VN Ren'Py A Wife and Mother [v0.211] [Lust & Passion]

[yihman1]

Compare the full package, L&P's is making a VN disguised as a game. DPC is making an actual game. This is why one has 10x more people suporting his project than the other.
DPC has better story, better game, plenty of animations, slightly less quality renders but I think we can all agree that L&P is now at a diminsihing returns point in terms of Render Quality / Development time.
Almost everyone (except the brain dead "liking" his every rant) would agree that theres no point in so much render quality if its making him spend 4-6 more weeks in each update.

So between both its a completely different ball park. Want to compare L&P? Compare him with someone like Pegasus Smith. It would be a more accurate comparison.

One person's success is not another person's failure. If DPK was making a million dollars or zero dollars it would not negatively or positively change anything with L&P at all.

I enjoy both of their games, but it's not cool to mock someone with someone else being more successful than them. L&P isn't exactly a failure when it comes to game development. He probably has more supporters than 99% of devs. Jeff Bezos makes more money than everyone in this forum combined, but that doesn't make him better than anyone.

As for him spending extra time instead of pumping it out faster... That's called being a "perfectionist". A lot of great artists do that. That's how he works it's his business not yours.

Probably the best comparison for L&P isn't DPK or Pegasus Smith. Best comparison would be StoperArt. JOHN is probably the closest game in comparison to AWAM out of any game I have seen.

What's your beef with L&P anyhow?

 

[Dr.SigmundFap]

This point is not fair with LP.
Most adult games have the same plot. Even movies of hollywood share the case. You cant expect something so unique that only you has. The truth of the matter is, whatever you think you are the first one to make it, there was someone else did it long time ago

Yes, most adult games and movies do share the same plot. But the problem here is, IMO, Do you need the same plot/theme shared with 3+ events? An example of this is Blackmail and Sex-Ed.

Blackmail:

1. Mr. Bennett - Using Dylan's grades to his advantage with Sophia.
2. Aiden - Threating Dylan to get what he wants out of Sophia.
3. Don Morello - Possible Blackmail, based on reader interruption, but L&P said this isn't Blackmail. I guess you can look at it as a debt payment.

Sex-Ed:

1. Dylan - The main plot to advance with Sophia.
2. Ellie - During the shower scene, Sophia explains her thoughts on finding the right partner with Ellie and teaches Ellie how to find "The Sweet Spot." She may use this going forward to advance the sexual side, like Dylan.
3. The 2nd Side Job - I'm not even going to touch this.

Old Men:

1. Postman: I don't know what's going to happen here... So far, he's been delivering the mail.
2. The 1st Side Job - Self-explanatory. Nursing Home.

The lesbian line is quite extensive as well. Again, I don't mind the different themes, but how many scenarios of the same themes do you need?

 

[r0rschack]

that is def unique of L&P

Absolutely not, my boii George Costanza did it in Seinfeld!!!

 

[Dr.SigmundFap]

I would say that blackmail only exists in the Aiden route now. As you mentioned Morello is not a blackmail path and Bennett has been cut short. From L&P's words he is probably getting one or two more optional events and that's the end.

As for the sex ed theme Dylan js the primarily the one. With Ellie it was used just once till now, so classifying it is the same theme isn't right at present. And the 2nd side job is sex ed but the way I expect the theme to move isn't anything like Dylan. Would need more events to see where that is going.

The old men only exists on the nursing home route. Nothing has happened with the mailman,so there exists no route as of now. Even in future I believe he will only get 1 or 2 events in total.

The duration of the event is not the point. The point is the themes were used over multiple scenarios. But since you brought up time, as a topic of the scenes, we have the one-and-done issue. If the scenes are that short, then why have it at all? Corruption Points? As I said, you can tell the story with a hand full of people, ex. 20. You don't need 79+ people to tell a good story, and if a majority of them will have a 1, 2, or 3 scenes for corruption points, then bounce out, IMO, that is a waste of time and resources.

I would keep the mailman in mind. Considering that L&P said the first male scene was to be with someone unexpected, and since the mailman is just delivering the mail each day, I guess he would be up there on the list.

 

[maybes4]

Yes, most adult games and movies do share the same plot. But the problem here is, IMO, Do you need the same plot/theme shared with 3+ events? An example of this is Blackmail and Sex-Ed.

Blackmail:

1. Mr. Bennett - Using Dylan's grades to his advantage with Sophia.
2. Aiden - Threating Dylan to get what he wants out of Sophia.
3. Don Morello - Possible Blackmail, based on reader interruption, but L&P said this isn't Blackmail. I guess you can look at it as a debt payment.

Sex-Ed:

1. Dylan - The main plot to advance with Sophia.
2. Ellie - During the shower scene, Sophia explains her thoughts on finding the right partner with Ellie and teaches Ellie how to find "The Sweet Spot." She may use this going forward to advance the sexual side, like Dylan.
3. The 2nd Side Job - I'm not even going to touch this.

