VN Ren'Py Superhuman [v0.999] [WeirdWorld]

[Gtdead]

Some thoughts on the Ella vs Gillibrand thing.

1) Children of the numbered have higher potential.
This is a recurring theme. Jake for example, being level 2 for a short time, could completely dominate Laurie who had 33 power at that time. MC can get more than that the moment he completes his evolution while Laurie has been level 2 probably for months by that time. It makes sense that Ella would be stronger than a similarly leveled superhuman, just like both Jake and MC.

2) Ella has been level 4 for many years.
MC can get from 11 to 14 power against Klaus depending on the path, and his evolution alone gave him more power than what he already had. Against Hydra Deryl he has 100~ and his evolution gave him double that. Ella claims that higher levels get higher gains even past level 3, so if the ratio holds, Ella would need to be a level 4 for 5~ years to match Gillibrand, and that's without counting the powerup from the evolution. This is actually plausible. She got her powers at 14. Reaching level 4 by 16 is feasible. Of course the ratio is speculation based on MC's stats, but it's important to note that Ella has seen a lot of conflict for her age. It's unlikely that Gillibrand was so busy for the whole 35 year stretch.

3) Gillibrand is not as powerful as Laurie thinks.
In fact Laurie specifically says that Gillibrand is "physically" as strong as the level 5s. This doesn't really mean much. Being physically stronger than Nico or Clark is a low bar, and I doubt that he can match Alexis. Considering that Ella can actually read power levels, I get the sense that she has vastly more power than Gillibrand to the point that he never had a chance. It's also unlikely for him to have enough power to take hold of the transformation even if he wasn't a tree.

 

[bloodaxis]

Some thoughts on the Ella vs Gillibrand thing.

1) Children of the numbered have higher potential.
This is a recurring theme. Jake for example, being level 2 for a short time, could completely dominate Laurie who had 33 power at that time. MC can get more than that the moment he completes his evolution while Laurie has been level 2 probably for months by that time. It makes sense that Ella would be stronger than a similarly leveled superhuman, just like both Jake and MC.

2) Ella has been level 4 for many years.
MC can get from 11 to 14 power against Klaus depending on the path, and his evolution alone gave him more power than what he already had. Against Hydra Deryl he has 100~ and his evolution gave him double that. Ella claims that higher levels get higher gains even past level 3, so if the ratio holds, Ella would need to be a level 4 for 5~ years to match Gillibrand, and that's without counting the powerup from the evolution. This is actually plausible. She got her powers at 14. Reaching level 4 by 16 is feasible. Of course the ratio is speculation based on MC's stats, but it's important to note that Ella has seen a lot of conflict for her age. It's unlikely that Gillibrand was so busy for the whole 35 year stretch.

3) Gillibrand is not as powerful as Laurie thinks.
In fact Laurie specifically says that Gillibrand is "physically" as strong as the level 5s. This doesn't really mean much. Being physically stronger than Nico or Clark is a low bar, and I doubt that he can match Alexis. Considering that Ella can actually read power levels, I get the sense that she has vastly more power than Gillibrand to the point that he never had a chance. It's also unlikely for him to have enough power to take hold of the transformation even if he wasn't a tree.

Ella, like the mc, can also probably consume monsters/superhumans for power as well.

 

[Aristarkhos]

No, there's 6 origins that are possibly the same as the 6 Arbiters, All 6 are the parent of 2 Apostles (twins).
So there is no relation to the Authority and Oil besides both being numbered monster known as Apostles.
Perhaps these Origins are related, but we don't have any information on that in the game so far.

Oil is not a numbered. Not an Apostle. Oil is just a name for Minyaks.
The six origins/arbiters aren't relevant to this conversation.
Origin in the context of the monster reports is what is being discussed.
We know the power of 1 (Authority) 3 (Body) and 7 (Darkness).
These powers correspond well with what the Minyaks are capable of.
Except maybe 7. But that's only 10%.

This is taken from the Minyak's monster report, its lineage.

 

[magnus341]

Oil is not a numbered. Not an Apostle. Oil is just a name for Minyaks.
The six origins/arbiters aren't relevant to this conversation.
Origin in the context of the monster reports is what is being discussed.
We know the power of 1 (Authority) 3 (Body) and 7 (Darkness).
These powers correspond well with what the Minyaks are capable of.
Except maybe 7. But that's only 10%.
View attachment 2678040
This is taken from the Minyak's monster report, its lineage.

where can i find this monster report

 

[RonaldGrand6969]

where can i find this monster report

I have the answer, you may even like it......

