VN Ren'Py Kingdom of Deception [v0.14.2.2] [Hreinn Games]

[random.person]

That could be but I can't really figure out why they thought that... then again, I have a feeling that switch to Ren'py was due to all of those people whining (sometimes with reason, but mostly without one) about RPGMaker.

Problem is, most of the RPGM games that people complain about should not be made in RPGM to begin with and use less than 10% of RPGM resources.

RPGM is the scourge of the Earth. It is an overrated game development tool which seriously needs custom scripts/plugins or whatever they're called in each version for some quality of life. But the real problem is that people use it even if they don't want to do a JRPG, which leads to many potentially good games being hindered by the engine being tailored to that purpose. I personally kind of hate RPGM at a deep level, it's just inflexible, it hits you in the face with the whole stubborness of forcing you to go through slow dialogue boxes and too much keystrokes to get even simple fights going.
Ren'Py has the same issue with people trying to build space stations out of a visual novel engine, but at least Ren'Py is capable of more general purpose stuff due to being more open as a tool.
I think that KoD would be far worse on RPGM, imagine all the walking around to get any stuff done... the catgirl investigation and the white hind hunt would've been nightmares of lost time wandering around the woods. Not to mention that playing through the game multiple times would be hellish without Ctrl-ing your way through thousands of lines of dialogue. I think Ren'Py provides the right framework to get the kind of story KoD has running without bullshit and allows for a gamestyle beneficial to the genre, which is less about the grinding and fighting and more about choices and intrigue.
This doesn't mean all RPGM games are necessarily bad, but using it to build a game means that the game must be heavily tailored around the inconveniences and strong points of a JRPG framework, which is far less flexible than the one Ren'Py provides for visual novels.

Besides, Ren'Py is more easily opened apart and modded =^)

 

[Nephelimo]

Amazing game, cant wait for it to be complete Although I must say I would like a bit more diversity to the choices, some options make the story too linear.

 

[Ripe]

RPGM is the scourge of the Earth. It is an overrated game development tool which seriously needs custom scripts/plugins or whatever they're called in each version for some quality of life. But the real problem is that people use it even if they don't want to do a JRPG, which leads to many potentially good games being hindered by the engine being tailored to that purpose. I personally kind of hate RPGM at a deep level, it's just inflexible, it hits you in the face with the whole stubborness of forcing you to go through slow dialogue boxes and too much keystrokes to get even simple fights going.
Ren'Py has the same issue with people trying to build space stations out of a visual novel engine, but at least Ren'Py is capable of more general purpose stuff due to being more open as a tool.
I think that KoD would be far worse on RPGM, imagine all the walking around to get any stuff done... the catgirl investigation and the white hind hunt would've been nightmares of lost time wandering around the woods. Not to mention that playing through the game multiple times would be hellish without Ctrl-ing your way through thousands of lines of dialogue. I think Ren'Py provides the right framework to get the kind of story KoD has running without bullshit and allows for a gamestyle beneficial to the genre, which is less about the grinding and fighting and more about choices and intrigue.
This doesn't mean all RPGM games are necessarily bad, but using it to build a game means that the game must be heavily tailored around the inconveniences and strong points of a JRPG framework, which is far less flexible than the one Ren'Py provides for visual novels.

Besides, Ren'Py is more easily opened apart and modded =^)

Most of the stuff you listed are due to developers not knowing how to use RPGM properly...

I can't believe how many developers don't give us a system console where we can set volume levels, whether we want Instant text or not (with that option skipping text is as fast as in Ren'py), what movement speed we want (walk or dash) and few others. RPGM is decent engine that got it's hate due to misuse by developers... Ren'py have just as many flaws but you don't hear about them because most developers use it for what it's designed (unlike RPGM).

 

[baneini]

Most of the stuff you listed are due to developers not knowing how to use RPGM properly...Ren'py have just as many flaws but you don't hear about them because most developers use it for what it's designed (unlike RPGM).

While incompetence can lead to horrible experiences with rpgm it's also a question of what people want from their games. Renpy titles have no learning curve, no interactivity most of the time just 2d pictures and text and some people want that.
RPMG is absolutely fantastic if you want any sort of interactivity in the title. Also it allows pacing the games sex scenes with gameplay while renpy you tend to have text only which is something people can dislike. I love working towards a reward in a game personally and I tend to get that from rpgm titles.

