had to pledge one of both games, I would clearly choose Eternum.

 

[Fuchsschweif]

The numbers were demonstrative, I feel there should be a base level until the revenue split catches up to/surpasses the base. And If the Patreon makes $1000, I would make $700 while the artist is making $2000, so in those 6 months they'd be having an additional 10.8k (12000 instead of 1200), not a loss.

I can't quite follow this calculation, but hey - if you want to throw additional 2k at the 3D artist while granting the exact same % of comissions to ease your mind, I'm sure they will gladly accept.

And I don't care about their portfolio, I care about my game, so I should be paying as someone receiving efforts undertaken exclusively for my taste.

Comission only is also a payment, just delayed. And regarding the taste, well, that's a difficult topic. When you hire a 3D artist because you acknowledge that you're not good at visuals, you most likely don't want do direct him to create (your) worse ideas in 4K. You will most likey roughly let him know what kind of scenes you want, but he'll make the aesthetic and creative decisions on how to execute them. If you're constantly demanding changes and he has to explain to you why this and that is bad, then you'll quickly lose the speed boost the collab grants because you two are constantly arguing.

Some artists are better than others in being merely a service provider that just executes the exact ideas of others, but most desire some amount of autonomy in how they do things. So it's good to clearly communicate the roles before starting and ensuring that everyone agrees.

And why would I try to find someone at my level if I want a good result?

That just happens naturally. You have not so much to offer in terms of expertise, your budget will be nonexistent and your project ideas will most likely be not that fleshed out as a beginner, so the kind of artists you have access to is pretty much limited by that.

And I think most artists would actually much prefer me to pay them a flat fee. Unless they have deep faith in my project and the money it will bring it, they'd probably make more going with hourly/per render basis going by the ocean of abandoned AND barely funded games we have on this site.

That's true, but those artist you speak of here will look elsewhere, at developers who already run 1-3 successful titles with monthly Patreon income they're willing to pay you from.

You can't be a bloody beginner who's in the same league of "perhaps my game will be one of those abandoned ones in the ocean" but in the same time hire people that you have to pay with a $2000 upfront payment. That's just two different worlds that don't collide usually.

They could work for someone else who pays them 4k upfront and then maybe 10% comission for the time being, already running a successful Patreon, so that 10% are predictable while for your Patreon it's uncertain what you will generate.

That means the kind of artists you have access to aren't those that receive 2k upfront payment. They're at your league, you both are uncertain yet about your performance, and you will both just work aside "for fun" and then share the revenue and see how far you come.

I also don't think the visuals are 50%, writing, coding, bugtesting, managing, financing and visuals, isn't the artist only doing 1/6th? It's the most important 1/6th probably, but I don't think it splits in middle that easily.

That's not the scope I would expect from a beginner. Writing and coding yes. Bugtesting - might be done as well from the 3D artist too, in the end he has to play the game to see how all his scenes play out, how smooth the transitions are and so on. Don't forget that visuals can also include UI elements, the menu, the text-box, custom portraits for characters and so on.

Financing will probably be zero as you start out, and there's not much to manage at this point (like having your own website, doing SEO optimization, doing advertisement). So a 50/50 split at this stage might be fair.

If you're a bit more advanced and the business side demands more from you, on top of coding and writing, then sure, the cut could be different. I suggested 70:30 for that earlier in the thread. But it really depends on how much of the visuals the 3D artist is doing, how much you pay for advertisements and such things.

It's only investment if there is a positive ROI you can reasonably expect. How many of the games on this website were/are running a profit? And I'm not talking about $37 a month from Patreon kind of profit, I mean if they threw 200k at it, would they see a return higher than that? 99% chance you won't, so calling it an investment rather than just paying for something seems very optimistic. "When its released the money flows back", I'd need 10K sales when its available for free on a pirate site to break even, so that feels unlikely.

Actually, I see many new developers who just started out in 2023 making good money on Patreon already. The numbers you use here like 200k are of course completely exaggerated. Since nobody at this stage puts so much money into his game, that's not the money you need to earn in order to get a positive ROI.

At this stage the most investments will simply be time, and it's hard to measure that in ROI. If all participants enjoy developing games and practicing their art along the way, while making some money and building their portfolio, for many that's a dream scenario for starters.

And a 200k 6 month trip across the world wouldn't "last only 2 weeks" by its very definition It would be 26 weeks. And yeah, 26 weeks just laying on the beach doesn't sound super fun.

If you have 200k lying around that you can just spend on whatever you want because you don't need them to survive or as safety-buffer, then you're already having some high income sources. In that case it's pretty much no issue to fund some game development aside. But again, if you had 200k available, you'd team up with some successful developers with promising projects, not with a bloody beginner without any save way to predict what he's capable of.

