The maiden path

[Gloot]

So fellow lewd gamers, I have a question for you all. Help me understand the maiden path in games like Melty's Quest and Meritocracy of the Oni & Blade. Others games like Life Choices and Girl Life make a statement that you can remain a saint or give in to the lust. Why? Why would someone play a erotic game only to avoid all the lewdness? Why are you pursuing this? What is the thrill behind it? I think I'm pretty open minded and if I don't enjoy a particular fetish, I'll at least try to relate it to another one to imagine how/why others like it. But the maiden path I just have nothing to relate to... If the MC would have a significant other, I could understand trying to remain pure until they can be together or something like that, but I simply cannot see the payoff on settings of those games that I've played.

 

[215303j]

Why would someone play a erotic game only to avoid all the lewdness? Why are you pursuing this? What is the thrill behind it?

Good question...

First of all, I am a straight man and I do firmly believe in monogamy IRL.
In games, I do tend to self-insert (i.e. pretend as if I, the player, am the MC).

When playing a game as a male MC, I tend to play like that as well, although it depends on the game's setting (realistic or let realistic / more porn-like) and whether the main love interest really captures me or not.

With a female MC though, I tend to become very protective of her, like you would of a daughter, and thereby indeed get on a maiden path as much as possible. Or a pure lesbian path, if available. The thrill of playing then becomes to have the MC avoid the "corruption" which is quite often the goal of those games. If that way I miss out on some lewd scenes, so be it. In some games, there is a male NPC which I consider "worthy" for my female MC and in such cases I do pursue that. But to be honest, that's pretty rare and I tend to go for lesbian options mostly.

Interesting stuff... I do think that a player's level of self-insertion / immersion as well as his general outlook on life plays a big role in this.

 

[anne O'nymous]

If that way I miss out on some lewd scenes, so be it.

Anyway, we all miss content when we play a game, whatever it is. We follow our path, playing it our way. It's okay with regular games, why should it suddenly become strange when it's an adult one ?
What matter isn't the pleasure we took while faping, but the pleasure we took while playing. And if sometimes some of us took this pleasure by playing against the game (because too often it's the only way to follow the maiden route), why not ?

 

[I'm Not Thea Lundgren!]

I follow that path to see if the writing is as good as in the lewd path, it's a sign of a good writer and worth my time to play future updates. So many games to play, so little time to play.

 

[recreation]

I used to play them, but got annoyed of always seeing the same stuff over and over again. I also don't like to see several guys gang bang the girl, and so I started to only go the f/f route and try to avoid corruption in these games.
Nowaday I simply don't play these type of games anymore. Why? Well, let's be honest, the "maiden path" is simply boring, or not well crafted most of the time, and the so called "lesbian" content in most of these games is a joke, so why even bother?

 

[215303j]

I used to play them, but got annoyed of always seeing the same stuff over and over again. I also don't like to see several guys gang bang the girl, and so I started to only go the f/f route and try to avoid corruption in these games.
Nowaday I simply don't play these type of games anymore. Why? Well, let's be honest, the "maiden path" is simply boring, or not well crafted most of the time, and the so called "lesbian" content in most of these games is a joke, so why even bother?

Disagree:
The Coceter Chronicles [v0.15 Beta1] [Nverjos]

Excellent game and you can choose which relations to pursue.

But yeah, I know what you mean. Generally I also avoid "corruption" games, especially with female MC.

 

[Brig]

For the Challenge and the Kicks and the Giggles!

 

[notajetfighter]

I could rant on this, but I think I'll try and be succinct, if perhaps not comprehensive.

Why play a game when you can just look up the animations or whatever online? Because, ultimately, the games give context to the sexual content that is shown. A very large portion of us love context. It's why we, as human beings, love stories in general. We love seeing that path that's walked.

We all like different contexts. Have different preferences. Different styles that we enjoy, when it comes to all manners of stories. Sexual content is no different than any other sort of content.

For some, they might prefer to be "rewarded" with sex, etc. They prefer the context of "hey, I've sought out this sexual act, and now I, via my actions, have acquired it. Now, what I'm experiencing has that context behind it, and therefore is more arousing to me."

For others, such as myself, I simply enjoy the possibility that sexual content might happen. That it's "around the corner" if I do something wrong. (It's why I'll often spend far too much time on games that don't deserve it, that actually don't really have the content that is promised, with it only there "in potential.") Because yes, I want to avoid the sexual content, yes, I like to do virgin runs, yes, I enjoy roleplaying a character who wants nothing to do with sex. Because the idea that I'm playing a game where such a thing might be forced upon her at any moment? That's what I enjoy. The context that such a set of actions brings. The story that it tells. The payoff is the fact that the journey exists.

