Ren'Py Lessons in Love [v0.46.0] [Selebus]

[aramaug]

A few things on the checkmarks:

• The specific flag that determines whether there are four checks or three in the second reset is ami_virgin whereas the normal Bad Uncle check is amifingered, so it seems pretty likely it has to do with penetrative sex/virginity.
• When we see the board before Maya's festival, the checkmarks are replaced with a large X. So the checkmarks only show up during resets, which might mean they are evaluating Akira and whether he gets to survive.
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• As fdsasdf_p alluded to, the bottom checkmark becomes bigger between the second and fourth resets. If the checkmark is for Maya, maybe it has something to do with him starting to recover his past with her, but that seems weak.
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1. I made valid theories as to why it could be

2. Except the checkmarks from the 2nd reset are Kirin, Chika and Niki

3. There is a reason why one checkmark is bigger than the others, it's not a coincidence, it is literally different which means there must be a reason for it

4. You are just deciding on your own that those things hold no value on your own, when in fact they do

5. what's the point of number 5 even?


Edit: It's LITERALLY UNDISPUTABLE, that Kirin, Chika and Niki were virgins and akira took their checkmarks for the board, it happened in the story, you can see it for yourself in the events and that's how it is, we have VISUAL proof of them bleeding, being virgins and giving their first time to Akira, but we DONT have proof that Molly was penetrated by Akira, you have no basis for an argument here

Sensei and Niki don't have sex until after the fourth reset, so there is no reason for her to count.

I'm open to theories that don't involve Molly being raped, but the only virgins that Sensei has sex with between the second and fourth resets are Chika, Kirin, and possibly Molly, so that seems like the simplest answer for three checkmarks. He also has sex with Maki, but if she counts then Sara and Haruka should too, so there are too few checkmarks. If penetration isn't important, he gave orgasms to Niki and Miku, so again too few checkmarks.

 

[JelF547]

I miss facepalm emoji

 

[Comiies]

A few things on the checkmarks:

• The specific flag that determines whether there are four checks or three in the second reset is ami_virgin whereas the normal Bad Uncle check is amifingered, so it seems pretty likely it has to do with penetrative sex/virginity.
• When we see the board before Maya's festival, the checkmarks are replaced with a large X. So the checkmarks only show up during resets, which might mean they are evaluating Akira and whether he gets to survive.
  Spoiler

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• As fdsasdf_p alluded to, the bottom checkmark becomes bigger between the second and fourth resets. If the checkmark is for Maya, maybe it has something to do with him starting to recover his past with her, but that seems weak.
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Sensei and Niki don't have sex until after the fourth reset, so there is no reason for her to count.

I'm open to theories that don't involve Molly being raped, but the only virgins that Sensei has sex with between the second and fourth resets are Chika, Kirin, and possibly Molly, so that seems like the simplest answer for three checkmarks. He also has sex with Maki, but if she counts then Sara and Haruka should too, so there are too few checkmarks. If penetration isn't important, he gave orgasms to Niki and Miku, so again too few checkmarks.

Im not really interested in this whole theory about the checkmarks but i just wanna ask.If molly was in fact raped,who did it?And if it wasnt us,wouldnt she at the very least act like a normal rape victim?So idk

 

[PhiloPhilo]

I don't even know if Yumi's a delinquent tsundere or just a teenager aware of her pedophile teacher's wrong doings at this point. Doesn't change the fact that I'm a professional hater of Selebus. Fuck him. Fuck texas.
View attachment 3853556

Yumi has been a teenager aware of and disapproving of her pedophile teacher's wrong doings the entire game. It wasn't just acting because she secretly loves him, she genuinely thinks he's a creep whose relationships with the girls is at best gross and morally grey. She's slightly more understanding of him and his blackouts now — but she's still right, anyway. It is gross and weird. She also knows that it's somewhat normal for girls to fall for older guys and it's on the guy to be the responsible one. Even if/when she finally falls for him and gives in, she'll still know it's fucked up.

