the future of adult games

[gunderson]

I would say the basic game as far as western AG goes involves a younger sister, older sister and a mother, but that's just me.

Oh, don't worry about that. When incest gets banned that's when transgender/furry/futa stuff starts showing up in droves and becomes the new standard. We've already seen some of that, it's what's happened to a bunch of porn game/writing communities when incest got banned in the past, and the community on Patreon will get more and more flooded with those specific fetishes as time goes by. But make no mistake: very little about this is going to be newer or more original than the games authors have been making in the past. Most of them will just rip off different shit than before.

There's nothing to celebrate here.

 

[gamersglory]

Patreon is getting in the way, for now, tell a real platform comes along that offers something better. Patreon will ban transgender/furry/futa stuff too once they become aware of it and once they know what it is as Paypal would object to that stuff as well. Patreon opened shop before doing any research on who they would attract. Also, let's be honest If you're making a game it needs to be profitable as otherwise, you are wasting your own time and money on nothing so you will make a game to attract the most paying people possible.

 

[redknight00]

Patreon will ban transgender/furry/futa stuff too

I very much doubt that, furry is 100% protected by fantasy logic and trans/futa would be politically incorrect to ban, and probably a crime depending on where patreon is hosted. But yeah, they will likely continue to tighten their control over barely legal content.

 

[gamersglory]

I very much doubt that, furry is 100% protected by fantasy logic and trans/futa would be politically incorrect to ban, and probably a crime depending on where patreon is hosted. But yeah, they will likely continue to tighten their control over barely legal content.

My overarching point was they will ban porn period. to placate their podcasting masses at some point as I think they are realizing going through everything takes more time and money then it's worth to them

 

[victor659]

The incest theme in adult games is popular so patreon avoids to ban creators of such games because it will lose money. But the last year it becomes more strict to the rules so creators have not the freedom to make the game as they like. Many creators abandoned their games, the updates delayed for months and patches become a partial "solution" but without be able to make the game as it would be if the creators was free to make the game as they like.

Unfortunately i don't see any other site that will give freedom to the creators to make their games as they like in the near future. The only site that it will suppose to allow adult incest content but nothing more is Sponsorion. Rape and loli - underage characters of course are not allowed. But sponsorion is supposed to get into service over 1 year before and i don't see any real progress since then except the design of their site. They need to find solution to legal problems and the payment system and i don't think that they have the money or the ability to do it.

Edit: I take a look now at the sponsorion site and although some months before they specifically stated that they will allow adult incest content now they remove this statement and they say that they will allow only what it is legal and what they can handle! (personally i don't think that they can handle anything above a drawn bikini model :
Allowed Content – We are frequently asked “is fetish X/Y/Z allowed?”. The basis of what adult content we do and do not allow can be summed up as - “Is it legal?” and “Can we handle the regulatory overhead of allowing this?”. With the exception noted above, drawn, animated, etc. fetish art is a “yes” on both counts.

 

[megaplayboy10k]

There are 3 basic funding models: Upfront(e.g. Kickstarter style), Ongoing(Patreon, e.g.), and Retail(that is, players pay for the final product). The retail model is largely only working for the Japanese stuff, because those studios have the resources to work with that model. Upfront requires a lot of trust between devs and players, and only top projects are likely to get fully funded that way. So mostly we're still looking at ongoing sponsorship, and probably only a few hundred projects actually receive enough to be viable. So I think at some point there will be a dropoff in the number of games in development, as opportunists discover that a) it's a lot of work and b) they can't really cash in easily. Even devs doing it for love of the genre may be a little discouraged by the finite amount of sponsorship money out there.
I think some kind of technical breakthrough making it easier to animate scenes would broaden the appeal of these games. Maybe a few A level, if not AAA, games would help too.