 

[lasttmp]

Does anyone know where one could find more of nomo's work ? Because his art is in large part responsible for my liking of the game and I can't seem to find more of his work after 15 seconds of googling, but I'd like to see more of his work, if there is some more available!

 

[Ripe]

Does anyone know where one could find more of nomo's work ? Because his art is in large part responsible for my liking of the game and I can't seem to find more of his work after 15 seconds of googling, but I'd like to see more of his work, if there is some more available!

Other than Noxian Nights... I'm not sure. It's possible he's on Deviant or something similar using different name tho.

 

[jande21]

I still cant comprehend the extreme level of overratedness this dude has over his writing. Like, yeah, its aight, but come on man, hiring him for side collaborations and all that stuff, I dont know.

The stories of these games are nowhere near impressive, I am sorry.

I'm curious then. What adult game writer would you consider the best? Because, IMO, Sierra Lee is far and away the best.

 

[bigpenniser]

I'm curious then. What adult game writer would you consider the best? Because, IMO, Sierra Lee is far and away the best.

Oh dont get me wrong, I didnt say anything about her being the best or not. Just that I find it funny that people treat the story of her games as something extremely deep.

As I said, they are 'aight, which is better than most of the ones you can find around.

 

[vbR592]

Other than Noxian Nights... I'm not sure. It's possible he's on Deviant or something similar using different name tho.

From what I recall, Nomo has a hentai foundry page under the username Nomo, and a tumblr page under the name nomoart. I think most of the recent posts on both are pictures from Noxian Nights and Kingdom of Deception, but I'm pretty sure some of the older stuff isn't from either game.

 

[random.person]

Most of the stuff you listed are due to developers not knowing how to use RPGM properly...

I can't believe how many developers don't give us a system console where we can set volume levels, whether we want Instant text or not (with that option skipping text is as fast as in Ren'py), what movement speed we want (walk or dash) and few others. RPGM is decent engine that got it's hate due to misuse by developers... Ren'py have just as many flaws but you don't hear about them because most developers use it for what it's designed (unlike RPGM).

And that's what I said: "the real problem is that people use it even if they don't want to do a JRPG". But that leads to disaster also because of the way RPGM is designed, it is a very specific purpose framework, it lacks the flexibility needed for games that are not JRPGs.
On the other hand you have Ren'Py which is a VN framework but is at least tweakable enough to allow for other types of content, like the shopping interface in this game, which is already more aesthetically pleasing than the one in RPGM and probably more functional - though still flawed in a lot of ways and limited due to Ren'Py core structure.
I have played a lot of good RPGM titles and I know where it can shine, but generally I think it's a bad choice and it's harder to tweak it to your purposes than opting for an alternative. Unless your game needs the core elements of an archaic turn-based combat system and the constant running around to get any stuff done, there are better choices.
In conclusion, good software, but overrated, to the point where people use it when they need not to. And that's the source of all the bad RPGM games.

Oh dont get me wrong, I didnt say anything about her being the best or not. Just that I find it funny that people treat the story of her games as something extremely deep.

As I said, they are 'aight, which is better than most of the ones you can find around.

More than the writing per se I greatly appreciate the way she manages the setting in her games. TLS plays exceptionally well with the tropes of its genre in a manner that alone is a sight to behold and KoD has a very believable fantasy setting which is managed in a very coherent way, in my opinion.

 

[Deleted member 563623]

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"RPGM is the scourge of the Earth." Absolutely not. RPGM has much higher upper potential than renpy at least. It's a much more flexible and powerful engine and has much more potential for things like immersion, creativity, playability, etc.

People are right in that about 90% of the games that use RPGM should have never been in that engine, don't make use of it's strengths, and suffer for it. These kinds of games would have been much better off in something like renpy, which yes is perfectly fine platform itself and capable of producing fine games and great VNs.

But talented, professional, ambitious and dedicated devs that have an intent to properly make use of the engine's features and capabilities would be wise to choose RPGM over renpy.

 

[random.person]

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"RPGM is the scourge of the Earth." Absolutely not. RPGM has much higher upper potential than renpy at least. It's a much more flexible and powerful engine and has much more potential for things like immersion, creativity, playability, etc.

People are right in that about 90% of the games that use RPGM should have never been in that engine, don't make use of it's strengths, and suffer for it. These kinds of games would have been much better off in something like renpy, which yes is perfectly fine platform itself and capable of producing fine games and great VNs.

But talented, professional, ambitious and dedicated devs that have an intent to properly make use of the engine's features and capabilities would be wise to choose RPGM over renpy.

