- Aug 2, 2019
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- Thread starter WeirdWorld
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- Aug 30, 2019
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Fear not fellow Ella simp, I am the Grand Arch Bishop of the Church of Ella. It was foretold that Ella would not die this day, for she has too much planned for her loyal subjects of lust.Ella... can't be...
Hold true to your heart of belief, for you must not let it sway by the influence of sin as is the way of the cult of Mommy the 4th, Shadow, or the Alice heathens.
-Ronald Grand, Ellawep 12:6
Dexter's likely protected to the gills, with Nyx mark and other things that either directly protect him from harm or otherwise will let him recover from it, maybe he even has protective charms made out of monster remains on him, there's really no way to tell. Regardless I don't think someone in his position would be so lacking in foresight that he wouldn't be protected.
- Jul 13, 2021
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- May 19, 2020
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Ella... can't be...
Meanwhile the MC and his friends (Ella included?
) after realising there is one less cunt going around 'persuading' people into cooperation:
Who are the apostles again? For some reason i wake up today just remembering mommy and daddy the 3rd and 4th, but i forgot who were the others
- Jul 13, 2018
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The 1st is the Authority.
You see him if you fight Jake in prison(I believe it requires some corruption points) and if you kill him. It's the Eye Boob boy with the mouth tentacles.
The 2nd is the Power.
You see Golden Boy descend from the clouds as Michael kills Leigong, the lightning monster.
Those 2 are the first set of twins. Their traits together makes Order.
You already know the 3rd and 4th, since they appear at the very beginning. They're called the Body(3rd) and Memory Mommy(4th). We can skip the rest of that.
The 5th is unknown. It's speculated by me that it represents Time and is called "Eternity".
The 6th is the Ether and represents Space.
You see him during Alice's 2nd Evolution this update. We don't know much else about else him currently.
The 7th is the Dark or Lord of Dark.
You see it for the first time on the dead end at Ella's apartment if you had 7 Power and chose to fight her. You'll also see it again in your dreams after reaching Level 2. Also during Valravn fight, during his flashback. He's the spawn of the 7th.
The 8th is the Light.
It's currently unknown if that's it's name or not. It could be the Radiant, the Brilliance or something else dealing Light. We also haven't seen it yet but we learned that Tiffany was turned via a serum made from it's avatar. We also learned this update from Aglaecwif that it indeed might be Light as it's the only Apostle, besides the 6th, that could reach the Monster's realm from our universe via travel.
Beyond the first 8 Apostles, we don't know anything besides the 9th and 10th lines worshipping the Lord of Dark, who is the 7th. That should cover it all, unless I missed something here or there for their appearances in game.
- Jul 13, 2018
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As far as I'm concerned, it's possible to cross inherit the twins traits from a singular Twin. Extremely rare, but possible nonetheless. MC and possibly Deus are the only ones we know that have both. Maybe Jake could've been another dual trait spawn as well but he messed it up with his mental state? Or it's possible to unlock the traits upon evolving. That seems to be the case with Ella. At least, that seems to be what she was hoping for on her 5th Evolution. Then again, she could've been hoping for the Arbiter(The Origin) to awaken in her. Or it could be both. They're likely connected anyway.
It's not exactly confirmed but Aglaecwif and The Origin would be pretty credible on the possibility and they both say Jake's the failed chosen of the Authority. Since Aglaecwif doesn't refute Ella's saying that about Jake, it's most likely a thing. It still wouldn't be common but it's possible to get both traits from one Apostle.
Now, I'm not sure about getting only the opposite trait from the other Twin. As in, Michael being turned by the 2nd but only getting the 1st authority trait, as an example. It's most likely a package deal, in that you get both or only the main trait of the twin that infected you. To further add to it. We know, at least for the 3rd and 4th(possibly the 7th and 8th from that dead end) that the Twins share each other's power in different levels of control. It could be possible that they can give their twin trait instead of their own. Probably, extremely unlikely to happen often, if at all.
So basically, we don't exactly know yet. We know Ella and Jake was turned by only one of them, yet Ella potentially expected the Memory trait while hoping Jake would gain Power at some point. As for the MC, while it's still debated here, I'm of the opinion he's only turned by one of them as well but he was compatible with both Traits. It seems extremely unlikely that both turned him. Especially since Fairy, Aglaecwif, Valravn and the MC himself only acknowledges one of them as his parent.
- Dec 3, 2018
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Who knows the purpose truly behind his death, we just gotta wait and see. I still like my theory of HERO just making him a Martyr for their cause (and what better way to make a Martyr than at his own wedding in front of so many people of influence).
- Aug 30, 2019
- 933
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Alright quit your big brain theories people, I just got to the end of the Deryl fight/Laurie death in my replay, my thoughts:
1. The Deryl Dilemma
I forgive Deryl a little more now as I think I have a better grasp on why the flying fuck he did what he did.
