honestly this game is soo fucking good and high quality I dont care if I have to wait a year for an update, there are plenty of other games you can play to pass the time and developing a whole fucking game by yourself is pretty hard
- Thread starter Bob69
- Start date
- Oct 3, 2019
- 965
- 1,494
- 267
alright so from what I have gathered and this is not a surprise for anyone
You don't have permission to view the spoiler content.
Log in or register now.
Digteren
Well-Known Member
- Nov 1, 2020
- 1,215
- 1,120
- 290
I don't think it's a question of empathy. I'm not certain people know it's just Erk sweating away.
I think it's a question of indie H game brain.
Imagine how many times some of these people have been burned. Whether on patreon or simply in their capacity as a pirate who reeeally hoped this or that game would go somewhere. This situation does look like that a little.
I think people are just assuming the worst because they haven't read the "this is a little preparatory patch" patch notes on steam.
Did this dev actually ask his customers for empathy ?
This is a business - they are offering a product in exchange for money.
And the product is not being delivered while the money is.
They are getting monthly subscriptions and early access purchases in exchange for...literally this:
And don't get me started on "you're a pirate" comment. People here subscribe and buy tons of content. This forum is creating new customers. I personally purchased tons of games only because I learned about their existence here.
This is a business - they are offering a product in exchange for money.
And the product is not being delivered while the money is.
They are getting monthly subscriptions and early access purchases in exchange for...literally this:
And don't get me started on "you're a pirate" comment. People here subscribe and buy tons of content. This forum is creating new customers. I personally purchased tons of games only because I learned about their existence here.
- Oct 3, 2019
- 965
- 1,494
- 267
Customers can vote with their wallets. My personal patreon offers 5 games for the cost of 5 bucks. If you pay once, you get them all. If you stick around, great. But I also don't push people to do anything, or offer any unique benefits to being a subscriber. Never have, never will.
Wet Nightmares is a game I publish, I help Erk make sure the game is good, and it lands correctly. The last few months since the launch he has had several deaths in his family and needed a break to sort out his grief. So you know, whatever you want to do.
Also that image you posted is a blocking image to lay out the narrative in engine before the focused work of building confirmed and locked assets begin. But if you don't wanna read the news post, don't be out here spreading misinformation.
Karnewarrior
Engaged Member
- Oct 28, 2017
- 2,288
- 3,006
- 418
For some reason, there are people on this site who will swear themselves blind that everyone on Patreon is a scammer for not putting anything out, despite the fact that anyone can, at any time, simply stop supporting someone.
I do not know why they care so much about other people wasting their own goddamn money. It'd be like standing on the side of the road screaming about how ferrari is a scam because people will buy one and then run out of money to support it, and ferrari allows them to do this and is thus somehow liable.
I do not know why they care so much about other people wasting their own goddamn money. It'd be like standing on the side of the road screaming about how ferrari is a scam because people will buy one and then run out of money to support it, and ferrari allows them to do this and is thus somehow liable.
atomicp
Member
- Feb 25, 2018
- 467
- 955
- 212
Not only that, some of those are the same people supporting known griefers because they like to have "insider info' about the lack of updates.
Also, I bought Wet Nightmares on steam because I liked it. No complaints from me. =p
The primary purpose of a forum is to share information. And content, in this forum's case.
You are all perfectly aware that both honorable and dishonorable creators exist and in no way does it hurt to be aware of them - that's why there is review and commenting system in place.
If Wet Nightmares dev had personal troubles, I can completely understand all and any delays or complete abandoning of the game. But personal issues and work issues do not mix - if development is severely delayed or halted indefinitely, the sensible thing to do is inform the community and stop sales.
- Oct 3, 2019
- 965
- 1,494
- 267
But we are not halting dev. Why the buggery are you making shit up? This is why I hate this site man, everyone just making up facts.
Completely ignored 99.99% of what I said and argued about only a single word - "halted".
Which part is made up?
That the development is extremely delayed ?
That this has not been communicated on distribution platform so people can make an informed purchase ?
That money is still being taken from subs and pre-release purchases despite little or no work being done ?
Last edited:
Satto
Newbie
- Nov 15, 2021
- 16
- 47
- 136
I feel like I should mention that when you subscribe to a developer you are not buying their game. You are choosing to help support them so they can continue to create the game you enjoy. If you don't enjoy the game and you don't feel that you are getting your "moneys worth" out of your sub then you are always free to cancel.
Also, while I have made donations to devs because of games I got from this site, you should keep in mind we are still getting them for free, unless you are an active subscriber you really don't have any grounds to complain.
I am not saying that all devs everywhere are honest and above board, yes some of them are only in it to try and get free money from people by flipping assets and not putting in any actual work but that is all the more reason we should try to support the devs who are working hard to make their games a reality.
We all want our favorite games that are in development to be completed or at least worked on regularly and to get regular updates but life gets in the way of that a lot of the time. Just because the dev of this game, a single person I will remind you, had a really rough time doesn't mean that they don't want to continue working on the game. It also doesn't mean that they dont still need the support from their subscribers to continue being able to work on it.
If everyone jumps ship because its not being updated often enough for them or because they feel like they aren't getting what they paid for then the game will either slow even further down in development or halt all together because the dev is forced to find alternate sources of employment which eats up the time they would have put into the game to begin with.
Has this game been in development for a long time? sure it has but the quality hasn't dropped and while the updates have been fewer and farther between recently that doesn't mean its been abandoned.
Fact of the matter is that I couldn't make a game by myself.
It would just be nice if we could see more positivity and support for devs who are working hard to make their dreams a reality instead of tearing them down when life throws hurdles in their way.
I will just leave this here, I am not looking to start an argument or to get into a flame war with anyone, these are just my personal thoughts so take them as is please.
