- Thread starter wynin
- Start date
- Jun 16, 2018
- 228
- 273
I agree with you on listening to the public opinion. I love this game, but it indeed still needs loads of expansion of content especially.
Here I agree with the developers: this is not the theme of the game.
I would however love to see a separate edition, as I do love BDSM and a bit more hardcore (no poo/pee/blood/animals, but anything else goes).
- Feb 7, 2018
- 125
- 252
I brought Loafy on the team literally two months ago after talking to him extensively and seeing his stuff in this thread. Just becase something isn't considered now it doesn't mean things can't go a certain direction later. We're trying to cover the most broad interests first and if BDSM would be a thing we'd need to discuss internally the best way to go about it. Without going into it I have one idea tied to potions where it could be a thing for example. Though the groundwork for that system needs to be done first.
The team works on different things, different times or amounts or different reasons. I think what you might not consider from an outside perspective is that whilst we encourage people to get involved there's no one on the team that has any obligation to implement what is brought forward. There's hundreds of scrapped, pushed back or sheved ideas even internally. We've tried to communicate this in the thread before. Just because we're not adressing someone specifically it doesn't mean we're not getting ideas, inspiration or even contact them further outside the thread.
Don't feel like you can't give us constructive critisism. I look at anything that involves what I've worked on and usually pass along anything I feel important to mention to other people. A patreon oversight was directly adjusted because of an issue brought up in this thread.
My impression is that the weather outside the window isn't linked to anything else in the game, apart from the full moon aspect. Another example is that it can be pouring with rain outside, but if Genie ventures outside at night the weather is always fine. I can see that it would be a big task to ensure that the weather was always consistent, so it's probably not worth doing.
- Aug 28, 2018
- 1,232
- 788
Then why bother even having the weather outside the window at all, if there are other elements of the game (that have more impact on the play experience) that don't jibe with it? It's just a mild cosmetic element, why go to the trouble of making different weather effects for the window in the first place, if they're not gonna make them align with the dialogue or outfits?
- Dec 9, 2018
- 19
- 53
Let me start off by saying two things:
1 – this comment is from me personally and doesn’t necessarily reflect the thoughts, opinions or feelings of any other member of WT:Silver
2 – I would normally send this kind of thing as a PM, but since the discussion has been initiated and continued here in the thread, this is where I will reply.
Okay @Wyrdo , you’ve been asking for communication, so here you have some. In this comment I will attempt to explain to you why I personally have chosen not to interact with you up to this point.
1 – Your contributions are of limited quality and use.
By your own admission, you have not produced anything original. So far it’s all been edits to existing art. That’s fine in principle, a lot of cool things can be made with good editing of already existing assets. Original work is however of far more interest since almost everyone on the team can do fairly high quality edits.
The next issue is that your edits are quite frankly of rather low quality. Many of the chibis are shrunk in pixel-format, making them jagged as well as decreasing the quality of the lineart. The cuts and pastes are also fairly obvious and stick out. The style of the assets you use, and even their image quality, is not always the same, making for a less clean look. As far as I can tell, you also acknowledge this in your posts, repeatedly saying things along the lines of “those are just quick edits”, “can be made better” or “it’s only for inspiration”. But that is not something I am content with putting into the game. We put in a lot of work to make the game look as good as possible, and I don’t want that to be undermined by placeholders and “quick fixes”.
Most damning of all however is that you’ve used assets from elsewhere (like random google searches) and even a screen of Hogwarts castle that you didn’t even know wasn’t from WT. This is a major no-no for anyone dealing in art online.
So, my personal interest in you as a contributor of art is therefore severely limited.
2 – Your overall approach is suspicious
First off, you came in here and presented a bunch of stuff that we hadn’t asked for, and that you hadn’t discussed with us beforehand. That in itself isn’t bad of course (it’s how a lot of us came into the project), but it isn’t always good either. In some rare cases you get socially awkward people that are desperate to attach themselves to something and just drain you mentally in the process. Many of those people mean well, but just end up being toxic regardless. I’ve been forced to deal with a lot of people like that, so I’ve become very wary of how I interact with people that come to me (or the group I am a part of, as in this case). Perhaps overly so.
I continue to be wary when you repeatedly say that you are presenting your stuff for us to do whatever we want with. But then you seem to get annoyed or disappointed when we do just that. It really puts us in an awkward spot, I feel, where you seem to place some sort of expectation on us that we haven’t accepted or willingly shouldered.
