Ren'Py What a Legend! [v0.7.05] [MagicNuts]

[FunFuntomes]

Well, most of these work arounds (patches, hidden activation, etc.) aren't safe on paper, either. And the safe ones, like the player determining relationships, quite often impact the whole writing negatively, so they should be avoided in my opinion.

Anyway, as far as I see it, incest is certainly a very accepted fetish. The only time I see people really pushing back against it, is when players want to add "their" fetish into a game, where the dev didn't plan add that kind of content in the first place. But that's basically the case for most fetishes...

I mean, incest in WaL! would be kinda futile anyway. Yes, you could add some kind of sister or mom character later on, but I'm not sure that would really please those, who actually like the whole topic. It's a bit like NTR, where it's only really good, if it's an important element of the game.

don't forget the protagonist is an orphan left at the doorstep of a church, all while Vi was scheming to take the throne. an orphan that has the nevernuff's gift. Royal bastards are a commn thrope... the trick is to hint at it nicely and let people that want incest in WaL see it.

 

[OmegaZero21]

Step relationships are against Patreon rules too (as well as using adoption as a workaround), that's why landladies, tennants and roomates come into play so often. The fact that some games can get away with using blood or step relationships only means that nobody in Patreon has checked them yet, most likely because no one has reported them. But they are infringing Patreon's rules and risking to be deplatformed.

In WaL, a restrictive view of Patreon's ToS could even mean that our MC should never come back to the brothel to lewd his 'mothers', since they effectively raised him up and therefore are actual motherly figures -so incest.

WTF can we STOP using Patreon please? Until Patreon gets a damn dictionary and looks up the word incest. I legit don't know how someone can support a platform that creates its own definitions and creates rules around definitions that they themselves created. Holy hell how long until holding hands is defined as sexual assault. Said it before and I'll say it again I'm NEVER supporting Patreon.

I mean legit how long until roomie and landlady aren't allowed anymore either?

 

[j4yj4m]

don't forget the protagonist is an orphan left at the doorstep of a church, all while Vi was scheming to take the throne. an orphan that has the nevernuff's gift. Royal bastards are a commn thrope... the trick is to hint at it nicely and let people that want incest in WaL see it.

Well, that's kinda what I meant by saying it's futile. Yes, you could add/imply it, but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't satisfy 95% of those, who'd play it for the incest. I mean, it's usually about the taboo, about the secrecy, etc. and if the story doesn't at least partly focus on that, it's just another attribute for some character.
It's a bit like let's say BDSM content or such: Yes, it's easy to add the tag, but if you actually produce content, that's worth having that tag, is another question.

WTF can we STOP using Patreon please? Until Patreon gets a damn dictionary and looks up the word incest. I legit don't know how someone can support a platform that creates its own definitions and creates rules around definitions that they themselves created. Holy hell how long until holding hands is defined as sexual assault. Said it before and I'll say it again I'm NEVER supporting Patreon.

To be fair, Patreon didn't care until their payment processors made them care. It's indeed mainly about for example paypal and stripe, who don't want to support platforms, who allow that kind of content. Hence for example, why subscribestar still doesn't offer paypal payments.

Else one can indeed say, that I'm not aware, that Patreon actually ever banned somebody because of stepcest. They just wouldn't allow it as a solution to get your already banned account back.
It seems like Patreon generally doesn't really care about incest, unless you advertise it on your patreon page. Yet, there's of course always a risk remaining.

 

[moskyx]

Yup, Patreon is not particularly harsh enforcing these rules. Most games just fly under their radar, they are not proactively seeking for games with banned content but of course they will react if a game is reported by users. And even then, they usually give devs some time to adapt their scripts and abide to the rules. Basically, Patreon is forced to be like this if they want to keep working with big payment processors, but at the same time there's kind of a tacit compromise with devs: don't stick out too much and we're fine.

 

[OmegaZero21]

Well, that's kinda what I meant by saying it's futile. Yes, you could add/imply it, but I'm pretty sure it wouldn't satisfy 95% of those, who'd play it for the incest. I mean, it's usually about the taboo, about the secrecy, etc. and if the story doesn't at least partly focus on that, it's just another attribute for some character.
It's a bit like let's say BDSM content or such: Yes, it's easy to add the tag, but if you actually produce content, that's worth having that tag, is another question.

To be fair, Patreon didn't care until their payment processors made them care. It's indeed mainly about for example paypal and stripe, who don't want to support platforms, who allow that kind of content. Hence for example, why subscribestar still doesn't offer paypal payments.

