VN Ren'Py Superhuman [v0.999] [WeirdWorld]

[Dominosaur]

Ella actually talks about this, and I have my own theories. Basically when the MC meets Demi, he is evo 1. He's "Pretty Strong" and growing at an astonishing rate, but Demi has had their powers for around 5 years at that point. Even with just their..."Endurance" training (They say having too many people looking at them used to tire them out and now they can emcee for an auditorium full of fans), over a 5 year period, Demi probably had around 10-15 power, at least. From there two things happened.
1, Demi "got their hooks" into the MC. Ella talks about this wrt Jake, but any 'psychic interference' seems to be sticky. It can be broken out of, but if you don't think to do it...
2. Demi just got to talk with and bond with MC. Obviously, anyone can dislike Demi, but I think the subtext of their relationship is "Demi is a nice person who likes me, and my super hero form" so he never has that "THE FIRST DOES NOT CONTROL ME" moment. He's trapped by Demi, the same way your blanket traps you when it's cold in your room in the morning and you don't want to go to work.


Also, Demi's power is almost "intentionally weak" and combined with their lack of malice, they can affect people they shouldn't be able to. As Ella explains it, "When you're in danger, your powers will naturally work to protect you." Demi, in many dimensions, isn't dangerous, and they don't try to be. Their power also works much more subtly (Literally, it's done subconsciously). Whe Jake infiltrates H.E.R.O. the first time, it's because he's not asking Alex to do anything she would be really opposed to. That's Demi's whole meta, except that's also who they are. It's not an act for them. Notably, the only times you can kill Demi are when they preset themself as dangerous: Either when they reveal they know your identity, and you can, in paranoia, kill them to hide the secret, or when they straight up threaten to expose you. (Even after killing Clover, the MC doesn't think to kill Demi until they threaten him first)

As a aside, I like to think Demi would basically introduce themself to anyone they meet in H.E.R.O. as "Hi, I'm Demi, I am required by law to inform you that I have a power that makes you like me. Please evaluate yourself so that you don't succumb to it. I hope we can be friends regardless!"

 

[Neverwonder]

Honestly it's a bit hard to tell if Demi had any effect on MC early on. If a prior discussion some of the more dedicated folks said a few pages back about the advantage MC has due to having 2 parents he might of just been too strong even at level 1 to be affected by them properly since they had no training.

But then I have to question something...if MC by the time he encounters clover (during the kidnapping thing) MC should be level 2 by that point right? Even with training I have no clue how Demi can affect MC who has such a power gap over em.

Jake is a good example of this despite the fact MC was ahead he was able to 'catch' up somewhat and when we head back to the party house he is in a room with Liz and Amber and can command the MC to leave but if the player trained enough he can resist that command by saying "What did you say to me?!?" (Something like that)

I doubt Demi evolved or maybe the MC just had his guard down so much that they could have some influence.

I mean for what I remember in game with jake his command was more forceful so he probably put some power behind it and even back then when the mc just just level two he could have felt "something" trying to rule him over so he resisted even if subconsciously, but with demi it was more of a plead and depending on your corruption you could either ignore it or follow their wish in not killing clover thus lettings their power effect you in a small way. that the best I could explain it since im pretty sure there was a topic on how similiter demi and jake power were. As I see jake power as more of an "Order" where if he say something to some one they either do it, experience it or just straights up believe him where as with demi how i see their power is more like "desire" if that correct they can make them see what they want to see or something more passives is making other people like her more where they like to hang around with her more and not harm her and if left alone for too long it will make the protective of her where they will hunt and kill anyone that as so much as look at her funny. at least that how I see it

 

[Neverwonder]

Ella actually talks about this, and I have my own theories. Basically when the MC meets Demi, he is evo 1. He's "Pretty Strong" and growing at an astonishing rate, but Demi has had their powers for around 5 years at that point. Even with just their..."Endurance" training (They say having too many people looking at them used to tire them out and now they can emcee for an auditorium full of fans), over a 5 year period, Demi probably had around 10-15 power, at least. From there two things happened.
1, Demi "got their hooks" into the MC. Ella talks about this wrt Jake, but any 'psychic interference' seems to be sticky. It can be broken out of, but if you don't think to do it...
2. Demi just got to talk with and bond with MC. Obviously, anyone can dislike Demi, but I think the subtext of their relationship is "Demi is a nice person who likes me, and my super hero form" so he never has that "THE FIRST DOES NOT CONTROL ME" moment. He's trapped by Demi, the same way your blanket traps you when it's cold in your room in the morning and you don't want to go to work.


