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SO why did the game returned to 2d instead of the 3d game that was worked on for months? anybody knows?
it's just that people didnt like it?
it's just that people didnt like it?
I think it was mostly that people didn't like it. Too many people felt it was an unnecessary use of time and resources when a 2D game would suffice. I think the team was originally going to stick with 2D, but 3D was considered because one of the designers had made quick work on it, but they ultimately decided to go back to 2D because of backlash. That was my understanding at least.
The return to 2d is a good idea, 3d is just excessively more work and really unless you put in some amazing levels of effort, you just won't see any real improvements anyway.
I'd argue even the time spent making 8 directional movement would be better with the more simplistic 4 directional animations and then let the characters slide up/down like games have done forever to simulate 8 directions without adding another walk cycle.
I'm not nearly as negative on the project as everybody else but it was a good idea to downsize and take on something more manageable.
I'd argue even the time spent making 8 directional movement would be better with the more simplistic 4 directional animations and then let the characters slide up/down like games have done forever to simulate 8 directions without adding another walk cycle.
I'm not nearly as negative on the project as everybody else but it was a good idea to downsize and take on something more manageable.
- Mar 11, 2018
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I believe it was the incredible backlash.
However, moving in a more 3D direction, from my understanding, would have been beneficial. Especially given how much of the game is planned to be travel and exploration.
I assume there will be a fast travel option, but I remember playing "run through the screens" in Sierra games and that got old fast. Sometimes you just want to be where you want to be.
With 3D games, navigation through the same area tends to be more forgiving than with 2D games, but this is just my opinion as well.
2D character animation vs 3D character animation is tough though. Even very good games using 3D characters are not always "quite right" at times. And the best I can think of at the moment, Wildlife, does it very well. But it has also taken them many years to just perfect the assets and animations.
- Mar 11, 2018
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Exactly what people felt like they were aiming for.
The good news is that they have went back to a fully 2D game, but the bad news is they have still kept some of the 3D concepts, primarily the 8-degrees of movement.
And while I know you were probably referencing Paper Mario, the term for seeing equipment on a character back in the day actually used to be a "paper doll" system.
You basically drew your character, drew their armor and other things, and could decorate your character as players equipped stiff with that paper doll artwork.
For this game, they have opted to make equipment be visible on the character which means they need to animate a variety of equipment slots; also in 8-degrees of movement. Otherwise when you walk up-left, suddenly your pants disappear.
This is a lot of work, for a feature I would consider not worth it, especially since the shift from the 3D world has strictly limited your "up and down" type movement on the screen. You're not going to be walking "up-left" for a long period of time in the 2D screens since they simply don't have the real estate for that kind of movement. This could be a big technical/artistic debt item to remove just by either having 4-way movement or just have upward movement by a left/right walk, I don't believe people will mind it much.
The problem is not that you do 2D or 3D, but that, artistically, the previous game looked much better than the current one. The team has only sought to try to convince of the possibilities it has in the long term without even knowing how to restart.
I think the team feels, in part motivated by the new ideas they can squeeze out, but on the other hand possibly not motivated with repeating the "LOK" theme, and possibly it is reflected in aspects like that artistic downgrade in all aspects, because then I could not think of anything else than what happened with that Kuja art that in its day I fell in love with.
I think the team feels, in part motivated by the new ideas they can squeeze out, but on the other hand possibly not motivated with repeating the "LOK" theme, and possibly it is reflected in aspects like that artistic downgrade in all aspects, because then I could not think of anything else than what happened with that Kuja art that in its day I fell in love with.
- Mar 11, 2018
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I agree with you.
Artistically, I'm not the biggest fan of the new characters because they seem to be frail. The color palette is also washed out, as if they took the contrast slider and just slid it down enough so everything has this sort of dusty tint to it now; which is most likely by design. It's just a design choice that doesn't resonate with me fully.