Old Men:

1. Postman: I don't know what's going to happen here... So far, he's been delivering the mail.
2. The 1st Side Job - Self-explanatory. Nursing Home.

The lesbian line is quite extensive as well. Again, I don't mind the different themes, but how many scenarios of the same themes do you need?

The same theme but different approaches, characters, stories. I think this is the core reason that makes people love this game

 

[xxxorro]

I would keep the mailman in mind. Considering that L&P said the first male scene was to be with someone unexpected, and since the mailman is just delivering the mail each day, I guess he would be up there on the list.

While it's true that the postman always rings twice and that would be a nice wink at the movie, once again he said **something** no one will expect and not someone. It's an old quote, maybe he already changed the story, maybe it will really be the postman, we don't know. But that's not what he said in that quote:

Well, closest to that is of course still with the husband. I mean they are married and the others need an approach first. After all, Sophia is everything but a slut! Something definitely really "wild" what is not with the husband is planned the first time for playable day 16 and it will be something no one will definitely expect at the moment! I think it's one of the highlights in the story. Before, there will be a lot of other hot scenes and much more lucid approaches which are not "casual events"! As far as I can tell now, there won't even be such "casual events" anymore.

It's just to avoid that this "fake news" spread once again

And just to come back to those "lucid approaches", the unexpected thing seems really something that will challenge the usual rationality with which Sophia kind of "defuse" the situations that happened so far.
Unless it hints at Sophia being in an altered state, e.g. drunk, but, personally, I really hope it's not the case, it would feel like a cheap shortcut IMO.

 

[maybes4]

Like i once said before, LP is really susceptible to criticism
I'm not saying who is right or wrong, but lets put the dissent in a holistic way.

From the fan of the game's perspective, they have the right to speak, especially ones pay LP on patreon.
I know we are all tired of waiting, that the development process is so slow, that someone or dev here can create render with the same quality in shorter length. But lets no be so harsh on LP guys. That you are fast doesn't mean i have to be as fast as you. Rockstar take 5 years to release an AAA game while Ubisoft just needs one, do you consider Rockstar's product as garbage? This is the same case goes for the comparison between LP and other devs. Its not only about render but maybe the story as well. Or maybe LP is busy doing something in real life, we don't know. At least don't judge him by his process compared to other games. Super unfair.

Now imagine you are LP, give all of yourself over to do AWAM, then you get criticized by an anonymous member on a forum, of course you would be pissed off. But I have to agree that his way to tackle dissent is horrible. He shoulda ignored the troll, paying more attention to the real fans instead.
You can complain, just please try keeping it civil!

 

[maybes4]

A

While it's true that the postman always rings twice and that would be a nice wink to the movie, once again he said **something** no one will expect and not someone. It's an old quote, maybe he already changed the story, maybe it will really be the postman, we don't know. But that's not what he said in that quote:



It's just to avoid that this "fake news" spread once again

And just to come back to those "lucid approaches", the unexpected thing seems really something that will challenge the usual rationality with which Sophia kind of "defuse" the situations that happened so far.
Unless it hints at Sophia being in an altered state, e.g. drunk, but, personally, I really hope it's not the case, it would feel like a cheap shortcut IMO.

You can say that again. If the first time Sophia has sex with a stranger is because she is drunk, it would be a lazy approach

 

[r0rschack]

A

You can say that again. If the first time Sophia has sex with a stranger is because she is drunk, it would be a lazy approach

I feel like that would be a very realistic approach though, it is quite common for people to cheat on their spouses when drunk.

 

[Deleted member 3325933]

L&P holy shit you have the most toxic fanbase ever.

I blame it on the black hole. The gravity is so irresistible, especially inside the event horizon, that none of the trolls can break away. They just keep circling faster and faster as they are drawn closer to the center.

 

[Deleted member 3325933]

I would say that blackmail only exists in the Aiden route now. As you mentioned Morello is not a blackmail path and Bennett has been cut short. From L&P's words he is probably getting one or two more optional events and that's the end.

As for the sex ed theme Dylan js the primarily the one. With Ellie it was used just once till now, so classifying it is the same theme isn't right at present. And the 2nd side job is sex ed but the way I expect the theme to move isn't anything like Dylan. Would need more events to see where that is going.

The old men only exists on the nursing home route. Nothing has happened with the mailman,so there exists no route as of now. Even in future I believe he will only get 1 or 2 events in total.

I lean heavily toward Dr.Fapalot on this. His points are still valid. It is not the exact same presentation but, the same theme, reason, or cause. I know you appreciate the nuances in variation of themes that L&P is able to bring to the story. That does not change the underlying element. The different stories can stand on their own but, they are the same underneath.

 

[Deleted member 3325933]

Absolutely not, my boii George Costanza did it in Seinfeld!!!