 

[Gloot]

I simply enjoy the possibility that sexual content might happen. That it's "around the corner" if I do something wrong.

I didn't mean to say the games can't be enjoyed without the erotic content... it just that the majority of those games barely hold it together when you do remove it. I certainly agree with all the context comment. And maybe I came to the question with the wrong mindset. I assumed the maiden path to be a sort of fetish like any other. But how you describe it sounds more like a suspense game, where you await when the next jump scare will happen. And sometime it does not have to happen at all to be entertaining. So I have to ask you, if/when you do face the sexual content, does it ruin it for you? Or is it a sort of a payoff in itself too?

 

[notajetfighter]

So I have to ask you, if/when you do face the sexual content, does it ruin it for you? Or is it a sort of a payoff in itself too?

I wouldn't necessarily call it not a fetish. I certainly enjoy playing a virgin character - and when they lose their virginity, I reload, and go down a different route, most of the time. It's certainly a fetish, alongside the other things. Though you aren't wrong to compare it to suspense and similar feelings. I'd still argue it's... more base than that. Just about that context.

As for the sexual encounters, it depends on the game itself. For some games, it's absolutely a let down. I mentioned it in that previous post of mine, about how I can spend too much time on games that don't really have all that much going for them - because I'm not actively seeking out participation in them. In the sexual scenes, that is. So in my mind, when I'm playing these various... life sims, etc, "this is great! Who knows what might happen! Oh, something could happen here, oh, this sort of event could happen there, oh, I could have an encounter like that, oh, the park, I bet X, Y, and Z" could happen there. As I play, I'm excited, I'm building up my character, in my mind I've roleplayed, I have her thoughts, her character, etc, in my head.

And over time... maybe nothing happens. Or maybe something happens and its disappointing. And I'll start forcefully "poking" the game. Not because I need, or am desperate to see, the sexual content. But because I'm curious as to what's actually there. And often, when I start poking around, it's just "... oh." A multitude of scenes that... devolve instantly into various themes I don't like ("you stuck your dick in me and now I crave cock," etc), or just writing I don't enjoy, or just simply a lack of any real, actual content. So where, previously, I was enjoying myself, enjoying the idea of "hey, all around me, there's stuff that may or may not happen - and that's exciting," I'm realizing "actually, there's nothing happening unless I go down specific routes and force it to happen." And that's where the disappointment comes in.

To speak on the opposite of disappointment, the payoff comes in when it's earned, when its done well, and when I "lose" to something that feels worthy. When it feels like I didn't have to force myself down a route. When I legitimately just played the game, made my choices, and then ended up in a situation that I was actively trying to avoid, it's the best. And then, in the perfect situation, I get to load, make a different choice, keep going, and keep experiencing that all over again.

To branch off, perhaps, I also do text roleplay. I both GM, and am GMed for at times (Game Master - controlling not just one character, but an entire world that the opposite player interacts with). And regardless of what side of the "table" I'm on, what I want more than anything is not for us to get to a certain point of a story ("hey let's do an RP where a girl gets raped"), but to play through a story where things are simply possible. Where things might happen. Or they might not - it's up to the players, up to the choices that are made. And I'll be equally happy with "okay, at the end of her vacation, she goes home happy" or things coming to a darker end. What I enjoy is that throughout the roleplay, there was the possibility that either could happen - and I never could be completely certain which path things would go down. When I'm looking for a game of a similar theme, I'm looking for that same feeling, ideally. One of "hey, things might happen. Things might not. But either are possible. And it all depends on what story I make with my own choices."

I think that's maybe a key distinction. The idea that the story is made via your own choices. That's what a "maiden" route often can give a feeling of. Just at least a token nod of "hey, you don't have to." The idea that I'm not being told "no, this is the story - sex happens, and that's what you get, and that's what you'll like." I get to choose. I get to play a part in my character's fate. And in that choice lies all the difference.