You've gotta suck W.W's cock, or ZeronZanara as a middle man alternative

 

[Fanvor]

Some thoughts on the Ella vs Gillibrand thing.

1) Children of the numbered have higher potential.
This is a recurring theme. Jake for example, being level 2 for a short time, could completely dominate Laurie who had 33 power at that time. MC can get more than that the moment he completes his evolution while Laurie has been level 2 probably for months by that time. It makes sense that Ella would be stronger than a similarly leveled superhuman, just like both Jake and MC.

Child of the numbered != higher potential, a clear example of this is Alice, Mc himself notices that she is far stronger at her power lvl than Mc ever was. Also, when did we learn Laurie's power lvl? I don't remember that.

Ella, like the mc, can also probably consume monsters/superhumans for power as well.

You don't gain power from consuming monsters or s/h, at all, you only ever get power for eating humans, you can check the walkthrough if you don't believe me.

2) Ella has been level 4 for many years.
MC can get from 11 to 14 power against Klaus depending on the path, and his evolution alone gave him more power than what he already had. Against Hydra Deryl he has 100~ and his evolution gave him double that. Ella claims that higher levels get higher gains even past level 3, so if the ratio holds, Ella would need to be a level 4 for 5~ years to match Gillibrand, and that's without counting the powerup from the evolution. This is actually plausible. She got her powers at 14. Reaching level 4 by 16 is feasible. Of course the ratio is speculation based on MC's stats, but it's important to note that Ella has seen a lot of conflict for her age. It's unlikely that Gillibrand was so busy for the whole 35 year stretch.

I will note that based on the last library encounter, the lieutenants and captains spar sometimes, considering his reputation as "Physically as strong as lvl 5" and his claims of being able to beat fresh lvl 5, we can assume that he won some sparing matches against them, like against Alexis or Caballero after they lvled up.

3) Gillibrand is not as powerful as Laurie thinks.
In fact Laurie specifically says that Gillibrand is "physically" as strong as the level 5s. This doesn't really mean much. Being physically stronger than Nico or Clark is a low bar, and I doubt that he can match Alexis. Considering that Ella can actually read power levels, I get the sense that she has vastly more power than Gillibrand to the point that he never had a chance. It's also unlikely for him to have enough power to take hold of the transformation even if he wasn't a tree.

At lvl 3 how durable you are IS indicative of how much power you have, every bit of power you gain gets your body just a little bit tougher, I believe it was said during one of the Hero lectures. And about the last part, I apparently have to repeat this again, he doesn't need to have enough power immediately, if Ella poured, say, 1000 points of power into the transformation and does not feed the connection any more, then tree man can simply chip away at it little by little, since unlike Ella, he can produce new power.

 

[DrakoGhoul]

We learned Laurie's power points during her first appearance. It was right after Ella evolved. She tells Jake to fight her and tells us her stats.

 

[vogelbeest]

You don't gain power from consuming monsters or s/h, at all, you only ever get power for eating humans, you can check the walkthrough if you don't believe me.

Yeah, that's true, but in order to unlock all your powers you still need to eat all these superhumans and monsters...
Not a +1 power but at some point access to special skills and/or stats...

If you say you want "power" during your 3rd evolution :

You "Power, obviously. I won't be satisfied until I stand at the top, there's way too many people stronger than me right now."
Unknown "I see. I hope you've heeded my warnings then."
You "Warnings?"
Unknown "Yes. Fate has provided all the nourishment you require, but it is up to you to take advantage. Miss even a single one, and you may never reach the heights you could have."
Unknown "The son and granddaughter of Oil. The crossed assassin. The failed chosen of Authority. And the many others that are yet to come, all must be devoured."
You "......"

That's Kenny, Bailey, Danica and Jake plus whatever people we can chose to consume later in the game...

 

[Fanvor]

Yeah, that's true, but in order to unlock all your powers you still need to eat all these superhumans and monsters...
Not a +1 power but at some point access to special skills and/or stats...

