- Oct 25, 2018
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- Thread starter Eva Kiss
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- Sep 25, 2020
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Yeah, we still don't have Jeremy/Lena ORS signatures.There seems to be a lot of Jeremy fans, so if you take the role as the Jeremy/Lena fan art guy, I’m pretty sure you’ll end up being popular around here
- Sep 11, 2018
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- May 26, 2020
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- Apr 25, 2020
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But that's why I like her
At least in the game, it would be different in real life.
Furthermore, she seems to be very submissive with someone she admires (with Ian or Axel for ex)
- Nov 15, 2020
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If Ian sleeps with Holly while he’s also sexually involved with Lena, Lena’s harsh response isn’t just about her own feelings, but also Holly’s. Unlike Alison, Cindy and the others, Holly has become a friend of Lena. And Lena knows that Holly’s got feelings for Ian, which should be obvious to Ian as well.
Ian is also the first guy Lena is close to starting something serious with after her breakup with Axel, and we know how that relationship ended. So when Ian sleeps with Holly seemingly without caring about her feelings, which also could be a threath to Lena’s friendship with Holly, she reacts different than she would if Ian had sex with someone else (she reacts pretty rational even when she finds out that he slept with Cherry). Ian sleeping with someone random doesn’t make him a worse person in Lena’s eyes, but Ian sleeping with Holly does, also because it probably reminds her of how she’s been treated by Axel in the past.
I do however agree that it’s not perfectly executed in the game, also because it’s so obvious that Lena herself should’ve told Holly she had something going on with Ian, especially when she knew they were going to the book fair together. Eva made some changes to the dialogue from the Alpha to the final version of that chapter, but it wouldn’t surprise me if that’s one of the plotlines she’s refining in the reworked version.
- Apr 23, 2021
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Holly is ok with Ian being sexually involved with other girls, because he is honest to her and he tells her at his current life situation he can't have a serious relationship. Even after everything that happened, she comes to his house to have sex with him again. She is also an adult.
In my gameplay, Lena not only has continuous sex with Ian but also with Mike, Louise, Masturbate to her ex and interact with her fans, doing her "modeling job". It kind of goes further than the modeling. But yet she is giving Ian a hard time. Even in another gameplay, where she sucks Jeremy Dick, even knowing that Ian is Jeremy friend and Louise trusts her as a friend, she goes and gives a blowjob to Jeremy when louise leaves the house and have sex with him. So how can Lena Judge Ian? When Ian was at least honest to holly about who he is fucking and she is never honest to her roomate louise or even to Ian? That is either bad writing or she is an hypocrite
But now that things ended between Ian and Lena, he can just enjoy Holly without Lena, she is the only one who lost. And now she has to deal with seymour who is clearly harrasing her. Keep fucking Mike who already told her he has a GF. Fucking Jeremy, that at this point have been with all girls Ian fucked, the only difference is, Ian lost all girls, and Jeremy keeps fucking them, apparently he is the good guy. I think that saying is true: "Once you go black, you never go back" lol.
- Nov 15, 2020
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But Holly is extraordinarily bad at standing up for herself. Ian could probably have fucked her and then told her to get out of the hotel room because he wanted to sleep alone, and next morning Holly would still tell him it was totally OK after spending the night sleeping on the floor in the hallway. And she’s afraid of telling Lena what happened, so it does lead her into problems, she just doesn’t want to bother Ian about it (see: "bad at standing up for herself"). In addition he only tells her about his involvement with Lena after they’ve had sex, which is convenient for Ian, but not exactly the best way to handle the situation.
I’m having trouble keeping control of all the different paths by now, but I think you’re also mixing up two different paths for Holly. If Holly meets and has sex with Ian at his apartment in chapter 9, that’s because Ian told her the night at the hotel wasn’t a one time thing, which in turn is only available if Ian and Lena aren’t serious about each other. In that scenario I’m pretty certain Lena reacts differently when she finds out what happened at the book fair. If Lena and Ian are serious, I don’t think we have the option to tell Holly it wasn’t a one time thing, and I don’t think Holly and Ian will meet in chapter 9 either. (Correct me if I’m wrong here, I absolutely might be.)
