Ren'Py The Null Hypothesis [v0.7b] [Ron Chon]

[Bentsay]

Really wish you could adjust the text and transition speed tbh.

 

[MaxRichard]

It's not hard/complex and it's exactly how it's coded. For example, Rogue.friendship on my game looks like this:
{'Laura': 118, 'Charles': 0, 'Kurt': 0, 'Jean': 92}

And Laura's look like this:
{'Rogue': 68, 'Charles': 0, 'Kurt': 0, 'Jean': 86}

Notice how Laura's relationship score with Rogue is lower than Rogue's relationship with Laura. (68 vs 118).

Rival is just when that number is below zero (for the time being and for Jean and/or Rogue. That may change as new characters are introduced). So basically, just keep working on that relationship until it goes into the positive (or cheat).

But then relevant branch will need to check each relationship both ways, which tends to result in inconsistencies unless you actively code against it. I'm not saying it necessarily creates inconsistencies here as I haven't played through every single scene, but it does make it more complex than just modeling each relationship instead of each character

 

[sleepingkirby]

But then relevant branch will need to check each relationship both ways, which tends to result in inconsistencies unless you actively code against it. I'm not saying it necessarily creates inconsistencies here as I haven't played through every single scene, but it does make it more complex than just modeling each relationship instead of each character

What? What are you talking about? I'm saying that for this post, he just has to keep fostering friendship between the 2 characters. Because anything below 0 is marked as "rival". Whether that number is -1 or -999 so it might take a while. There's no inconsistency check both ways or duplicate/redundant values or anything that's causing the rival status.

Like here's the code (version 0.53b):
./scripts/interface/Player_menu.rpy:1919

        viewport id "relationships_friendship_viewport" anchor (0.0, 0.5) pos (0.515, 0.595) xysize (0.385, int(195*game_resolution)):
           <snip viewport properties>
            hbox:
                spacing 20

                for C in eval(f"{current_relationships_Entry.tag}_friendship_thresholds.keys()"):
                    if C != current_relationships_Entry.tag and eval(C) in active_Companions:
                        $ friendship = eval(f"current_relationships_Entry.get_friendship({C})")

                        fixed xysize (int(135*game_resolution), int(195*game_resolution)):
                            add f"images/interface/photos/{C}.webp" align (0.5, 0.5) zoom 0.13
                            add f"images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_{friendship}.webp" align (0.5, 0.5) zoom interface_adjustment

Where current_relationships_Entry is set to a single character via a button here:
./scripts/interface/Player_menu.rpy:1758

                button xysize (int(911*game_resolution), int(191*game_resolution)):
                   <snip button properties>
                    action SetVariable("current_relationships_Entry", C)

As you can see, it's a simple for-loop that iterates through the keys of a single character's friendship object. There's no reverse checks for friendship counts in the rival calculation. In fact, the rival status isn't even a straight evaluation, but rather a threshold check to return a string that just gets concatenated into what color it shows on the game's GUI.

Or, to put it simply:
current_relationships_Entry ==> current character whose info is being viewed
friendship ==> variable to hold string of a number, ranging from -2 to 3 (depending on characters and thresholds)

which means that this line:
add f"images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_{friendship}.webp"

Will display one of the following images:
images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_3.webp
images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_2.webp
images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_1.webp
images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_0.webp
images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_-1.webp
images/interface/Player_menu/relationships_-2.webp

Which you will find are borders with colors that correspond to a characters relationship status/threshold to another character. A. Single. Linear. Evaluation. No inconsistencies, no duplicate states. Just a single instance for one character and how they feel about another.


That's part of what makes this code so much better to mod/maintain. The evaluations are straightforward and simple. As Jamie Hynemann of Mythbusters said:
"Whenever you run into an overly complicated design, that's a sign of an inferior engineer. Simpler is always better."


Like, I had to understand this code to know how to inject my cheats and my cheat allows you to turn off rival status. I know how it works.

 

[cannavaro99]

how far away is laura full deepthroat animation? really want to see her go down all the way :=)

 

[DarkLurker12]

She is also the youngest of multiple siblings and was treated with less respect because of it. You don't look up to the youngest person in the family as an authority or expert on something.

I didn't know she had siblings!? And here I thought she must have had a little brother she never got to help raise as she was wisked of to be the special.