 

[polywog]

The majority of people don't like taboo. Take a moment to look that word up, and you'll see what I mean, that's kinda the definition, people don't like...
These new copycat devs think that game did well because incest was in a game, or because it had a fetish. They are blind to the real reason the game did well. They only hear the controversy about the game, and because that's how they found out about it, they assume that everyone likes the game because of that controversy. Porsche sales went up after Paul Walker died... trust me death fetish wasn't the reason.

More people dislike incest than there are people who like it. By making you game incest genre, you're limiting your audience to the fans of that genre. More people hate fetishes, than there are fans of all fetishes combined. putting fetishes in your game limits your fans, it doesn't bring in more. Vanilla is the most popular ice cream flavor 10 times over. Your chocolate game might get some players... and some haters gonna rant, but it won't outsell the vanilla.

 

[polywog]

There are 3 basic funding models: Upfront(e.g. Kickstarter style), Ongoing(Patreon, e.g.), and Retail(that is, players pay for the final product). The retail model is largely only working for the Japanese stuff, because those studios have the resources to work with that model. Upfront requires a lot of trust between devs and players, and only top projects are likely to get fully funded that way. So mostly we're still looking at ongoing sponsorship, and probably only a few hundred projects actually receive enough to be viable. So I think at some point there will be a dropoff in the number of games in development, as opportunists discover that a) it's a lot of work and b) they can't really cash in easily. Even devs doing it for love of the genre may be a little discouraged by the finite amount of sponsorship money out there.
I think some kind of technical breakthrough making it easier to animate scenes would broaden the appeal of these games. Maybe a few A level, if not AAA, games would help too.

You missed some. Steam is the largest game distribution site, and the Porn industry has taken an interest, now that they see profits from games, they are gearing up an adult game platform.

 

[megaplayboy10k]

You missed some. Steam is the largest game distribution site, and the Porn industry has taken an interest, now that they see profits from games, they are gearing up an adult game platform.

Right. But what the porn industry sees as an appealing or viable game platform may be very different from the types of games we see here.

 

[polywog]

Right. But what the porn industry sees as an appealing or viable game platform may be very different from the types of games we see here.

I hate to break it to you, but there's more here on F95Zone, than just those visual novels that you wank to.
True, that the porn industry is making interactive porn games, and going heavy into VR, but those games are here on this site too.

 

[megaplayboy10k]

I hate to break it to you, but there's more here on F95Zone, than just those visual novels that you wank to.
True, that the porn industry is making interactive porn games, and going heavy into VR, but those games are here on this site too.

Right. But it seems likely that porn site game content would be oriented towards low overhead, quick payoff for players. We're not likely to get the h game equivalent of Skyrim(i.e., skads and skads of gameplay, deep storyline, etc.).

 

[polywog]

Right. But it seems likely that porn site game content would be oriented towards low overhead, quick payoff for players. We're not likely to get the h game equivalent of Skyrim(i.e., skads and skads of gameplay, deep storyline, etc.).

The porn industry isn't just one dude. There are thousands of photographers, videographers, developers, and content contributors from around the world... fast forward to the credits, after you jizz all over yourself. makeup artists, fluffers, grips, sound engineers, lighting, graphics, visual effects, and much more. It ain't all filmed in one basement.
VR devs from this site could potentially get their wares on the porn platform, and make a fortune.

 

[khumak]

A ban on incest or any other content where it's just a text/story based patch that could determine whether it was in there or not really isn't enforceable. Just release the game with MC living in a house with his landlady and roommate. Then release a patch somehwere else that replaces landlady with mom and roommate with sister. Done. Nothing Patreon can do about it. The restrictions that would actually hinder development for some devs would be for actors that look under age or something. You can't just make an easy patch to make a character that looks 10 years old suddenly look 20 or vice versa.

The context for the non incest version might not be that convincing ("but you're my rommate, I can't do that" vs but you're my sister, I can't do that"), but I don't really think there would be any way to police vague "read between the lines" inferences to things that might be patchable to include incest.