If you say you want "power" during your 3rd evolution :

You "Power, obviously. I won't be satisfied until I stand at the top, there's way too many people stronger than me right now."
Unknown "I see. I hope you've heeded my warnings then."
You "Warnings?"
Unknown "Yes. Fate has provided all the nourishment you require, but it is up to you to take advantage. Miss even a single one, and you may never reach the heights you could have."
Unknown "The son and granddaughter of Oil. The crossed assassin. The failed chosen of Authority. And the many others that are yet to come, all must be devoured."
You "......"

That's Kenny, Bailey, Danica and Jake plus whatever people we can chose to consume later in the game...

Yes, I know, but that wasn't what the guy was saying.

 

[bloodaxis]

You don't gain power from consuming monsters or s/h, at all, you only ever get power for eating humans, you can check the walkthrough if you don't believe me.

You're right, my point was mainly that she has other avenues for quick power that the other non body/memory superhumans don't have through consuming, who she has to consume isn't necessarily the point since she highly likely wouldn't give a shit if she had to consume a bunch of people to get stronger. As in, there is kind of no reason to believe that she is inherently weaker in terms of power levels.

 

[vogelbeest]

At lvl 3 how durable you are IS indicative of how much power you have, every bit of power you gain gets your body just a little bit tougher, I believe it was said during one of the Hero lectures. And about the last part, I apparently have to repeat this again, he doesn't need to have enough power immediately, if Ella poured, say, 1000 points of power into the transformation and does not feed the connection any more, then tree man can simply chip away at it little by little, since unlike Ella, he can produce new power.

The lecture about it :

Xanthe "The next stage is quite possibly the most important, the third evolution, the strengthening stage."
Xanthe "Your body is used to evolving now, it understands that in order to keep up with the power inside you, it must continue to improve. Not at set intervals, but constantly."
Xanthe "And so, it endeavors to do so. At this stage, your strength, your speed, your endurance, your body as a whole, will continuously improve as you grow your powers, as your pool of energy increases."
Xanthe "This means, that there is no longer a cap to the power you can accumulate. As long as you keep training, your power can keep growing, and your body will follow suit."
Xanthe "Theoretically, at this evolution, your body could reach a state similar to a fifth evolution superhuman, through simply improving your powers over time."
Xanthe "Of course your rate of improvement would have to be astronomical, as a level five will be constantly growing as well."


As for himself returning into his original form? He lacks the skill to do it, as far we know transmutation is not one of his skills. Regeneration is the body healing itself back to the original form... Something that happens too with a resurrection, however after being burned down to ashes he returned to tree form... In other words.. his regeneration is useless at this point...

 

[bloodaxis]

As for himself returning into his original form? He lacks the skill to do it, as far we know transmutation is not one of his skills. Regeneration is the body healing itself back to the original form... Something that happens too with a resurrection, however after being burned down to ashes he returned to tree form... In other words.. his regeneration is useless at this point...

It is possible that once he gains control over the power she left in him that he would switch back, but it seems as if he's in no position mentally to do so currently anyway.

 

[vogelbeest]

It is possible that once he gains control over the power she left in him that he would switch back, but it seems as if he's in no position mentally to do so currently anyway.

Yeah, pretty much, lol...

You "What the hell...."
"I approach it, unable to restrain my curiosity. And, on a whim, I touch the glowing bark."
You "Hhrnngh!!"
"Memories flood my mind, an agonizing torrent of thoughts and feelings experienced over the past few weeks."
"They're jumbled an incomprehensible, human I think, but twisted and malformed."

You "(Huh.... I'm not sure I could overpower her work, not without making things even worse...)"
You "(But according to what she told me, he should be able to turn himself back normally if he can focus on taking control of the power, she implanted in him.)"
You "(Then again, I'm not sure a tree has that level of consciousness...)"


As it's said there it's not even about his powerlevel, it's about taking control of the power implanted... A question of sheer willpower... But how much of that will he have? Sounds like he's mostly running on despair...

You "I saw his memories..."
Nyx "Oh? How's he doing?"
You "....Not good."
Nyx "Oh, that's too bad."
Nyx "He's probably not looking forward to me burning him down again."

So how many times did Nyx burn him down? Once? Or several times already? Sounds like it's more of a habit at this point...


You "Well... I'm not sure I can help. Ella's much better at transforming others than I am, my powers have kind of gone in a different direction."
You "Maybe I could whittle down at what she's done to him over time, but it'll probably take a long time and cost me a lot of power. I also have no idea whether he'll survive it."
Nyx "Hmm, you don't have to worry about that. Even so, better leave it to later, can't have you wasting all your strength, we have work to do."