Else one can indeed say, that I'm not aware, that Patreon actually ever banned somebody because of stepcest. They just wouldn't allow it as a solution to get your already banned account back.
It seems like Patreon generally doesn't really care about incest, unless you advertise it on your patreon page. Yet, there's of course always a risk remaining.

Don't know why more people just don't use subscribestar I donate to a few games through there and it's not that bad. If anyone says it's unsafe the same could be said about Patreon and their use of PayPal since PayPal is actually pretty unsafe.

 

[j4yj4m]

Don't know why more people just don't use subscribestar I donate to a few games through there and it's not that bad. If anyone says it's unsafe the same could be said about Patreon and their use of PayPal since PayPal is actually pretty unsafe.

I don't think it's really about safety, but about convenience. There are certainly quite a few people on this planet, who don't own a credit card in the first place and who can't use subscribestar easily. Paypal makes paying for the average user a lot easier and you can be sure that quite a few subscriptions (especially for NSFW games) happen on a whim, rather than after long consideration. With paypal the next payment is like 3 clicks away, that's why it's such an asset...

 

[OmegaZero21]

I don't think it's really about safety, but about convenience. There are certainly quite a few people on this planet, who don't own a credit card in the first place and who can't use subscribestar easily. Paypal makes paying for the average user a lot easier and you can be sure that quite a few subscriptions (especially for NSFW games) happen on a whim, rather than after long consideration. With paypal the next payment is like 3 clicks away, that's why it's such an asset...

Don't have a credit card myself and I was still able to use subscribestar.

 

[Omnikuken]

Don't have a credit card myself and I was still able to use subscribestar.

Not using a credit card doesn't mean Paypal will allow you to use it on Substar

 

[Mario Itsametoo]

It's even worse when it COMPLETELY obvious that roomie and landlady is just a change from sister and mother. Like talking about growing up or how they walk around in their underwear or mention their father. I mean the only real workaround is step sister and step mother. So I don't know where roomie and landlady came into play. And honestly if you use step mom and step sister you only have to mention that once and the rest of the time you should be able to get away with mother and sister. There's plenty of people with step siblings who refer each as full blooded siblings and view each other as such. Hell even a simple mention that they were adopted works as well.

And the problem was very easy. Your parents died, car crash (the usual), friend of your parents takes you in their house. Problem solved. No stupid landlady/landlord

 

[Mario Itsametoo]

I know but the other guy was complaining about people kinkshaming him and calling incest a problem which is how the conversation got derailed.

Now I make myself guilty like most others, not reading the rest of the conversation....

 

[moskyx]

And the problem was very easy. Your parents died, car crash (the usual), friend of your parents takes you in their house. Problem solved. No stupid landlady/landlord

Not solved at all. Those people would be considered as your foster parents -> incest. It's exactly the reason why including a belated birthday orgy in WaL would be a risky move, those whores are MC's 'mothers'.

Seriously, every single option you can imagine has already been tried by actual game developers -and banned by Patreon. If people keep using the landlady bullshit is because it's literally the only option that actually works.

 

[Mario Itsametoo]

Not solved at all. Those people would be considered as your foster parents -> incest. It's exactly the reason why including a belated birthday orgy in WaL would be a risky move, those whores are MC's 'mothers'.

Seriously, every single option you can imagine has already being tried by actual game developers -and banned by Patreon. If people keep using the landlady bullshit is because it's literally the only option that actually works.

Years back I had a landlady, and the only thing, I remember of her, is wanting money, and complaining when old far overdate furniture of her broke in my room. I was so happy to move out and get my own place. And now all those shit games come up with landlord and landlady. It always makes me shiver...

 

[TheDevian]

Years back I had a landlady, and the only thing, I remember of her, is wanting money, and complaining when old far overdate furniture of her broke in my room. I was so happy to move out and get my own place. And now all those shit games come up with landlord and landlady. It always makes me shiver...

The worst example was when your 'landlord' died, and your 'landlady' moved into her sister's place, and she did not become the new landlady...

 

[OmegaZero21]

Not solved at all. Those people would be considered as your foster parents -> incest. It's exactly the reason why including a belated birthday orgy in WaL would be a risky move, those whores are MC's 'mothers'.

Seriously, every single option you can imagine has already being tried by actual game developers -and banned by Patreon. If people keep using the landlady bullshit is because it's literally the only option that actually works.

Dear lord I've said it once and I'll say it again stop using Patreon. Legit it won't be that much longer until you can't even use Landlady. It wasn't that long ago that Patreon went down this road and already they've left almost ZERO room for relation negotiating.