You're right in that it'd work better in a Japanese game but it's more just a power dynamic that she latches onto as an excuse that evolves into faux-incest.

*As has been discussed to death, not all colleges have seniors look after freshmen in this way. However several, including my own, did. Not everything is a universal experience and we're not going to include or exclude something for that reason alone.

Maybe have Null's responses include "like, some anime school?" like the little goober he can be. between that and jean mentioning something about it being normal in the college in her hometown would solve all the the discourse on the college dynamic.

Jean very much is meant to be awkward. Also I believe that was me and it was about how Jean is upset at no longer being Xavier's interesting special kid.

This woman is deeply troubled and yes we will be exploring this thoroughly as development proceeds.

Great to hear. I'll be honest but Jean originally was just "there" for me. The base line you compare all the other girls' personality types to. "Professor X's model female". You guys really opened my eyes to how interesting her personality really is. I really want to be there for her development.

I mean Jean even voices that the big sister thing was worded awkwardly and she only jumps on it because Null gave his approval directly or indirectly.

Which is why it's not as easy as simply asking. The girls have to know each other and have these rules.

Would be nice to overhear them discussing these rules a few times. or have their openess to opening the relationship refected by trying to breach the subject with their fav potential member.

Spoiler: Though...

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[ShinyBoots1993]

Strip Poker! STRIP POKER!

also, normal Poker, love a game of texas hold em.
(Seriously, this has TOO much potential to let go, friendly games, strip games, characters having lore/personal/4thwall comments as they play, increases to love/trust, improve (or worsen) friendship between chars, can also have an impact on popularity ranking...)

I'll throw this suggestion at the devs.

I don't *think* most people are gonna be interested in running the same repetitive sandbox a bunch of times over with a single girl/relationship per run.

You'd be surprised. We've held polls and a lot of people want to see how the game plays out if you date only one girl. Others have voiced they'd attempt it once they know other girls being introduced.

As for the overly-prudish shame system, as long as that's moddable the default values are more suggestion than anything.

Overly prudish? You can have Rogue walk around with just her mesh shirt and Laura wear her jacket with nothing underneath. Hell, you can get Jean to go to class in a bikini.

The only thing that's a bug is having them walk around naked.

Christ, just went thru like 4-5 pages of "already established" topic on the game. Exhausted my head. Shiny handle it pretty well.

Copious amounts of caffeine and long form youtube video essays. Pyrocynical's coverage of niche horror mods and indie games are my drug.

One of which is still influx. As of the time of this post: The latest version is now 0.6beta44, the links in the OP are for 0.6beta38, and whoever made the edits "conveniently" got rid of the links for the last stable build: 0.5b. I could have sworn that someone on the dev team said to not replace the links in the OP from the last stable build to the 0.6 betas, but dudes seem to be hard-headed and don't wanna listen.

We tried to get the admins involved but there's not much that can be done other than informing them that Ron wasn't trying to game the system.

Every time someone uploads a new beta the official release gets delayed by another 2 weeks since we want it to show up on the front page.

In all honesty it would be a big deal in the institute because there are kids running around

Also this. A divergence from the timeline is that Xavier opened the school a lot earlier.

What remains is that he's still incredibly picky on letting people on the actual crime fighting team. Nightcrawler being an example.

I didn't know she had siblings!? And here I thought she must have had a little brother she never got to help raise as she was wisked of to be the special.

Correction on my part. She has one younger sister but she also has an older sister and two older brothers. Older sister gets killed by mutant haters and everyone else in her family is murdered by a spoiler.

Great to hear. I'll be honest but Jean originally was just "there" for me. The base line you compare all the other girls' personality types to. "Professor X's model female". You guys really opened my eyes to how interesting her personality really is. I really want to be there for her development.

Jean for a long time was just "there" because she was the girl. We're just retroactively bringing her personality to a point in the timeline where she was portrayed as the overly emotional girl on the team.

Like legit. If you read the original comics, she's in the wrong for the guys perving on her and even into the 90s she's dismissed whenever she's rightfully upset about something. Evo Jean I think is the first instance of her having any real agency.

Edit: She was also a bikini model for some reason. No she won't be one in TNH, yes she may model a bikini for YOU. No promises of when.

Would be nice to overhear them discussing these rules a few times. or have their openess to opening the relationship refected by trying to breach the subject with their fav potential member.

This is planned. Though again the reason why an obvious thing isn't in the game yet is because we're still in early development.

