Jun 10, 2022
286
314
Melee is good for long run. At the beginning melee is too weak and waste of turn makes it useless. But after endless grinding u can raise strength,melee and dexterity to three figure(max 2points daily in strength/dex and during combat each crit gives +1 melee). Strength,dex above 90 is really pain in ass as after 90 , during training learning chances will be lower(bigger the number lower the chances),save scumming + sexually depleted state is your best shot at this. Now at high dex u can start at striking position,no need to waste 1 turn and high strength + melee give u better damage output that plasma gun.
Don't waste your time... A quick look at Evolution's other posts reflect he's more of a serial complainer than a gamer. He complains about not feeling like he is role playing, while admitting he used an editor to give himself millions of dollars.

Melee is also great now to capture slaves, don't forget. That in itself is huge benefit.
 

Gunner Rey

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2018
1,097
966
I wanted to like this game. I really did. But after spending almost a year in game, I'm done with it.
Yet you still played some three hundred days of it, I'm sorry to hear you gave up on it entirely. It's not done yet and lately the focus has been on catching up on all the WIP renders for the various slave girls etc, other things that were added do need some filling out, along with completions and additions of a number of quests that may well have taken a back burner while the slavegirl renders were completed.

I don't think your concerns are invalid, I too would like a lot more content to divert me in the process of training these girls and living in Raana, and your line about living in a cubicle cracked me up as when I'm pursuing certain strategies I tend to adhere to regimens that I'm convinced will get me through it faster but tend to blunt my enjoyment. However I look at the Furry's socialization engine and Dockgraves and think what if the content there was expanded even more, as there's a fair amount there to build upon. I think the mind that came up with those diversions is worth giving more time to fill out the more empty and stale portions of the game as it stands.

Just a final note, sometimes the 'grind' is the game. Just how you navigate through Raana as it stands and the opportunities available is part of the experience, it's not all about sex renders.
 

EvolutionKills

Well-Known Member
Jan 3, 2021
1,204
3,978
Melee is good for long run. At the beginning melee is too weak and waste of turn makes it useless. But after endless grinding u can raise strength,melee and dexterity to three figure(max 2points daily in strength/dex and during combat each crit gives +1 melee). Strength,dex above 90 is really pain in ass as after 90 , during training learning chances will be lower(bigger the number lower the chances),save scumming + sexually depleted state is your best shot at this. Now at high dex u can start at striking position,no need to waste 1 turn and high strength + melee give u better damage output that plasma gun.

Yeah, not doing that. The combat isn't fun. Putting all that effort (including save scumming) just to make it viable, only proves how lopsided the combat is. Want to be good at melee combat? How about spending literal months of in-game time training in a menu to be marginally less-shit at it? Yeah, doesn't exactly sound enticing. Sure you could do all that, or spend a fraction of the time raising just Ranged Combat, loot a Coil Gun or Plasma Rifle, and be comparable in a fraction of the time and resources. Plus, nothing in the game or wiki say anything about the existence of that 'striking position', something that might be useful to know. Plus, a scientist with 30 in Strength and Dexterity has just a much health in combat as a uber-ninja with 100 in both.

I tried melee. It sucked, and making any sort of progress with your stats took forever. That and compared to the hired help Peasant, who was blowing shit away with his .30-06 rifle. Looted some more rifles and gave them to Ansel and Loren, they too started blowing shit away, and my character was utterly left in the dust and with no clear progression to getting any better on a time scale not used to measure tectonic movement. As a new player, even one looking at the wiki, there's no reason to even think melee is a viable option after you've played the game at start, and realize that one of the biggest advantages you have is that you move first AND most of your opponents are mostly melee and need to waste a turn moving into range. Your greatest strength is 2 full rounds of actions before they can even start to fight back. When that's where the combat starts, why would anyone even think spending their time trying to improve melee is even a viable path forward?
 

Gunner Rey

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2018
1,097
966
Yeah, not doing that. The combat isn't fun. Putting all that effort (including save scumming) just to make it viable, only proves how lopsided the combat is. Want to be good at melee combat? How about spending literal months of in-game time training in a menu to be marginally less-shit at it? Yeah, doesn't exactly sound enticing. Sure you could do all that, or spend a fraction of the time raising just Ranged Combat, loot a Coil Gun or Plasma Rifle, and be comparable in a fraction of the time and resources. Plus, nothing in the game or wiki say anything about the existence of that 'striking position', something that might be useful to know. Plus, a scientist with 30 in Strength and Dexterity has just a much health in combat as a uber-ninja with 100 in both.

