Ren'Py Hero Party Must Fall [v0.5.0 Bugfix 2] [Nitrolith]

[2LAOD]

Couple of theories/hopes:
-Hellele and the Goddess are the same person
-One of the bad endings Erin finds out everything, kills the whole party, and razes the entire world to the ground. the reaction pleases the goddess and turning him into a world ending god of rage. (He will only amount to a garbage disposer of worlds)
-Erin finds out and teams up with the demon king against both goddess and Hellele. (And the party)
-Hellele was possessing Mars bio-mom, step mom +Hilda the whole time.
-Elena's incestuous tendencies progress even further with Erin.
-Sera stops fighting, gives the hero energy to Mars and becomes impregnated in a public marriage ceremony.
-vi gets captured. ON PURPOSE.
-entire timeline reset shenanigans
-Mars kills Hilda once and for all.
-Mars fully combines with the hero energy becoming a brand new lifeform due to half demon blood. Becomes a threat to demon king or even the goddess+Hellele.
-Cecile tries to kill vi. Every skill she learns during training she uses against Mars in some way.
-Mars offers the greatest gift to Elena. Instead of making him righteous, she simply rights his wrongs instead. He gives her the ability to find all his children so she can raise them with the warmth he never had. Including the one they have together.
-Mars fights the demon king with the hero energy and takes his place as ruler of demon kind.
-Mars figures out a way to escape the reality to save himself and allies or traps Hellele AND the goddess in it. The wolrds magic begins to drain without the 2 biggest sources.
-Mars chooses Sera as his waifu (ending/sidequest) he saves her dredzen people, but ALL them are his concubines. Massive orgy ending.
-Mars chooses Erin as his waifu(ending) game ends without explaining JACK SHIT
-Mars saves whole pigobi race(sidequest) they all become his concubines (because of course) all except one which tries to save iris's exboyfriend from his hell. Actually uno reverse carding both iris and her ex. Iris is devastated thinking she might have been wrong.... For like 2 minutes. Dick solves everything. Happier end for the ex tho.
-Cecile ACTUALLY MEETS her mom. She a dirty GILF who owns a brothel and has a reputation for highjacking her girls sex work if the customer is handsome enough. She tries to steal Mars from Cecile because of course. Cecile friggin kills her(bad end?). Mind break ensues. Would Mars cheat on Cecile with her own MOM who abandoned her?(yes, just to fuck with her)

Ok I got a couple more:
-VI is actually Mars's bio mom soul put inside a humonculous body. It was an emergency magic relic that her lover had her wear to activate on death. She's kept the secret ever since. But she won't stop calling herself his mama. Weird...
-Vi is actually a vessel+spy for Hellele and nothing more.
-Vi is time/reality traveler. She originally tried to escape this reality with Mars, but he saved her at the cost of his life. She's constantly going back in for just ONE perfect timeline. It isn't going great so far....
-Mars gets the 2 goddesses together to instigate a fight but betrays them both by sealing them away.
-its actually ALL Elena's fault:
The REAL reason the goddess has so much hatred for humanity is because Elena(the PERFECT priestess) disobeyed the goddess's 'end of trial' hero orgy ritual.
She disobeyed while humanity still praised her. They praised her almost as much if not more than the goddess. The goddess only needed to overhear it once, from just one stranger; 'if only Elena was the goddess, the world be so perfect'(Hellele was behind it. she knew the goddess was listening lol that nasty bitch) Elena is the perfect priestess, and the perfect storm no one, not even the goddess saw coming.

The goddess was furious. No one would be spared her wrath. She killed Elena's husband in secret, but not before tying the hero's life force+power to his semen. She Immediately pivoted her entire plan of future priestess lineage towards the child of the most vile, debauched, and immoral whore she could find. That was Cecile. She would be her tool against Elena's son Erin.
Its why he's destined to suffer great pain. He is to suffer unimaginable pain and to cause Elana's+the hero lineage to be broken in the most public, shameful, and humiliating way possible. She would shame the entire human race for the sake of revenge.

Hell hath no fury like a goddess scorned.

 

[petersenk]

I'm playing this for the fourth evening now and about to break the curse a second time, with no idea how much more content there is to come. I'm really tempted to already give some feedback, so I do just that (maybe prematurely), or I wont find peace while playing any further. I'm also catching up reading the thread (I'm up to page 50 or something...), so maybe I just gonna repeat what already has been said, so bear with me, or just skip the parts you're already annoyed discussing. Still, maybe I can give another good argument for one or the other thing...

Obligatory praise (first things first)

setting: underwhelming/same old and boring at a first glance, but that turns out to be not only okay, but an excellent choice. There's simply no need to elaborate too much on worldbuilding (and the usual tropes) everyone is already familiar with, and nobody is here for that kind of (fantasy/isekai) plot (written by some 13 year old jackass...) anyways. And that's what makes this game so great: it focuses on exactly the right kind of plot: the characters. Still, the world isn't sold cheap either, and the author really knows how to setup an exciting story (

Spoiler

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). And deliver. Oh boy...

characters: incredible. 10/10. This is the lewdest, absolutely most erotic kind of porn: Up close and personal.

writing: excellent. 10/10. The perfect rollercoaster of funny, sad, intriguing, witty and most importantly: erotic as fuck. Finally an author that understands what's to be emphasised, and what kind of plot is needed to make porn work: characters and the situations they are put in. I couldn't care less about demonkind and their enternal struggle against humanity, or the other way around, or - oh no - some third, even more evil party emerging (shocking) and all that bullshit. Just as much as is needed to setup the characters. And it's go time! Oh boy... Excellent shit.

art: very good 8/10. Sure, it's not the dopamine overloading, almost grotesque and exaggerated and over-shaded to shits and back boobies one might be used to, but don't be fooled. This shit is, if sometimes a bit wonky, absolutely lovely, very expressive (Cecille's many dumb faces are the best) and still easily manages to be incredibly hot and as such perfectly functional. The animation is great too. /v/tards would call it SOUL - and really mean it.