 

[Sphere42]

If the MC would have a significant other, I could understand trying to remain pure until they can be together or something like that

Actually I consider that variant to be one of the worst. There's little to no chance the game can hold up without its adult content and if making that happen had been the main priority of the devs they simply could have made losing to rapists a game over to invest more time and effort into the actual story and non-porn artwork. Or taken to the other extreme, guro is a thing yet when you lose to a wolf or a feral demon you don't see the character "erotically" dismembered and eaten, it just fades to black immediately (*insert default RPGM jingle*)

Plus having a valid reason to remain pure (holy powers, controlling parents...) isn't even all that common. The protagonists simply start out as an unaware ditz with no way of gaining knowledge or showing interest without going full slut or doing rounds through Rapeville. I guess most authors still adhere to traditional Japanese or Christian values and consider all sexuality to be inherently sinful? Or cater to an audience with these views?

 

[215303j]

I guess most authors still adhere to traditional Japanese or Christian values and consider all sexuality to be inherently sinful?

Although it may play a part (it's part of our culture at least) I do think that's too narrow minded.
Virginity (and related things like innocence and purity) is a kind of fetish which can be had (or lost) only once in a person's lifetime, which is what makes it special.

And notajetfighter has a very good point: it's about avoiding what might happen, which is interesting.
E.g. in the Hitman games, the goal is as much (or more) trying to avoid detection as it is to kill your target. The enjoyment is to think about ways to pass that guard or climb through that window, much moreso even than the act of finally snuffing the bad guy.
Notably in RPGM and QSP games, the goal to avoid sex can be just as interesting as the goal to pursue as much sex as possible. For some reason, Renpy games rarely seem to offer a virgin path.

 

[eosar]

Actually I consider that variant to be one of the worst. There's little to no chance the game can hold up without its adult content and if making that happen had been the main priority of the devs they simply could have made losing to rapists a game over to invest more time and effort into the actual story and non-porn artwork. Or taken to the other extreme, guro is a thing yet when you lose to a wolf or a feral demon you don't see the character "erotically" dismembered and eaten, it just fades to black immediately (*insert default RPGM jingle*)

Plus having a valid reason to remain pure (holy powers, controlling parents...) isn't even all that common. The protagonists simply start out as an unaware ditz with no way of gaining knowledge or showing interest without going full slut or doing rounds through Rapeville. I guess most authors still adhere to traditional Japanese or Christian values and consider all sexuality to be inherently sinful? Or cater to an audience with these views?

Not about sin, more about worth - like Mjonir. Not just anyone can use it, while the player decides who is worthy, if any.
Exclusivity has value and the more limited the access, the higher the value - which is why virgins are the most expensive ones usually.
So it becomes a quest where the player is the defender of a perceived treasure and their actions decide who, if any, reaches its grasp.
But each player has their own goals and being able to achieve them is the sought sense of accomplishment. Some want to keep the girl pure or save her for a special one, others want her holes to be filled by every stick available - being allowed to do that is what decides if the player favours or spurns the game and it is why kinetic novels or forced events are heavily frowned upon.

Sin has nothing to do with it. After all, porn is sin and we're all sinners - hell has long since had reservations set up for our tainted souls.

 

[Sphere42]

Notably in RPGM and QSP games, the goal to avoid sex can be just as interesting as the goal to pursue as much sex as possible.

In that case unfortunately the games I've played were just horribly implemented: either stock RPGM combat not even using damage types or crits making it a pure snoozefest/level grind, or RNG-laden and worse than Nintendo hard because any random encounter could pin you down and rape you before even getting a chance to cast your stun skill. I have never played Hitman but to my understanding those games offer a wide variety of mechanics e.g. hiding corpses, distractions, stunning/drugging people, impersonating authority figures to send them away etc.

Virginity (and related things like innocence and purity) is a kind of fetish which can be had (or lost) only once in a person's lifetime, which is what makes it special.

Note I didn't mention schoolgirl romance stories, and restating my previous point the same could be said for your life. I suppose some games are meant to cater to the virgin fetish but those are not the ones with "hole stats" taking hundreds if not thousands of cocks to max out while losing your virginity plays the same old sex scene with a few extra red pixels and all female dialogue replaced with unsexy sobbing.

Plus everything except the virginity/full innocence angle is not actually in opposition to what I'd like to see. Especially with the female warrior/priest/magical girl premise you could easily give them sexual agency and even a sense of "purity" by having a (friendly and actually likeable!) designated love interest/explicit partner. Maybe a proud amazon who really likes shota boys but still considers drunkard brigands with sleep bombs to be scum lower than pigs. Speaking of pigs I don't see how the F-PC just so happening to have a dark fantasy about fucking one would be any less believable than the same girl just so happening to get snatched up by three armed muggers, raped until morning with no help or witnesses, and somehow being addicted to their cocks by the end of it.