I tried melee. It sucked, and making any sort of progress with your stats took forever. That and compared to the hired help Peasant, who was blowing shit away with his .30-06 rifle. Looted some more rifles and gave them to Ansel and Loren, they too started blowing shit away, and my character was utterly left in the dust and with no clear progression to getting any better on a time scale not used to measure tectonic movement. As a new player, even one looking at the wiki, there's no reason to even think melee is a viable option after you've played the game at start, and realize that one of the biggest advantages you have is that you move first AND most of your opponents are mostly melee and need to waste a turn moving into range. Your greatest strength is 2 full rounds of actions before they can even start to fight back. When that's where the combat starts, why would anyone even think spending their time trying to improve melee is even a viable path forward?
Melee is best used in a supplemental role to mop up opponents after taking out anyone they have that can reliably pierce Duraplate (plasma, coil, auto-rifle). Once your dex gets high enough (I think it's 70) your MC can start in the advanced position and doesn't have to close. A high dexterity will also mitigate the penalties incurred by the heavier armors.

In the short run, you're correct, getting everyone rifles makes the early game much easier. In the middle to long term though it's worth it to use melee rather than fire coil/plasma guns at weak/wounded opponents.
 

iamnuff

Well-Known Member
Sep 2, 2017
1,669
1,214
Lol, LMAO.

Melee combat does suck balls though. You have to waste a full turn to get close, so at the very least you should do twice as much damage as a ranged combatant.
But you don't. You miss just as often as a ranged character does and your damage is sub-par.

I got the power-katana merc from the arena area in my combat party and she's definitely my lowest contributor.
Even worse than Aiko, and I only just took her shotgun away and gave her a real gun.

Maybe it's just a lack of good melee weapons, maybe melee is just inherently inferior.
Either way, don't bother to level melee. You can afford guns, you'd have to be a moron not to use them.

That said, I do agree that the way that you level up skills needs to be made WAY more interesting. At the moment it's just a timesink where you have to waste dozens of in-game days on it. Even more when you want to level up your followers.

I know there's a chance to gain ranged skill in combat, but I think that's either only on kill, or only on hit.
If your skill-level is low enough, you don't get to hit, so you don't get that chance.
Change it to 'chance per attack' weighted towards lower skill-levels gaining skill way faster.

Then you can bring slaves into combat, give them crossbows and just get them used to the idea of shooting at things and they'll improve over time.

Alternatively, as I suggested before, let you take your whole combat party down to the range to train all five of you at once, so even if it does take months to get someone to level 90 ranged, you at least don't have to do it five times in a row.
 
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Kavalor

Member
Jan 29, 2021
451
431
I think nobody here claims that the system is amazing ( not even Grimdark) , there is a reason a combat rework is planned.
The question is not if, but when and it is most likely when the other core system are in place - at least I hope so.
But we are still talking about a twine/html game, I doubt you will ever be able to get a super tactical experience out of that.
Better - absolutely , but not on a level of a professional game from a gamestudio with more than 1 "Employee"
 
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Gunner Rey

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2018
1,097
966
Lol, LMAO.

Melee combat does suck balls though. You have to waste a full turn to get close, so at the very least you should do twice as much damage as a ranged combatant.
But you don't. You miss just as often as a ranged character does and your damage is sub-par.

I got the power-katana merc from the arena area in my combat party and she's definitely my lowest contributor.
Even worse than Aiko, and I only just took her shotgun away and gave her a real gun.

Maybe it's just a lack of good melee weapons, maybe melee is just inherently inferior.
Either way, don't bother to level melee. You can afford guns, you'd have to be a moron not to use them.

That said, I do agree that the way that you level up skills needs to be made WAY more interesting. At the moment it's just a timesink where you have to waste dozens of in-game days on it. Even more when you want to level up your followers.

I know there's a chance to gain ranged skill in combat, but I think that's either only on kill, or only on hit.
If your skill-level is low enough, you don't get to hit, so you don't get that chance.
Change it to 'chance per attack' weighted towards lower skill-levels gaining skill way faster.

Then you can bring slaves into combat, give them crossbows and just get them used to the idea of shooting at things and they'll improve over time.