In short, it's a joy to follow the main story. And it's so good, I hope the game recieves the polish and streamlining it deserves. Because there are a few problems that render actually "playing" the game not so fun, and that hurts, because the meat of the game is so fucking good.



UI: main interface/navigation, or world screen

The main click and point adventure interface got it's charms, but I'm afraid it's the wrong choice here; a typical RPGM world map with chibis running around would serve this so much better, and I hope maybe this could be swapped out at some point. Let me elaborate:

• Navigating the click and point adventure with the mouse is fine, but with a game pad it's just a pain in the ass. All would be solved with an ordinary RPGM world map to run around in. Good game pad support for porn games is important, since it's way more convenient than using a keyboard and a mouse.
  
  Can you imagine? I almost completely ignored Mihra a good chunk into the game, because I only ever reached her sprite while (later) playing with the mouse, yet initially I was playing with the game pad only, and so I always jumped to one of her boys who never had anything interesting to say (from where I probably could push the down button to reach Mihra...). That arrow/direction navigation is ass.
  
  
• It scales. You currently only have a bunch of screens, yet going right-right-right like in a flip book is already dumb and annoying. And I'm not suggesting that you implement a huge world. All you need is one screen for the town, with a house for the important npcs, the inn (and their interior screens/rooms), the void, and maybe another screen for the woods. That's it. A very compact scenery with plenty of room for all the NPCs and if you feel like adding another screen/location, it's no problem at all. Fun and easy to navigate with mouse and game pad alike.
  
  
• Fun activities: Aiths (crazy imaginary lewd wanna be priestess) scenes shouldn't be triggered automatically; but also they shouldn't be initiated by the player, since Aith is pursuing Mars. Ordinary RPGM chibi world would fix this easily, by having her show up on some screen/place and having her chibi chase the one of Mars, s.t. the scene gets triggered if she catches you; but the player may choose to escape her.
  
  And that's just one example. Here's another: the lewd maid, Iris, right? Imagine there would be one screen for the hotel/inn they're staying at with a bunch of rooms, maybe a second floor, and the lewd maid, Iris, with her pussy exposed, randomly walks around, from room to room to clean it. So you can catch her to interact with her, in this case: how about free-use anywhere, anytime? (just have a bunch of different backgrounds and maybe also a bunch of different fuck positions, depending on the exact spot, and you're good to go) See? You just can't do fun stuff like this with a static click and point thing, but you can do all kinds of silly shit with RPGM - easily. Player and NPC movement might not seem like much, but it really is a powerful tool if used correctly.
  
  
• Mind tricks: steering your chibi around in a 2d world is simply much more immersive. Going to town and fuck some bitches. It's just not the same with your static screens.

UI: indicators

This one may be even more important than the main/world interface, and still holds true should you decide to stay with the static click and point screens: there's nothing more frustrating than having to check each character (or void/spiral object or what not...) over and over again whether they have something new to talk about or do, only to find out there's nothing to be done. It's such a waste of time. Plus, our main character is a demon mage/magus with elevated senses, instincts and magical powers, so for the love of god, implement some indicators that clearly tell the player whether there is (new) content behind a button/object/NPC.

For a start, don't put a dialog anywhere only to say: "Progress more of the main story to continue". There's no purpose. Instead, simply get rid of the character for the time being (e.g. the maid), or fine, let her there, which wouldn't be a problem with proper indicators in place, that signal whether you can do something (new/meaningful) to this character (or thing).
Similarly there is also no need to announce end of content for certain characters (that's rather something for the changelog, or the forum). Just make sure that their latest state makes some kind of sense. (e.g. I could indefinitely repeat Ivet's "I'm pregnant/meet the parents" scene, which does not make any sense at all. Also you should always end on a lewd fucking scene if it can be repeated indefinitely, obviously).

alright, indicators:

• Having no indicator at all (e.g. on an NPC) means there are only trivial things to talk about that the player already explored and exhausted. There is nothing (meaningful) to do whatsoever. Not even anything lewd. No need to click, nothing to see here, please move along.
  
  
• Have an action, or talk indicator if you can talk about something new with an NPC. E.g. certain nameless townfolks will have new gossip from time to time. Don't make me click every fucking day on them, only to be told the same old stuff, and then, for one day to get something new... It wastes so much time and is no fun at all. But also don't just take away the option to hear the same gossip again. So what do? Give our protagonist some magic power to know when people talk about something new, and let's have an indicator. An exclamation mark will do. Anything.
  
  
• Have a heart symbol for repeated lewd options, such as fucking the town bicycle. Maybe use another for the training readyness, or also use the heart (or whatever indicator).
  
  
• And maybe even have another special indicator for milestones that progress or branch the story. Maybe not.

That would help so much already. I mean, do you even have a fucking idea how many accumulated man-hours you've collectively wasted by all the anons repeatedly clicking on Lavinias spiral (or Vi's door), only to be able to click on talk to hear the same old line and fuck back off because there wasn't actually anything to do with or to Lavinia? Show some responsibility!

Also such indicators would have let me know that I'm missing out on Mihra, so I would have tryied harded to reach her anyways with my stupid game pad.



UI: training stage
It's fine with a mouse, but a horrible experience with a game pad. Please implement dedicated game pad controls there; navigating this thing with this "arrow/directions" concept is a mess. And training clearly needs you to switch fairly quickly from teasing to hard mode and back; which should have a dedicated button, then maybe use L/R buttons to switch modes, and something like that. Give it a thought, I'm sure you'll figure out something much better.



Gameification vs VN: training stage vs (post-)training
While the training collecting points to break the curse mechanic seemed to work fine at first for Cecille's first stage of training, it was already off with Sera's first training session, where I noticed that training Sera was done much too fast (i.e. I collect points far too quickly), with many post-training scenes left to be seen. And later the training gameification fell completely apart where all of a sudden post-training was no longer post, but actual training, and yet I had to go through a completely useless and detached game training stage first. This needs to be fixed, and I think you know where to put the knife here.