 

[Comiies]

Yumi has been a teenager aware of and disapproving of her pedophile teacher's wrong doings the entire game. It wasn't just acting because she secretly loves him, she genuinely thinks he's a creep whose relationships with the girls is at best gross and morally grey. She's slightly more understanding of him and his blackouts now — but she's still right, anyway. It is gross and weird. She also knows that it's somewhat normal for girls to fall for older guys and it's on the guy to be the responsible one. Even if/when she finally falls for him and gives in, she'll still know it's fucked up.

>About the whole Yumi falling for Sensei thing

You know this whole "Yumi developing feeling for Sensei" thing made me think.Excluding Ayane,Niki and Ami.All of the other girls that "Love" sensei dont really love him.The way i see it sensei just said the correct things in the correct time,soothed their insecurities and that developed into one sided-love.Now im well aware than sensei cares for the girls and the girls themselves care for him but what he said in the latest Uta event still rings in my ears.

When will the girls put an end to this?When will they hold him responsible for his actions?Why is he allowed to keep hurting them?

EDIT:Btw since this take is quite pessimistic and cynical do take it with a grain of salt.Im just a bit biased due to my way of seeing things.

 

[aramaug]

Im not really interested in this whole theory about the checkmarks but i just wanna ask.If molly was in fact raped,who did it?And if it wasnt us,wouldnt she at the very least act like a normal rape victim?So idk

The assumption is that, if the rape did happen, Wires immediately reset Molly like how Makoto was reset in "Bluejay", hence why her costume is suddenly back on again. So she doesn't feel the effects when she wakes up.

Again, I'm not really weighing in on whether it happened or not. Until Selebus apparently confirming the checkmarks, I was leaning toward it being in Akira's mind and later Sekai lies to him.

 

[Riolol]

The assumption is that, if the rape did happen, Wires immediately reset Molly like how Makoto was reset in "Bluejay", hence why her costume is suddenly back on again. So she doesn't feel the effects when she wakes up.

Again, I'm not really weighing in on whether it happened or not. Until Selebus apparently confirming the checkmarks, I was leaning toward it being in Akira's mind and later Sekai lies to him.

I vaguely remember somebody saying their hymen was long gone because they had dildos or something, that may have been Molly but I'm not sure. If that is the case would he still technically have taker her virginity in the eyes of whoever is keeping track?

 

[jamyong]

Man, so I've finally caught up to the latest update. I took about a year long break while I was in a relationship, tried to get back into it after that ended and stopped when I realized how much more depressed the game was making me, but over the past few days I've read through about 40 hours worth of content...and man oh man has shit gotten crazy.

A lot of the questions I had have only gotten more convoluted, though fortunately a few have been answered. We're really finally getting into the true dark path aren't we? This game has always been sickening yet far too interesting to look away from, but some of the more recent event chains have left me staring at the wall doing my best Yasu imitation. The Tsukasa events, assaulting Karin, basically assaulting Io, watching Ami completely lose it, watching Maya reset... I'm actually scared to see how things are going to continue to devolve.

I will say though, I expected Ami's eventual breaking to be more consequential. For literal years I remember theorizing and watching people theorize about who she would kill when she eventually goes full yandere. It's kind of amazing that she only ended up having a melt down in front of the class, locking Sensei up and eventually stabbing him with scissors. Thought forsure someone would die, at least temporarily. She's still my favorite character in the story, and I love how she almost always serves to drive so many other character's stories forward. I hope Sensei eventually starts being truthful with her. I think she's at a point now where he could tell her everything that he does and everything that's going on and that it would only serve to bring them closer. Her jealousy would always be there but I think his trust in her could override that to a great extent.

Anyway, I'm about 1700 pages behind on discussion so I really have no clue what you guys have figured out or what Selebus's revealed intentions are anymore. Are we still on track for a main dark path and then subsequent individual paths?

 

[PhiloPhilo]

>About the whole Yumi falling for Sensei thing

You know this whole "Yumi developing feeling for Sensei" thing made me think.Excluding Ayane,Niki and Ami.All of the other girls that "Love" sensei dont really love him.The way i see it sensei just said the correct things in the correct time,soothed their insecurities and that developed into one sided-love.Now im well aware than sensei cares for the girls and the girls themselves care for him but what he said in the latest Uta event still rings in my ears.

