redharvest1
Well-Known Member
- Jun 7, 2019
- 1,089
- 3,612
Go jogging in the town center.How can I get to fitness level 5 or is that not possible yet? I keep running but it stays at level 4
Go jogging in the town center.How can I get to fitness level 5 or is that not possible yet? I keep running but it stays at level 4
Since the user defined relationship system works, and all that is needed is for PaleGrass to remember to use variables in dialogue, rather than writing in static relationships like "aunt" or "mom", which I believe he now has under control, there is no reason to change anything. This is especially true because, as you pointed out yourself, it would be a pain in the ass for him to have to rewrite the entire opening of the game again. PaleGrass already has his hands full, just keeping up with the ongoing development of the game. Putting development on hold, in order to fix something which doesn't need fixing, doesn't sound like a good use of development time or resources....You need to sacrifice either the incest or the non-incest in the script.
You can write the script so that it makes sense with the incest relationship...
On the other hand, you can also just remove the incest...
Personally, I would just go with option 2 for this specific game. It doesn't seem like incest is a particularly strong theme anyways. But hey, that's just my opinion. It would be a pain in the ass to change things again and there would obviously be people hell bent on having some incest no matter how poorly it is implemented.
Beta. Downloaded Final and the problem is gone. Thank you.Are you playing the Final V1 or the Beta?
There are some fundamental issues that prevents user input relations from working for both incest and non-incest variants if all you do is rely on the user input relationship.Since the user defined relationship system works, and all that is needed is for PaleGrass to remember to use variables in dialogue, rather than writing in static relationships like "aunt" or "mom", which I believe he now has under control, there is no reason to change anything. This is especially true because, as you pointed out yourself, it would be a pain in the ass for him to have to rewrite the entire opening of the game again. PaleGrass already has his hands full, just keeping up with the ongoing development of the game. Putting development on hold, in order to fix something which doesn't need fixing, doesn't sound like a good use of development time or resources.
I don't think you understand how variables work in RPGM. The developer can use a variable, instead of a name, when writing the dialogue. The variable will correspond to user input. For the line you offered above, he can write "[variable], I missed you so much!", where variable is a value which corresponds to the user input for the relationship, which is set at the beginning of the game. For the people who want to set incestuous relationships, it will then read "Mom (or Aunt, or whatever), I missed you so much!" For people who want to avoid incest, it says something else.There are some fundamental issues that prevents user input relations from working for both incest and non-incest variants if all you do is rely on the user input relationship.
Just some common examples. "[Mom], I missed you so much!" vs "[Landlady/mom's friend/neighbor], I missed you so much!" That second one is stupid, so maybe the dev will decide to use the name instead of the relationship here. "Sharon, I missed you so much!" Oops, now the incest version doesn't work. Other common issues include things like "Oh no... this is my landlady... it's wrong to think about her this way!"
As I said above, no, it does not have to be written one way or the other. With proper use of variables, the same dialogue can automatically adjust to reflect the user input for relationships.That's the gist of my position on user input relations. The script must be written to support one specific intended relationship.
Did you read what I wrote? I just told you why the relationship variable runs into problems when used in a sentence. You can argue that it isn't worth it to go back and address the issue, but you are refuting my points without even understanding it.I don't think you understand how variables work in RPGM. The developer can use a variable, instead of a name, when writing the dialogue. The variable will correspond to user input. For the line you offered above, he can write "[variable], I missed you so much!", where variable is a value which corresponds to the user input for the relationship, which is set at the beginning of the game. For the people who want to set incestuous relationships, it will then read "Mom (or Aunt, or whatever), I missed you so much!" For people who want to avoid incest, it says something else.
The only problem with this happens when the developer forgets to write dialogue using [variable], and instead writes the dialogue using actual relationship terms. For example, because the intro of the game states that Lisa's parents were killed, but because I still want her relationship with Sharon to be incestuous, I set the relationship to aunt/niece. Despite this, there were a couple of times in the first release of the game when Lisa referred to Sharon as "Mom", which shows that the developer failed to use the variable in the dialogue. This has only happened a couple of times in the game, so far as I know, and I believe that all such instances have now been corrected.