First and foremost: do not ask the player whether he wants to prematurely break the curse or whether he wants to watch the plot (the whole point and meat of the game), that's dumb and dumb players will pick the wrong choice, because they think this is a game and the first to break the curse wins something.

Indeed, this part of the game is a linear VN, not a game. The simple fix is to have as many hard point thresholds as needed for so and so many post-training scenes, so you can't go any faster than there are post-training scenes. Seconldy, if the post-training is actually proper training, then just skip the manual training stage alltogether. The training game is still functionally fairly useless (still fun, don't get me wrong), but this way the problem should be mostly fixed.

And maybe training scenes should have been more specific (with new goals/tools each session) instead of a generic collecting points thing. I don't know. It's not so important.



Helelle's shop
Make her introduce and explain the potions she has to sell, so there's a bit more talk with her, and you know what those fucking potions are. Maybe don't introduce the three potions all at the same time, but one after the other. Also that estrogen side-char/quest thing needs some dedicated talk and what's up with that anyways, not finished (implementing) yet? I never got an opportunity to use that, I believe, or did I? This was supposed to be for Aith, I believe? Well, she went nuts anyways...



Side characters
The main game/story is super strong, and sure, that's where to put your main effort and focus. Still, I believe your game would gain a lot if you would put a bit more into the side characters, and even introduce some more of them. A simple system as in Kichikuou Rance would work perfectly, where you have a "good" and a "bad" ending/outcome for each lewdable side-char depending on your actions (not that any of it would matter much in the big picture). And in fact, from what I can tell, this is pretty much what you're doing already.

This would not only serve to break up the mostly linear nature of the game, but also offer a way for plenty "nukige" (this is a porn game after all) and arranging the town and its people to your liking. Mars is a manwhore afterall. Yet, a bit into the game I've noticed there are plenty of time-slots where there simply isn't anything meaningful to do. This is fine, but the town should be really populated by plenty of options to have some fun with. Something to fight for, seduce and fuck (repeatedly once conquered/solved).

And there probably should be a few more places to visit (which would be no problem, once proper RPGM map and action/plot indicators as outlined above are in play), such that side characters may appear in different locations, so you can do them differently. Maybe some side-chars can have combined scenes. Interruption scenes. Anything goes.

Not to get lost in side-characters, but the town really does need some (more) life and opportunity to be changed by the player. And this side of the game not only would serve as a pleasant nukige contrast to the main plot, it would also allow the player to choose a comfortable pacing (of the main plot). Sometimes you just don't feel like training the priestess, and let her squirm and wait another day, hahaha.

Special shout out to Yvet and Odette: I will be so mad if I can not play my cards just right, so I end up with both of them in the same bed. At the same time. In competition to each other, judged and tamed by the great Mars. hahaha. But there should be the possible outcome of just one or the other becoming your (nukige/side-)fucktoy. Up to you. Good or bad end for the side chars, where becoming your fucktoy isn't necessarily always the bad end (or is it?).

Julia (I mean the mom with the kid): while I think she and her story is great, unfortunately it's all fixed on rails. Instead the player here should have the option to (actively) make sure her husband returns safely, or (passively) let him die. Help or don't. Preggers with a demon baby, or forever (un-)happy? with her returned husband?

While the main plot/story is mostly linear (with a later branch or two), the side characters are up for gameification!

And when the fuck do I get to lewd the lewd Iris (the lewd maid). AAAHHHHH. Again, tie lewding her into your own sexy maid to her bad end, or help her make her dreams come true for a good end and maybe a goodbye quicky for the player. Or just a hug, hahaha.

Basically, there should be a secondary achievements screen at the end of the game similar to Kichikuou Rance (see pic. related), where side characters either reached their god or bad end. That's all I'm asking for, so that players can take a screenshot and post it around in forums and on 4chan (this stuff is important; you also need a character sheet/overview picture kind of thing that introduces and teases all the characters in your game; this stuff is important).

This also means, that not everyone should end up with the same (side-)characters and endings, and that players indeed should be able to personalize the town by making tuff decisions. Have some mutually exclusive side characters. Flat or cow? Boobs or ass? ... Not that any of this is meaningful in the grande scheme of things, but it really does add a lot, so your game really becomes alive. And most importantly: have plenty of fun writing this. It's short. It's optional. So you can really go places and have some more extravagant fun with this.



Conclusion
I would look at the state of the current game as a nice prototype. No regrets (or hard feelings nitrolith), but this needs to be put together from scratch. That's just the nature of prototypes. I would suggest to start with a small, compact, default-tileset RPGM world, set up the necessary locations and chibis, and then you put it all back together.
All the art and scenes do not need to be rewritten, a bit restructured, and it's all python anyways. I think you could do it without wasting too much time. Maybe some anons even wanna help with a proper RPGM template, putting a lovely compact world together and or help with some chibis. Once that's set up (which should be fairly straightforward), putting the scenes and stuff back should be equally simple. Sure, it still takes time, but it would be worth it 100% guaranteed. At least, think about it. Maybe later, once you're done and happy with the main plot. I don't know.

Hero Party Must Fall is simply way too good, and it would be really a shame to not give it the overhaul, streamlining and polish it deserves.

 

[asdxzcv]

I got this scene while randomly clicking in Cecille mini-game

 

[PoPcloud]

View attachment 3257947
I got this scene while randomly clicking in Cecille mini-game

whoa when did that mini-game become fully playable?

 

[PoPcloud]

Spoiler

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[Piyush1481481]

Hey,
I think I got stuck on Aith's( Innkeeper daughter) route. Cecille told me to get a liquid, i bought it.
Now what to do? Whenever I touch(Joiplay) on her, i don't get any response.


