Deleted member 929426

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We barely learn of our own full history, how do you expect us to know others? :ROFLMAO:
Oddly enough, I know european countries better than US states
How many of us remember everything about our own personal history (i.e, childhood)? Trying to remember much from a time centuries or eons ago is asking a lot.
 

c3p0

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How many of us remember everything about our own personal history (i.e, childhood)? Trying to remember much from a time centuries or eons ago is asking a lot.
For mankind it is even more difficulty than for ourselve. Otherwise how would you explain that again and again mankind fails to avoid repeat it's own mistake?
Other than forgetting the only explanation would be madness, as one defintion of it would be doing the same thing consistently yet expect different results.;)
 
Feb 3, 2018
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I hate to get political here of all places, but I wonder what Runey's politics are.

Now, I get that this is a game, and at a certain point you get to explain away certain problems with "it's fiction.", but I don't think you quite get to do that with the economics of slavery. Plenty of people believe that slavery is beneficial to the slaveowners, but it's not. Slavery did not benefit a country like the US, in fact, the US had more economic growth after slavery was abolished. Slavery doesn't only mean that slaves have it horribly, it also means that the wealthy, the masters, also have it worse than they would if slaves were free - after all, slaves don't have much money to spend, slaves need guards to ensure that they work, and slaves never get to be managers or entrepreneurs or similar, even if that's where they would be the most beneficial to the society. Even in the modern world, there is an obvious difference between the countries that had slavery in 1750 and those that didn't, when comparing their economies.

Slavery doesn't make anyone wealthy or powerful. The "country X is powerful because they have slaves" line is wrong. Slavery is unnecessary. It makes things worse for everyone, and it doesn't make anyone powerful. What improves economies is liberty, freedom to work whatever job you want, to create whatever business people demand and lead it the way you see best, and freedom to trade freely with whomever you want. If slavery worked, you'd see a lot more of it in the wealthiest places on the planet, and you'd never see it abolished. But it doesn't.

I had a long response, but since I don't want to go into politics, I'll sum it up. Neither you nor the article are wholly right, nor are you or the article wholly wrong. It loses quite a bit of nuance and ignores the issues black people had after emancipation. That pokes holes in the theory, but it's also right in the sense slavery is at least partially responsible for keeping the South down. That said, until Trump, Washington (adjusted for inflation) was the richest President we ever had, with an adjusted net worth of nearly $600 million. Jefferson and many other slaveholding Presidents also had impressive net worths. That might not be super-rich, but that's nothing to scoff at.

Anyways, bringing this back, it's been stated that many slaves in this game are getting a decent wage, so they're able to contribute to the economy. Plus, there may be alternative ways of keeping the economy going. UBI doesn't seem like that crazy of an explanation, as it allows people to buy goods produced cheaply by elves. It could reasonably be funded with a higher sales tax. Alternatively, elves may take supplemental jobs. Even in today's economy Mexican workers send most of the money they make in areas like California home to their families, contributing very little to the host economy. It's not crazy to think construction or agriculture couldn't function with a group of people not reinvesting their cash into society and having it do well (California is still the best economy in the US) because of the example California provides. Syl'anar being the second richest country might sound like a stretch, but China had the seventh-largest economy under Mao just due to population, and India similarily has a massive economy due to population. If Syl'anar is populated enough, or the other countries are just to small to have a massive economy it could frankly brute force itself to #2 by default. Hell, the purchase of elves themselves contributes to the economy. As for other complaints: Housing, a one-time cost. Clothing, hand me downs and yarn. Food, Can be minuscule in cost if handled right. Security, in the age of cameras, two salaries (if a computer couldn't handle it by itself). At the end of the day, this isn't that crazy.

Edit: Wording.
 

Deleted member 929426

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For mankind it is even more difficulty than for ourselve. Otherwise how would you explain that again and again mankind fails to avoid repeat it's own mistake?
Other than forgetting the only explanation would be madness, as one defintion of it would be doing the same thing consistently yet expect different results.;)
In my experience, it's usually someone trying to justify doing the exact same thing they condemn others of doing. It's kind of like the time I was listening to some friends of mine (who happened to be black) complaining about racism only to turn around and complain about "those damned Mexicans" that moved into the neighborhood.
 
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SpikyHair

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We barely learn of our own full history, how do you expect us to know others? :ROFLMAO:
Supposedly that's by design. I certainly have noticed a distinct trend of "obedience training" in American educational system at the expense of cultivation of critical thinking skills.

And this is coming from somebody raised in the laborously Party-controlled environment on the other side of the Wall.
The base of this conversation revolves around how slavery is handled in harem hotel, so I think it's fine.
This comment right here, officer Your Moderatoriness!
In Syl'anar's current era, they use slaves for labor. In the case of Lin, MC barely pays her and she does a ton of work. He's a great master relatively though. But Lin is definitely profitable
I really liked the exchange between the MC (for a change) and Kali when speaking of her plan for using androids to replace elf slaves. Kali might be highly intelligent, but she sure didn't put too many points in her Wisdom stat.

Ironically, the best opportunity they both have right now to genuinely help the slaves is to set up a hotel chain (and expand it later to other service areas) ran by the slaves themselves. Sure, use the non-sentient androids for the most menial tasks, but keep the management and customer interaction in hands of the elves themselves. And set up the corporate rules of the franchise to disallow any kind of abuse, or mis-treatment, by the customers. "A happy elf is a productive elf" kinda thing as a foil to any objections from the general population.

They would not become accepted as equals overnight (or even in short-term), but it would push cultural norms into that direction, on top of actually providing an economically-sustainable way of keeping as many elf slaves as the MC can afford from worse conditions.

