Ren'Py Lessons in Love [v0.39.0] [Selebus]

[Vizer007]

People from here have been trolling him for months with the speed of the leaks, and a lot of commentary here about doing things specifically to piss him off.

He trolled us back.

I'm pretty sure he knew it would only take at most a day to crack the code, and no permanent harm was done (because he also knows that save sharing happens in abundance here)

Nah, thats a given, I just say that if even 1 current or potential subscriber got caught in this - it's not worth it. But seeing that it's not even appear in the latest updates now - not worth it at all.

 

[k1n5l4y3r]

Ok i added the new reset answers to this:
Thank you Wardtnaci for the formating, and butterfly boy for the 6th reset answers

 

[fdsasdf_p]

My chicken brain finally figured out where that intense deja vu came from when going over how Sekai slurped Sensei. I guess it doesn't have to have additional meaning, but bad deeds do propagate I suppose even though you were a victim to those.

The handjob on sofa resembles Ami's sick day event, but that was at least wholesome.
Also only now I came to realize which Ami's favorite blanket was

 

[Bingoogus]

My chicken brain finally figured out where that intense deja vu came from when going over how Sekai slurped Sensei. I guess it doesn't have to have additional meaning, but bad deeds do propagate I suppose even though you were a victim to those.

Now that's some sweet sleuthing right there bro. Props to you.

Also only now I came to realize which Ami's favorite blanket was

Eh?

 

[ElukiaTV]

My chicken brain finally figured out where that intense deja vu came from when going over how Sekai slurped Sensei. I guess it doesn't have to have additional meaning, but bad deeds do propagate I suppose even though you were a victim to those.

The handjob on sofa resembles Ami's sick day event, but that was at least wholesome.
Also only now I came to realize which Ami's favorite blanket was

Yeah.. this one is not a coincidence at all..
Maybe Sekai is the one in "control" each time Sensei does something like this... same with the Molly scene.

 

[fdsasdf_p]

Now that's some sweet sleuthing right there bro. Props to you.

Eh?

I am talking about this blanket; it's very very minor and of no importance to be sure, but at the time I thought this was just some obscure running gag.

Yeah.. this one is not a coincidence at all..
Maybe Sekai is the one in "control" each time Sensei does something like this... same with the Molly scene.

Other scenes might be from other beings (like Molly one, USER2 wired you 1 million affection point to "procced" with the event), but this scene in particular is intriguing enough to consider the possibility of supernatural influence from Sekai;

or Sekai was also under control when she did it, idk.

 

[Bingoogus]

I feel like, at times, we might forget that parts of this game might be more like... interpretations of things not supernatural but more like hallucinations or altered mental states. Like, i'm more keen to lean on Sekai 'taking control' and making Akira kiss Yumi being less literal, Sekai is his abuser, his groomer, the ghost of his trauma, in a broken headcase like him, that situation with Yumi could cause flashbacks of his trauma and in that altered state, he'd just be on autopilot, copying what was done to him but to her. Like, i know with all the timelooping stuff there's got to be more to this than it turning out he's just a dude in a psychward dealing with his insanity, that'd be the lamest cop-out of an ending Selly could go for, but always assuming shit is exactly what it is on face value kind of strikes me as going too far the other way, some of the shit he does and goes through has got to be manifestations of his abuse trauma... replicating past experiences is beyond common in long term abuse victims, particularly those abused in their formative years, i myself enjoy getting physically hurt in the bedroom as a form of twisted and soothing replication of all the times my father beat the shit out of me growing up.

I suck at this theory stuff but sometimes i think sucking at it might offer some unique insight, sort of a situation of seeing the forest for the trees, even a broken clock is right twice a day. Is this one of those times?

 

[smuk]

stuck after reset... how do I start Niki or Otoha events? Does fingering Miku counts as one of two her new events?

 

[barglenarglezous]

replicating past experiences is beyond common in long term abuse victims, particularly those abused in their formative years, i myself enjoy getting physically hurt in the bedroom as a form of twisted and soothing replication of all the times my father beat the shit out of me growing up.