Ps: Okay, it got solved. The night scene of her struggling got triggered by just simply clicking on the day/night icon. I was doing Sera's night activities and because of that I was unable to progress on her

 

[CallousHayat]

The memories tab is never updated on the alpha, only on the next ones (bugfixes), you guys will have to wait to see Erina/Elena scenes on the gallery

Yeah I figured that out, Which I don't mind really since I have saves for the scenes I would like to go back and see, And replay it again for the story if I'm free haha

 

[petersenk]

But seriously...

Yvet vs. Odette lewd jelly mom vs daughter competition shenanigans fucking when? They both and seriously need to teach each other a few lessons. AAAYYIIHHHHHHHHHHAAA~~

 

[loaderblaster]

Goddess reminds me of the Planner in the Rance series.

 

[petersenk]

Played some more, and I've finally reached the part where Elena appears (a bunch of scenes into this so far...). And while the writing is still great, and I think I will like where this is going, the pacing is not. In fact, the whole game interface falls now apart and is reduced to a pure VN where I never get to walk around and do some stuff at all. It's just one scene after the other. I'm afraid, this is not good, and this will not do.

And once again (continuing my previous post...) a proper RPGM world would at least greatly alleviate the problem. There's the inn, behind is Mars's temporary cuck-shed. Now you're sleeping there, and you're restricted from accessing the inn, but you're still given at least one time-slot per day to walk around and go fuck some bitches (so there is something else between all those Elena scenes). The remaining hero party has to clear five floors, but that doesn't mean it will take them just five days. If the player takes too long, you could intersperse some quick and funny scenes, how the party struggled (again) this day and had to retreat. Pacing should be in the hands of the player (with no real time limit).

Now, I'm not done with Elena scenes, but here's what I imagine should happen, once she agrees to come into your shed (which happens too fast; is something missing here?): Elena is something of a control freak, at least about her son, right? Right. So let's take away her control (also she's all about pleasuring others, right? take it away. she doesn't get to dish out pleasure, not just yet, she's on the receiving end for now...): it's SHIBARI time! Of course! IMHO this would also be an ideal "ice breaker" for her: it doesn't seem too sexual (for a sexually inexperienced retard like her anyways), there's no kissing, no penetration, no groping (for starters), no sex, heck, not even nudity (for starters...).

And once bound and helpless in your shed, Mars just leaves and goes to town (free play) to fuck some of his bitches, leaving poor Elena behind, abandonned, unable to do anything but feel a tight rope in her crotch and weights hanging from her nipples and what not. hahaha. It's also something you can easily put into the form of the already established training session format, have Helelle give you some more bondage toys, with plenty fun options to go further and further, maybe places even.

But my point is not so much the shibari scenario, but to mix things up a little bit, and not completely destroy the game/world UI and also the pacing (and control thereof).

Having a small RPGM world filled with plenty of side-chars would really solve many problems, all at once.


Now... when the fuck do I finally get to lewd the lewd maid...



...AAHHHHHH, this is torture!!!

 

[oarclownfish]

But seriously...

Yvet vs. Odette lewd jelly mom vs daughter competition shenanigans fucking when? They both and seriously need to teach each other a few lessons. AAAYYIIHHHHHHHHHHAAA~~

what competition when yvet is clearly superior

 

[petersenk]

what competition when yvet is clearly superior

Aren't we a bit early to judge? At least I haven't seen much of Odette yet, and am eager to see what she's got. Besides, this isn't about you (or Mars) think(s) about which one of the two is the better girl. This is about Yvet and Odette duking it out between themselves and fighting for your (Mars's) attention (and getting the lewdest out of each other, so no matter which one you like better, you still should wanna see them in lewd competition, you're not gay, son, are you?).
And later, you still may (well, maybe) kick one or the other from the edge of your bed, if you feel like it (keeping them both as fucktoys: bad ending for both. good ending only for the sluttier slut that gets to join you, bad ending for the other, certainly for the mom if she loses to her daughter and has to stay with her smelly husband. There.).

Btw. was there ever a competition for best "before and after Hero Party Must Fall" meme? Did I miss it?



There should be at least one for every (side-)character.


Anyways, what follows are the continued ramblings and my take on the Elena act so far, another wall of text, spoilers and no hard feelings ahead.


Critique of Elena act (continued) and mini-game suggestion
Et voilà, bondage! Yet, I think you could make more out of this, with a clear theme and progression from:

1. (simple/non-nude) bondage, abandonned bondage, exposed/nude bondage, abondonned and nude, ... to
2. bondage with toys such as nipple clamps, weights, wax play and what not, to
3. finally, light body modification such as nipple piercings, tats and that kind of thing.

They have a lot to talk, which suits perfectly for some bondage/light bdsm sessions. And secondly, you can easily make a fun customization mini-game out of this: let the user decide which forms of additional toys (clamps, wieghts, whip, ...) to use (they're all equally effective, this is all about catering to the players tastes a bit), and what kind of body modification to apply (plenty of people cant stand tats at all, also offer some options and different places a user may want to place it, others may not like piercings very much, why not let the player customize her to his taste; but a minimum amount of body modification will be necessary to successfully beat this mini-game... and I believe, with respect to art, you can manage this with a bunch of extra overlays, so hopefully it shouldn't be too much extra work). Customization is always fun, players love it, especially the lewd kind of customization. It's another simple mind-trick too: I DID THIS, GAHAHAHAHA.

I mean, imagine Mars going "you're much more beautiful now" while the player sitting in front of the computer is just shaking his head? Not so good, since it's a disconnect, and then players start to self-insert as Erin instead. Was that your goal all along? How devilish.

Anyways, some more ideas for bondage/body modification:

• A gag-ring to keep her mouth open and drooling all over the place, but unable to talk, or a regular gag-ball to be gagged (both offering themselves to be written into a scene for a "oh will you shut up already (mummy)" moment, I believe there are a few of those).
  