Exclusivity has value and the more limited the access, the higher the value - which is why virgins are the most expensive ones usually.
So it becomes a quest where the player is the defender of a perceived treasure and their actions decide who, if any, reaches its grasp.
But each player has their own goals and being able to achieve them is the sought sense of accomplishment. Some want to keep the girl pure or save her for a special one, others want her holes to be filled by every stick available - being allowed to do that is what decides if the player favours or spurns the game and it is why kinetic novels or forced events are heavily frowned upon.

Except that last part is exactly why I tend to hate these games: in order to, say, seduce the prince into actually having sex with me, bone those big sexy werewolves or milk some tentacles without every speech bubble being full of "eek, *sob*, eww!" I am FORCED to first masturbate in a public toilet, get raped or prostitute myself to some ugly mofo, grind lewdness to near max somehow and potentially lose the ability to resist sexual advances in random encounters altogether. The actions themselves make no sense in-universe, the "progression" makes no sense and the intermediate steps are not rewarding in the slightest. And most of the time people with an explicit rape fetish should see their fun declining because the PC becomes "mindbroken" or "slutty" and doesn't even consider it rape anymore.

 

[Gloot]

I think we are sidetracking here. I may be wrong, but it sounded to me that most of you instead of pursuing the maiden path, are more likely avoiding the slutty/corrupted path that normally entrails this type of game. If should said game be done with a male PC would you still try to stay 'pure'? Not entirely fair comparison, but I can think of two games: SpaceCorps XXX and Monster Girl Quest.

For SpaceCorps the PC is a religious farm boy introduced to this high liberal society. I went back and tried playing avoiding the lewdness because I was intrigued by the religious aspect of the PC, but afaik there is nothing different on the current build. You simply skip the hot bits.

For Monster Girl I simply hate losing. If you are not aware of the game, you play a young hero boy on a quest and most of the erotic content (if not all) is after losing a battle to one of those monster girls. I find it a chore to have to lose a battle to see some spicy pics and learned to avoid those (btw, this kind of gameplay have a name?).

 

[Sphere42]

I may be wrong, but it sounded to me that most of you instead of pursuing the maiden path, are more likely avoiding the slutty/corrupted path that normally entrails this type of game. If should said game be done with a male PC would you still try to stay 'pure'?

For me it depends on the game. Mostly I avoid rape by humanoids and explicit NTR. However as I already stated I play these games for the sexual content so the "maiden" path's only value is the full CG unlock if that is more efficient or less off-putting than slogging through all the early-game rape. If female-on-male rape were actually written as such and with comparable character choices (i.e. unwashed grannies, pig-faced landwhales or scrawny nutjobs whose only character trait is "asshole") I would avoid it all the same. But it isn't, the "rapist" (if it is even called assault once the scene actually begins) tends to be a hot woman in her prime and the guy gets "into it" even faster than the slutty girls.

However as I alluded to individual components of "the maiden path" might feel necessary to maintain some degree of selectivity or sexual agency. I don't want to bang everything no questions asked but if I wanted to play a pure and innocent virgin I'd boot up Dragon Quest or something.

I find it a chore to have to lose a battle to see some spicy pics and learned to avoid those (btw, this kind of gameplay have a name?).

"Game Over rape (GOR)" tends to be the most common, connoisseurs around here might debate the definition of "Game Over" and use terms like "defeat rape" instead if you aren't forced to restart/reload afterwards.

 

[215303j]

In that case unfortunately the games I've played were just horribly implemented

I'm not saying it's well implemented. And certainly not on a level comparable to Hitman (which I think is a brilliant game series).
Most of these games follow the well known "Retard in Lechertown" trope: stupid innocent girl in a world full of rapists. But some, like Anna Exciting Affection [v1.6] [DeepSleep] (also Retard in Lechertown) do have a reasonably decent story and it's fun to see how far you can come without corrupting the MC too much.

Plus everything except the virginity/full innocence angle is not actually in opposition to what I'd like to see. Especially with the female warrior/priest/magical girl premise you could easily give them sexual agency and even a sense of "purity" by having a (friendly and actually likeable!) designated love interest/explicit partner.

Have a look at The Coceter Chronicles [v0.15 Beta1] [Nverjos] it fits your description quite well.
Excellent game in my opinion. It's a pity that it seems abandoned at this point, but still there is a lot of content.