The cycle of abuse -- where someone who experiences abuse projects it forward because they haven't properly processed their past trauma and in the process becomes an abuser themselves, is a theme of the game. Sekai > Akira > Yumi (and others, in varying ways). Very likely Nozomu > Sekai as well.

Hell, a major factor in Yumi's treatment of Futaba stems from her abandonment, Kirin is largely a product of the neglect she experiences from her parents, etc. The abused becomes the abuser.

 

[fdsasdf_p]

I feel like, at times, we might forget that parts of this game might be more like... interpretations of things not supernatural but more like hallucinations or altered mental states. Like, i'm more keen to lean on Sekai 'taking control' and making Akira kiss Yumi being less literal, Sekai is his abuser, his groomer, the ghost of his trauma, in a broken headcase like him, that situation with Yumi could cause flashbacks of his trauma and in that altered state, he'd just be on autopilot, copying what was done to him but to her. Like, i know with all the timelooping stuff there's got to be more to this than it turning out he's just a dude in a psychward dealing with his insanity, that'd be the lamest cop-out of an ending Selly could go for, but always assuming shit is exactly what it is on face value kind of strikes me as going too far the other way, some of the shit he does and goes through has got to be manifestations of his abuse trauma... replicating past experiences is beyond common in long term abuse victims, particularly those abused in their formative years, i myself enjoy getting physically hurt in the bedroom as a form of twisted and soothing replication of all the times my father beat the shit out of me growing up.

I suck at this theory stuff but sometimes i think sucking at it might offer some unique insight, sort of a situation of seeing the forest for the trees, even a broken clock is right twice a day. Is this one of those times?

Completely agree. A lot of times I actually prefer thinking about what we “see” as a visualization of Sensei’s mental state due to his prior experience (in a way it’s like Silent Hill 2 where monsters symbolize MC’s whatever traits, more about mentality rather than scary). I think most of her presence can be explained this way.

The only few times I think Sekai is indeed a being and not hallucination of Sensei is when Yasu seems to “sense” her, acknowledging the rabbit doll floating because Sekai is holding it at the end of last update (and maybe how she creeps around the corner during this reset)

 

[darkparts]

even a broken clock is right twice a day.

What if the clock has no hands?

 

[worthlesspeon]

Yeah I mean it's no coincidence that the background and posing is identical (Sel probably just replaced the characters in the scene), but as for why -- could just be like you said, abusees often repeat the cycle.

At the same time, the game has established that there are higher beings that fuck with sensei for whatever reason, and many of the times when the "happy world" slips into the "real world" tend to be around Yumi.

Going back to the Abyss event where ?User3 talks to Sensei directly, it does make a little more sense now. He notes how Yumi (who is apparently known by a different name to it) looks scared just like Sensei always looked scared when he was with "the world" (Sekai) -- again drawing parallels between the Sekai/Sensei relationship and Sensei/Yumi relationship. Again whether that's just because Sensei is now the abuser or if there's some supernatural fuckiness, who knows.

 

[ZathuraVentura]

stuck after reset... how do I start Niki or Otoha events? Does fingering Miku counts as one of two her new events?

You need to do Niki's event first to unlock Otoha's.

To unlock everything you need to:
1- Call Niki in the morning.
2- Go to the second floor of the dorms during the night.
3- Go to the cafe during the morning and talk to Rin.

 

[k1n5l4y3r]

This talk about the gods acting through Akira Sensei, has got me thinking back on that scene where he froze up after kabedoning Wakana, she said she could see his real self in his eyes and was teasing him while he was frozen up while pinning her against the wall.