Oh, lol, I was kind of hyperbolic there, I didn't mean it literally. There are worse thing than RPGM and it does fine when used for its intended purpose. But it being the wise choice for talented, professional and dedicated devs? Not by a long shot. Those with even one of those listed qualities could just use Unity and get a way better general purpose FREE tool instead of a highly specialized commercial one such as RPGM.
Unless you want to specifically make a JRPG, there's no reason to use RPGM, in my opinion. It's just like trying to use a screwdriver to put a nail in the wall: it might be possible with enough effort, but why would you do that if you could just use a hammer?
RPGM is popular because it allows people to develop a game with a simple UI instead of coding and with a lot of premade art assets. I bet only few of its users have ever bothered to learn how to write plugins for it, they just download whichever plugins are the most used - because they usually solve some common functionality need which the engine per se leaves unsatisfied.
Besides, one of the previous versions required Ruby, which I absolutely hate, so at least kudos to them for switching to JavaScript, even though this must have surely nuisanced some older users.
So I'd say that the more you need to customize your game deviating from the JRPG structure the more you should look elsewhere.
I don't have direct experience of developing for any of those engines (I was taught low-level programming only for scientific purposes), but by my experience rummaging through game innards I think I can make the educated guess that coding stuff that deviates from the VN model in Ren'Py is easier than coding stuff that deviates from JRPG in RPGM. But I'm open to being corrected on this by someone who has spent some time doing just that.
My hunch is that if one is a skilled enough programmer or has one on the team, RPGM is more hassle than it's worth if you don't need a JRPG, better use Ren'Py for simple stuff and Unity for more ambitious games with more gameplay requirements.

 

[bigpenniser]

And that's what I said: "the real problem is that people use it even if they don't want to do a JRPG". But that leads to disaster also because of the way RPGM is designed, it is a very specific purpose framework, it lacks the flexibility needed for games that are not JRPGs.
On the other hand you have Ren'Py which is a VN framework but is at least tweakable enough to allow for other types of content, like the shopping interface in this game, which is already more aesthetically pleasing than the one in RPGM and probably more functional - though still flawed in a lot of ways and limited due to Ren'Py core structure.
I have played a lot of good RPGM titles and I know where it can shine, but generally I think it's a bad choice and it's harder to tweak it to your purposes than opting for an alternative. Unless your game needs the core elements of an archaic turn-based combat system and the constant running around to get any stuff done, there are better choices.
In conclusion, good software, but overrated, to the point where people use it when they need not to. And that's the source of all the bad RPGM games.


More than the writing per se I greatly appreciate the way she manages the setting in her games. TLS plays exceptionally well with the tropes of its genre in a manner that alone is a sight to behold and KoD has a very believable fantasy setting which is managed in a very coherent way, in my opinion.

Yeah thats completely true, the setting is always nice.

 

[Shakira]

Hey guys need some help. The game isn't starting for me anymore, idk why. No errors or anything, it just doesn't start. I tried deleting, re-downloading and re-installing the game but to no avail.

 

[Enthusiass]

I'll say, really loving the artstyle, unlike other stereotypical "female heroine is trapped in orc tribe and becomes tribe onahole" games this weirdly is story heavy, not that it is a bad thing, but with the accompanied artstlye I kinda wish it was one, especially with the trial bad-ending.

That aside, what are the mega "Bonus" files for? Downloaded the first one, turns out it contained entire thing again?

 

[Papow]

One of the best game ever I found in f95zone

 

[Shakira]

Can you guys upload the CG gallery including bonus scenes on E-hentai or somewhere? x'D Game stopped working for me and nothing seems to help.

 

[random.person]

Hey guys need some help. The game isn't starting for me anymore, idk why. No errors or anything, it just doesn't start. I tried deleting, re-downloading and re-installing the game but to no avail.

So no error whatsoever is reported? Do other Ren'Py game launch correctly?

 

[Shakira]

So no error whatsoever is reported? Do other Ren'Py game launch correctly?

I downloaded few other Ren'Py games but none of them seem to work. All of them have the same problem. They just don't start and yeah, they don't give any error message whatsoever.

 

[random.person]

I downloaded few other Ren'Py games but none of them seem to work. All of them have the same problem. They just don't start and yeah, they don't give any error message whatsoever.

Which OS are you on?
Do you get any "errors.txt" or "traceback.txt" files in the game's folder? If yes, care to post the content here?