When will the girls put an end to this?When will they hold him responsible for his actions?Why is he allowed to keep hurting them?

EDIT:Btw since this take is quite pessimistic and cynical do take it with a grain of salt.Im just a bit biased due to my way of seeing things.

In the real world at least, you have to ask whether they're really in love, or whether it's puppy love, infatuation, or just a normal crush. Girls that age are naturally going to cling to someone if they're their only male figure and spend an unusual amount of time with them. A lot of the girls have only been (at least from their perspective) interested for a few months or not much longer, and don't even seem to allude to "falling in love" but just that they like Akira. It's actually really common. I'm sure Maya and Ami both love him for their own reasons and the amount of time they've had with him. Whether that love is strange is a different question. But I'd say a good amount wouldn't even claim to be in love with him.

Man, so I've finally caught up to the latest update. I took about a year long break while I was in a relationship, tried to get back into it after that ended and stopped when I realized how much more depressed the game was making me, but over the past few days I've read through about 40 hours worth of content...and man oh man has shit gotten crazy.

Tarnished, forget about that harlot. You must 100% Lessons in Love and give the girls headpats 100 times for their secret climax scene. There are like 3 dozen maidens, tarnished, just pick one. Stop crying and get Haruka's lust value up so we can do her in public.

 

[aramaug]

I vaguely remember somebody saying their hymen was long gone because they had dildos or something, that may have been Molly but I'm not sure. If that is the case would he still technically have taker her virginity in the eyes of whoever is keeping track?

I don't remember if it was explicitly stated or not, but I think Nodokathon probably implies that her hymen was gone. On the other hand, she certainly still thought of herself as a virgin. So I guess the unexciting answer is it might count, it might not, there's too much we don't know about the rules.

 

[jamyong]

Oh I do have a question that maybe one of the more depraved of us could answer: What happens if you share nudes with Otoha? I chose not to and I don't seem to be missing any events because of that. Have the consequences just not taken hold yet or did I just miss some different dialogue?

 

[fdsasdf_p]

1. I made valid theories as to why it could be

2. Except the checkmarks from the 2nd reset are Kirin, Chika and Niki

3. There is a reason why one checkmark is bigger than the others, it's not a coincidence, it is literally different which means there must be a reason for it

4. You are just deciding on your own that those things hold no value on your own, when in fact they do

5. what's the point of number 5 even?


Edit: It's LITERALLY UNDISPUTABLE, that Kirin, Chika and Niki were virgins and akira took their checkmarks for the board, it happened in the story, you can see it for yourself in the events and that's how it is, we have VISUAL proof of them bleeding, being virgins and giving their first time to Akira, but we DONT have proof that Molly was penetrated by Akira, you have no basis for an argument here

1. And I am here to see how you'd defend your idea; at least try to prove that the possibility in your head is quantitatively equal or larger than the one in mine.

2. I am just going to assume you meant 4th here and not 2nd. Regardless, Niki's event (How To Make Love Stay) takes place in Ch3 so it is chronologically impossible to have Niki as a checkmark at 4th reset.

3. I didn't question your thought on "Bigger checkmark == There must be a reason for it". What I was aiming at is "How do you prove that reason is well aligned with your headcanon".

I went back and check your other posts and found that you also said the big one might be Akira's. While all of our conjectures are merely supported by "I think it'd be cool if it turns out to be like that", the only thing about the bigger checkmark I really care is the fact that it wasn't there at 2nd reset and it was there at 4th reset. Even if it really means something, it's more reasonable to think that it's related to an incident in Ch2. Otherwise, it should have been there since 2nd reset, indirectly ruling out the possibility of it representing Maya, Sekai, Akira, etc.

4. Share you thoughts. What values do "Akira is Ami's father" and "Akira losing V-card to Sekai" have in determining which checkmark is which? How do you utilize these two information?