I also think it's important to understand that this new version is actually very different than the original. This one is planned to be more of a "conventional video game" and it will have more features and such to it. I feel like people who are just expecting them to rebuild up to and finish what was in 0.8 may not necessarily be pleased with the goal.
There is a significantly more detailed story, there are characters you can interact with and whom can join you, very reminiscent of the old KoTOR game. There is also combat planned, also planned to be very KoTOR. The sex parts of the game "are present" but they are not the focus of the game.
That part I'm more interested in, too. I happen to enjoy a game where there is sexual stuff but it's not necessarily in your face as the only goal. But this may not appeal to everybody.
The team is doing what they can to distance from 0.8 and where it was going, including dropping Krystal and going with character customization and a "Kay" as a sort of generic name that you can also change. It is LoK in a sort of loose connection only, but it is paving its own direction.
- Sep 19, 2017
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I agree with you.
Artistically, I'm not the biggest fan of the new characters because they seem to be frail. The color palette is also washed out, as if they took the contrast slider and just slid it down enough so everything has this sort of dusty tint to it now; which is most likely by design. It's just a design choice that doesn't resonate with me fully.
Now see, this I simply do not understand. There were numerous anatomical issues with the old Krystal model. For one thing her body sat at an almost 3/4 angle, but her breasts were weirdly offset to face the camera even more than the body was. Her breasts were literally out of line with the center of her stomach to the point. Her head faced 2D forward while the rest of her body was 3/4. Her neck was elongated, and overall she had less detail. The new shading is better, and makes the old one look like she was slathered in butter or olive oil. Kuja improved substantially with the new model, I do not understand for a second why people constantly complain about the new one being 'worse' than the old one. If it's just the expression and color, that's why we have customization:
Chopolander just never stops about this, and I've just started ignoring him.
It's a porn game. We plan for far more sexual content than v0.8 ever had, we just **also** want a good video game. I have also stated multiple times that we are getting back to where v0.8 was in content right now.
Yes and no. The sex is a major part of the game, but we want it so that sex isn't necessary for enjoyment of the game. I.e. a good game. Part of the large appeal I always hear about from the old version of Lok:R is that the sex was a slow build, and it felt immersive. That is what we're going for.
I agree, I don't want walking-sex simulator. There are plenty of places where you can just go to see raw porn. It's the build up that I think people like about this game, and it's what I intend to preserve if at all possible.
We're distancing ourselves from anything Nintendo, but v0.8 is very much our work, and our story, and we are recreating v0.8 at the moment. The ancient Legend of Krystal games are not what we're going for, because it's Nintendo, and we don't want anything to do with them for obvious reasons.
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The last image is a reedition that you made when the subject was first proposed here in the previous topic, so it is clear that you ignore what you want, but I'm used to you always wanting to be right.
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- Sep 19, 2017
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Actually it was more Kuja being fed up and frustratingly giving you an example of what customization means. Besides, we appreciate constructive criticism.
Well the first constructive criticism that was proposed from day 1 was the character design, so see how many you have appreciated.
At least you realized a year later that 3D wasn't going to work and it was also proposed back in the day. You were selling smoke very well back then.
Anyway, I don't know why you care, my friend.... If on your patreon they already offer you constructive criticism and are happy with the designs... Then everything is great, isn't it? I had seen many fetishes, but the "technical demos" or "promises" is new to me. Forgive me, maybe it's my fault for learning the lesson about becoming a patron of projects in standby, cancelled or back to start. No hard feelings, okay?
At least you realized a year later that 3D wasn't going to work and it was also proposed back in the day. You were selling smoke very well back then.
Anyway, I don't know why you care, my friend.... If on your patreon they already offer you constructive criticism and are happy with the designs... Then everything is great, isn't it? I had seen many fetishes, but the "technical demos" or "promises" is new to me. Forgive me, maybe it's my fault for learning the lesson about becoming a patron of projects in standby, cancelled or back to start. No hard feelings, okay?