Let's hope for Duncan that is enough to keep Nyx from playing with fire for a while....

 

[Fanvor]

As for himself returning into his original form? He lacks the skill to do it, as far we know transmutation is not one of his skills. Regeneration is the body healing itself back to the original form... Something that happens too with a resurrection, however after being burned down to ashes he returned to tree form... In other words.. his regeneration is useless at this point...

In the hobo alley Ella says that s/h you turn will, eventually, turn back, no mention of skill or specific power requirement. An example of this is Ange, absolutely zero skill and ill suited powers, yet she resists Mc transformation easily. I am fucking amazed at how many times I've repeated this at this point, and at how no one seems to care.

You're right, my point was mainly that she has other avenues for quick power that the other non body/memory superhumans don't have through consuming, who she has to consume isn't necessarily the point since she highly likely wouldn't give a shit if she had to consume a bunch of people to get stronger. As in, there is kind of no reason to believe that she is inherently weaker in terms of power levels.

Good point, but we can assume that Duncan and other supers also have unique ways of getting power, but, to be fair, it's just speculation.

 

[vogelbeest]

In the hobo alley Ella says that s/h you turn will, eventually, turn back, no mention of skill or specific power requirement. An example of this is Ange, absolutely zero skill and ill suited powers, yet she resists Mc transformation easily. I am fucking amazed at how many times I've repeated this at this point, and at how no one seems to care.

You aren't reading WHY they will turn back eventually... There's a condition....

Ella "Living things are a different story."
Ella "To feed your power into another organism, especially one that can think, and force it to change from within... It can be a fairly dangerous process."
You "For me, or the person I'm transforming?"
Ella "Both."
Ella "For the person being transformed, the likelihood of you totally fucking up their body or outright killing them is extremely high, at least until you get a good handle on it."
Ella "You'll need an excessive amount of power on hand too."
Ella "As for the dangers to you, feeding someone else your power can go all sorts of wrong."
Ella "For one. If they have power of their own, and you don't know it. You can wind up killing yourself."
You "What!?"
Ella "It's a costly ability, if the person you're using it on puts up too much of a fight, you may overexert your strength too quickly to stop."
Ella "Of course, this means that until you've reached a certain level of mastery, never use it on a monster or a superhuman."
Ella "It's mostly pointless anyway. Any transformation you do manage to force on them will reverse itself as soon as they regain dominance over the power you implant."

They need to regain dominance, either passively or actively.... Now compare Duncan's situation... Passively he seems to return to tree form and actively his mental state is a mess.... So yeah, eventually he will turn to his original form, but in a week? a year? a century???

 

[Fanvor]

You aren't reading WHY they will turn back eventually... There's a condition....

Ella "Living things are a different story."
Ella "To feed your power into another organism, especially one that can think, and force it to change from within... It can be a fairly dangerous process."
You "For me, or the person I'm transforming?"
Ella "Both."
Ella "For the person being transformed, the likelihood of you totally fucking up their body or outright killing them is extremely high, at least until you get a good handle on it."
Ella "You'll need an excessive amount of power on hand too."
Ella "As for the dangers to you, feeding someone else your power can go all sorts of wrong."
Ella "For one. If they have power of their own, and you don't know it. You can wind up killing yourself."
You "What!?"
Ella "It's a costly ability, if the person you're using it on puts up too much of a fight, you may overexert your strength too quickly to stop."
Ella "Of course, this means that until you've reached a certain level of mastery, never use it on a monster or a superhuman."
Ella "It's mostly pointless anyway. Any transformation you do manage to force on them will reverse itself as soon as they regain dominance over the power you implant."

They need to regain dominance, either passively or actively.... Now compare Duncan's situation... Passively he seems to return to tree form and actively his mental state is a mess.... So yeah, eventually he will turn to his original form, but in a week? a year? a century???

If your point is that he needs to be conscious to revert change, then you are probably correct, but we already established that yesterday. Why are you bringing this up? You were talking about needing skill/specific set of powers just a second ago.

 

[RonaldGrand6969]

What in the flying fuck are you people arguing about now? The sanctity of the wholesome (sometimes depraved) thread is at stake, and I shall save it.