5. It means all the checkmarks we can gather from the game are only from those two time points; we can use these clues to benchmark whatever prompt we set for ourselves when attempting to explain them, but we can't quote anything beyond 4th reset because we never get to see the billboard again and check how it looks like again; that data point is lacking. I am again referring to all your attempts in bringing Niki into the discussion.

In the end, there are two things we don't agree: Sekai and Molly.
- The Sekai part? Sure. I think Maya Sekai/Ayane/Ami/Makoto isn't more possible but not impossible (again how more possible it might be cannot be shown by "Akira is Ami's father" or "Akira losing V-card to Sekai"; the logic bridge in between is lacking)

- The Molly part? You're very fixated on the virgin blood, and to be fair I don't necessarily disagree with you on it. I am honestly not here to argue her or anyone's hymen status without direct disclosure from the game itself; instead I am here to test what input assumption fits the observed evidences better with less contradictions, and for the time being no girl would fit better than Molly for now, with Niki's possibility being exactly zero and with the arrival of this meta Q&A (btw I absolutely dislike Sel for revealing this level of information via discord and not via his work; SLOPPY).

If you still hold fast to Molly not being raped, you can try to come up with another list of candidates for the checkmarks that doesn't require any overboard assumption and doesn't violate any well established premises, under the hypothesis that checkmarks = V-card claimed by Akira.

 

[Breadtaker]

Oh I do have a question that maybe one of the more depraved of us could answer: What happens if you share nudes with Otoha? I chose not to and I don't seem to be missing any events because of that. Have the consequences just not taken hold yet or did I just miss some different dialogue?

Rin finds them on your phone when she uses it to call chika in her recent event. Rin will probably talk to Otoha next update and you might miss an event there.

 

[Dc345]

Oh I do have a question that maybe one of the more depraved of us could answer: What happens if you share nudes with Otoha? I chose not to and I don't seem to be missing any events because of that. Have the consequences just not taken hold yet or did I just miss some different dialogue?

You win and lose at the same time. Rin gets upset with Sensei if she finds out and tells him to send her a dick pic to make it even and she says she'll send one back. Like Breadtaker mentioned above me Rin will be confronting Otoha about this in the next update.

Which makes me think Rin will find out that Niki sent Sensei nudes and Rin might spill to Chika because Rin is Rin and Chika might ruin the person she once idoled career since she vowed to destroy everything Sensei loves if he ever cheats on her.

 

[hcguy]

Hymen or not, if someone the size of Molly got fucked with a dick the size of Akira's, she'd know it.

 

[jamyong]

You win and lose at the same time. Rin gets upset with Sensei if she finds out and tells him to send her a dick pic to make it even and she says she'll send one back. Like Breadtaker mentioned above me Rin will be confronting Otoha about this in the next update.

Which makes me think Rin will find out that Niki sent Sensei nudes and Rin might spill to Chika because Rin is Rin and Chika might ruin the person she once idoled career since she vowed to destroy everything Sensei loves if he ever cheats on her.

Shit that would be rough. I already don't really like Chika, but it's not her fault and mostly because she has this incredibly naive idea that she's the only one Akira is screwing, but man her ruining Niki's career would for real make me hate her.

 

[Comiies]

In the real world at least, you have to ask whether they're really in love, or whether it's puppy love, infatuation, or just a normal crush. Girls that age are naturally going to cling to someone if they're their only male figure and spend an unusual amount of time with them. A lot of the girls have only been (at least from their perspective) interested for a few months or not much longer, and don't even seem to allude to "falling in love" but just that they like Akira. It's actually really common. I'm sure Maya and Ami both love him for their own reasons and the amount of time they've had with him. Whether that love is strange is a different question. But I'd say a good amount wouldn't even claim to be in love with him.


Tarnished, forget about that harlot. You must 100% Lessons in Love and give the girls headpats 100 times for their secret climax scene. There are like 3 dozen maidens, tarnished, just pick one. Stop crying and get Haruka's lust value up so we can do her in public.

Yea if we apply real life on these girls the number of girls that love him goes way down.But as weve been said again and again cough cough

"This is a world made for you to have fun.Do anything you want.Nothing is real and remember to smile!"

So yea.They do love him.