• Optional skin hooks (or just bondage up in the air) to learn how to let go (of her son) and get a feeling for freedom (just hanging there, later maybe with some toys stuffed to get pleasure from it too...). Well, personally no big fan of skin hooks (and other extreme body modification and shit, eww). How about a classic nose hook, so Elena gets plenty of fresh air?
  
• Arm-binder, leg/knee binder, i.e. mobile bondage, and then you make her clean up your dirty cuck-shed, cook something for you, and such stuff (there was talk about her being your lewd maid now afterall!). Right, right. Mobile bondage play has to fit in somewhere here too! Emphasis the burden of being a mother (of Erin), then free her.
  
• Just a collar would be nice, no? And a leash?
  
• Maybe you can stray into bimbofication territory, give her big botox mommy filler lips. Slutty make-up. A new dress? Mars is making her his, right?
  
• A tongue piercing (to fix her lisp, or make it worse/pronounce it, hahahaha).
  
• Oh, here's another idea: so Elena wants to be Mars's mommy so bad, right? Well, how about Mars gives her a pair of big, chunky demon horn implants (yeah, that's a thing btw. currently image searching body modifications a bit, looking for ideas, baaarf.. gross, don't do that at home, kids), so she can be his demon mommy (and no longer Erin's human mommy, *ding* *ding*). HOW ABOUT THAT! Wouldn't that be a lovely coronation, high and end point of this arc? Fake, symbolic demon horns, and an ass-plug demon tail. FUCKING DO IT. (no need for this to be permanent, but just having it for this arc and end it with it would totally rock, from what I can tell..)

...and there's probably much more. I'm not really an expert here.

Btw. it's been day 11 (or what not) training Erina and having the other jerks being useless in the dungeon all day long. And only one (1) Erin card has been teared. Something does not add up here. So a minimal amount of clean up/rewriting is probably due here anyways.

Oh, the tattoo has a meaning. Well, a bit of dialogue branching isn't a problem, should you make a customization mini-game out of this (I think you really should and it would be totally worth it, hehe).

Day 13. Still just that one Erin card teared. And there's the collar. Cute. But quite frankly, the writing of this act might need a clean-up. Might be just me, but it's a bit all over the place, a bit confusing, and just not as strong as the previous Cecille or Sera arcs. That whole making her his own (property) bit... it's.. eh.. I just don't really buy it, and Erina's reactions are not very convincing, or just odd. Something is off (if you ask me). I also didn't buy the threatening her with hurting Erin bit. Sure, a mother wants to protect her son and all, but uhhh. IMHO not so good. I believe a (thematically) more focused binding->freeing->becoming demon mommy arc could work better (and wouldn't require Erina to become so agreeable so fast). Maybe not. I don't know. But having Erina repeating lewd lines Mars told her to say, while she thinks in her head that "it's not real" and lewdly does it, only to being nicely lewded and she likes it... it just does not work (for me). She should be bound. And you pleasure her until she likes it. That's the binding and freeing part. Then comes the transformation part. And that concludes the act.

Erina feels guilty about her son: you really need to put on some weights on her lovely tits that didn't give poor Erin enough milk, so you then can remove that weight from her. Just making her cum from her nipples isn't poetic enough.

The Erin/Cecille parts are golden, bwahaha.

hmmm, that mommy talk kind of annoys me. Can't you make her shut up about it by making it clear that it would be incredibly naughty if a son would do *this* to his mummy? So she gets disgusted by herself saying it, only to become demon mommy and love it again. Something along those lines. Well, maybe not. But that mother vs. master thing just does not really work (yet). In fact, is that master thing necessary here? The goal of this arc is to make Erin's mom, Erina, the demon mother of Mars. "Master" just really doesn't fly here, if you ask me. She will be a lewd demon mommy doing the naughty with his demon son. That's way more like it. We already have Sera and Cecille for those kinds of bdsm/power dynamics, no? And a son simply isn't "master" of his mom. Just doesn't compute in my head.

(Maybe something motherly like that . . . might get him to see me as a mother and not a secual partner?)

...upon being ask to tell Mars to drink her mommy Milk. No! Not yet. Argh, this is so confusing. She isn't demon mommy yet, and demon mommy would let her demon son drink her milk and suck her dry, lewdly. Erin's human mommy, which she still is by this point, is disgusted by sexual acts with Mars and indecent/lewd behaviour between mommy and son. See what I mean when I say this is all a bit over the place? Thematically?

(It doesn't hurt to try . . .)

WOMAN ARE YOU STUPID? See, it just renders Erina retarded, and I don't like my Erina retarded. She should not be. I don't buy it.

My nipples will never get to touch your mouth ever again!

DUH. WOMAN!! Anyways, I rest my case.

Why are we counting days now anyways? If anything, there should have been a proper ACT II title screen before the Elena arc, and a lewd Intermezzo title screen with the goddess Intermezzo right before. The structure is there, but you dont really sell it. That stuff is important too!

Day 14. One Erin card teared, still. Fuck yeah, it's a Cecille/Lavinia scene.

Day 15. Back in the shed. 1 Erin card teared. A magical tongue seal to make her talk less? Huhuu. I'd prefer a classic bondage gag or something, really. Oh, it's another episode of Mars not liking the word "mother". Yeah, yeah, sad backstory, but it doesn't help the scene/arc, erotically speaking. The Mars I know would have made Erina stop using that word a long time ago, if it bothers him so much. But hey, let's see where this mother complex goes...

I'll remove it if you renounce the brat and acknowledge me as the Hero.

Ehhh, I'd really much prefer it if this would be all about making Erina Mars his naughty (symbolic) demon mommy, and no longer Erin's. Obviously this would also entail her renouncing the brat and acknowledge Mars as the Hero, but as a son alltogther would be much stronger. Even if Erin is no longer the hero, she's still his mommy and thus protecting him. That's no good. DEMON MOMMY TRANSFORMATION, OR RIOT! And if you pull it just right, you can also deal with Mars his mommy complex in this fashion. Just a tad of rewriting...