Alternatively, as I suggested before, let you take your whole combat party down to the range to train all five of you at once.
You gain skill points with critical successes, which means no matter how low your current score you have the same chance of increasing your skill up to the cap at least, which I think is now 150. The chance to crit is roughly 4-5%. That means every combat that goes long enough to allow at least four shots from your five-person party will result in roughly one of you gaining a skill point on average.

Tactically guns are superior, but strategically you can gain through using less ammo by utilizing melee in at least a supplemental role. Alternatively once you really learn the game you can forgo ranged combat to increase the challenge as I've read some veteran players do.
 

JaxMan

Active Member
Apr 9, 2020
730
654
Don't know why you guys are responding to or trying to placate the poster. He doesn't like the game, made his reasons known and has no intention of changing them. Let him go and play something else he, hopefully, might enjoy. That's how it works. If he stays and continues to comment on his critique he's a troll.
 

GD-studios

The Budman
Game Developer
Nov 20, 2021
911
3,287
Piss off. I'm not just a gamer, I fucking went to college for Game Design & Animation (Art Institute of Pittsburgh). I subsequently have a much more refined 'gamer' pallet. Stuff that doesn't bother other people, bothers me a lot. In the same way that a film major is going to notice poor editing and pacing in a movie, or a medical student will notice bad practices in a medical procedural TV show.

If this shit doesn't bother you? Great. Have fun. But the game has fundamental issues, and I gave it a long and solid try, hoping that it would eventually get better at some point. It did not. The more I played it, the more the problems compounded. Even when freed of the rat-race for money, the experience didn't improve. That speaks to a fundamental problem with the core gameplay loop. The progression that is there is grindy and almost meaningless (e.g. in combat, stats matter far less than gear), the interaction with your slaves is rather shallow and uniform (e.g. once they reach the same range of stats, they all have the same reactions).

That's not including problems with the UI, like how some pages within the slave menu let you swap between slaves without having to back out to the main menu, but others do not and force you to swap back and forth to check each slave individually (e.g. the prostitution and house rules submenus) because the dev decided to waste half the UI real-estate with a still image that you won't care about after you've seen it twice. Or how the house rules lacks options to set a slave's preferred clothing to some of the available options, like any of the swimwear or the New Eden gown. Or how making one of your slaves your wife completely eliminates any bondage options with them. Why? What did that accomplish? Even if you have later plans for a slightly different version of the bandage stuff unique to the wife, why completely remove the standard options you'd been using to train them up to that point?

Or how the house menu options are split into 3 confusing categories (why is Training under Actions & Events and not Manage, are you not managing yourself at that point?) that each lead to a 6 icon submenu that none of which actually have an entire 6 icons worth of options. Just eliminate all of the submenus, put the Spend Time / End Day options at the top, and now use the entire bottom to display a row or two of those icons. If you want them displayed with a lot of excess space, make it a single row with arrows on either side to rotate out to a second or third row of icons (much like how the Manage Household submenu works, and it already has the arrow UI elements you need). That way you're not getting confused with where each icon you want is hidden, you can just see them all right there.

The only trick to the combat is having good gear and decent aim, all of which are money sinks rather than XP or skill progression. You don't even need to bother training your Ranged Combat skill (which determines your accuracy, not your Dexterity, despite how they're often tied together in character creation) when you can just purchase that ocular combat implant that makes it nigh impossible to miss. Your only meaningful character stat for combat is accuracy, and that can be bypassed with money.

Here's a question: how much health does the player have? No fucking idea! It's not in the Wiki, nor is it displayed on the character stats screen in game. Nothing in any of the attributes on the Wiki says anything about effecting health, and Stamina is it's own dedicated stat rather than a derived one (from say a Constitution score). How do you increase it? More costly implants! Money might as well be a core character attribute, cause it means more than your actual stats; you might as well be a walking bank account with a gun.

So yeah, I started out initially with a big mean bruiser of a melee build, trying to play into being a raging barbarian. It wasn't great. Later I started over with a high Intelligence scientist build that used guns, and with zero options in character creation put into combat utility, and it utterly mopped the floor in combat compared to the earlier melee build. Even with the money sink that is ammo, ranged combat does more damage faster, which keeps you safer and spending less on healing and armor repair.