-Deryl was brainwashed by Jake to love Ella.
-He gains his powers and receives an order/condition or whatever from Charlie and Ella tells him to STAY PUT.
-He constructs PM Office Deryl, Alice Mansion Deryl, and works on Del.
-Deryl's stupid cocky nature gets the best of him WHILE STILL UNDER THE UNDYING LOVE INFLUENCE, he sends PM Office Deryl to attack the MC and Jake of his own volition to prove himself to Ella.
-After the MC finishes PM Office Deryl, the MC goes to fight ORIGINAL DERYL and during the fight, he breaks his brainwashing but still has Charlie's stigma.
-Deryl loses control of himself for whatever reason, and fails to evolve (this in part is probably done by Charlie's stigma; as mentioned with Shen getting to his 4th Evolve before Cole via a deal with said stigma).
-By Charlie's order he goes back to Ella's base to finish the hearts, but before Original Deryl loses complete control to his nature, he floods Alice Basement Deryl with his humanity and what not through pure instinct to preserve what little of himself before monsterfication fully took over.
-Del is also finished before hand, and joins H.E.R.O leaking the MC's documents in order to force Alice Basement Deryl to get closer back to the original via plot, of Del's own free will mind you.
-The Diamond War commences and the Deryl Chimera's are monsters so of course they act as bodyguards so that cocky Original now Monster Deryl can fight the MC one on one for literally no reason other than to be a prick.
-After all the Deryls minus Alice Basement join up with the Original, he becomes remade and Evolved, as he wanted for himself from the get go, but he is incomplete, allowing the Monsterifed state to still take hold, even if the Alice Basement Deryl joined up, he would still love swallowed up by the Original's monster nature.
-The MC beats this Deryl, weakening it, so that when the last Deryl joins up it's a more complete Evolution, thus restoring Original Deryl, and all the Deryls after.
He's still a massive cunt for it, but if it was me (save for fighting my friends for no reason) I probably would've done the same with luring Basement me back to my original self.
2. The Laurie Saving Conditions
So this part is fucking RIDICULOUS to me. At first I thought the ONLY way to save Laurie was because Deryl got a special healing serum from Aglaecwif (he even mentions trading a few things), and that's why we could only save her going Right. But upon reading the dialogue; Deryl uses his evolution blood, and of course our skill check and Deryl win.
There is virtually NO GOD DAMN REASON why we can't just go Left, meet Aglaecwif, request Skill as a prize, and STILL save Laurie...shit even all of the Deryl fights checks remain the same save for the Hesitate/Do Not Hesitate.
I really wish you could do both, as there is no reason for you not to if Deryl isn't even using anything he doesn't have in his possession already...it sucks and will probably be the one thing I'll always hold against W.W; still love them tho.
Anywho that's my summary of everything up to that point via going Right. I still need to go Left again and read everything with Valravn, and then go play through the rest of the after War content once more. But overall, it was fun going back ALLL the way through and being better well informed and catching stuff I missed previously. Hopefully my terrible memory will cease from a 5th god damn replay.
1. The Deryl Dilemma
I forgive Deryl a little more now as I think I have a better grasp on why the flying fuck he did what he did.
-Deryl was brainwashed by Jake to love Ella.
-He gains his powers and receives an order/condition or whatever from Charlie and Ella tells him to STAY PUT.
-He constructs PM Office Deryl, Alice Mansion Deryl, and works on Del.
-Deryl's stupid cocky nature gets the best of him WHILE STILL UNDER THE UNDYING LOVE INFLUENCE, he sends PM Office Deryl to attack the MC and Jake of his own volition to prove himself to Ella.
-After the MC finishes PM Office Deryl, the MC goes to fight ORIGINAL DERYL and during the fight, he breaks his brainwashing but still has Charlie's stigma.
-Deryl loses control of himself for whatever reason, and fails to evolve (this in part is probably done by Charlie's stigma; as mentioned with Shen getting to his 4th Evolve before Cole via a deal with said stigma).
-By Charlie's order he goes back to Ella's base to finish the hearts, but before Original Deryl loses complete control to his nature, he floods Alice Basement Deryl with his humanity and what not through pure instinct to preserve what little of himself before monsterfication fully took over.
-Del is also finished before hand, and joins H.E.R.O leaking the MC's documents in order to force Alice Basement Deryl to get closer back to the original via plot, of Del's own free will mind you.
-The Diamond War commences and the Deryl Chimera's are monsters so of course they act as bodyguards so that cocky Original now Monster Deryl can fight the MC one on one for literally no reason other than to be a prick.
-After all the Deryls minus Alice Basement join up with the Original, he becomes remade and Evolved, as he wanted for himself from the get go, but he is incomplete, allowing the Monsterifed state to still take hold, even if the Alice Basement Deryl joined up, he would still love swallowed up by the Original's monster nature.