Yup, now her lisp is worse. And salvia all over the place (no magic required, btw.). Please, give me an ordinary gag-ring. I think thats much lewder and fits much better, thematically. Or even better; tie it to the customization mini-game and let the player decide what gag to use.

Wait, why does she *want* an orgasm from her tongue now? Sure, it feels good, there's a magical seal there now, but the Erina I know still wouldn't give in and *want* an orgasm from that. I just don't get it, or her, Erina. Her behaviour is all over the place. Maybe that was the intention, but I don't buy it. Mars should simply pleasure her, with force, until she fucking likes it. Wouldn't that work much better? I'm also not a big fan of all those Mars/dead husband comparisons and making Erina say mean things about the dude, who is no longer here and never was. For one we have this kind of thing already with Cecille and Erin, where it works great, because Erin is still around.

Not allowing Erina to kiss or hug her son? Lame. Turn her into "demon" mommy, and she no longer will want to do that anyways. But just telling her to stop it? Nah, that doesn't work.

Elena agrees to it, should Erin not appear in time . . . (not really a quote)

Oh, for fucks sake. WOMAN!! (also I've just noticed that I didn't rest my case afterall. My bad).

...man, Mars just came in her mouth, and it wasn't very erotic (the art is great though). Dumb magical tongue seal. Erina should be slowly force-feed your cum, by force, until she likes it, while being bound and gagged. She wasn't even bound or anything, just a tongue seal, and she lets you cum in her mouth like that? I don't buy it. That's not my Erina.

Magical spell so she wont be able to sleep? Uhhhuuu. Why not some kind of bondage over night with toys stuck in her, that would also not let her sleep, and be so much lewder, thematically speaking. Magic is a cheap way out, and not very erotic (Cecille electro shocking Sera, magically, that was lewd!). And extreme sleepiness? No magic needed if you don't let her sleep, duh.

It might not sound like much but the torment is like nothing else.

Yeah. Exactly. Implied/passive magic is not much. And certainly not lewd. Just tie her, lewdly, over night already. Much better.

If you can't survive until morning then cruel punishment awaits your son . . .

BOOOOHHH. See? I just don't buy that threatening her indirectly with Erin spiel. The main problem here is that this *enforces* her motherly instincts, it counts on them. The exact fucking opposite of what this all is, or should be about. And it's just half-assed blackmail. We don't want her to protect her human son. And why is this threat needed anyways? Just bind her up real good, put some toys in her and leave. There is no threat needed.

P.S. If she doesn't survive, she's dead and punishing Erin has no effect any longer.

The very semen you hold in your mouth, you'll have to feed it to Erin.

What? In case she doesn't survive the night? How is that supposed to work? The fuck happened to your excellent writing skills? You've been drinking a lot, lately?

But having to keep a load of cum in her mouth over night, not being allowed to swallow, that was lewd. There just needs to be another carrot on the stick, such as simply threatening her to keep her bound for another day (with a fresh load) and the day after and so on if necessary. No need for blackmail. She's bound (ghahahaha)! The theme is being bound (and freed) and transformed in the process, not fucking blackmail.

The love she feels for her son is the real deal. Pure, genuine, motherly love.

...

I feel so jealous.

see? Now Mars, my personal hero, is going retarded as well. Man up and make her your lewd twisted demon mother already. For fucks sake!

Day 16. Back to Cecille, Lavinia and Erin. This is gonna be good, I can tell.

Yeah, I'm basically writing as I play, or rather click through the game that suddenly became a pure VN (once again: not good. I need to see to my town side-bitches too every once in a while, you know?). I probably should stop now. haha.

EDIT: here's another one: (abandonnment play) bind her up, exposed in your shed, let the door open and leave, but let Vi stay guard, which of course you don't tell her. Thematically this symbolizes the burden or weight of being a mother and a saint to all the people and the whole world (and cuck Erin). And Mars is going to take of that burden of her, maybe, at some point, after being a mother and a saint, for fucking free, for anyone that may or may not come by the cuck-shed (in the ghetto. lalala..) by making her his exclusive demon mommy, who is 100% loyal and supporting his demon kid and only him and nothing but, no matter what and the lewder the better, Demons are naughty. Sound good?

 

[puddles1234]

Bruh I'm new to this thread and the first thing i see is a whole ass thesis

 

[petersenk]

Bruh I'm new to this thread and the first thing i see is a whole ass thesis

You're supposed to start reading on page 1, dummy. But hey, you're welcome.
Here is its (the thesis's) conclusion (I've slept over it, and now it's settled, gahaha):

Demon mommy transformation
Elena needs to be indeed transformed into a demon mommy. It solves *all* the problems of the arc, and, if you've noticed, it poetically mirrors and rhymes with the magical removal (and transformation) of Lavinias demon horns (which is always a sign of the highest levels of writings, poetically speaking, gahaha).



Here's the tl;dr:

1. Bound -> freed -> transformed throughout the whole Elena arc, as outlined above
2. Her (body) transformation peaks with giving her demon horns, because she wants to be Mars's mommy so bad, she can have it. And with that, all is set up to conclude the arc and bring it to its fruition.
3. Demon mommy faces Erin, her human son, who is shell-shocked by his demon mommy (there may be a magical TV ball scene first where he doesn't believe his mom went demon before they're forced to meet in person). He certainly would never listen to what she has to say now, kiss her ever again in this form, and neither would he accept the kiss of a demon mommy. She's no longer his mom. He wants her to go away and never return, die even, for all he cares, what the hell is even going on..
4. Elena just lost her human son and is devastated (and no longer a mommy at all, and not even a saint, reduced to nothing).
5. Obviously Mars is there to pamper her (you always do that after rough bondage sessions, right?) and most importantly: to accept her many kisses and return them. In short: she will now accept Mars as her demon son, reborn as a new demon mommy, never to kiss, nor support her now dead to her human son Erin ever again. The end.