Circumventing a ban on rape scenes or something similar where the images give you away would be tougher. I guess you could write the vanilla game up so that the characters involved are into rough sex and are just roleplaying so you can actually have the images included in the game and then release a text patch that replaces the "role play" dialog with a "rape version".

IMO they really should just fall back on allowing whatever is legal and banning anything that's not. No need to make moral/asthetic judgements. I think DMD could potentially have been banned for underage content even if incest was not an issue. Most of the girls in there look about 12 to me. Doesn't matter if there's a disclaimer saying they're 18.

 

[trippleK]

after patreon suspended DMD ..BB because of incest
iam disappointed
what do you guys think is going to happen to the others
and is there any solution for making incest -rape games without being blocked or suspended

So did MrDot's patreon get shut down? no more money for him?
Thank god

 

[Dependable_223]

but ntr could also fall under this categorie of bann especially once says non concensual. then they too will be banned. so to say the losers are those fetishes above is wrong term. They are just cleaning the act till more fetishes will be banned. most ntr has drugging rape etc.. also in those tags like corrupting etc..

 

[obibobi]

The majority of people don't like taboo. Take a moment to look that word up, and you'll see what I mean, that's kinda the definition, people don't like...
These new copycat devs think that game did well because incest was in a game, or because it had a fetish. They are blind to the real reason the game did well. They only hear the controversy about the game, and because that's how they found out about it, they assume that everyone likes the game because of that controversy. Porsche sales went up after Paul Walker died... trust me death fetish wasn't the reason.

More people dislike incest than there are people who like it. By making you game incest genre, you're limiting your audience to the fans of that genre. More people hate fetishes, than there are fans of all fetishes combined. putting fetishes in your game limits your fans, it doesn't bring in more. Vanilla is the most popular ice cream flavor 10 times over. Your chocolate game might get some players... and some haters gonna rant, but it won't outsell the vanilla.

That's not how it works.

Say you have a physically developed 16 year old girl, a girl who has a body more developed than most women will ever have, most men in the world will find her sexually attractive and yet men in the western society will lie and say they don't. Now finding her sexually attractive is not the same thing as trying to sleep with her, in western society we have a social contract that became a legal contract that girls below the legal age are out of bounds but we didn't suddenly develop the ability to only find girls attractive when they turn 18 at midnight.

Now for people who where legally men at the time, Ariel Winter when she had bigger tits than Sofia Vergara would have been taboo, but a lot of men and boys would have fantasized about that taboo chocolate. Current example would be Isabela Moner, she's not 18 yet but you know she's not been hired solely for her acting ability.

Never mind that controversial example, in current western society we've the point where it's taboo for a man to say he would want more sexually attractive women in a TV show or movie. They've even had discussion panels on the issue with bitch faced feminists arguing that it's ok for them to sexualize men but not vice verse because men need to make up for the past.

But the idea that the niche drives away fans shows a lack of understanding in how marketing works. Markets exist, vanilla may be more popular than strawberry or chocolate but people don't eat the same thing everyday and some prefer chocolate or strawberry. Sometimes it's easier to market to a niche than try and compete with those producing whats popular.

As for incest, it's super taboo but it's seen a massive rise in popularity. Now that's not to say that people want to sleep with their actual blood relatives anymore than girls who read vore fiction want to get swallowed IRL. If anything taboos are like a spice and incest is one of the safest.

 

[polywog]

That's not how it works.

Say you have a physically developed 16 year old girl, a girl who has a body more developed than most women will ever have, most men in the world will find her sexually attractive and yet men in the western society will lie and say they don't. Now finding her sexually attractive is not the same thing as trying to sleep with her, in western society we have a social contract that became a legal contract that girls below the legal age are out of bounds but we didn't suddenly develop the ability to only find girls attractive when they turn 18 at midnight.

Now for people who where legally men at the time, Ariel Winter when she had bigger tits than Sofia Vergara would have been taboo, but a lot of men and boys would have fantasized about that taboo chocolate. Current example would be Isabela Moner, she's not 18 yet but you know she's not been hired solely for her acting ability.