Also, some people do refer to their parents by their first names, especially after they themselves reach adulthood, so Lisa calling Sharon by her name doesn't necessary mess up the incest version, at least for some people. I never would have called either of my parents by their first name, but I've known several people who do so.
As I said above, no, it does not have to be written one way or the other. With proper use of variables, the same dialogue can automatically adjust to reflect the user input for relationships.
I think that it's very clear that I did read what you wrote, since I responded directly to the points you raised.Did you read what I wrote?
No, I am refuting your points while understanding them. I am saying that you are mistaken. And I'm saying that it's probably because you don't understand how variables can be used in RPGM to control how dialogue is displayed. There wouldn't be anything surprising about that, since most people don't have any experience in writing events in RPGM, so they wouldn't be expected to know how to use variables.I just told you why the relationship variable runs into problems when used in a sentence. You can argue that it isn't worth it to go back and address the issue, but you are refuting my points without even understanding it.
Why would they have to keep reading things like that? It isn't anymore necessary for Lisa to refer to Sharon as "Landlady" than it is for her to say "Mom" or "Sharon." The same dialogue can display in any or none of those ways, based on user input for the relationship.What will happen for people who don't want incest? Will they have to keep reading things like "Landlady, I missed you so much!" And what about incest fans? Will they have to keep reading Lisa referring to Sharon by her name? Do you not understand the fundamental incompatibility? You cannot write a single script that can make both versions sound natural.
No, I am not arguing to support the incest version. Nor am I arguing to support the non-incest version. I'm saying that you don't have to choose between them. I'm saying that there's no need whatsoever to sacrifice either one, and that the user defined relationship can work just fine, if it is set up properly.It seems like you are arguing for the dev to support the incest version by using the relationship variable whenever Lisa refers to Sharon. That is one solution that I already talked about. You write the script for incest or non-incest and then sacrifice the other version. If you use the relationship variable whenever Lisa addresses Sharon, it will only make sense for incest. Landlady, mom's friend, or anything like that will not make sense in the same sentence.
Ok...? We went from user input relationship to conditional dialogues?Yes, you can - I repeat, you can - write a single script which can make both versions sound natural. All you have to do is set up conditional branches in your dialogue events, and have those branches check for variables, and then display the text which corresponds to the specified variable. And you set the variables, based on user input. You can set them to display the text entered by the user, if that's what you want, but then you end up with things like you mentioned, such as Lisa calling Sharon "Landlady", when that was the relationship specified. But you can also set it to display something else. For example, you could set it so that Lisa will call Sharon by her name, if their relationship is landlady/tenant or family friend or whatever-you-please, and have her call Sharon "Mom", if their relationship was set to mother/daughter.
Desmosome, can you knock it down a bit? Your last few post in this thread come off way to aggressive and arrogant which makes you look like unlikable passive-aggressive person.You seem to have poor reading comprehension, so I will just leave things here. Not like I want to convince a random dude on F95zone.
Conditional branches are a common feature of events in RPGM. All dialogue which pops up in-game (As opposed to in cutscenes, though this can sometimes also apply to cutscenes, depending on how they're programmed.) in RPGM is an event. Although I haven't attempted to decompile the game data for Lisa, nor am I going to do so, I think it's a pretty safe bet that PaleGrass is already using conditional branches for some of the events in the game. Suggesting that this is a viable solution for incest on/off in the game is an easy progression.Ok...? We went from user input relationship to conditional dialogues?
No, I'm not talking about writing different scripts. This game isn't being developed in Ren'Py. It's being developed in RPGM. The game already uses variables, and all of the in-game dialogue is already being done in events (the only way to do in-game dialogue in RPGM). All I'm talking about is using conditional branches in the dialogue events which check variables which are set based on user input. The dialogue between Lisa and Sharon already checks variables based on user input, so adding conditional branches is not that much work.What you are describing is essentially writing different scripts and is much more extensive than the user input relationship. You want if/else statements every time to check if sharon_relationship = mom | mother | mommy | aunt, etc.? Or do you want to switch an incest flag on if you entered something specific? That is obviously writing different "scripts" for the incest and non-incest.