I think we are sidetracking here. I may be wrong, but it sounded to me that most of you instead of pursuing the maiden path, are more likely avoiding the slutty/corrupted path that normally entrails this type of game.

Maybe, but often you don't have a lot of choice...

If should said game be done with a male PC would you still try to stay 'pure'? Not entirely fair comparison, but I can think of two games: SpaceCorps XXX and Monster Girl Quest.

Never played either, SpaceCorps is on my still-to-play list, Monster Girl doesn't appeal to me that much.

But it depends on the story.

For instance, Our Fate - A new family [CedSense] , I play more or less like I would IRL. I stay faithful to my girlfriend until she decides to leave me because I pay too much attention to my ex-girlfriends daughter. Except that I'd never have any relation with my not-daughter of course...

Other games, particularly the harem kind are mostly focussed on creating lewd situations, and as long as I don't find the girl repulsive I just go along with that. I do have to say that I find that easier to do with a male MC than with a female MC.

In general I think that games are a safe way to act out fantasies that are not possible or recommended to carry out IRL. Which is why topics like incest and NTR are so popular. But in order to have immersion, I prefer it if the MC stays close to my own personality.

However as I alluded to individual components of "the maiden path" might feel necessary to maintain some degree of selectivity or sexual agency. I don't want to bang everything no questions asked but if I wanted to play a pure and innocent virgin I'd boot up Dragon Quest or something.

I read a bit on the topic of sexual agency in an interview with the Israeli director of the movie Isha Ovedet / Working Woman where a attractive married office lady gets sexually harassed by her boss, which sounds close to the Retard in Lechertown trope, except this woman is not a retard and this situation apparently happens to 1 in every 4 women at some point. Anyway, one point she made in the interview was that men are generally encouraged by society to pursue sex while women are generally encouraged to avoid it.

I don't entirely agree with this characterization because I would never encourage a young man to sexually harass women. Likewise I do think it's advisable for young women to be a bit reserved and not behave slutty or engage in sex with every boy she meets. But still in general she does have a point.

 

[Sphere42]

It seems my point was phrased poorly: I meant in those existing games the "maiden" options feel "necessary" because it is the only way to warp their shoddy Rapeville mess into something slightly more enjoyable. If I got to write the script every single attempted rape scene would have a big red (optional) "kick him in the balls!" button right at the beginning but a female MC could also sit down at a bar, wink at some hot and genuinely friendly people and end up riding them all night long without ending up naked in a pillory on the town square the next morning.

this situation apparently happens to 1 in every 4 women at some point.

Sadly most studies on that subject cannot be trusted for various reasons. Some sources (even the Canadian police statistics or an old FBI report I believe) define rape as the perpetrator inserting their penis and secondary analyses tend to completely ignore the "made to penetrate" or "forced envelopment" columns which list the female-on-male equivalent. Often female-on-male sexual assault is ignored to twist the narrative from "people are horrible" to a "women's problem". For what it's worth the original "1 in 4"/"1 in 5" figure is from a study in 1987 which started out on a single university campus, and even goes so far as to explicitly specify a male perpetrator in all 10 published survey questions:

You must be registered to see the links

(pg. 6/9 in that PDF, or pg. 167 in the journal). Plus the whole "no women were raped in the making of this game", not that that ever stopped PETA...

Anyway, one point she made in the interview was that men are generally encouraged by society to pursue sex while women are generally encouraged to avoid it.

Primarily by OTHER WOMEN one should note!

 

[215303j]

If I got to write the script every single attempted rape scene would have a big red (optional) "kick him in the balls!" button right at the beginning but a female MC could also sit down at a bar, wink at some hot and genuinely friendly people and end up riding them all night long without ending up naked in a pillory on the town square the next morning.

Amen brother

Sadly most studies on that subject cannot be trusted for various reasons.

All fair points, but it does happen way more often than it should happen. And is likely under reported in most statistics.

The interesting thing is that sexual assault (in any form) is often perpetrated by "normal" people who are known by their victims.

 

[Avaron1974]

If i'm playing one of those games that has a maiden path and a female MC I can rp a little bit.

I tend to stick to that path because she's usually a warrior of some kind and supposed to be a badass so being molested by old guys, shota's and monsters she's been killing for fun doesn't make any sense.

Plus it's usually tied to the ending.

I like happy endings.

Also those sex scenes usually involve losing fights which is the opposite I want to be doing when gaming.

Also also i'm not here for porn, i'm here for adult games that may or may not contain said porn but isn't my focus, I don't jill off to RPG's.