Furthermore, you seem to keep wanting some sort of contact with us, but like we’ve told you, we run our stuff on discord, and you’ve been invited to it. Now, if you do not have the ability to join it, well, I’m sorry to say but that just tough. That is where we operate. F95, /STG, twitter etc. are just extensions where we reach out when we have a new patch, or occasionally reply to bugreports and stuff like that. It’s simply not reasonable that you request for us to make our development process more complicated by coming to you. To the best of my knowledge, you haven’t tried to reach out personally to any of us either, even after being invited to do so. You’ve been explicitly asked by Loafy to give us some suggestion as to how we can discuss things with you outside of F95, but again, no apparent response from you.
There’s also a comment you made about Sad crab essentially telling you to eff off when you wanted to help them. Naturally, it’s entirely possible that Sad crab could be jerks that would say that for no good reason. But it does make me consider the possibility that they may have had a reason for taking that attitude with you and that your description of events is just one side of the real story.
This possibility is made more likely in my opinion after your latest comments. Replying publically in a thread to a PM and quoting the PM is extremely poor form. Basic etiquette is to reply in the way you were contacted. Now, if you can’t reply to PM for some reason (which seems very dubious to me, but might be possible, I don’t know) then writing publically here explaining that and asking for an e-mail address to reply to would be the better move.
Finally, you keep taking about all the stuff you will do, all the original art that you’re about to create, and how you’re going to add so much stuff. So far: nothing except for words and promises. With the possible exception of Mo, I’m the one on the team that been involved with WT-modding the longest and I’ve seen this time and time again, especially on /STG. In my experience, nothing is the most you’ll ever get from people that talk grand like that. My advice is to stop talking, start doing, and then let your work do the talking.
3 – You make false claims. Repeatedly.
You’ve posted here saying that we were working on chibis after you presented yours. At no point did we say that.
You’ve stated that we should release updates as smaller patches that will not break saves and that this should work because most updates are “more tweaks than anything”. Anyone involved with the work can tell you this is nonsense; saves will continue to break for the foreseeable future due to the significant upgrades we make to the code.
You’ve said multiple times that you’re being ignored, or that we aren’t responding. We’ve replied to you six times here in the thread, and one PM. I daresay that is the most we’ve replied to any single individual here. Like I said before, we operate on discord and only occasionally check in on F95.
You claim we are removing Astoria, which as Johnny stated is simply false. She is getting a much needed remodeling like Cho did before her.
4 – You’re antagonistic.
Pretty much all the other points also feed into this point. You’re coming across (to me anyway) as quite passive aggressive in quite a lot of your posts over not using other projects art, or not implementing your art, or not communicating. The way you replied to Merlin was quite prickly as well, certainly not civil.
You’re also accusing us of removing Astoria (which as I said is false) so we can keep “patreon begging”. You complaining about that is extra fun since one of the first things you said in this thread is that you find the fact that someone included Astoria into the game to be sickening, and that you wanted nothing to do with such depravity. Aside from that, calling us shills is a poor idea if you want to associate with us in any way. I personally haven’t taken a dime for anything I’ve made, and your point about “suspicious timing” or whatever is simply non-existent. We’ve been on patreon for ages at this point and have only now gotten around to Astoria, meaning there is no timing to speak of. We’ve been busy doing other stuff before, that’s all.
5 – On our side
I have limited time and energy, and stopping what I do to keep a discussion going with you outside the discord will disrupt my work too much.
We devs aren’t all of one mind, and we live in different timezones. So when you (or anyone else for that matter) write here, I hesitate to reply since I don’t know what the rest of the team thinks and feels. Checking the matter with them properly will take time, and is frankly a bother and a distraction from what otherwise needs to be discussed and get done.
Final words
I don’t know you, and I have zero idea about who you are as a person. All I have to go on is how you’ve presented yourself here, and I hope I’ve explained well enough why I feel that you haven’t made a very good impression, to put it mildly. I don’t know about the rest of the team, but I personally have no desire to cooperate or collaborate with you currently.
I’ve taken over a day out of my time to write this up. I have no intention of dedicating even more time to this matter that could be better spent making art (and I also don’t want to clog the thread with this discussion). If you feel I’ve erred in my assessment of you and want to let me know so, feel free to show me wrong instead of replying to this post. I certainly have neither the intention nor the desire to tell you to stop modding WT. Please keep going if it makes you happy. But until you impress me with your contributions and the way you approach communicating with us, I will keep my distance.