Also, Demi's power is almost "intentionally weak" and combined with their lack of malice, they can affect people they shouldn't be able to. As Ella explains it, "When you're in danger, your powers will naturally work to protect you." Demi, in many dimensions, isn't dangerous, and they don't try to be. Their power also works much more subtly (Literally, it's done subconsciously). Whe Jake infiltrates H.E.R.O. the first time, it's because he's not asking Alex to do anything she would be really opposed to. That's Demi's whole meta, except that's also who they are. It's not an act for them. Notably, the only times you can kill Demi are when they preset themself as dangerous: Either when they reveal they know your identity, and you can, in paranoia, kill them to hide the secret, or when they straight up threaten to expose you. (Even after killing Clover, the MC doesn't think to kill Demi until they threaten him first)

As a aside, I like to think Demi would basically introduce themself to anyone they meet in H.E.R.O. as "Hi, I'm Demi, I am required by law to inform you that I have a power that makes you like me. Please evaluate yourself so that you don't succumb to it. I hope we can be friends regardless!"

Yeah what he said

 

[Dominosaur]

Glad you said Desire, because that also comes up when MC is reading Demi's mind...Or trying to.

[Part of why I think Demi might be related to the. Fooourth? Memory? Is because even though by that point, MC is evo 2, he has trouble reading Demi's mind, which makes me think of how powers have some "Rock Paper Scissors" to them (Like how Valravn nullifies Nico, or Alice sort of nullifies Klaus).]

He mentions that he has trouble reading them and figuring out their power, but does mention the word 'desire' iirc. My game is being weird (because it's been strung together from version 0.21, so a lot of flags are messed up on old saves) so I ca't find the actual text.

 

[Neverwonder]

Glad you said Desire, because that also comes up when MC is reading Demi's mind...Or trying to.

[Part of why I think Demi might be related to the. Fooourth? Memory? Is because even though by that point, MC is evo 2, he has trouble reading Demi's mind, which makes me think of how powers have some "Rock Paper Scissors" to them (Like how Valravn nullifies Nico, or Alice sort of nullifies Klaus).]

He mentions that he has trouble reading them and figuring out their power, but does mention the word 'desire' iirc. My game is being weird (because it's been strung together from version 0.21, so a lot of flags are messed up on old saves) so I ca't find the actual text.

I kinda though jake and demi power were more related to each other

 

[Dominosaur]

I kinda though jake and demi power were more related to each other

Demi's monster, unlike the MC and Jake, was not an apostle, so they could be related to multiple sources. I think I've said it before, but my theory is "1st, 4th, 8th"

 

[RonaldGrand6969]

Demi's monster, unlike the MC and Jake, was not an apostle, so they could be related to multiple sources. I think I've said it before, but my theory is "1st, 4th, 8th"

Not every monster is a mix of a bunch of Apostles, it most likely is a direct first born of the 1st or perhaps a second born, regardless literally the ONLY real ability is Perception, not Desire. We know Jake can issue commands so far as to make you think the person in front of you is your son, replace information, etc.

Demi doesn't change your Memories of any events so it's not a mix of the 4th, she sure as SHIT doesn't move at light speed, in fact her body is incredibly weak, probably due to her power being ONLY mental. I really don't see how it could be related to anyone else unless we are just throwing Apostles out there for the sake of it. I'll give the benefit of the doubt and concede that we don't know what the 9th, 10th, 11th, or 12th are, but out of all the Apostles we do know, Demi and her monster only relate to the 1st, so it's probably only a close descendant of that alone.

 

[Dominosaur]

Not every monster is a mix of a bunch of Apostles, it most likely is a direct first born of the 1st or perhaps a second born, regardless literally the ONLY real ability is Perception, not Desire. We know Jake can issue commands so far as to make you think the person in front of you is your son, replace information, etc.

Demi doesn't change your Memories of any events so it's not a mix of the 4th, she sure as SHIT doesn't move at light speed, in fact her body is incredibly weak, probably due to her power being ONLY mental. I really don't see how it could be related to anyone else unless we are just throwing Apostles out there for the sake of it. I'll give the benefit of the doubt and concede that we don't know what the 9th, 10th, 11th, or 12th are, but out of all the Apostles we do know, Demi and her monster only relate to the 1st, so it's probably only a close descendant of that alone.

Oh, is that what that scene with the MC said? Perception? Thanks for looking that up. I appreciate your enabling my laziness.

I wouldn't say "mix of apostles" because that makes it sound stronger. I'd think of it more as a mutt. An impure monster brought on through strife or alliance, or accident.

Anyway, you agree on the 1st, so I am going to go over the other two.