 

[PhiloPhilo]

Yea if we apply real life on these girls the number of girls that love him goes way down.But as weve been said again and again cough cough

"This is a world made for you to have fun.Do anything you want.Nothing is real and remember to smile!"

So yea.They do love him.

That's true to some extent, but I don't think it applies to everyone equally across the board. At least if we mean actually being in love with someone(title drop.) Loving someone can be pretty vague or mean different things from different people. Miku I'm fairly certain isn't in love with him. I'm not sure if she's ever tried to say it or imply it, but even the way she describes her feelings about him makes it pretty clear that she just has a crush on him and probably isn't emotionally mature enough to understand love, anyway. Makoto even asks her up front (pretty early on in the story to be fair) if she loves him and she says I don't think so, but this is new to me anyway so how would I know. Touka almost assuredly isn't at that point, and I don't see Molly being at that point either. Sana, too, maybe apart from outside forces. Uta, Futaba, even Makoto are debatable in my opinion. And Kirin/Nodoka definitely aren't in love with Akira and probably don't love him, outside of some weird mind-game or sexual escapade fantasy argument.

You could argue that being a little nit-picky, and that there's a theme of everything being unconsciously attracted to him, but then we come back to Yumi, and I honestly don't see any argument that she was hiding any significant feelings for him from the start, or that she has more than a fascination for or crush on him now. So I don't think everyone inherently feeling love for him that isn't built up holds water.

 

[Moonflare]

You win and lose at the same time. Rin gets upset with Sensei if she finds out and tells him to send her a dick pic to make it even and she says she'll send one back. Like Breadtaker mentioned above me Rin will be confronting Otoha about this in the next update.

Which makes me think Rin will find out that Niki sent Sensei nudes and Rin might spill to Chika because Rin is Rin and Chika might ruin the person she once idoled career since she vowed to destroy everything Sensei loves if he ever cheats on her.

That would be wild, but it's not going to happen because it would change too much of the story and characters while being dependent on an optional path.

To have a path where the aftermath of Chika finding out is ruining Niki's career, and at the same time ruining Rin's relationship with Akira (having her slip something that is dangerous to him AGAIN), and Niki having to confront Akira's sexual activities with his students... (taking a deep breath, that's a lot) - AND then to have another path where all of this doesn't happen and yet you end up at the same place is unfeasible. Too many characters involved, huge consequences, and Niki wouldn't be present in one of the paths at all.

Plus, I don't think Chika would do something to harm another person (Niki in this case), especially cause Niki is his childhood girlfriend. It's one thing to have her denial, it's another to be plain stupid - My take is that Chika would assume Akira's cheating on Niki with her, not the other way around. If she's getting revenge she'll get it on Akira personally (and even that I'm unsure about).

 

[Comiies]

That's true to some extent, but I don't think it applies to everyone equally across the board. At least if we mean actually being in love with someone(title drop.) Loving someone can be pretty vague or mean different things from different people. Miku I'm fairly certain isn't in love with him. I'm not sure if she's ever tried to say it or imply it, but even the way she describes her feelings about him makes it pretty clear that she just has a crush on him and probably isn't emotionally mature enough to understand love, anyway. Makoto even asks her up front (pretty early on in the story to be fair) if she loves him and she says I don't think so, but this is new to me anyway so how would I know. Touka almost assuredly isn't at that point, and I don't see Molly being at that point either. Sana, too, maybe apart from outside forces. Uta, Futaba, even Makoto are debatable in my opinion. And Kirin/Nodoka definitely aren't in love with Akira and probably don't love him, outside of some weird mind-game or sexual escapade fantasy argument.

You could argue that being a little nit-picky, and that there's a theme of everything being unconsciously attracted to him, but then we come back to Yumi, and I honestly don't see any argument that she was hiding any significant feelings for him from the start, or that she has more than a fascination for or crush on him now. So I don't think everyone inherently feeling love for him that isn't built up holds water.

Mhm totally agreed.Even if Yumi is the so called tsundere of this game and the seeds have been planted they have yet to bloom.I believe that whatever happens next update will just become fertilizer for the seeds of her crush to start blooming