Androids could automate all jobs (they certainly seem to be at the tech level where it's wholly feasible even without actual sentience), but the prestige of live service should still keep the franchise profitable in the transition period. While keeping the elves safer than they could be elsewhere - and not just the females, either, because why couldn't you have male buttlers as well (especially for female customers).

Then work with Android to set up wholly-automated manufacturing backing for MC's taking over the whole planet and beyond the planet itself.

But that kind of planning would require MC to be more than a mobile platform for his magic dick, though, so not really in character ;)

Anyways, bringing this back, it's been stated that many slaves in this game are getting a decent wage, so they're able to contribute to the economy.
Uh... maybe I missed this, but where? Lin makes it kind of clear the amount she makes streaming with Maria is beyond her wildest expectations, and I don't see her spending money on herself without asking MC to cover the cost.
 
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Deleted member 929426

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Uh... maybe I missed this, but where? Lin makes it kind of clear the amount she makes streaming with Maria is beyond her wildest expectations, and I don't see her spending money on herself without asking MC to cover the cost.
I'm assuming Lin is getting some sort of salary. How else do you explain the MC getting just $5 rent from the tenants?
 
Feb 3, 2018
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Uh... maybe I missed this, but where? Lin makes it kind of clear the amount she makes streaming with Maria is beyond her wildest expectations, and I don't see her spending money on herself without asking MC to cover the cost.
TBF, my recollection comes from Discord which I may have misremembered or misinterpreted. That said, even if I'm wrong on that aspect, it doesn't change the overall argument since the other facets presume a slave salary of 0.
 

SpikyHair

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I'm assuming Lin is getting some sort of salary. How else do you explain the MC getting just $5 rent from the tenants?
Upkeep costs and cutthroat-pricing to have ANY customers to stay afloat?

Don't forget at the very start he needs to support not just himself (and improvements to the hotel, aside from its daily maintenane) but both Lin and Ellen, Lin cooks for everyone... Later on you get "sure you can live here for free" bunch of free-loaders, too ;)
That said, even if I'm wrong on that aspect, it doesn't change the overall argument since the other facets presume a slave salary of 0.
Eh... if even the most "progressive" MC doesn't really let Lin participate in the economy that much, I doubt slaves getting any kind of wage is something common-place.

Sure, it's a non-zero participation (food and clothing alone), but wouldn't exactly count it as significant. Kind of like people working nowadays in the US are increasingly squeezed into "bare essential only" lives, and the impact this kind of wealth inequality has on our real-life economy.

Edited for quote fix and clarity.
 
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Deleted member 929426

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Upkeep costs and cutthroat-pricing to have ANY customers to stay afloat?

Don't forget at the very start he needs to support not just himself (and improvements to the hotel, aside from its daily maintenane) but both Lin and Ellen, Lin cooks for everyone... Later on you get "sure you can live here for free" bunch of free-loaders, too ;)
It does make me wonder how much of a "cut" Ellen gets.:oops:
 

SpikyHair

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You forgot having to witness some of our shenanigans in the lobby.;)
I'm truly shocked Maria hasn't yet taken advantage of the entire situation. She certainly was highly attracted to Ellen, and it's Maria.

You'd expect her working under that desk on semi regular basis, at the very least.
One nice thing about Lin is that you can make an extra $10 simply by having her take off her top at the cafe.
Meanwhile Kali and Ashley not just go fully nude, but Kali also get boned right there and then, and nobody tosses a dime their way.

So much anti-human discrimination!
 

Deleted member 929426

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I'm truly shocked Maria hasn't yet taken advantage of the entire situation. She certainly was highly attracted to Ellen, and it's Maria.

You'd expect her working under that desk on semi regular basis, at the very least.
Meanwhile Kali and Ashley not just go fully nude, but Kali also get boned right there and then, and nobody tosses a dime their way.

So much anti-human discrimination!
I wouldn't be surprised to find out that Maria and Ellen are plotting some sort of revenge upon us at a later date.:LOL:
 

Runey

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Upkeep costs and cutthroat-pricing to have ANY customers to stay afloat?

Don't forget at the very start he needs to support not just himself (and improvements to the hotel, aside from its daily maintenane) but both Lin and Ellen, Lin cooks for everyone... Later on you get "sure you can live here for free" bunch of free-loaders, too ;)
Eh... if even the most "progressive" MC doesn't really let Lin participate in the economy that much, I doubt slaves getting any kind of wage is something common-place.

Sure, it's a non-zero participation (food and clothing alone), but wouldn't exactly count it as significant. Kind of like people working nowadays in the US are increasingly squeezed into "bare essential only" lives, and the impact this kind of wealth inequality has on our real-life economy.

Edited for quote fix and clarity.
Yeah, you don't have to pay your slave anything, but a lot of people do because it's great incentive to keep them working. With a paycheck, they can have future goals. Their paychecks, if any, are usually cents on the hour. Just enough for them to think "Maybe in a couple of years, if I do good enough work, I'll be able to afford something nice."
 

TheDevian

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The base of this conversation revolves around how slavery is handled in harem hotel, so I think it's fine.
In Syl'anar's current era, they use slaves for labor. In the case of Lin, MC barely pays her and she does a ton of work. He's a great master relatively though. But Lin is definitely profitable!
Pleasurable too... wait, what?
Yeah, you don't have to pay your slave anything, but a lot of people do because it's great incentive to keep them working. With a paycheck, they can have future goals. Their paychecks, if any, are usually cents on the hour. Just enough for them to think "Maybe in a couple of years, if I do good enough work, I'll be able to afford something nice."
And a couple of years, is like a couple of months to us, so that is not toooo bad.. XD
 
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