4: This gets into my own philosophy but like. You can't see anything. Your eyes process information, then your brain looks at that information, then creates a narrative of what just happened. If someone shows you three images of a closed door, a half open door, and an open door, in that order, with the sound of a door creak over them (for example, a three CG "animation" of a door opening as you might see in some kind of VN) the you think "That door opened" but you didn't actually see the door open. In this way, while we think of memories as being "things in the past that we remember" because our brain is always processing things, it would be more accurate to say "All of recognized human experience, including what you are seeing, doing and feeling right now, is memory"

And this is what Demi is manipulating, albeit subconsciously. They're not "Controlling People" they're changing how people perceive the world, to make them appear more favorable. Which LOOKS like controlling people, but it's the difference between Mind Control and Propaganda.

8: The other thing we know the 8th apostle can do (assuming (I think rightly) that Tiffany has the 8th apostle) is Imbue people with energy. While we can see this energy used as a strengthening thing, I imagine (Again "I Imagine") This imbuement can give other things. We don't know sources on everything, but we have seen a few "debuff" type abilities all marked with glowing light, like Oscar and the Wepewat, as well as the Radiation magnet that Deryl had. I think Demi's power isn't just writing over people's perceptions while they're perceiving Demi. I think Demi is imparting their power, a little bit, to alter the target's perceptions after they stop seeing Demi. It's why repeated, prolonged exposure has a gradually more extreme effect. (And also explains how Demi can "cure" Clover)

From the...I think 4? monsters we have profiles for, 2 of them are naturally hybrids of 3 different apostles, and one of them is Chimeras. Only Valravn has been a pure descendent of an apostle. I don't think Assuming pure lineage is the right assumption to make, in the abstract.


One last thing, which I'm only now thinking of. When Demi is turned, they're held aloft in a glowing orb. Not using that as evidence, but it does make me think about vectors of infection. MC got injected, Michael got irradiated. That one guard got Electrocuted. We didn't see what happened to Alice, but idk...maybe the fairy bit her? Maybe he gravity zapped her? Demi got held up like. Do all monsters have different methods? Do apostles of similar monsters have similar methods? Was Jake held up in a glowing orb? Was he mind zapped? Did the 1st just fucking Bite him with its tentacle mouth (it had that, right?)

 

[Gtdead]

Not every monster is a mix of a bunch of Apostles, it most likely is a direct first born of the 1st or perhaps a second born, regardless literally the ONLY real ability is Perception, not Desire. We know Jake can issue commands so far as to make you think the person in front of you is your son, replace information, etc.

I've talked about this before. Authority does not change perception. It changes behavior.
For Jake's power to be about perception, he would have to alter how you see him. He can't do that.
His powers literally stop you from thinking the things that he doesn't want you to.

He hates that he was fat, so everyone can't remember that he was fat but people still can perceive that something changed about him.
He is afraid of MC finding out he is a s/h, whenever MC tries to reach that conclusion he gets a headache or he forgets what he was tlking about.
MC doesn't have trouble perceiving Jake for what he is. He has trouble acting on these thoughts because Jake doesn't allow him to.

When Jake commands MC to stay in prison, MC feels that (quote) "his desire to escape, vanished entirely". Since he can't act on his desire, his feelings change and he feels that prison is his home, till he breaks the command, becomes able to act on his desire to leave the prison, and he stops thinking that.

We also have strong indications that Jakes power would be able to affect objects.

Spoiler: Ella's quote

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Objects don't have perception. They do have behavior though.
__________

When Jake imprints Deryl, Deryl ends up falling in love with Ella. He feels that she is his world, that he wants to protect her and prove to her that he is the only one she needs.
This is, point for point, the exact behavior Clover has when Demi infects her by mistake.

Clover perception is not altered. When Demi tries to undo the effect, Clover knows what she has done and begs for Demi to not undo it, otherwise she won't be able to live with herself. If she had altered perception, then she wouldn't be able to say that. She would be confused, like a schizophrenic who commited a murder by mistake, because he perceived something different than reality.
__________

On Demi's possible connection to 4th and 8th.
Demi doesn't know what her target sees when looking at her illusion. This means that whatever she creates has to do with the individual. Of the Apostles that we know, only the 4th has the capacity to read an individual and act on it (4th reads MC's memories and turns into a chick to blow him).

If Demi knew what her target saw, then we could easily say that she made the target think that. But since this is obviously wrong, her trick is an actual visual illusion. Illusions are tricks of light so here's the connection to 8th (assuming ofcourse that 8th is light).

So she could have some bastardized power that is the combination of light and memory which creates these effects. My money would be on the 1st being the primary influence on her powers, but the other 2 are also plausible. In any case, "Desire" is the perfect way to explain her powers. She can turn into an object of desire, or force her targets to see the object of their desire.