I skimmed over nye everything so forgive me if I'm wrong but I'm seeing these things:

1. Miniak Origin Makeup:
If you're a Patreon you'll have your answer via the Monster Reports. But from what I remember it's like 50% the 1st, 35% the 3rd, and 15% the 4th? (Authority, Body, Memory).

2. MC Monster Parents and the Origins + Numbered:
-I hate the cope that we only have one or the other, I'm 90% sure they BOTH fucked with us, whether it be the 3rd you picked or the 4th. So whining about having more than one than the other potentially is pointless; it's pretty clear we have an equal amount of both because they are working for the perfect spawn in unison.
-The Numbered's true titles (according to most intelligent monsters) are the Apostles and/or Lords, but mainly Apostles by the fan base. And I BELIEVE the Origins are and/or can be ALSO referred to as the Arbiters (unless the 3rd and the 4th's Origin is CALLED the Arbiter). They are the peeps that belong to each pair of Apostles, making 6 in total, as there are 12 Apostles.

3. Charlie and Nyx Oscar Corpse Plan:
Seems that Charlie wants Nyx's power to resurrect her brother, but the debate was whether or not Nyx would ever do it? Up for debate honestly as we literally know next to nothing about Nyx as a person. She could very well be much like Deus, in which he is CLEARLY hiding his power/capabilities. Who's to say Nyx isn't doing the same with her allegiances. Charlie could TRY to FORCE her into it? I wouldn't begin to wonder HOW in truth, but if I had to pick SOMETHING maybe a monster type could give her a tough time, like Nicolette or Malik have had issues with in the past. She clearly doesn't truly care about teammates seeing as her Lieutenant is now a tree decoration for her office, she also has no problem KILLING people morally speaking; seeing them as tools to bring back to further her power without considering the potential psychological issues that could come with DYING AND THEN BEING BROUGHT BACK so there's that...

4. Ella Nyx Team Up:
Something I didn't even CONSIDER but entirely plausible. Again, we know next to nothing about Nyx other than her questionable moral compass, something Ella and her share in common. Another thing is that they are both goth, everyone knows 1st rule of big titty goth chicks is to STAY TOGETHER and help a bitch out, emo bitches be damned (or cut themselves). It would explain why Ella is still alive because let's face it, that's OUR kill, not some fucking plot driven character death, nice try W.W. IF they are allies it would have had to have been incredibly recent, as up to Jake she didn't have a means of knowing about H.E.R.O or getting into it without his help. Another thing to note is that Ella KNEW what monsters to use against Malik IMMEDIATELY, SOMEONE helped her get inside information I'd guess. Alexis was nothing, Nicolette was personal, and the rest were inconsequential, it was only when she got GREEDY that her master plan slipped up and she got herself caught or "killed" (bullshit). Maybe I'm overthinking it who knows, but an Ella Nyx Team up if true, would be CRAZY and I'd be all for it.

5. Lvl 3 Strength and The Duncan Tree Debate?:
-Okay listen, call me CRAZY but I THINK Ella, a lvl 5 and master of monsters and mayhem who's been doing it for years, knows a little bit more about how to shift living material than the MC. Now I KNOW that's a tough pill to swallow I know, but thems the facts. The MC didn't even know what he was fucking doing in the prison, so if we are using prison humans going wrong against the process by the newbie MC vs Duncan turned by an Ella Mastermind; I think I'm gonna have to chalk up the mismatch to be lack of experience rather than "it doesn't abide by the logic rules, how does a nobody prisoner revert but Lvl 3 Duncan can't!" If you have to ask yourself that question, you've already lost.
-Leaning more into the Lvl 3 side, they aren't gods like the 5s. I know Xanthe's word is like divine mandate around here but he doesn't know EVERYTHING, but let's pretend he does; Duncan's growth rate would have to be ASTRONOMICAL to match Ella's, because Ella is constantly growing at a much faster rate strength wise. He also refers to Lvl 3s being cable of being as strong as a Lvl 5 as THEORETICAL, meaning it probably has never been done, or wouldn't be able to be done due to the sheer difference in growth. It's just that Lvl 3 is a grander Evolution than the rest potential wise, not that it immediately just makes you better. Duncan is going to stay a tree, period, because he cannot beat something out of his league, that being Ella's (REFINED OVER YEARS, and LVL 5 POWERED) handiwork; on his own.