I wish you a good day, and good luck in your future endeavors.
1 – this comment is from me personally and doesn’t necessarily reflect the thoughts, opinions or feelings of any other member of WT:Silver
2 – I would normally send this kind of thing as a PM, but since the discussion has been initiated and continued here in the thread, this is where I will reply.
Okay @Wyrdo , you’ve been asking for communication, so here you have some. In this comment I will attempt to explain to you why I personally have chosen not to interact with you up to this point.
1 – Your contributions are of limited quality and use.
By your own admission, you have not produced anything original. So far it’s all been edits to existing art. That’s fine in principle, a lot of cool things can be made with good editing of already existing assets. Original work is however of far more interest since almost everyone on the team can do fairly high quality edits.
The next issue is that your edits are quite frankly of rather low quality. Many of the chibis are shrunk in pixel-format, making them jagged as well as decreasing the quality of the lineart. The cuts and pastes are also fairly obvious and stick out. The style of the assets you use, and even their image quality, is not always the same, making for a less clean look. As far as I can tell, you also acknowledge this in your posts, repeatedly saying things along the lines of “those are just quick edits”, “can be made better” or “it’s only for inspiration”. But that is not something I am content with putting into the game. We put in a lot of work to make the game look as good as possible, and I don’t want that to be undermined by placeholders and “quick fixes”.
Most damning of all however is that you’ve used assets from elsewhere (like random google searches) and even a screen of Hogwarts castle that you didn’t even know wasn’t from WT. This is a major no-no for anyone dealing in art online.
So, my personal interest in you as a contributor of art is therefore severely limited.
2 – Your overall approach is suspicious
First off, you came in here and presented a bunch of stuff that we hadn’t asked for, and that you hadn’t discussed with us beforehand. That in itself isn’t bad of course (it’s how a lot of us came into the project), but it isn’t always good either. In some rare cases you get socially awkward people that are desperate to attach themselves to something and just drain you mentally in the process. Many of those people mean well, but just end up being toxic regardless. I’ve been forced to deal with a lot of people like that, so I’ve become very wary of how I interact with people that come to me (or the group I am a part of, as in this case). Perhaps overly so.
I continue to be wary when you repeatedly say that you are presenting your stuff for us to do whatever we want with. But then you seem to get annoyed or disappointed when we do just that. It really puts us in an awkward spot, I feel, where you seem to place some sort of expectation on us that we haven’t accepted or willingly shouldered.
Furthermore, you seem to keep wanting some sort of contact with us, but like we’ve told you, we run our stuff on discord, and you’ve been invited to it. Now, if you do not have the ability to join it, well, I’m sorry to say but that just tough. That is where we operate. F95, /STG, twitter etc. are just extensions where we reach out when we have a new patch, or occasionally reply to bugreports and stuff like that. It’s simply not reasonable that you request for us to make our development process more complicated by coming to you. To the best of my knowledge, you haven’t tried to reach out personally to any of us either, even after being invited to do so. You’ve been explicitly asked by Loafy to give us some suggestion as to how we can discuss things with you outside of F95, but again, no apparent response from you.
There’s also a comment you made about Sad crab essentially telling you to eff off when you wanted to help them. Naturally, it’s entirely possible that Sad crab could be jerks that would say that for no good reason. But it does make me consider the possibility that they may have had a reason for taking that attitude with you and that your description of events is just one side of the real story.
This possibility is made more likely in my opinion after your latest comments. Replying publically in a thread to a PM and quoting the PM is extremely poor form. Basic etiquette is to reply in the way you were contacted. Now, if you can’t reply to PM for some reason (which seems very dubious to me, but might be possible, I don’t know) then writing publically here explaining that and asking for an e-mail address to reply to would be the better move.
Finally, you keep taking about all the stuff you will do, all the original art that you’re about to create, and how you’re going to add so much stuff. So far: nothing except for words and promises. With the possible exception of Mo, I’m the one on the team that been involved with WT-modding the longest and I’ve seen this time and time again, especially on /STG. In my experience, nothing is the most you’ll ever get from people that talk grand like that. My advice is to stop talking, start doing, and then let your work do the talking.
3 – You make false claims. Repeatedly.
You’ve posted here saying that we were working on chibis after you presented yours. At no point did we say that.
You’ve stated that we should release updates as smaller patches that will not break saves and that this should work because most updates are “more tweaks than anything”. Anyone involved with the work can tell you this is nonsense; saves will continue to break for the foreseeable future due to the significant upgrades we make to the code.