 

[Gtdead]

I was interested until you called trap a weird fetish, as if being gay and/or traps are weird and you made it part of the game yourself? Weird.

Disregarding the fact that trap content has nothing to do with gay and I don't even understand why anyone would put those two together (one is about clearly defined same sex relationships while the other is about challenging the actor's sexuality), the game is predominantly a male power fantasy. The protagonist is introduced to us as straight and the main purpose of the game is for the protagonist to increase his power and fuck all the girls. Additionally the protagonist has a dominant personality. He doesn't take shit from anyone, only submits when the other person forces him through superior strength or trickery.

Any content which challenges these assumptions is supposed to be dissonant for the target audience. Ntr challenges his dominance, trap challenges his straight sexuality, genderbender challenges his gender identity or his sexuality depending on the scene. So yes, all these are weird.

 

[Alandir]

I remember in the last update, hou can only save the ice dagger girl if you don't go the way of the monster that wants to breed. Anyone know if that was a bug or if it was intentional?

 

[ItzSyther]

I remember in the last update, hou can only save the ice dagger girl if you don't go the way of the monster that wants to breed. Anyone know if that was a bug or if it was intentional?

Was intentional.

 

[PerpetuallyAmiss]

And very unfortunate. I like that lore drop; especially talking to the raven afterwards.

 

[necromater]

Was intentional.

Fuck you W.W
Making us choose between. Hot monster sex , saving laurie or using the game console to make a Deus. That Deryl mock us if we let him go left doesn't help T-T

 

[Gtdead]

We can only hope that we will encounter Aglaecwif again in the future and fuck her even harder. Making us choose was fucking criminal I say.

 

[xhib]

First three are pretty concise. Last topic...not so much.

Spoiler: Breaking into Hex's Dimension

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Spoiler: The Meaning of Ether

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Spoiler: The Descendant Conundrum

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Spoiler: Suddenly your defending gravity and I'm attacking it?

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[alkeera]

Fuck you W.W
Making us choose between. Hot monster sex , saving laurie or using the game console to make a Deus. That Deryl mock us if we let him go left doesn't help T-T

If you are corrupted enough, you can use the secret immoral superpower of editing variables and do both.

 

[necromater]

If you are corrupted enough, you can use the secret immoral superpower of editing variables and do both.

Of course i did. i'm a horny bastard like everyone here but also a softcake laurie deserves better. Fucking Jared you deserve perpetual agony.

 

[GonkoGoyaMan37]

Never said a thing on this forum but, I have been playing this game for about a year or so I believe, and its unironically the best novel I have read in my entire life, down to the simplest of ideas to the most complex and degenerate ones.

I do have to ask since I feel like I have missed a lot, how does the routing so far affect the overall of the story, I am avid safe scummer and mousescroll a few pages back every choice just to see how different is the dialogue, but I have never seen an entire picture of if there is or isnt something in relation to how you choose things and what you do... (I say cuz the a/n update text threw me a wrench about doing the Deryl fight perfectly and getting a reward at the end).

Is there any significant difference to whether you do or don't choose an option? Cuz most of the time I see the illusion of choice or the coin flip between a dead end and game progress. Do some options block or not portions of the story (I noticed that in this update, the choose your lore drop options where final and in a normal ideal playthrough you'd only see one of but not all options), so I ask, is there really an appropiate or like idk, super fucking amazing thing I'm missing or is it really how I am seeing it, just a linear game with illusory choice and coin flips?

 

[DrakoGhoul]

Never said a thing on this forum but, I have been playing this game for about a year or so I believe, and its unironically the best novel I have read in my entire life, down to the simplest of ideas to the most complex and degenerate ones.

I do have to ask since I feel like I have missed a lot, how does the routing so far affect the overall of the story, I am avid safe scummer and mousescroll a few pages back every choice just to see how different is the dialogue, but I have never seen an entire picture of if there is or isnt something in relation to how you choose things and what you do... (I say cuz the a/n update text threw me a wrench about doing the Deryl fight perfectly and getting a reward at the end).

Is there any significant difference to whether you do or don't choose an option? Cuz most of the time I see the illusion of choice or the coin flip between a dead end and game progress. Do some options block or not portions of the story (I noticed that in this update, the choose your lore drop options where final and in a normal ideal playthrough you'd only see one of but not all options), so I ask, is there really an appropiate or like idk, super fucking amazing thing I'm missing or is it really how I am seeing it, just a linear game with illusory choice and coin flips?

The very short and fast answer is yes, there's a difference. If you go to Aglaecwif, Laurie dies permanently. If you get a perfect "score" with Deryl, she lives.