 

[Bingoogus]

Whilst it would be more applicable to go with the cycle of abuse line of thinking for this game, my actual example was not a cycle, i didn't pass on what dearest daddy did to me, i kept it with me and went inwards, the replication is, as i said, a twisted form of re-experiencing something that my abuser convinced me i deserved and intermingled it with sex as i went through puberty such that the two are stuck, tangled, and makes me feel like perhaps Akira repeating things on Yumi in an episode as being his way of mimicking the feeling he felt, that twisted way of "do the thing that someone who loves you does cause it feels nice, love me please". Like, i'm not saying at all that that is what happened, just that thinking about that got me wondering how much we all might take the blackouts a little too literally when juxtaposing them with the supernatural stuff... it's not that i think they're more traditional blackouts from a psychiatric perspective, just that they might be and we should keep that in mind, or more, you guys should, when doing your theory crafting, cause you're all so much better at it than me.

 

[alex2011]

Goddamn, how many boxes does this game and the custom renders check?

View attachment 2473287

Just a random custom render for no reason:

Spoiler: TW: "Animal cruelty or abuse"

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To be honest I'm far too lazy to actually try, but the thought of Sel having a meltdown does make it tempting.


Their TOS does say they don't allow rape or incest. This game has statutory rape, probably will have "real" rape, and certainly features incest. As far as CP they do specifically say it's real images that's against their TOS, so this game is in the clear from that perspective if the terms don't change.

You must be registered to see the links

Now they probably won't do anything any time soon because SS entire business model is basically taking on the people patreon banned. But things can change.

I wasn't talking about the CP part. The custom renders feature beastiality, animal cruelty, and rape, and the game features incest, self-harm, suicide, and a fuckton of "filthy or disgusting words or pictures."

All of which is against SS TOS.

As another user posted, it is against the tos.
You can check it here:

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The issue with most games of this genre is that they operate in a form of gray area. Be it because of the way they make the CGs, or because of the kind of content. But yes, it isn't worth the collateral damage. That is the real reason that most of these devs make their games free, not because of goodness of their hearts. I don't think they can legally sell these games. The people in patreon/Subscribestar aren't paying for the game, they are only supporting its creator. I'm not even sure if keeping these care packages behind a paywall would be legal. At least, that is how I understand it, and I'm not a lawyer, so take a grain of salt here.

The best way to keep having these games (and keep receiving money from them) is to not stir shit. I don't think Subscribestar wants to enforce these rules now, but everyone has to keep in mind that they might eventually.

Btw, I get why he is mad. Making games is hard work, and everyone wants to be paid when they work. What some devs don't get is that piracy is a good problem to have. It means, before anything, that people do want to play said game. And it will only happens when a bunch of people are playing a game. Things are bad when you don't have enough supporters to worry about leaked content.

Custom renders don't go there either, they go to a place specifically designed around not having content rules that deny this game's freedom of creativity. Also, they don't enforce on things that aren't illegal in the US, namely fictional depictions. If this had been a real porn game, as in used images of real people, it would be in violation. This is where the difference is with Patreon, which enforces on fictional content, that's the root of the Patreon issue. As far as a grey area, there is none content wise since it is constitutionally protected in the US for reasons listed in a later reply below this.

And if the ToS changes, they will be in the same position as Patreon and will be useless to this game anyway, prompting another move before the new terms even get enforced.

Unlikely that Lessons in Love would be the first then although that trial would be fun to watch.





I don't think so, no. Just because they felt the need to be specific about CP doesn't imply that they're not only talking about real stuff elsewhere. By default "bestiality" (for example) means "bestiality", not "bestiality and also all fictional depictions of it on all supports".

It would just be plain absurd to ban fake bestiality/rape/incest but not fake CP.

For reference, here is the Patreon version :



Of course SS could still remove LiL at any point using the more ambiguous parts of their ToS like "Filthy, or disgusting words or pictures" or even "obscene or immoral purpose". But like Worthless Peon said, that would be a very dumb decision in terms of business as of right now.

It would be, that has the potential to cause a mass exodus. Their creators have already been burned for fiction once, they are already on guard, they aren't going to take even a hint of a Patreon move. This has the potential to ruin SubscribeStar entirely considering their main draw is being more free than Patreon, you can't be more free than something and still enforce rules just as strict, that's not how it works.