I concluded that you didn't know how it works because it seemed obvious from your statements that you don't know about how this can be done in RPGM without too much extra work. And, as it turns out, I was correct. You just admitted that you aren't familiar enough with RPGM to check the programming.I didn't look under the hood because well, I don't know how to for RPGM, but I always check the script file on renpy. Not sure why you assumed I had no idea on how this works.
I do know. I'm very well up on Patreon's censorship, and have spoken out against it often and loudly, both here on this forum and elsewhere. However, it isn't relevant in this case, because a user input defined relationship system sidesteps Patreon's censorship (at least for now), and the Ren'Py version of this game is not being developed by PaleGrass, so his Patreon support is not vulnerable because of how they code it in Ren'Py.Why is this relevant? Having code that supports incest is also against patreon policy, in case you didn't know.
No one in this thread, including you, thinks that I have poor reading comprehension. This is just an attempt by you to make this personal and put me off balance. But I'm not interested in having a pissing contest on the internet. I'm discussing the subject of the user input defined relationship system, and why I think it doesn't need to be removed or replaced, and why I think that the developer should not waste time on a major rewrite.You seem to have poor reading comprehension, so I will just leave things here. Not like I want to convince a random dude on F95zone.
I suspect that, if Sharon is set to "Mom" or "Aunt", then Paul will likely be set to "cousin" by a lot of people, which would qualify as incest in a lot of legal jurisdictions. And perhaps Touma will eventually have some sexual interactions with Lisa? But currently, even if you count Paul, we're still looking at a relatively small number of instances. The amount of reworking should be pretty slight, I would think. And there wouldn't be much extra work going forward, either.As Lecher pointed out RPGMaker supports dialogue branches for different variables. Since the incest is mostly limited to Sharon, PaleGrass doesn't need to write two different sets of dialogues. However, minor adjustments will be needed. He even could distribute future content with her as a patch file on Lewdpachter same as we are used to for RenPy games.
Anyway, the question is, if PaleGrass is able to do it and willing to go through all the dialogues and make the necessary adjustments to support dynamic dialogues, which would fix inconsistencies.
My knowledge of RPGMaker is very little and as far as I know dialogues are linked to their events. I assume that going through all the required events and adjusting them takes times. Time PaleGrass might not want to spend on dialogues.I suspect that, if Sharon is set to "Mom" or "Aunt", then Paul will likely be set to "cousin" by a lot of people, which would qualify as incest in a lot of legal jurisdictions. And perhaps Touma will eventually have some sexual interactions with Lisa? But currently, even if you count Paul, we're still looking at a relatively small number of instances. The amount of reworking should be pretty slight, I would think. And there wouldn't be much extra work going forward, either.
But I honestly don't see that any major changes are needed, one way or the other. I've only seen a handful of complaints about wrong relationship designations in dialogue, and I can't think of anyone other than desmosome who has suggested that the system should be reworked. If it's something which is bothering a lot of people, or if it's important to PaleGrass to fix it, then I don't think it would be that much trouble. I just don't see why it should take time or attention away from continuing to advance the story.
I was under the impression that UE was just an engine - like a platform to use your animations in. Can you animate within UE? That would almost certainly cause weird lighting differences between the images and the animations if it were possible though ^_^hey pale grass why don't you use unreal engine for render animated scenes. Unreal engine is best for faster render animations and it work on low end pc too like on my pc i have 4gb ram 2gb nvidia graphic card it work smoothly on my pc just take too much time to open.
By definition the canon relations wouldn't be incest anyway, at least not in the real world. Patreon says otherwise ^_^I understand, but the way it is now is the worst of both worlds. It does a bad job of portraying any form of incest, be it mom, stepmom, or aunt. It also does a bad job of portraying a non family dynamic. I guess you did the best you could to cover various different relations. I think that is fundamentally the wrong approach to it though. You need to sacrifice either the incest or the non-incest in the script.
You can write the script so that it makes sense with the incest relationship. This will naturally sound really stupid if you don't use the incest relationships. Certain situations and dialogues just don't make sense if you are not related. You just have to trust the players to have common sense with these things and use the correct relation.