Again, the game isn't bad. It's writing is serviceable, but doesn't rise above that. It gets the job done with a minimal of grammatical errors, but you're not going to find yourself playing this game for the strength of the prose. The renders look okay, but they're small, grainy, and frequently missing. They also include a generic bald guy (despite all three of the player avatar images having hair) who I know I've seen in dozens of other 3D CG games (the one that comes immediately to mind is the antagonist of The Point of No Return). You're going to see the same content dozens and dozens of times, because making any progress requires inordinate grinding of the same actions over and over and over again. What might have been engaging or hot at first, absolutely loses all of its luster when you're seeing or reading it for the hundredth or two hundredth or three hundredth time.

Which would bother me less, if it was actually any fun. But it's not. It scratched that itch to see numbers go up, that most basic of Pavlovian gamer responses. But once you get beyond that? It's just not an engaging experience. It's a money and time management game with the occasional repetitive sex scene, which makes you feel like you're trapped in a soulless 9-to-5 office cubicle job rather than being a globe trotting noble slavemaster bounty hunter badass. There is no power fantasy here. The only power is the size of your bank account, and you will need to grind incessantly to increase it; again making the game feel more akin to the office cubicle rat-race than a epic RPG adventure.
Several interesting suggestions. However, I'd say at least 75% of all those issues are something I've planned to address eventually - especially the combat system, slave diversity and different ways to "grind".

Are you on our Discord server? There's a lot of planned features and discussions going on there and I usually bookmark all suggestions posted by players. You do seem like a veteran MoR player so I'd love to hear more!
 

AH-64E

Member
Nov 2, 2017
117
697
Don't know why you guys are responding to or trying to placate the poster. He doesn't like the game, made his reasons known and has no intention of changing them. Let him go and play something else he, hopefully, might enjoy. That's how it works. If he stays and continues to comment on his critique he's a troll.
I'd say it's an overall constructive conversation. If you ignore his less than... sociable... traits (which might be rather difficult), he does indeed have some good points and critiques to share. The best kind of feedback to get is negative feedback, provided it's informative.
 

EvolutionKills

Well-Known Member
Jan 3, 2021
1,204
3,978
Several interesting suggestions. However, I'd say at least 75% of all those issues are something I've planned to address eventually - especially the combat system, slave diversity and different ways to "grind".

Are you on our Discord server? There's a lot of planned features and discussions going on there and I usually bookmark all suggestions posted by players. You do seem like a veteran MoR player so I'd love to hear more!

I actually post here because I prefer an old-school traditional forum to Discord's stream-of-consciousness take on interaction. I enjoy taking my time to collect my thoughts, then edit and format them as needed before posting; and Discord really isn't conducive to that. That being said, I have been mainlining MoR for the last few days, so I have put a lot of hours into it in a relatively short amount of time.

Happy to hear that you're aware and working on improvements, rather than doubling down. I haven't written the game off for good, and perhaps I should have been more clear with that in my original post. While I am certainly done at the moment with the version that I played, I haven't written the game itself off entirely.

But if I can make a suggestion here. I thought the option for difficulty was good, and the choice of dice rolls was rather novel. Maybe add in a third option that would invoke a game-wide modifier to most all stat changes? Not combat health or damage, but an option to raise a multiplier (2X~5X) for stuff like money and stat gains would help cut into the grind for those who would prefer a more streamlined experience with faster progression. That way instead of making a lot of individual tweaks, you could still build to your vanilla baseline, and give those who want it a fast track.
 

GD-studios

The Budman
Game Developer
Nov 20, 2021
911
3,287
I actually post here because I prefer an old-school traditional forum to Discord's stream-of-consciousness take on interaction. I enjoy taking my time to collect my thoughts, then edit and format them as needed before posting; and Discord really isn't conducive to that. That being said, I have been mainlining MoR for the last few days, so I have put a lot of hours into it in a relatively short amount of time.

Happy to hear that you're aware and working on improvements, rather than doubling down. I haven't written the game off for good, and perhaps I should have been more clear with that in my original post. While I am certainly done at the moment with the version that I played, I haven't written the game itself off entirely.

But if I can make a suggestion here. I thought the option for difficulty was good, and the choice of dice rolls was rather novel. Maybe add in a third option that would invoke a game-wide modifier to most all stat changes? Not combat health or damage, but an option to raise a multiplier (2X~5X) for stuff like money and stat gains would help cut into the grind for those who would prefer a more streamlined experience with faster progression. That way instead of making a lot of individual tweaks, you could still build to your vanilla baseline, and give those who want it a fast track.
Understandable! F95 works fine too of course.