We're not moving onto Chapter 2 until all the core systems and features are out of the way.

You start to wonder of all this psychology is just a complicated excuse for the autor's barely hidden fetish

Jokes aside I get my psychology degree in 4 weeks.

 

[salscou]

You'd be surprised. We've held polls and a lot of people want to see how the game plays out if you date only one girl. Others have voiced they'd attempt it once they know other girls being introduced.

Yeah, no kidding, my most recent and complete save is 1 girl only, im not kidding when i say that for me, the game feels better for me that way, i guess that when you add more than one girl for me my suspension of disbelief gets broken.

What remains is that he's still incredibly picky on letting people on the actual crime fighting team.

Makes sense, with the kind of bullshit the X-men find themeselves in all the time, you only want the more apt, prepared and stable mutants to go out.

Jean for a long time was just "there" because she was the girl. We're just retroactively bringing her personality to a point in the timeline where she was portrayed as the overly emotional girl on the team.

Early Jean its so lame, she literally is just "the girl" in the team, no wonder she ended up becoming the phoenix.

Jokes aside I get my psychology degree in 4 weeks.

Hey! congratulations!

 

[ShinyBoots1993]

Hey! congratulations!

Thanks!

I've been giving input with the main story beats as Marvel doesn't portray mental or psychological issues very well.

I had a direct hand in helping the writers shape Laura's obsessiveness not crossing the line into cartoon territory, Jean's anxiety attacks(I may or may not have projected lol), and Rogue's low self esteem.

Although I will not take credit away from Maddeninggg for the Rogue line "Why do you hate me?" I wrote that whole guilt trip post like 20 pages ago but Mad and the rest of our team know how to do a good emotional gut punch without psychological assistance.

 

[DarkLurker12]

Jokes aside I get my psychology degree in 4 weeks.

Congratz my guy!

 

[salscou]

but Mad and the rest of our team know how to do a good emotional gut punch without psychological assistance.

Well they did a superb job.

Spoiler: I could never hate you

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I was one of the ones caught in the update suddenly making all the girls thin you cheated, i had to suffer the emotional damage of Rogue and Laura being heartbroken while Jean was all smug.

 

[Crel]

Overly prudish? You can have Rogue walk around with just her mesh shirt and Laura wear her jacket with nothing underneath. Hell, you can get Jean to go to class in a bikini.

Guess it's been adjusted then, glad to hear! Last time I played was a patch or two prior, and at the time you couldn't even get a girl to wear a swimsuit. At the pool.

Even then my comment wasn't really intended as complaint; I just assumed they were having it stricter for now to leave room to grow in later chapters.

Haven't played 0.6 yet, waiting for full release!

 

[Tommy7358]

Hi, I realise that this is jumpping the gun quite a bit, but now that we're at the beginning of chapter 2 may I ask how many chapters in total are planned so far? quick search didn't seem to turn up the answer I wanted.

 

[ShinyBoots1993]

Guess it's been adjusted then, glad to hear! Last time I played was a patch or two prior, and at the time you couldn't even get a girl to wear a swimsuit. At the pool.

Yeah that was basically around the time we introduced the shame system and were still tweaking things.

Even then my comment wasn't really intended as complaint; I just assumed they were having it stricter for now to leave room to grow in later chapters.

This will still be the case to some degree. With 5 chapters and a 6th free roam chapter we have to have some character development and we have NO intention on neglecting girls.

 

[ShinyBoots1993]

Hi, I realise that this is jumpping the gun quite a bit, but now that we're at the beginning of chapter 2

Where not even done with Chapter 1. What on earth made you think we've begun Chapter 2????

may I ask how many chapters in total are planned so far?

Five with a sixth which will be dedicated to bonus stories, a handful of girls who couldn't fit in the timeline in a believable way, some extended stories for chapter 4 and 5 girls who didn't have as much screen time*, and the set up for a sequel.

*Girls from chapters 1-3 will get content too but they got a lot more time to show off.

 

[FacelessVixen]

We tried to get the admins involved but there's not much that can be done other than informing them that Ron wasn't trying to game the system.

Every time someone uploads a new beta the official release gets delayed by another 2 weeks since we want it to show up on the front page.

If you don't mind, I'll copy and paste 0.5b from Discord so that newcomers can enjoy the latest stable version:
[redacted]

Jokes aside I get my psychology degree in 4 weeks.

