- Aug 21, 2018
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- Jan 27, 2023
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I can easily make an argument about how it is difficult to control since he both has to use his power to maintain a transformation and to do different stuff at the same time, like grow hands or fight etc. But whatever, at this point I've defended my claim enough that it's just a matter of perspective and interpretation now.
- Jul 13, 2021
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It's ok, we can agree to disagree. You are probably more tired than me since you had to answer to others too.
The game is interesting and consistent enough so we can theorize about it. All these arguments are about details and inner workings that aren't explained fully. As long as the arguments have merit they are worth posting since obviously a lot of people like taking part in the discussion.
The important thing is that Ella is probably alive, which is a good thing cause she is my #1 currently ^_^.
- Jan 9, 2021
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Jake's parent is "the Authority" his powers are mindcontrol, psychokinetic arrows and some influence shield that prevents attacking him or atleast makes it much harder... And his orders only work if you can hear him, so it's a strong hypnosis.
He does say "imprint authority" when using his power though... But it's just one of his orders...
Mc can have either "the Body" or "the Memory" as parent... But both give similar powers as far we know. Don't take the parent as a literal description of your powers... Kenny's parent was "Oil" so that would pretty much mean his power is floating on water, being flammable and usable as lubricant? Alice's parent is "Ether" that's hardly a reflection of graviton powers...
But okay, you made several on point and correct observations, but the rules that apply to shapeshifting don't apply to the transmutation events... Most important is the power used when transforming the body...
Take your time reading, but there's never any mention of power needed to sustain the new form. But every single transformation needs a huge power output for the transformation... Changing into the form after that is even easy...
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Another confirmation about the amount of power used...
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And finally Ella transforming Duncan...
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Kenny's parent was Oil, but Oils parents or grandparents or grand grandparents were Authority, Body, and the Lord of Dark. The first 2 fit perfectly, the third... Well we don't exactly know what his deal is, so whatever.
- Jan 9, 2021
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No, there's 6 origins that are possibly the same as the 6 Arbiters, All 6 are the parent of 2 Apostles (twins).
So there is no relation to the Authority and Oil besides both being numbered monster known as Apostles.
Perhaps these Origins are related, but we don't have any information on that in the game so far.
I am absolutely amazed by the amount of times i have said this, and by the amount of times you ignored it. I've already said that using normal people as an example is incorrect, the rules for them are different. And even if I'm wrong and it works the same for both, Ella will nevertheless need to feed the connection, otherwise the power already used on the transformation will be spent, while the tree man will simply produce new power. That means that if Ella spent 100 monster energy points on the tree, and Duncan currently has 0, he will just wait a little until he will get 200 and restore himself, I don't think I can explain this in any simpler way. And yes, he probably can't do that since his consciousness is fucked up, we have discussed this already.
Read the monster reports, Minyak is part Authority, part Body, part Lord of dark.
- Jan 9, 2021
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The Eye is an origin, he's the parent of "the Body" and "the Memory", Same like "Order" is the origin/parent of "the Authority" and "the Power"... The power of the origin is the powers of both twins combined... It's what Ella is looking for when she is talking about "perfect evolutions", she is looking for the original powers.
Aglaewif :
You "Order? What is that?"
Female "The power to command all things. To structure all things. To write the laws that govern the universe and to have both the Power and the Authority to enforce them."
Female "I've never personally met a being, human or monster that has acquired it since the origin, although..."
Female "I did, not long ago, hear talk of a potential inheritor, one your Ella had high hopes for. Though it seems to have ended in a failure. A weak mind can ruin even the greatest potential."
Female "Still, if it were possible to completely inherit the traits of both the First and the Second, to claim one of the original powers... A spawn that could fully realize that strength would be unfathomably powerful."
Female "Of course inheriting both traits from any of the twin Apostles would make a spawn quite exceptional."
I know, why are you talking about it? It doesn't matter, the apostles, apparently, interbreed.
- Jan 9, 2021
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We only know they infect monsters and humans... If they're breeding they're doing it in their own dimension anyway...