Oh, Lena is absolutely a hypocrite if she’s involved with Jeremy. That’s worse than Ian sleeping with Holly, as Jeremy has been Ian’s friend forever, and he’s also the boyfriend of her friend and room mate. She’s also a hypocrite if she has sex with Mike and dirty talks about him cheating on his girlfriend — considering Lena herself has struggled for a long time because Axel cheated on her. And then when she has sex with Axel literally just hours after having the relationship talk with Ian, and then the events with Seymour a few days after …Even in another gameplay, where she sucks Jeremy Dick, even knowing that Ian is Jeremy friend and Louise trusts her as a friend, she goes and gives a blowjob to Jeremy when louise leaves the house and have sex with him. So how can Lena Judge Ian? When Ian was at least honest to holly about who he is fucking and she is never honest to her roomate louise or even to Ian? That is either bad writing or she is an hypocrite
But isn’t that a big part of the fun as well, being able to play both Ian and Lena as either nice and faithful or ending up doing shitty things over and over? And while Ian so far can’t have sex with Holly without some consequences to his relationship with Lena, there’s a lot of other options for him where he can act equally shitty and get away with it (for now). Like him having sex with Cindy in her and Wade’s bed, also just hours after the relationship talk with Lena.
Not as good as yours, but may be appreciated by some peopleAny Jeremy fans here?
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How nice would it be if we could have a DLC to play as Jeremy? Same story, but we get to see Jeremy in action with all the ladies!
Sure but it just isn't the same as Ian secretly watching videos of Jeremy's conquest. IMO playing as Ian and witnessing things is a lot hotter than playing as Jeremy, since that type of game is a dime a dozen on f95.
- Nov 25, 2021
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Yeah, I think it's pretty clear that if Ian tries to have a casual thing with Holly, she is very much not okay with it. She's just super into him, has massive self esteem issues, and will put up with just about anything. Some pretty good writing, that.
And yes, you can absolutely play a route where Lena has issues with behavior from Ian that she herself engages in. People are weird, complicated, conflicted creatures. Again, good writing.
- Apr 23, 2021
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That is exactly what I am talking about. I went in a path caring for lena, and even in that path she would also have a thing with louise, she had kissed holly. etc. When she ended her fling with Ian because of holly. I decided to make another path to see how she reacts. This other path, she goes for mike and that gf conversation, she sucks Jeremy and after that keeps having sex with him. and has sex dreams with Axel. In this second path, I only didnt go for the guys who were trying to force her or trick her into dating/having sex with them (Robert, Axel and Seimour). And she acts the same way with Ian. When lena ends things with Ian in this path, and Ian tells Holly that he has nothing serious with Lena, it is just sex and he is still single. She is relieved because he has told her he didnt have a girfriend, he was single, that doesn't mean he doesn't have a sex life (and holly gets it, she even tells him that she didn't expect he wasn't having sex with other girls). Being in a relationship with a girfriend and being single having a sex life it is 2 different things, and holly knows that. Holly also tells at some point when with Lena and Ivy that one of her fantasies is having a 3some. In this path after Lena ends things with Ian, Ian is only fucking 2 girls at this point, Emma and Holly.
As we all agree with it not being bad writing. Lena is just being hypocrite on my opinion. Specially with Mike and Jeremy situation, but specially with Jeremy who is Ian's friend.
- Jun 21, 2018
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I think you taking all the different paths as an indication of Lena's personality, but that isn't the case. Lena/Ian become who we want them to become, these choices are just different paths they might take, but nonetheless each path creates a shift in their personality(within limitations of their established personality of course), they can be shitty af, or dope ppl who take others into consideration; for example Ian can either be a really good friend to Wade and actively try to help him get back with Cindy, or he can go after Cindy and feel bad about it, or he can be a total hypocrite going out with Cindy behind Wade's back, gaslight him as being a pos, then turn around and rag on Jeremy for doing something similar with Alison.......who isn't his girlfriend. All of this though is based on what we choose, so if you don't want your Lena to be a hypocrite then simply make different choices.True. The only one my mc would have a serious relationship is Holly though. I will tell you why. If we both are having fun Lena, Me with some girls and Lena with Louise and some guys, she still wanna judge Ian for having slept with Holly even he being honest to holly and Lena through the whole time. Lena was never open about who she is fucking to him. This is when I give them both the freedom to date who they want. on Ian's side he goes for Alison, Emma, Holly and Lena. On Lena side, she goes for the DJ, Ian, Louise and uses axel pictures. She also play with her fans. And Ian knows about her erotic model profession and doesn't Judge her, but she does to him. That for me is a "no go" with Lena.
Another thing that has nothing to do with the subject but I noticed and kinda made me sad is how guys force themselves on Girls. Just because Lena was nice to Robert and went in a date with him he tries to kiss her even when she isn't flirting or anything, he first lured her into go in a date using the work problem as an excuse. Saying he is gonna tell her what is going on. Then he never tells he knows about her modeling, so he already assumed from what he saw that if she is that kind of model she would go out with him and have sex. He tries to force himself on her. Very bad attitude. Then Axel. He goes after her family, she gives him a chance to explain himself, he says he is sorry, she accepts his apologies but makes it clear that whatever they had is in the past. But when he has a chance to work with her again he also takes advantage of her by kissing her and she has to push him twice for him to release her. And the last is the Seymour guy. So if the girl doesn't wanna work with him, he will try to destroy her life and not let her have any job.