But from the way you are approaching this subject, I don't think we're going to fully agree on much. So let me conclude with:
'I am glad you are passionate about more appealing adult games, no issues with someone advocating for higher quality. Have a good one!'

+1

 

[tretch95]

The NSFW game market is one of the biggest in terms of making money. But in order to be at the top, the art really needs to be fantastic as well.

...and yet, Summertime Saga was rolling in cash with its horrendously ugly MC and his repulsive family. Basically every character in that game is unattractive.

I believe it actually was the first patreon porn game to crack the 5-digit income barrier.

Here's an example: https://f95zone.to/threads/the-bouncing-agency-v0-19-adn700.142560/

Ultra cringe!

This seems to be made with TK17, an ancient porn simulator. It looks horrible. There is zero effort involved in this, similar to games made with Virt-A-Mate. You just download some characters and animations, hit play, record it.

 

[Fuchsschweif]

...and yet, Summertime Saga was rolling in cash with its horrendously ugly MC and his repulsive family. Basically every character in that game is unattractive.

I believe it actually was the first patreon porn game to crack the 5-digit income barrier.

I find him actually one of the most appealing MCs, and the characters in the game are also hot asf. Most people think so too, that's why the game is so successful. Hand drawn 2D art is anyways very special.

Ultra cringe!

This seems to be made with TK17, an ancient porn simulator. It looks horrible. There is zero effort involved in this, similar to games made with Virt-A-Mate. You just download some characters and animations, hit play, record it.

That's definitely not made with TK17, it's VAM.

And VAM isn't just hit play and record. While it comes with its own UI, it's designed for animators to make custom animations. It just works similar to Blender and every other animation software. Skilled people can create astonishing animations with VAM as you can check out on the VAM marketplace. They do it all from scratch, some even using motion capture.

 

[tretch95]

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...


Dude this looks like horseshit.

If you consider this "great animations" then you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[Fuchsschweif]

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Dude this looks like horseshit.

If you consider this "great animations" then you have no idea what you're talking about.

It's rather that you don't have any idea what you're talking about, starting with confusing VAM with TK17 and not understanding how VAM works. You seem to be very self-centered. You assume that because you personally don't find the women hot in Summertime Saga, the game must've been successfull while having ugly women.

But it's more likely that your personal views simply don't align with what the majority likes.

Same goes for this title. This is mainly about bouncing boobs, and in that regard the developer delivers very decent animations. I also said the animations "are great and stand out from other games", not "the animations are state of the art and the best you can find".

It's about being noticed for doing something others don't, and in this case it's the focus on high quality animations when it comes to bouncing boobs. He puts a lot of effort into getting the physics right. And that's definitely a level of motion and detail you won't see in many NSFW games.

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[HDiddy]

And VAM isn't just hit play and record. While it comes with its own UI, it's designed for animators to make custom animations.

Unfortunately many folks use VaM in a hit play and record fashion. They download a scene, load their model and then hit play and record. Personally, even though TK17 is old...you can make some high quality animations in it. Making good animations is more about the actual animator not the tool. I have seen a lot of shit animations in VAM.

 

[Rafster]

Nah, I'll pass. Even if I find someone willing to do 3D or even 2D animation for a gay game or I had the money to hire one, I don't see myself working in a team again. Ever. I'm a control freak, and the game must be under my terms. Coding, writing, Ui (my game is real porn, so I'm not dealing with 3D yet. In my next game, I may change to Sims 4) must be exactly how I want.

I'll quote myself in a post on the dev's forum about this:

Heh, That's why I can't work in a team. Even with myself, I seem to have many personalities when I develop my game:

• The monkey coder: Complains every time the idea guy comes up with another "gameplay feature" and how insane is the spaghetti code of the game. He's the boss here directing everyone and whipping them in shape. Especially with the writer guy who slacks off to the last minute.
• The idea guy: The typical dude with LOTS of ideas for storylines, and gameplay features. He's the one that usually test the game and takes care of the general UI of the game. The other two hates him, they want him bleeding to death.
• The barely capable writer: He does 75% of the work in the game, in a barely readable english. Sometimes he comes up with ideas that the Idea man make even worse. Of course, Monkey coder cannot stay on the same room with anyone without exploding.
• The porn freak: He select the kinks, sex scenes and how it will appear. Writer fears that him get us out of Patreon one day, idea guy and monkey coder brings him to the meeting on purpose just to annoy Writer. Wants to have an orgy each meeting but everyone ghosts him.
• The inexistent PR Manager: Supposed to handle the communication with the players on Patreon, F95, itch, etc... he hasn't come for a few years and no one has seen him. The other four think he's dead or just escaping off his obligations on the team.

Now, I imagine myself working with an actual team, and it would be a mess