Yeah. Check back around 2026 or something when the game has (hopefully) reached version 1.0. - even if the next couple of updates have a lot of new stuff coming.
 

iamnuff

Well-Known Member
Sep 2, 2017
1,669
1,214
How is your 'combat power' calculated for the Mad Preacher questline?
I could grind my gambling for hours... but I kinda just want to kill this asshole?

It says i'm at 13/25, but it doesn't tell me how it's calculating that.
Gear level? The combat-skills of my companions? Everyone has combat armour and coilguns, and almost everyone has a ranged attack stat of 90+
 
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Gunner Rey

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2018
1,097
966
How is your 'combat power' calculated for the Mad Preacher questline?
I could grind my gambling for hours... but I kinda just want to kill this asshole?

It says i'm at 13/25, but it doesn't tell me how it's calculating that.
Gear level? The combat-skills of my companions? Everyone has combat armour and coilguns, and almost everyone has a ranged attack stat of 90+
One thing I know is that everyone in your household with a ranged or melee combat score of 25 counts one.
 

iamnuff

Well-Known Member
Sep 2, 2017
1,669
1,214
One thing I know is that everyone in your household with a ranged or melee combat score of 25 counts one.
Total household?
But why?

I'm standing two feet away from this dude holding a man-portable plasma weapon. He shouldn't be assessing the strength of my household, he should be assessing my ability to vaporize him and his retinue before he can put pants on.

Relatedly, I know how to modify my own stats with console commands ( SugarCube.State.active.variables.master-) but how do you target slaves/mercs with that? Their names don't seem to be working and if i'm going to have to start a new save when the capture update comes out, i'm going to want to cheat a bunch.
 

Gunner Rey

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2018
1,097
966
Total household?
But why?

I'm standing two feet away from this dude holding a man-portable plasma weapon. He shouldn't be assessing the strength of my household, he should be assessing my ability to vaporize him and his retinue before he can put pants on.
It could be he's concerned that even if he does win you might have enough thugs and slaves in your household to avenge you.

My endgame characters can shake off a couple plasma blasts.



Relatedly, I know how to modify my own stats with console commands ( SugarCube.State.active.variables.master-) but how do you target slaves/mercs with that? Their names don't seem to be working and if i'm going to have to start a new save when the capture update comes out, i'm going to want to cheat a bunch.
I've never actually done that so I'm not the one to ask, the Discord might be the place to ask about that if no one answers you here.

There's no reason to think you'll have to start a new game when the new update goes public.
 

Hargan2

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
1,201
1,395
Total household?
But why?
I'm not sure whether the Preacher quest uses household power or if combat power means something else.

Relatedly, I know how to modify my own stats with console commands ( SugarCube.State.active.variables.master-) but how do you target slaves/mercs with that? Their names don't seem to be working and if i'm going to have to start a new save when the capture update comes out, i'm going to want to cheat a bunch.
So, the variables aren't straightforward. Slaves use an $av_# variable, and mercs/issids use $is_# (for example, is_3 is loren) see my post below for more details

All of the mercs/issids have their stats saved in an array tied to the "$is_" variable. "is_3" is Loren, for example. Here's a screenshot of Grim's explanation of each number in the array.

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.
 

Gunner Rey

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2018
1,097
966
\Probably not while naked tho.
Actually, yes. With all the implants your health is 200 at least, that's roughly two first-shots by Ayden.

At any rate Hargan makes a good point, I naturally assumed that was your household
power rating being considered, that might not be the case. I've never seen that screen because I let Michelle take care of that problem, she's a slavegirl and a slut, that's what she's for.

I killed a bunch of potentially capturable slaves. I'm going to restart.
Ah, I get it.
 

Mahroni

Newbie
Aug 22, 2020
46
19
How is your 'combat power' calculated for the Mad Preacher questline?
I could grind my gambling for hours... but I kinda just want to kill this asshole?

It says I'm at 13/25, but it doesn't tell me how it's calculating that.
Gear level? The combat skills of my companions? Everyone has combat armor and coilguns, and almost everyone has a ranged attack stat of 90+
This, I need to know what determines the power calculation. At first, I thought it was about influence but after having over 10000+ influence, it still stuck at 17/25. I don't want to share my waifu. Also, my character is a total noob at gambling so savescumming is futile.
 
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