 

[Omnikuken]

Dear lord I've said it once and I'll say it again stop using Patreon. Legit it won't be that much longer until you can't even use Landlady. It wasn't that long ago that Patreon went down this road and already they've left almost ZERO room for relation negotiating.

The wincest ban was in 2017, it's been a while already

 

[j4yj4m]

Dear lord I've said it once and I'll say it again stop using Patreon. Legit it won't be that much longer until you can't even use Landlady. It wasn't that long ago that Patreon went down this road and already they've left almost ZERO room for relation negotiating.

Let's be fair, the crackdown happened in october 2017 and since not much has happened in case of NSFW games, apart from a few very obvious cases.

 

[lazymunchlax]

Now I make myself guilty like most others, not reading the rest of the conversation....

Mostly my bad, I took more out of your comment than it seems you actually meant, so my fault.

The wincest ban was in 2017, it's been a while already

Honestly, my only question is why the payment services even care.
Like, I understood when some Image sharing websites had to remove certain content, I completely get that.
Why does a payment service give a damn about incest though?

 

[Omnikuken]

Mostly my bad, I took more out of your comment than it seems you actually meant, so my fault.


Honestly, my only question is why the payment services even care.
Like, I understood when some Image sharing websites had to remove certain content, I completely get that.
Why does a payment service give a damn about incest though?

Paypal is everywhere-ish, guess the higher-ups care enough about not supporting wincest to have it banned on Patreon. Just like you can't use Paypal for pron sites (most of them anyway, you can bypass it with some processors in Europe)

 

[Dragon59]

Fair enough, granted there are work arounds.

Back to my original message... Somehow I'm feeling doubtful that he used the word problem in reference to Patreons rulings. Comment just screamed to me that he didn't like the fetish and therefore was glad this one was "Safe" from it.

And Patreon and the powers that be are starting to recognize some of the workarounds. For a long time, the patches were officially not created by the developer but by some "Evil Modder." Some developers have gotten heat from Patreon even though the product on Patreon does not have the patch. Some developers have been forced to close their Patreon accounts and move to SubscribeStar (which doesn't use PayPal).

Supporting developers in telling the stories they want to tell is one reason much of my support is on SubscribeStar, not Patreon. All things being equal, I will chose a developer's SS account over their Patreon one.

On the other side, if the developer does not want a certain kink in the game, people insisting it be added is a problem.

I'm not a big fan of the "Incest Everywhere" agenda because I feel that some stories do not call for it. Even though I play and support some of the "incest patched" games (in those cases where it is obviously part of the intended story), the stories I'm working on will have lots of kinks, but incest will not be one of them. A major reason is that

1. There are plenty of incest games (like I said, I play some of them),
2. I honestly see the prevalence incest and step-incest in the adult industry is a way to cut corners in story-telling, and
3. I'm going to use other dramatic elements to create drama and tension. Some of the stories elements will be inspired by my own actual experience with the Kink community. I'm part of the Kink and polyamory communities. I'm not part of the "incest community," so I have no experience to tap into. Adding incest elements would distract from the path of the stories. Also, I was abused by an uncle when I was 5-6 and my housemate/collaborator suffered even greater sexual abuse from family members (as a lifestyle Domme, she refused to do age-play), so we're not going there in our stories.

As such, people trying to insert incest into one of my stories will be perceived as a problem.

EDIT: I need to correct myself. There will be "Wincest" content in my current game, a short contemporary game.

 

[TheDevian]

Dear lord I've said it once and I'll say it again stop using Patreon. Legit it won't be that much longer until you can't even use Landlady. It wasn't that long ago that Patreon went down this road and already they've left almost ZERO room for relation negotiating.

Okay, well, here is the problem, none of the other so called alternatives, get even 1/10 the traffic of Patreon, so if you want to make a living, you don't really have a choice (same with Steam). All devs can deal with that issue the way they choose. If you don't like the way they do it, either don't play, or go make your own game/mod and make it the way you want.
Not everyone wants to deal with the headaches that come along with certain elements, and no one is required to cater to YOUR personal kink/issue, they do no owe you anything. Anyone can make whatever they want, and they have to deal with the consequences.

At least for you, most games have that kink already, you don't need to go forcing it into games that don't have it. You don't see me bitching because almost no games have my kink, and most of the ones who do, do it in a way that turns me off rather than on, by including things I hate that can't be avoided. That, or the have the tag, and it's barely even noticeable.

If that is your only reason for being here, then move on and wait until it's done, we need to see if he even learns who his family is first. Either way, fucking drop it already, it's been days now. The whole thread is going to get nuked at this rate.