Also, while I have made donations to devs because of games I got from this site, you should keep in mind we are still getting them for free, unless you are an active subscriber you really don't have any grounds to complain.
I am not saying that all devs everywhere are honest and above board, yes some of them are only in it to try and get free money from people by flipping assets and not putting in any actual work but that is all the more reason we should try to support the devs who are working hard to make their games a reality.
We all want our favorite games that are in development to be completed or at least worked on regularly and to get regular updates but life gets in the way of that a lot of the time. Just because the dev of this game, a single person I will remind you, had a really rough time doesn't mean that they don't want to continue working on the game. It also doesn't mean that they dont still need the support from their subscribers to continue being able to work on it.
If everyone jumps ship because its not being updated often enough for them or because they feel like they aren't getting what they paid for then the game will either slow even further down in development or halt all together because the dev is forced to find alternate sources of employment which eats up the time they would have put into the game to begin with.
Has this game been in development for a long time? sure it has but the quality hasn't dropped and while the updates have been fewer and farther between recently that doesn't mean its been abandoned.
Fact of the matter is that I couldn't make a game by myself.
It would just be nice if we could see more positivity and support for devs who are working hard to make their dreams a reality instead of tearing them down when life throws hurdles in their way.
I will just leave this here, I am not looking to start an argument or to get into a flame war with anyone, these are just my personal thoughts so take them as is please.
Karnewarrior
Engaged Member
- Oct 28, 2017
- 2,288
- 3,006
- 418
There is a pretty significant difference between sharing development information, to include warning people that development is extremely slow or halted, and insinuating that the developer is a scammer because of the pause or slowness. Developing a game slowly is not a scam, it's a consequence of being indie, and of developing a game. Pausing development is not a scam, even if the dev doesn't pause their patreon, because again the user can stop supporting the dev whenever they wish.
The issue is not in the content of your message, but how it's delivered, which is unnecessarily hostile, implies untrue things, and is generally misleading and not informative. Particularly as I'm seeing more and more people calling any gap at all between updates as an unacceptable delay and thus the developer is a scammer. This is not a forum culture I wish to foment.
Yeah....NO - you are twisting my words and putting words in my mouth.
As long as you "feel" words and not "read" words, it is impossible to have dialogue. I am responsible only for what I say(type) - not for what you feel like I'm saying.
So let me repeat myself one last time and take this literally for what it is written, not how you feel about it:
If little or no work is done(for whatever reason), the responsible and decent thing to do is to inform the subscription community that they will not be getting their money's worth and temporarily halt sales.
Otherwise it is like that classic line "I didn't lie to you, you just didn't ask about it!"
what is this para-social sentiment? developers aren't our friends we do not know them. I'm all for supporting the few good lewd devs out there including during hard times but at the end of the day when you accept someone's money you are accepting your half of the social contract. i provide money for a good or service with the understanding that might take significantly longer than buying a game upfront and the developer agrees to provide said product eventually. you have to eventually deliver and the dev DOES have to answer for delays or long periods of inactivity.
we have all things going on in our lives it doesn't excuse us from our responsibilities or obligations or from showing a basic level of respect to people. normally i'd give a metric fuckton of leeway to a lewd dev. this particular dev being repeatedly rude and nasty to anyone not showing total admiration really lowers that threshold for me and i imagine most people. in in regards to the other point if you automatically dismiss any opinions from people who aren't willing to support you then you're guaranteeing you never see more support much less get valuable input from the people playing the game. part of me was hoping there'd be a shift in attitude over time but it seems not. which is unfortunate because this game does look like it could be going somewhere.
Karnewarrior
Engaged Member
- Oct 28, 2017
- 2,288
- 3,006
- 418
It's not parasocial. It's right there in the name: Patreon. Patron. When you patronize someone, you aren't supporting them for any particular product - at least not in the classical definition of the word - you're supporting their career in general. It's not parasocial to admit to that? I don't know where that even came from.
It's a patronizing relationship. That is, mostly one-sided. The Patron chooses who to support, when, and for what purpose. If people want to hand you money for doing nothing, that's their business. It might be stupid of them, and I'd agree if that was all you were saying, but it doesn't - and cannot - imply any moral impetus on the part of the patronized beyond deception, which is not in play here. Putting out things super slowly is still putting them out and is not deceptive, just annoying and lazy
It's a patronizing relationship. That is, mostly one-sided. The Patron chooses who to support, when, and for what purpose. If people want to hand you money for doing nothing, that's their business. It might be stupid of them, and I'd agree if that was all you were saying, but it doesn't - and cannot - imply any moral impetus on the part of the patronized beyond deception, which is not in play here. Putting out things super slowly is still putting them out and is not deceptive, just annoying and lazy
If your only argument is the word definition behind the name of the platform - it is a weak ass argument.
Why are you playing dumb - you know perfectly well that many people subscribe only so they can download the product.
Your argument completely crumbles when you ignore all the other platforms where the game is sold and are not a supporter-style platforms.
But you only point out things that suit you.
Last edited:
And how would you know how much work was done?
For all we know, the dev might have worked on chapter 3 the whole time, but hasn't released it in the recent update coz it's not finished as a whole.
It's a game made by what, 1 developer? These things take a ton of time even if there are tens of devs. Rushed projects are garbage that benefits neither dev nor player, let the dev cook in peace and eventually you'll get the product. You have thousands of other games to play until this is finally ready to release.
QuietCynic
Member
- Dec 22, 2021
- 155
- 321
- 187
Wet Nightmares v3.11
You must be registered to see the links
:
You must be registered to see the links
You must be registered to see the links
You don't have permission to view the spoiler content.
Log in or register now.