Erin is free from her mother. Elena is free from being a saint and Erins mom. Mars wasn't unprepared and jelly of Erins mom (like what the hell) and instead simply took Elena and made her his lewd demon mom, because he wanted to (you can still sob and wade in his sad background story, no problem, he just now solves it in a manly and straightforward Mars way).

And if you wanna top this: make Erin now sexually interested in demon Erina in a confused way (he doesn't regard her as his mom any longer so he can lewd her now), which makes Erina disgusted about Erin since she wants to see him as a son, but is now unable to, since he wants to lewd her so much and cums all over the place just looking at his former human mommy now in lewd demon form. How about that to really and mutually burn the bridge between them?

And I'm sure, nitrolith would come up with a super lewd writing for a Lavinia vs. horned Erin's mom scene (to get her used to her new demon horns, erotically speaking. sounds super lewd, no?). And in this case, I'd be totally fine with magical horns (customized/picked by the player, just make them all big and chunky enough, ghahaha), similar to how Lavinia's horns aren't removed, or only temporarily with magic. This would also then enable to later have the player turn the horns on and off as he pleases and likes them on Elena.

Oh, and maybe the forced demon cum-feeding her might have something to do with her new demon horns, maybe not.
So, but that's it for now, and I'll continue seeing how the Elena arc currently plays out, maybe I am and was in the wrong all along... but still, for now I'm fairly confident that this arc isn't as good as it should be and needs to be rewritten and cleaned up a bit.



Infinitely many lewdable side-characters
And now for something completely different, here's a quick and fun idea to further promote a RPGM world/interface: There's the inn, right? Let's also have an unfrequented bar inside. Bar keeper (with nothing much to say or do). Then every single day, there is a new girl (random hair color chibi) sitting at the bar, occupying a room during the night. Give her a randomly generated girl name, a new one each day. And then Mars can do two things:

• In the evening, Mars may approach the chibi girl at the bar. Chibi girl has a heart indicator. NO talk at all, just make the two move up to her room in the inn and cue to Mars doing her in his favorite slam a random slut bitch real quick position, and her going "Mars!!" (with proper random name and all).
  
• If it's already night, have the heart indicator on her door. And then Mars may approach the door, if activated he simply gets nude and comfortable (outside still) and then enters her room. Short shout and shock from the girl. Mars going: "I'm sorry, wrong room..." and cue to Mars doing her as above, in his favorite slam the random pump and dump bitch real quick and real rough position.

What a man-whore.

Anyways, now you can claim that your game has (virtually) infinitely many lewdable side-characters! And just how cool is that?! Of course just as a joke to skip the time-slot in a funny way. A simple still shot from behind (i.e. the girl not very visible, certainly not her face) or short animation (with the girl from behind, and random hair color matching the chibi hair color) would already do the trick.

 

[ExpertDemon]

Can someone let me know if I keep training Ceil after the whole hand-holding scene? I'm now getting a repeated scene of Mars playing with her after training, but nothing else happens. I am confused if I missed something or if my game is broken.

 

[obibobi]

The writing this is very good but there was one thing I had a big issue with and how it never feels like the MC is challenged, the game keeps making a point of him being under threat but you never feel.

This was a particularly sore point with Elena's arc, the heroes mother, because the entire set-up is the elaborate situation of her being locked away and sexually abused until she breaks, but it was entirely Elena at the MC's mercy, she had to do whatever he wanted, that is a situation where there should have been some risk on his end, where the deal involved some turn about, where he was at risk of succumbing to her mental manipulation, not have it so one sided.

 

[kinglionheart]

The writing this is very good but there was one thing I had a big issue with and how it never feels like the MC is challenged, the game keeps making a point of him being under threat but you never feel.

This was a particularly sore point with Elena's arc, the heroes mother, because the entire set-up is the elaborate situation of her being locked away and sexually abused until she breaks, but it was entirely Elena at the MC's mercy, she had to do whatever he wanted, that is a situation where there should have been some risk on his end, where the deal involved some turn about, where he was at risk of succumbing to her mental manipulation, not have it so one sided.

I think this is a result of the dev trying to move the story along. Since the story would only continue if Mars is winning, the only story path we are getting is the "happy path". This comes at the cost of the game elements being ignored like decisions and stats like affection. Hopefully when the main story is done, he will go back flesh out the paths so we get more interactive elements. Like he did with adding the NPCs.

There was a early idea I still hoping for. The dungeon was suppose to be more important to the story. In the beginning Mars was suppose to able to manipulate the dungeon's strength. He had to carefully balance the difficulty to make the Hero Party stay. If too hard they get suspicious and Mars gets kicked out. Too easy and the party will conquer the dungeon and leave. Also after Mars tame Cecille and Sera, he will to able to control their actions in dungeon. Imagine the girls not helping Erin and fool around with Mars in the dungeon!

Hope for the future!

 

[lnppo]

Played some more, and I've finally reached the part where Elena appears (a bunch of scenes into this so far...). And while the writing is still great, and I think I will like where this is going, the pacing is not. In fact, the whole game interface falls now apart and is reduced to a pure VN where I never get to walk around and do some stuff at all. It's just one scene after the other. I'm afraid, this is not good, and this will not do.

And once again (continuing my previous post...) a proper RPGM world would at least greatly alleviate the problem. There's the inn, behind is Mars's temporary cuck-shed. Now you're sleeping there, and you're restricted from accessing the inn, but you're still given at least one time-slot per day to walk around and go fuck some bitches (so there is something else between all those Elena scenes). The remaining hero party has to clear five floors, but that doesn't mean it will take them just five days. If the player takes too long, you could intersperse some quick and funny scenes, how the party struggled (again) this day and had to retreat. Pacing should be in the hands of the player (with no real time limit).