Never mind that controversial example, in current western society we've the point where it's taboo for a man to say he would want more sexually attractive women in a TV show or movie. They've even had discussion panels on the issue with bitch faced feminists arguing that it's ok for them to sexualize men but not vice verse because men need to make up for the past.

But the idea that the niche drives away fans shows a lack of understanding in how marketing works. Markets exist, vanilla may be more popular than strawberry or chocolate but people don't eat the same thing everyday and some prefer chocolate or strawberry. Sometimes it's easier to market to a niche than try and compete with those producing whats popular.

As for incest, it's super taboo but it's seen a massive rise in popularity. Now that's not to say that people want to sleep with their actual blood relatives anymore than girls who read vore fiction want to get swallowed IRL. If anything taboos are like a spice and incest is one of the safest.

Television, television, television... your entire post says "I belong to the cult of tv" go outside occasionally, the world is a beautiful place. If you keep listening to the television telling you how to think, parts of your brain will atrophy from lack of use. I didn't have to google Ariel Winter, but come on, she's a 5/10 on her best day. Literally all of my daughter's friends are hotter than that. I'm not buying what they're selling on tv.

The reason everyone likes vanilla is not because they don't like variety, quite the contrary, you see. Vanilla goes with everything. You can add sprinkles and toppings as you please. Chocolate icecream on apple pie? gross

 

[victor659]

The subject here is not what most people like or not. Nobody forces a game developer to make taboo or other fetish games. On the other hand Patreon forces a game developer to not make such kind of games. And tomorrow maybe they will not allow adult games with demons and supernatural stuff and next year maybe they will ban every adult game. It is their site and they have the right to have any terms of service or policy they want. However creators want to have the freedom to make the game as they like. If the people like their game they will have many supporters and get more money, if not they will abandon the game or continue it because maybe some of them don't do it just for money. It is their game and they will decide, not me not you.

More options are better for everyone and a site that offer more freedom within the limits of the law is welcome but it is not an easy task for many reasons.

 

[obibobi]

Television, television, television... your entire post says "I belong to the cult of tv" go outside occasionally, the world is a beautiful place. If you keep listening to the television telling you how to think, parts of your brain will atrophy from lack of use. I didn't have to google Ariel Winter, but come on, she's a 5/10 on her best day. Literally all of my daughter's friends are hotter than that. I'm not buying what they're selling on tv.

The reason everyone likes vanilla is not because they don't like variety, quite the contrary, you see. Vanilla goes with everything. You can add sprinkles and toppings as you please. Chocolate icecream on apple pie? gross

You don't understand my post, that doesn't mean you insult someone and rant about how they belong to TV because they name dropped 2 actresses. You won't make any friends on facebook let alone real life like that.

 

[Zippity]

The subject here is not what most people like or not. Nobody forces a game developer to make taboo or other fetish games. On the other hand Patreon forces a game developer to not make such kind of games. And tomorrow maybe they will not allow adult games with demons and supernatural stuff and next year maybe they will ban every adult game. It is their site and they have the right to have any terms of service or policy they want. However creators want to have the freedom to make the game as they like. If the people like their game they will have many supporters and get more money, if not they will abandon the game or continue it because maybe some of them don't do it just for money. It is their game and they will decide, not me not you.

More options are better for everyone and a site that offer more freedom within the limits of the law is welcome but it is not an easy task for many reasons.

Patreon doesn't force anyone to do anything... People have this tendency to over react, like Patreon is the only means by which anyone can accept donations for making their projects... There were plenty of folks making stuff that Patreon now disallows, and they were getting donations by various means before and even after Patreon...

When I see folks cry on and on about how Patreon is making them do this or making them do that, I just shake my head... Patreon isn't making anyone do anything, other then re-evaluate how they go about gaining their donations... No freedoms are being trampled on, and no one is being forced to abandon their projects... It's pure laziness that a developer can't move on from using Patreon and use some other means to get their money... I think that Patreon has some how spoiled some developers and other folks, due to it's ease of use and popularity (regardless of media)…

If you do your due diligence and research, there are varying options available for receiving donations to a site that contains adult/mature content... Yes, some companies and sites will have similar restrictions as Patreon, depending on the subject matter promoted... But there are still options available...