And funny is. In real life men usually treat women like that we just don't realize it most of time. When she turned down Seymour, she went for axel to keep doing her modeling job and he tries to force himself on her. The other guy would only help her at work if she slept with him. And the third won't let her have a job if she doesn't do the erotic voyeur stuff that he wants.
It leaves her with Stan, the fucking creepy guy. If she is understanding and nice with him, he will remain being a creppy towards her.
In my gameplay she is Jobless
Saying all that her issue with Ian and Holly isn't about her(Lena), it's about Holly. Holly is not okay with being Ian's casual fuck, she just accepts it because she's infatuated with him, and is a huge pushover, she "totally cool" about all the shit Ian's doing because she simply does not have the confidence to speak her mind, this is a huge part of her character. Lena knows all this, and knows that while Holly is an adult, she also has issues, and her casual relationship with Ian is simply toxic for her, as it will result in her letting Ian walk all over her(Lena's own history makes this a huge sore point). She's not being a hypocrite here, she's simply being protective of Holly.
Yea Woman deal with shit like that a lot, that's why things like Red or even Yellow flags can be a dealbreaker, because it can lead to being caught in a really fucked up situation. There's also this cultural expectation of women playing hard to get so "your not seen as easy" and dudes being aggressive because "woman are just playing hard to get", it just creates this whole fucked up cycle that isn't good for anybody. And this is really only one of the many reasons. As to Robert, Axel, and Seymour though their just shitty ppl. Axel and Seymour are straight sociopaths, and Robert's a lowkey incel. Since Ian can't do corruption content, majority of it went to Lena, so most of her LIs are just creepy dudes, that's why Eva wanted to rewrite Stan to give Lena more wholesome options, just hoping that his creepiness is toned down alot on the Lena being genuine friends with him path(then he can go full creep on the other path).
Lena being a hypocrite isn't a problem; I only hope that it will have consequences at some point. Perhaps a big blowup of all the shady stuff Ian and Lena did would be followed by the apparently planned timeskip, where we can see the consequences play out.
- Nov 15, 2020
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I started writing a response to this, but realised I was just repeating my previous posts, and Echbert's post did a good job summarizing what I might have added anyway. So instead I'll point out what I think is the weakness about Lena's confrontation with Ian about Holly, which I suspect is part of why you and others have disliked it.
The Ian/Holly book fair hotel scene can play out the way it does because of a few requirements. 1) Lena doesn't tell Holly that she's involved with Ian (and Ian doesn't either), 2) Ian doesn't fully realise how infatuated Holly is with him, and 3) while Holly suspects that something's going on with Ian and Lena, she's still unsure enough about it to make a move on Ian.
I think at least the first two requirements aren't fully realistic. Realistically I think Lena would have told Holly about it, especially when she knows they are going to the book fair together, because she knows from early on that Holly's got feelings for Ian. And in a lot of other situations Ian is or could be played way more attentive, so I find it a bit strange that he doesn't fully see the extent of Holly's feelings for him. His whole beginning relationship/affair with Cindy is mostly based on him being way more observant and attentive when it comes to Cindy's feelings that anyone else, especially Wade.
But if Lena or Ian told Holly that they have something going on, or if Ian realised how head over heels in love Holly was, the scene between Ian and Holly probably wouldn't happen. So with how everything has been set up until then, Eva's hands are a bit tied when it comes to ways she can write the scene.
It's not realistic that every scene will be solved perfectly in a gigantic, fast-paced story like this, but in this instance it's more obvious because of the confrontation afterwards. The scenes where Ian and Lena have serious, important talks, are probably among the most difficult to structure writing wise, because you can only control one of them, so the reaction of the other person will necessarily be out of our control, and instead be based on how they would most likely behave based on how we've played them until then. During the relationship talk in chapter 9, I think this is solved better (the only thing that's out of our control, is Lena's decision that she won't enter a relationship with Ian if she's had sex with Jeremy, which I think makes sense). But while I think it's obvious to us as players that Ian acts a bit shitty if he sleeps with Holly when he's involved with Lena, I doubt most players expected the outcome to be completely out of our control.