I agree with the CP part, they probably felt the need because there a ton of people on the internet who see even fiction as something to ban and who would go after such content, causing an influx of user reports that would be detrimental to the site as a whole.

The only thing i see in their ToS that could be an issue is the following :



Is loli illegal in the USA ?



Obviously zero. It says "real people".

This is true as well, though the things are listed, they are only illegal in real life in the US.

I think that's still an open question legally speaking, hasn't really been tested in courts.




Real people is with respect to the child pornography (and also subscribestar doesn't allow real porn at all to avoid the record keeping requirements). Points 1, 2, 3, and 6 in that image are all things this game or associated content contains. Arguably 5 as well.

Ashcroft v Free Speech Coalition and Ashcroft v ACLU came out with a supreme court ruling that fictional depictions are first amendment protected as long as no real person of the type depicted in the fiction was involved and the fiction is distinguishable from real images.

idk man, taking away the income might make him just stop producing the game lol. yall are in this forum so you must've played the game or enjoyed it, and want more updates. is it just spite or smth that makes you wanna fuck him over? like i get he's a dick but this is really going overboard.

To be fair, nobody here is actively planning to do it, certainly not me as that is a risk to my status on the other side of this divide. However, if they did, you are correct, it would essentially be 'shooting oneself in the foot' as the saying goes. At best, that could be a pyrrhic victory, but I doubt it could be considered anything but a loss if that outcome were to pass.

No idea. I think itch happened last year because of the content but I have no idea when or why the annual passes disappeared.

Itch.io was some advocacy group going after fiction, pretty sure he got that back after a while as there is talk about it as if it is still running. Also pretty sure annual pass is still up considering the lack of talk about it being down. These are topics that would have at least been announced by Sel.

That's the thing, whatever Selebus and his discord followers seems to think about F95 or pirates in general, we're at least not dumb enough to do something like that...
But we are on the Internet, this is a huge place with lots of people even outside of this forum, and if Selebus continues on this path, he will eventually end up upsetting that one dude who will answer without any care about collateral damages.
I'm not sure if even Selebus cares about collateral damages to his own subscribers at this point.

I mean, Selebus is the only one risking his livelihood over his little obsession, and if he's unable to see that, maybe someone close to him who cares enough, should tell him to back down before it goes too far.

Personally, I always saw LiL as an endless project who will never have a proper ending and will continues until the dev retires.
So I'm not particularly worried about what's going to happen. I just hope it happens as late as possible and without too much drama.

Being a VN, it will have a proper ending, several actually. The game plan is just so big that it will take a long time to complete. We are still in the general route with hints that the next full cast route, the dark route, is coming, then there are the individual purity routes after that for all of the characters.

Thanks, i don't understand how much of a bitch sel is to literally program the original affection cheats into the game only to try to screw over anyone who used them.

The point is to make it less tempting to cheat, if there is a punishment that severe, then it produces a severe drop in willingness to use the cheats. This also does not apply to all codes, just the ones with actual gameplay effects from what I understand, though I cannot confirm as I never use them and prefer to just grind it out as intended. Sel wants and has always wanted people to play the way it is intended to be played, that means with sound, with grinding, and with 'happy' scenes (all three of which have been the center of complaints at one point or another).

 

[smuk]

You need to do Niki's event first to unlock Otoha's.

To unlock everything you need to:
1- Call Niki in the morning.
2- Go to the second floor of the dorms during the night.
3- Go to the cafe during the morning and talk to Rin.

tyvm

 

[Vega Cifer]

I do believe some events are influenced by Sekai. Most obvious being at the beach with Makoto and futaba. Where she appeared, and if you have the 50 affection, instead of leaving they show Sekai holding Makoto's head and they go nuts and all have sex. Also many points at the supernatural and higher beings. But it can also be Akira's mental state mixed in with these things

 

[smuk]

oh oh, is this some reference to out of touch?

Spoiler

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[ElukiaTV]

i doubt it but.. a welcome coincidence.