So when I see a project get abandoned because their site was banned by Patreon, then I have no sympathy for that projects developer, in any way... They chose to abandon it, rather then look elsewhere... For what ever reasons... This kind of stuff happens, regardless of industry... So, beyond crying about it in order to seek likeminded sympathy, or to feel better about it after having shouted it into the ether, nothing really constructive will happen by complaining about it, if your hoping for any real change on the part of Patreon... They are just protecting themselves, is all... It happens...

patches.
just make a clean adult game , but create the opportunity within it ( backstory ) and release a patch on here or any other site , or make it open for others to create a patch .

Even if a developer hides a patch on other sites, that would reinstate content that Patreon disallows, they can still have their site taken down... Their reporting mechanism actually allows for reporting off-site content directly related to the developers projects being promoted on Patreon... And not just with regards to patches... They might be able to get away with it for a little while, but the moment it gets reported and the Investigation Team determines it's associated to the developer and his/her posted projects, they can still close down the site... They are already aware, that some site owners are trying to wiggle their way out of getting removed... People like to think that big corporations are blind and ignorant to what is really going on... And the more that people keep doing it, the more visible it becomes, and the worse the consequences will get...

There are 3 basic funding models: Upfront(e.g. Kickstarter style), Ongoing(Patreon, e.g.), and Retail(that is, players pay for the final product). The retail model is largely only working for the Japanese stuff, because those studios have the resources to work with that model. Upfront requires a lot of trust between devs and players, and only top projects are likely to get fully funded that way. So mostly we're still looking at ongoing sponsorship, and probably only a few hundred projects actually receive enough to be viable. So I think at some point there will be a dropoff in the number of games in development, as opportunists discover that a) it's a lot of work and b) they can't really cash in easily. Even devs doing it for love of the genre may be a little discouraged by the finite amount of sponsorship money out there.
I think some kind of technical breakthrough making it easier to animate scenes would broaden the appeal of these games. Maybe a few A level, if not AAA, games would help too.

I saw some of the replies to the post I quoted... There are several Retail sites through which developers can sell their completed products above and beyond the main stream sites like Steam, who does have it's own list of adult/mature restrictions... Sites such as

You must be registered to see the links

, and even though many are Japanese Hentai based VN/Games, the option is still there for other types... And there are lots of others, if you only take a look...

I don't really see any drop off happening, now or for the foreseeable future... There were just as many projects being abandoned before Patreon became a thing, as well as before and after their rules became more developed and strict... This is a primarily Amateur Developer driven small niche part of the overall Porn industry... It's been going on, probably since the birth of the internet... In various forms, it's morphed and changed in some ways, stayed the same in others... You have varying levels of overall talent, mixed with varying degrees, of what the developers want to even make in the first place... As the technology has grown, so has the industry...

The Incest gold rush that began, once a few big hitters made bank using Patreon, prior to the rules changes, is of course seeing a slight down turn these days... But I don't think that has anything to do with Patreon or other companies like it... It is more attributable to an over saturation of the market over the last few years, and folks can get bored of the same old thing over and over again, especially when so many are not all that good... Plus this niche market has it's up's and down's just like with any market, for anything...

I still see new VN/Games in this market coming out all the time, and I see the same abandonment rate there has always been, regardless of Patreon changes... Sure there was an initial bump due to lazy developers, not taking the time to look for other means to get their donations, but that was a long while ago... That excuse needs to be put out to pasture... I still see new incest themed VN/Games being released and worked on... And there are plenty of options developers can go with to get their donations and/or funding... They just have to be willing to look for, and use different systems... I think this niche market is still trucking along, at around the same rate it always has...

Zip