You’ve said multiple times that you’re being ignored, or that we aren’t responding. We’ve replied to you six times here in the thread, and one PM. I daresay that is the most we’ve replied to any single individual here. Like I said before, we operate on discord and only occasionally check in on F95.
You claim we are removing Astoria, which as Johnny stated is simply false. She is getting a much needed remodeling like Cho did before her.
4 – You’re antagonistic.
Pretty much all the other points also feed into this point. You’re coming across (to me anyway) as quite passive aggressive in quite a lot of your posts over not using other projects art, or not implementing your art, or not communicating. The way you replied to Merlin was quite prickly as well, certainly not civil.
You’re also accusing us of removing Astoria (which as I said is false) so we can keep “patreon begging”. You complaining about that is extra fun since one of the first things you said in this thread is that you find the fact that someone included Astoria into the game to be sickening, and that you wanted nothing to do with such depravity. Aside from that, calling us shills is a poor idea if you want to associate with us in any way. I personally haven’t taken a dime for anything I’ve made, and your point about “suspicious timing” or whatever is simply non-existent. We’ve been on patreon for ages at this point and have only now gotten around to Astoria, meaning there is no timing to speak of. We’ve been busy doing other stuff before, that’s all.
5 – On our side
I have limited time and energy, and stopping what I do to keep a discussion going with you outside the discord will disrupt my work too much.
We devs aren’t all of one mind, and we live in different timezones. So when you (or anyone else for that matter) write here, I hesitate to reply since I don’t know what the rest of the team thinks and feels. Checking the matter with them properly will take time, and is frankly a bother and a distraction from what otherwise needs to be discussed and get done.
Final words
I don’t know you, and I have zero idea about who you are as a person. All I have to go on is how you’ve presented yourself here, and I hope I’ve explained well enough why I feel that you haven’t made a very good impression, to put it mildly. I don’t know about the rest of the team, but I personally have no desire to cooperate or collaborate with you currently.
I’ve taken over a day out of my time to write this up. I have no intention of dedicating even more time to this matter that could be better spent making art (and I also don’t want to clog the thread with this discussion). If you feel I’ve erred in my assessment of you and want to let me know so, feel free to show me wrong instead of replying to this post. I certainly have neither the intention nor the desire to tell you to stop modding WT. Please keep going if it makes you happy. But until you impress me with your contributions and the way you approach communicating with us, I will keep my distance.
I wish you a good day, and good luck in your future endeavors.
- Dec 9, 2018
- 19
- 53
While I'm here, I'll echo a bit of what Johnny said
Open source just means that the code and the contents is there for anyone to fiddle about with. It doesn't mean we are under some obligation to assist people in doing so, or to accept anyone into the dev group. We try to bring people in when we think it would benefit the team and the project, but not everyone fits that bill. Same with opinions and criticism, we try to listen and adjust when we can, but you can't please everyone at the same time. Plus, we have our own visions of what we want to do.
Happened to me too a while back. I *think* loafy fixed it so it should be good in 1.35, but I can't guarantee it.
I don’t know anything about this conflict and i don’t want to know.
I actually don’t know what I’m doing here at 2AM.
But, Dostoevsky - you just demonstrated what ”opening a can of whoopass” means.
Whether deserved or not - I thank you, this is just impressive. Damn...
I actually don’t know what I’m doing here at 2AM.
But, Dostoevsky - you just demonstrated what ”opening a can of whoopass” means.
Whether deserved or not - I thank you, this is just impressive. Damn...
Umm... Why would you think that? The most recent version was released at the end of Jan of this year. On the first page of this thread.
Edit: Unless you meant the original game.
No idea but everyone keeps telling me it updated last 2017 though they could have lied/been misinformed
- Mar 1, 2018
- 2,154
- 2,433
I think that the people who have told you the last update was in 2017 were referring to the original game by Akabur. This thread is for a modified version that expands the game far beyond what Akabur released in his version.
Any way to remove animated map? First few times it looked greate but then its just tedios to wait it unroll every time (
just get the Checkbox on the Map that says "Animation"
- Dec 17, 2017
- 151
- 250
FYI the game is complete. Not abandoned. The creator is still active.
- Feb 10, 2018
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I'd say it does, dude wants to get into the project, but he talks like he is the leader or something. Responding a PM publicly is just really bad decorum, specially when he is wailing at the dev's work, telling them what to do so brashly without even being part of it.