Now, I'm not done with Elena scenes, but here's what I imagine should happen, once she agrees to come into your shed (which happens too fast; is something missing here?): Elena is something of a control freak, at least about her son, right? Right. So let's take away her control (also she's all about pleasuring others, right? take it away. she doesn't get to dish out pleasure, not just yet, she's on the receiving end for now...): it's SHIBARI time! Of course! IMHO this would also be an ideal "ice breaker" for her: it doesn't seem too sexual (for a sexually inexperienced retard like her anyways), there's no kissing, no penetration, no groping (for starters), no sex, heck, not even nudity (for starters...).

And once bound and helpless in your shed, Mars just leaves and goes to town (free play) to fuck some of his bitches, leaving poor Elena behind, abandonned, unable to do anything but feel a tight rope in her crotch and weights hanging from her nipples and what not. hahaha. It's also something you can easily put into the form of the already established training session format, have Helelle give you some more bondage toys, with plenty fun options to go further and further, maybe places even.

But my point is not so much the shibari scenario, but to mix things up a little bit, and not completely destroy the game/world UI and also the pacing (and control thereof).

Having a small RPGM world filled with plenty of side-chars would really solve many problems, all at once.

Only person I've seen that wants their time wasted by adding needless traversal.

 

[petersenk]

The dungeon was supposed to be more important to the story.

I'm of the honest opinion that all work on some dungeon is a waste of time, and in fact, Hero Party Must Fall shouldn't have an actual dungeon the player ever enters to do some shitty RPGM fighting for a bunch of floors with random monsters and none of it matters at all. There shouldn't be a single fight, this game simply isn't about that kind of gameplay, and looking at the current state of mini-games I've encountered so far: none of them are functional or fun to play (yet; no offense). We can talk about the dungeon once the mini-games are good and fun and extra lewd. Way more important. And even more important is everything else.
Also, personally I think it's just funny to not ever see the dungeon from inside in person and not having a single fight, given the whole setup and scenario. It's perfect.

Imagine the girls not helping Erin and fool around with Mars in the dungeon!

Sure, sounds like a lovely pay off, for some shitty gameplay. But you can just narrate such an event as post-dungeon VN, maybe one with some choices to pick. No shitty gameplay (and precious developer time) required at all.

But I perfectly understand your opinion and wanting that dungeon too. Maybe it's more about personal taste, and as such up to the dev, if he really wants to do that and thinks he can pull it off in an enjoyable way.

Only person I've seen that wants their time wasted by adding needless traversal.

I doubt it. And what do you even mean with needless traversal? The traversal isn't needless, it's a perfectly functional and comfy interface. Again: every single thing (all houses, the inn, the whole little town, maybe even the woods) is supposed to be on a single, compact map/screen (+interior screens). That's not much of a traversal, and if you also have proper indicators as suggested (and which are established in the genere for are good reason), there is no waste of time at all: a short stroll around the town is a lovely experience, where you always may spot a new side-bitch to fuck (maybe another day, but you're already keeping an eye on her, observing her patterns, haha). It's immersive. And while going from place A to B with a clear goal in mind, there is that anticipation (mind tricks) that simply does not really emerge with that static point and click screens: because you're not in there, going with the flow, there is no pacing to your point and clicks. It's not satisfying at all.

There are many very good reasons why this RPGM chibi format has established itself and dominates at least the "indy h-market" other than that it's really easy to setup and use. And sure enough, way too many of those games do waste your time with needless traversal and wast but empty maps. But, there are also plenty of games with incredibly compact (and still super lovely) maps, that are just fun to stroll around in. To name a few: The imperial Gatekeeper has super compact maps, or The Nobleman Retort which got a super lovely town on one, maybe two screens, and a bunch of interiors. Incredibly compact. Something like that. And sure enough, none of these games would be better off with a static point and click interface (and once again, think about game pads and how that's supposed to work).

Btw. visiting Lavinia or Helelle in the void could be easily achieved with an inventory item spell in addition to some magical object in his room in the inn (or the cuck shed). I don't really like the current solution with those odd icons up there. Same for the dungeon, which should simply be a small cave (entrance) on that suggested, one, super small and compact, lovely little map. Shall I draw you a sketch of what I've in mind? Or how about we make a competition out of it: let random anons come up with a map only as base for a rewrite (which is a fun activity), then you let the patreon users vote for the best and most compact map with the lovliest features it may offer, giving the author a head-start in the supposed little rewrite of the game, for free, and maybe offer a comissioned side-char to be implemented according to the taste of the winner as price in return? Just an idea, and certainly not up to me. And maybe, just maybe, nitrolith has been tempted enough and is eager to make that chibi town all on his own (or simply doesn't want to, fair enough, even if that would be quite a shame).

EDIT: Oh, and remember the doing Yvet in the woods at her favorite place every single evening (for the time being) scene? And how it was mentioned how they were watched and observed each time but nobody dared to say a word? With a RPGM map, you can actually make some randoms come up close and make them watch and observe as Mars nails Yvet in the woods. A bunch of random spots around that place, a bunch of randoms picked that will show up, maybe even some chibi we may recognize (e.g. Vi might show up every now and then and start to masterbate furiously, hahaha), a small script to make it all work, and what you get is immersive RPGM magic, you simply can't pull off with static screens. I will say it again because people tend to overlook and forget: how powerful simple movement (player and NPC) is. It's just that versatile and effective. SHOW DONT TELL. And it's the little things.

I'm also sure the Erin watching Marion and Mars scenes would work twice as good with chibi rooms right next to each other in a chibi inn. And those scenes are already incredibly hot. Similarly having chibi Erin sleep alone in his room, while you train Cecille and/or Sera a room or two away.

Click and point is like listening to a narrator. It's very passive and non-sensual (no pacing). I don't really feel like playing Mars, I'm merely listening to (or clicking through) his story.

RPGM chibis, on the other hand, are oddly immersive, sensual (bound to its game physics, if ever so simple), and now I'm indeed playing Mars, I fucking steer him and his every movements. There is so much less disconnect. Mind tricks!

 

[The_Evil_lord]

​

Hero Party Must Fall [v0.4.9 Alpha] [Nitrolith]

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For android apk please bro