I think that could've been a bit clearer if we'd gotten some additional reminder that Ian goes behind both Lena's and Holly's backs if he chooses to have sex with Holly. Off the top of my head: If Ian suddenly had gotten a phone call from Lena when he and Holly were in the hotel room, and Holly noticed this and asked who was calling, we could've gotten the choice between telling her it was Lena (leading to Holly losing her courage and asking Ian if there's something going on between them, ending the chance of them having sex), or downplaying it as "nothing important" (meaning Ian is actively holding back the information about him and Lena to make sure he's not losing the chance to sleep with Holly). That would've made Ian's betrayal a more active choice, and Lena's reaction would probably have felt less surprising in the next chapter. (But it's easy to throw out random solutions or suggestions to improve the story, it's something completely different having to implement that into the gigantic web of choices, variables and plotlines the game consists of.)
Edit: Sorry about the wall of text, again. I need to work on being brief.
- Apr 23, 2021
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That is exactly what I am talking about. I went in a path caring for lena, and even in that path she would also have a thing with louise, she had kissed holly. etc. When she ended her fling with Ian because of holly. I decided to make another path to see how she reacts. This other path, she goes for mike and that gf conversation, she sucks Jeremy and after that keeps having sex with him. and has sex dreams with Axel. In this second path, I only didnt go for the guys who were trying to force her or trick her into dating/having sex with them (Robert, Axel and Seimour). And she acts the same way with Ian. When lena ends things with Ian in this path, and Ian tells Holly that he has nothing serious with Lena, it is just sex and he is still single. She is relieved with that because before he told her he didnt have a girlfriend, that doesn't mean that he isn't having sex with other girls, and she totally understand that. Being in a relationship with a girfriend and being single having sex life it is 2 different things, and holly knows that. Holly also tells at some point when with Lena and Ivy that one of her fantasies is having a 3some. In this path after Lena ends things with Ian, Ian is only fucking 2 girls at this point, Emma and Holly.
As we all agree with it not being bad writing. Lena is just being hypocrite on my opinion. Specially with Mike and Jeremy situation, but specially with Jeremy who is Ian's friend.
Bro I am not complaining. I am just stating the fact that she is an hypocrite when she is in the SAME situation as Ian and that IS a fact. And for Lena being in the same situation and being an hypocrite about it, I decided to let her go on my gameplay (not really my decision but if it was she was gone too
) There were many conversations about what I said (here in this forum), but my point of view won't change, because it was my gameplay. I played her being a nice girl avoiding all guys around but Ian and another path where she would have as much fun as Ian. But in this second path,Ian accepts her and she doesn't accept Ian. And they are both in the same situation. <- all this here, is my opinon about lena. You don't have to agree, I just decided to talk about it here in the forum, because I had other plans for Ian, Holly and Lena, but apparently it is not the way the story goes.
As much as the decisions you make with every character, the cards you pick are also very important to the way the story goes. in my story, Ian will end up with Holly and Lena with probably no one. Ian was the only nice guy around her and she decided to take the situation with Holly in a wrong way. And Holly, different as many people say, she is an adult and know what she is doing. She is shy, she doesn't speak up, but everything she did on my gameplay, she knew exactly what she was doing and wanted to do it. Because when Ian goes with her to her event, she is the one kissing him first, knowing he HAS some flings and is NOT interested in having a girlfriend at the moment.
she chose to be on that situation, no one led her to do that or forced her to do anything. Ian was completely honest to her, then they have all sex activities and she says "I wish you told me sooner", He did tell her, he just didnt go into details of who he was going out with and what they were doing. But even so, She accepts him and will continue to see him. So, ofc, she is a keeper. Depending on how Eva will write the next episodes.
I never said it was wrong. and it wasn't fun. I am having fun, loving the game. Just, in my personal desire as a player, wish she didnt take it the way she did when she is in the same situation as Ian. This discussion will only keep going, if people keep trying to change my mind on what I think and how I wish it was written. We all have our personal preferences and freedom to speak up about what we would like to see happening with every character. That doesn't mean, the game isn't fun or anything is wrong.
- Nov 15, 2020
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I don't expect you to change your mind about it! I enjoy the discussions even though we don't agree. Just wanted to point out some of the reasons why Lena reacts differently to Ian having sex with Holly than with others. It's completely legitimate to dislike her reaction and/or our lack of control of it. But I suspect we can expect more hypocrisy from both Ian and Lena as the game goes on
- Nov 25, 2021
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I agree with pretty much all of that, and would like to add that I was also a bit frustrated that she blows her lid a little even if Ian only kisses Holly and then comes clean with her. Yes, I know Lena forgives him later, but it still seems like a massive overreaction.
First off, it was just a frigging kiss, a secondly I felt a bit pushed into it as a player. They're having a nice conversation, he says something supportive to her, and next thing you know they're kissing. I do think one additional choice to pump the breaks there would have helped a lot. Holly leans in and kisses him, and he can either kiss her back or not.
Again though, I totally agree that Lena's reaction to all this is all about Holly, not herself.
I just want my Ian Lena Holly threesome, dammit!