-The MC beats this Deryl, weakening it, so that when the last Deryl joins up it's a more complete Evolution, thus restoring Original Deryl, and all the Deryls after.
He's still a massive cunt for it, but if it was me (save for fighting my friends for no reason) I probably would've done the same with luring Basement me back to my original self.
2. The Laurie Saving Conditions
So this part is fucking RIDICULOUS to me. At first I thought the ONLY way to save Laurie was because Deryl got a special healing serum from Aglaecwif (he even mentions trading a few things), and that's why we could only save her going Right. But upon reading the dialogue; Deryl uses his evolution blood, and of course our skill check and Deryl win.
There is virtually NO GOD DAMN REASON why we can't just go Left, meet Aglaecwif, request Skill as a prize, and STILL save Laurie...shit even all of the Deryl fights checks remain the same save for the Hesitate/Do Not Hesitate.
I really wish you could do both, as there is no reason for you not to if Deryl isn't even using anything he doesn't have in his possession already...it sucks and will probably be the one thing I'll always hold against W.W; still love them tho.
Anywho that's my summary of everything up to that point via going Right. I still need to go Left again and read everything with Valravn, and then go play through the rest of the after War content once more. But overall, it was fun going back ALLL the way through and being better well informed and catching stuff I missed previously. Hopefully my terrible memory will cease from a 5th god damn replay.
Have just replayed the whole game and found something interesting. When Nico goes off on how MC is a weakling during introduction to HERO Xanthe says:"leave the talking to the educated". Does that mean that Nico didn't attend/finished university? It would be quite hilarious if true.
I think you have to go right so that you know what the red light is, so you don't get blindsided by it. Basically by MC having foreknowledge, he can save some energy, and then he has power to spare so he can hold back, which leads to a bit of "are you still in there" so Deryl also holds something back, so by the end, you're both at 10% and can save Laurie, instead of at 1% ad have to watch her die.
Is the idea.
That said, there should be another check on hesitate where if Power=Max, the you can brute force through it.
I think he requests power or skill himself, meaning that after he becomes whole he is more powerful than if mc was the one who went left and got the power/skill instead, giving him the ability to heal Laurie, since Mc alone isnt able to fully heal laurie due to his, for lack of a better word, lesser ability to manipulate someone else's flesh
I think I can clear up the timeline around Zack and Deus. At least a little.
1) I found some fun stuff on Zack while I was trying to figure out his age.
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A. Around a month or two before the game began at the earliest.
B. Slightly before the R&X massacre at the very latest.
Deus still seems fairly new to HERO in the first and second months of the game. It is a strange coincidence that a new precog joins so soon after the old one got taken out.
4) Lucius says something really interesting here.
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Cole released evidence of human experiments, mass sterilisation and a public eugenics program. Lucius still expects suspicion after Zack and Henri theoretically cover everything up. That means they probably couldn't alter the timeline or completely erase the leak from the public consciousness but the evidence disappears.
I'm not sure what to make of that, but I think it's worth keeping that in mind for past events. Until recently, HERO could cover its tracks pretty well.
Ella doesn't seem surprised by the MC gaining the shapeshifting ability if they're infected by the 4th, and doesn't seem to expect them to have the Memory ability.
That's likely due to the 3rd and 4th both having the same powers and working together more than the other pairs seem to, but it's likely a little bit more complicated than it seems at first.
- Jul 13, 2018
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I covered that in my post. It's likely not a common thing but it's still possible to inherit the opposite twins power from the other. There's probably a lot variables to it, yeah. Like the Apostles twins working together could indeed play a part. Or, having enough compatibility with both twins trait and the mind set being proper for it. Maybe even an Arbiter chilling inside of you plays a part as well?
The MC is a special case as he was compatible with both twins trait and has an Arbiter inside of him, which made it possible for him to get both regardless. Ella not being surprised does say that it's possible to inherit the opposite trait but that might only apply for our own twins.
- Jul 13, 2021
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I agree that Dexter would probably survive it but that doesn't necessarily make him a bad target. He may be marked but it's implied that Nyx needs a body or to be in close proximity to resurrect someone. Whatever charms he may have would need to be incredibly strong, making him either untargetable, unable to be shallowed or indestructible with the ability to wound or kill the monster himself. Otherwise the monster just eats him and flees. Alexis doesn't have the best track record in underground fights and I doubt that humans can actually create that powerful items which turn businessmen into gods.
Instead the monster just kills Alaric and lingers there, waiting for the Captains to finish their chat and kill it. In the same timeframe Kenny had already killed multiple partygoers. So in my opinion, everything about the scene is just too fishy to be an actual attack on Dexter's credibility or property.