Hopefully I got some of those debate answers right, I dunno. If not, it's 2a.m, fuck off. If so, than glad to have kept the peace.

 

[Gtdead]

Child of the numbered != higher potential, a clear example of this is Alice, Mc himself notices that she is far stronger at her power lvl than Mc ever was. Also, when did we learn Laurie's power lvl? I don't remember that.

Yes, it's talked about how Alice is more powerful as a level 1 had the right to be. Alice is also connected to the 6th. Just like MC is connected to the Eye and his powers reflect that, it's fair to assume that the same happens for Alice too.

Kenny on the other hand is connected to the Mother. Not Authority, Body or the Dark Lord, even if his monster parent has the genes.

Additionally her upbringing is talked about in the game. Both her and Michael are way stronger than they should be, and that's because they were raised on monster juice. I really don't think she is a good counter argument with the knowledge we currently have.

I will note that based on the last library encounter, the lieutenants and captains spar sometimes, considering his reputation as "Physically as strong as lvl 5" and his claims of being able to beat fresh lvl 5, we can assume that he won some sparing matches against them, like against Alexis or Caballero after they lvled up.

Good catch. Lisa and Bernhardt talk about it. It's highly probable that Gillibrand has already shown his chops in practice.

At lvl 3 how durable you are IS indicative of how much power you have, every bit of power you gain gets your body just a little bit tougher, I believe it was said during one of the Hero lectures. And about the last part, I apparently have to repeat this again, he doesn't need to have enough power immediately, if Ella poured, say, 1000 points of power into the transformation and does not feed the connection any more, then tree man can simply chip away at it little by little, since unlike Ella, he can produce new power.

I think it's the teacher who says that depending on your powers, the body augmentations will be different. Alexis is a physical combat specialist and her body is significantly stronger than Nico who is a caster/utility combatant. Nico on the other hand was visibly hurting and Ella managed to connect with her these 2 times, and the narrator says that she managed to teleport before any serious damage was done.

Gillibrand while having some elemental powers, acts like a physical combatant and carries a machete in combat. A physical combatant should have a more powerful body at lower power levels compared to Clark and Nico who are support casters.

 

[Fanvor]

Kenny on the other hand is connected to the Mother. Not Authority, Body or the Dark Lord, even if his monster parent has the genes.

Kenny is not connected to anything, he talks to mother because Mynyak are a hivemind with telepathy and inherited a link to the hivemind, not some spawn/parent connection.

Yes, it's talked about how Alice is more powerful as a level 1 had the right to be. Alice is also connected to the 6th. Just like MC is connected to the Eye and his powers reflect that, it's fair to assume that the same happens for Alice too.

Alice is the daughter of fairy, not the 6. Her seeing the 6th during the evo trans means nothing, since we know from Del thal all other supes experience the same thing, they see the apostles in their visions, not their immediate parents.

I think it's the teacher who says that depending on your powers, the body augmentations will be different. Alexis is a physical combat specialist and her body is significantly stronger than Nico who is a caster/utility combatant. Nico on the other hand was visibly hurting and Ella managed to connect with her these 2 times, and the narrator says that she managed to teleport before any serious damage was done.

Gillibrand while having some elemental powers, acts like a physical combatant and carries a machete in combat. A physical combatant should have a more powerful body at lower power levels compared to Clark and Nico who are support casters.

Good point, but he still would have to be obscenely strong to even stand a chance against lvl 5, and since we know he kinda can, we can assume that power wise he is a head above almost every one else. I would also remind you that, other than Nyx, he is the strongest member of team Reaper

 

[vogelbeest]

If your point is that he needs to be conscious to revert change, then you are probably correct, but we already established that yesterday. Why are you bringing this up? You were talking about needing skill/specific set of powers just a second ago.

Yeah, and you just kept saying it's all a matter of power, which he has more then any other level 3 superhuman..
Conscious he needs the willpower, subconscious regeneration, healing and even knowledge of transformation would help returning to his original state... Maybe it's even possible his monster part does it for him, much like the eye breaks Jake's control on MC. But so far he's a tree that's been burned down and resurrected at least once and possibly even several times.

Duncan been a tree for roughly 6 days now.... If it's all that easy he would have returned to his original shape by now...
So far Ella's transformation of Duncan doesn't seem so pointless as she told us....