They can only be on Earth temporary in the form of an avatar... Well, until Ella manages to summon them permanently using dark magic, the hearts of Apostle spawns and the kidnapped twins...
It's very likely that he could ignore the change and no matter how much power he has it still wouldn't change him back. Everything we've seen so far about how powers interact on other people is that they're like a seal that have to be either be unravelled slowly with finesse or bruteforced through, but either case is easier said than done even if the dude happened to be much much stronger in raw power than Ella.
- Aug 30, 2019
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I regret to inform everyone that as of 1:02 p.m today; I have lost my "W" key...it is a dark day for Ronald Grand...
- Jul 13, 2021
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Some thoughts on the Ella vs Gillibrand thing.
1) Children of the numbered have higher potential.
This is a recurring theme. Jake for example, being level 2 for a short time, could completely dominate Laurie who had 33 power at that time. MC can get more than that the moment he completes his evolution while Laurie has been level 2 probably for months by that time. It makes sense that Ella would be stronger than a similarly leveled superhuman, just like both Jake and MC.
2) Ella has been level 4 for many years.
MC can get from 11 to 14 power against Klaus depending on the path, and his evolution alone gave him more power than what he already had. Against Hydra Deryl he has 100~ and his evolution gave him double that. Ella claims that higher levels get higher gains even past level 3, so if the ratio holds, Ella would need to be a level 4 for 5~ years to match Gillibrand, and that's without counting the powerup from the evolution. This is actually plausible. She got her powers at 14. Reaching level 4 by 16 is feasible. Of course the ratio is speculation based on MC's stats, but it's important to note that Ella has seen a lot of conflict for her age. It's unlikely that Gillibrand was so busy for the whole 35 year stretch.
3) Gillibrand is not as powerful as Laurie thinks.
In fact Laurie specifically says that Gillibrand is "physically" as strong as the level 5s. This doesn't really mean much. Being physically stronger than Nico or Clark is a low bar, and I doubt that he can match Alexis. Considering that Ella can actually read power levels, I get the sense that she has vastly more power than Gillibrand to the point that he never had a chance. It's also unlikely for him to have enough power to take hold of the transformation even if he wasn't a tree.
1) Children of the numbered have higher potential.
This is a recurring theme. Jake for example, being level 2 for a short time, could completely dominate Laurie who had 33 power at that time. MC can get more than that the moment he completes his evolution while Laurie has been level 2 probably for months by that time. It makes sense that Ella would be stronger than a similarly leveled superhuman, just like both Jake and MC.
2) Ella has been level 4 for many years.
MC can get from 11 to 14 power against Klaus depending on the path, and his evolution alone gave him more power than what he already had. Against Hydra Deryl he has 100~ and his evolution gave him double that. Ella claims that higher levels get higher gains even past level 3, so if the ratio holds, Ella would need to be a level 4 for 5~ years to match Gillibrand, and that's without counting the powerup from the evolution. This is actually plausible. She got her powers at 14. Reaching level 4 by 16 is feasible. Of course the ratio is speculation based on MC's stats, but it's important to note that Ella has seen a lot of conflict for her age. It's unlikely that Gillibrand was so busy for the whole 35 year stretch.
3) Gillibrand is not as powerful as Laurie thinks.
In fact Laurie specifically says that Gillibrand is "physically" as strong as the level 5s. This doesn't really mean much. Being physically stronger than Nico or Clark is a low bar, and I doubt that he can match Alexis. Considering that Ella can actually read power levels, I get the sense that she has vastly more power than Gillibrand to the point that he never had a chance. It's also unlikely for him to have enough power to take hold of the transformation even if he wasn't a tree.
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Ella, like the mc, can also probably consume monsters/superhumans for power as well.
- Jun 23, 2017
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Oil is not a numbered. Not an Apostle. Oil is just a name for Minyaks.
The six origins/arbiters aren't relevant to this conversation.
Origin in the context of the monster reports is what is being discussed.
We know the power of 1 (Authority) 3 (Body) and 7 (Darkness).
These powers correspond well with what the Minyaks are capable of.
Except maybe 7. But that's only 10%.
This is taken from the Minyak's monster report, its lineage.