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I honestly think this looks pretty good. She doesn't really look right with the lighter blue fur. The only other problem I have is she needs a little more booty, but I think a few people have already mentioned that. Look like it's planned anyway since the customizer has an "ass" preset.
- Sep 19, 2017
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The lighter blue was actually to go more along with Dr Comet's style, and distance ourselves a bit more from Nintendo.
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Really just classics. We also went with f-r95 and fluff kevlar for inspiration in some areas. Obviously some of the angles/animations aren't perfect and could use some polishing over time, but I think what we've got is a very good base to build a game on.
- Jan 29, 2019
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How many times have I given you "constructive criticism" about K's anatomy? With references that included real-life people and 3d anatomical examples, everything that artist needs to fix. A lot and constantly. And how many times have you ignored them? All of them.
Instead you chose to listen to the "majority" of people who have no idea what anatomy is like and whose idea of art is that anatomy is not important. "We can not cater to everyone" you say, but your Key is literally redesigned with polls that you had, to cater to the bigger majority of people by simple votes instead of your own vision.
You still haven't fixed those anatomical problems I presented to you but this "we welcome criticism" is being given out non-stop.
No. Stop it. You have made your minds long ago and the only thing you listen to is polls, not individuals. Trying to give you constructive criticism is a useless waste of time, you won't listen.
P.s. even looking right now at these comparisons, I can at the very least say that previous Key had actual asscheeks and not 1 single arc going from her hip. She wasn't perfect by any stretch, pretty flawed model, but I'm still attracted to her seasoned-like face way more than the new doll-looking-like.
The new one may be of a higher quality, may have better anatomy, but the design choices together create just a more "usual" version without some kind of spark imo. I have no feelings towards new K, she looks "just okay" to me.
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Well, with my little knowledge of Photoshop, I have created what, i consider, would be a more correct model, both in anatomy and in a respect for the previous work. Let everyone make their own judgment. 1 hour of reediting work and no subscription required
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- Nov 8, 2017
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I'm assuming the crouching animation is one of them?
Because it looks more like she's squatting to take a piss
Oh that's interesting! This seems like a fun game, so here's my version!Well, with my little knowledge of Photoshop, I have created what, i consider, would be a more correct model, both in anatomy and in a respect for the previous work. Let everyone make their own judgment. 1 hour of reediting work and no subscription required
View attachment 1080357
Btw I took the liberty to add some notes about your redesign.
I tried to make it even more anatomically correct, and make a mix between your design and the actual one. Kinda wonky but again it took me like 10 minutes to deface this.
The fact is, the design is done. I'd prefer changes too, but we're too far now to change it. Please stop. What's done is done. We're not gonna change it. Even though I'd also would like to change stuff. It's not gonna happen.
Still, this was fun! I wanted to try my hand at this too, so thank s for giving me an excuse haha. It could still be improved further!! And yet, this only makes me realize, as things can be worked and worked and worked on, if we keep doing this, we'll be stuck in a loop never taking a definitive stance. We have to take that stance. Even if it doesn't please me or you. I want this game to be done you know?
Have a lovely day and nice photoshop skills!
- Jul 27, 2017
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Not sure how to feel about them going back to 2D, i think doing the 2D version with a low FOV close up camera perspective (not completely isometric so that things in the background still moves around), but with 3D backgrounds, would give a ton of depth to every scene.
I feel the 3D prototype we got was probably too open and too different from what we had, platforming in 3d just isn't great with flat 2D characters, hell, even 2D platforming is awful if you have z-axis movement unless you have some discrete target guided jumping like Tomb Raider that gives you some leniency.
I feel the 3D prototype we got was probably too open and too different from what we had, platforming in 3d just isn't great with flat 2D characters, hell, even 2D platforming is awful if you have z-axis movement unless you have some discrete target guided jumping like Tomb Raider that gives you some leniency.
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