Hopefully it'll be more useful than an art degree.

 

[Crichton1]

Hi, I realise that this is jumpping the gun quite a bit, but now that we're at the beginning of chapter 2 may I ask how many chapters in total are planned so far? quick search didn't seem to turn up the answer I wanted.

I think it's six. I don't know, don't work here, but i've seen 6 chapters mentioned often.

if you don't mind, I'll copy and paste 0.5b from Discord so that newcomers can enjoy the latest stable version:

I sure hope this doesn't mess with the "no more than 1 update every two weeks" thing the mods have set-up.

It could end up preventing the game from getting to the front page of "latest updates" when there is an actual proper 6a

 

[FacelessVixen]

I sure hope this doesn't mess with the "no more than 1 update every two weeks" thing the mods have set-up.

It could end up preventing the game from getting to the front page of "latest updates" when there is an actual proper 6a

Then I guess the best solution is to direct the newcomers to Discord, because I do not trust the level of reasonability with the powers that be in this situation.

 

[Tommy7358]

Where not even done with Chapter 1. What on earth made you think we've begun Chapter 2????


Five with a sixth which will be dedicated to bonus stories, a handful of girls who couldn't fit in the timeline in a believable way, some extended stories for chapter 4 and 5 girls who didn't have as much screen time*, and the set up for a sequel.

*Girls from chapters 1-3 will get content too but they got a lot more time to show off.

Hmm... I personally haven't played the game yet, and since I saw talk of chapter 2 I thought it was coming out soon or something. I only found out by scrolling through that chapter 2 is scheduled for roughly February 2025 after I posted. Sorry about that.

Quick follow up questions,

1. Would the bonus stories be canon or in the vein of 'this happened in another timeline' sort of way for the 'handful of girls who couldn't fit in the timeline in a believable way'; I also assume the extended stories of the chapter 4 and 5 girls are canon events that just didn't fit in the development schedule and thus just delayed to another chapter.

2. I again know this is reaching quite far in the future and also subject to change but as of right now is the set up for the sequel in chapter 6 and is the player character of the sequel the same as the one as we control in The Null Hypothesis?

Thanks for your answers by the way. You're awesome from what I can tell.

 

[Tommy7358]

I think it's six. I don't know, don't work here, but i've seen 6 chapters mentioned often.

I sure hope this doesn't mess with the "no more than 1 update every two weeks" thing the mods have set-up.

It could end up preventing the game from getting to the front page of "latest updates" when there is an actual proper 6a

Thanks for your reply.

 

[ShinyBoots1993]

Hopefully it'll be more useful than an art degree.

Clinical Psychology. Not to knock on talk therapists but I'll be as far as one can go without having to go to medschool.

1. Would the bonus stories be canon or in the vein of 'this happened in another timeline' sort of way for the 'handful of girls who couldn't fit in the timeline in a believable way'; I also assume the extended stories of the chapter 4 and 5 girls are canon events that just didn't fit in the development schedule and thus just delayed to another chapter.

I'm gonna take this moment to explain in full.

The game will be taking place over the course of 5 years. Each chapter being a full year.

We will be adapting the X-Men Comics from The Phoenix Saga to the Onslaught Saga.

Chapter 1 exists to establish the setting

Here's the

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. Starting with Chapter 2, we will be adapting the comics from Phoenix Saga (1976) – X-Men #101-108 to Onslaught Saga (1996)

An exception is that the Muir Island Saga (1991) is the columniation of Chapter 1. Like Laura, this is a holdover from Ron's initial build.

Now for reasons I have to be EXTREMELY vague about. Chapter 6 won't be following any defined span of time. However, all of the stories will be 100% canon.

The extended stories exist because we will be introducing girls in Chapter 5 and them missing out on 4 chapters of character development isn't fun for their fanbases.

2. I again know this is reaching quite far in the future and also subject to change but as of right now is the set up for the sequel in chapter 6 and is the player character of the sequel the same as the one as we control in The Null Hypothesis?

Null will be the protagonist of all our X-Men games.

I'm currently in an active discussion with the writing team of how to make a Null in his late 30s not come off as weird for going after characters like Kamala since I don't think Kamala isn't even born yet in our timeline.

Thanks for your answers by the way. You're awesome from what I can tell.

You're welcome. I feel the love.