On the other hand, you can also just remove the incest. For example, Sharon is mom's best friend who took you in after mom dies. She doesn't have to be a step mom. It's entirely believable for a family friend to become a child's guardian without adopting them. And they would just refer to each other by their names while still acting like a family unit. You can still let people change relations, but it shouldn't be supported in the script if it leads to awkward text on the default non-incest version.
Personally, I would just go with option 2 for this specific game. It doesn't seem like incest is a particularly strong theme anyways. But hey, that's just my opinion. It would be a pain in the ass to change things again and there would obviously be people hell bent on having some incest no matter how poorly it is implemented.
The only other requirement is that Lisa be wearing her summer blouse outfit but it should state that in the event at Lisa's laptopIn the instagram intro quest, i met this men who wanted my autograph but after that, i can't search for that model in laptop. Can any of you guys help me...i played that 3 drinks bar event after that and did that had any effect on saves?
If only it were longer, huh?Hey here as usual I was eager to see the new update, always impressed with the work done when I played it with a special mention on the sharing scene with in the bath hub (the rendering of the expressions of the Lisa's face and the feeling of the feelings is incredible). Now I'm already waiting for the next stage, hoping that it will always be longer than the previous one.
Congratulations pale grass and all the team that helps you.
That's awesome mate, thanks for letting me know that one is finally fixed ^_^!Beta. Downloaded Final and the problem is gone. Thank you.
It is indeed a very long scene mate! I just had a quick skip through the events without issue. Could you fire me over the save you mentioned and I'll have a look? ^_^Outside of my gripes for rpgmaker, this game is pretty good. I'm having issues with the game going to black screen towards what I believe to be near the end of this scene "Swim Trip 1-15-46 Double donk.png"
It's a shame because I did perform a save right before starting the hotwife path. But somewhere in that following pool scene the rpgm window goes black and the music keeps playing. That's a very long scene with no way of saving somewhere in the middle to my knowledge. Three for three for this happening so far.
Running an arch linux derivative with nwjs-v0.63.1-linux-x64.
I always read John Cena as "JOHN CEENNNAA"So when "John Cena" party will happen?
On the next update or still long way?
That's a fair point, it probably does take the taboo out of it honestly. I always talk of how I'm looking toward the final product and maybe there is an easier way to include the original relations with Lisa referring to Sharon as "Mom" while still staying out of Patreon's crosshairs but for now I'm just pushing content.I know that it is common to call close relatives by their first name but somehow it also limits the impact on the forbidden relationship. It just feels off to me.
Sharon really was suppose to be Lisa's mother?to include the original relations with Lisa referring to Sharon as "Mom" while still staying out of Patreon's crosshairs but for now I'm just pushing content.
Yeah mahn, i got around 4 to 5 photo locations too.Stupid question maybe but did your MC has already created an instagram account? Did you take some pictures around the city?
Oh no, Lisa just called Sharon "Mom"Sharon really was suppose to be Lisa's mother?I think Sharon's role would fit better to be Lisa's step-mother or aunt.
Sorry, just me pissing against the wind.
Oh you've seen the Hyun account thenYeah mahn, i got around 4 to 5 photo locations too.
Ok, just to be sure. So normally you could do the PC task. You must click on the computer in Lisa's room to see model's profile. I don't recall which was the option, but normally once you've opened your IG profile, visited the shop, you should have this option. And then you should do wht PaleGrass is telling you just before my reply.Yeah mahn, i got around 4 to 5 photo locations too.
I can't access hyun's account and i have taken photo's in all the mentioned locations.Oh no, Lisa just called Sharon "Mom"
Lisa's parents have always been deaded in the script ^_^
Oh you've seen the Hyun account thenif you've received the notification about Lisa's admirer then visit the coffee shop just beside Lisa's house when the black barista is working to begin that chain, I'm not sure if that was what you were looking for originally ^_^
Edit: The Barista rotates every day so you might need to sleep to get him to appear x
You can't access her account, it's only used to introduce Lisa to InstagramI can't access hyun's account and i have taken photo's in all the mentioned locations.