Wait! Wasn't Seinfeld the show that was actually never really a show? It was just a vehicle to get out Jerry's monologues. Hmmm, how does this relate to AWAM, to L&P? I think you may be on to something. I don't know what but, Yeah! That's the ticket!

 

[nexer]

OK, BaDik is a big game

Here, bad topology


Here, UV needs more work



What is this, what does she want to do with this bottle? Ifs he wants to drink out of the bottle, the position's weird.



the width of the doors is not for normal people.


Except characters, all is base resolution, no Normal map, No Bump, ....





Look at this one, no reflexion



And L&P.


L&P needs more time for his renders, a lot more.



I think DPC uses a lot: Maya/3dsMax/Blender and knows how to work well with it.

 

[sophpa]

Yes, most adult games and movies do share the same plot. But the problem here is, IMO, Do you need the same plot/theme shared with 3+ events? An example of this is Blackmail and Sex-Ed.

Blackmail:

1. Mr. Bennett - Using Dylan's grades to his advantage with Sophia.
2. Aiden - Threating Dylan to get what he wants out of Sophia.
3. Don Morello - Possible Blackmail, based on reader interruption, but L&P said this isn't Blackmail. I guess you can look at it as a debt payment.

Sex-Ed:

1. Dylan - The main plot to advance with Sophia.
2. Ellie - During the shower scene, Sophia explains her thoughts on finding the right partner with Ellie and teaches Ellie how to find "The Sweet Spot." She may use this going forward to advance the sexual side, like Dylan.
3. The 2nd Side Job - I'm not even going to touch this.

Old Men:

1. Postman: I don't know what's going to happen here... So far, he's been delivering the mail.
2. The 1st Side Job - Self-explanatory. Nursing Home.

The lesbian line is quite extensive as well. Again, I don't mind the different themes, but how many scenarios of the same themes do you need?

In the end it`s all will finish as usual:
1. Bennett will fuck Sophia (so hard i think, maybe even sadistic)
2. Aiden will fuck Sophia (maybe gangbang with his friends too)
3. Don Morello will fuck Sophia after/with his brother (??)
4. Dylan will fuck Sophia (mom-son staff, nothing fantastic for adult games)
5. Ellie will fuck Logan with Sophia (i don`t believe that L&P so predictable and will show to us usual lesbian sex between Sophia and Ellie)
6. Guys from 2nd Side Job also will fuck Sophia (gangbang). And I think that their mom actually will take part in this too after she saw Sophia`s sex with them or after intimate dialogue with her
7. Postman will not get sex with Sophia (even if she will be slutty to the core at this time). I think we must expectate just teasing, tits/ass flashing, kisses, handjob or blowjob and that`s all.
8. Old mans from 1st Side Job maybe would fuck Sophia, if she bring them viagra, L&P made it clear in the last update that their members aren`t working already, so except sexy cosplay (nurse), nude bathing with old gentlemans, tits/pussy touching or even sucking, handjob/blowjob we will not get anything.
9. Thugs from subway are working on Don Morello i think or on his competitor, mafia boss always have competitors from another family, and i`m not about Dominic Toretto`s family. If thugs are working on another mafia boss that`s will be already different route with +1 or 2 new characters, so thugs i think will not get Sophia`s ass. Maybe Don Morello after information about unlucky Sophia`s rape will order to find this idiots and torture them to death, and after this Sophia will be more loyal to Morello`s brothers. And another thought about this, Sophia will seduce mafia boss from another family because this is Morello`s request and Sophia still will have a debt.

 

[DIRTY FILTHY Animal]

Like i once said before, LP is really susceptible to criticism
I'm not saying who is right or wrong, but lets put the dissent in a holistic way.

From the fan of the game's perspective, they have the right to speak, especially ones pay LP on patreon.
I know we are all tired of waiting, that the development process is so slow, that someone or dev here can create render with the same quality in shorter length. But lets no be so harsh on LP guys. That you are fast doesn't mean i have to be as fast as you. Rockstar take 5 years to release an AAA game while Ubisoft just needs one, do you consider Rockstar's product as garbage? This is the same case goes for the comparison between LP and other devs. Its not only about render but maybe the story as well. Or maybe LP is busy doing something in real life, we don't know. At least don't judge him by his process compared to other games. Super unfair.

Now imagine you are LP, give all of yourself over to do AWAM, then you get criticized by an anonymous member on a forum, of course you would be pissed off. But I have to agree that his way to tackle dissent is horrible. He shoulda ignored the troll, paying more attention to the real fans instead.
You can complain, just please try keeping it civil!

Yeah because L&P really kept it civil. He acted like a baby with a full diaper & would not let it go. The man child cannot take constructive criticism at all

 

[Deleted member 3966947]

OK, BaDik is a big game

Here, bad topology

Here, UV needs more work

What is this, what does she want to do with this bottle? Ifs he wants to drink out of the bottle, the position's weird.

the width of the doors is not for normal people.

Except characters, all is base resolution, no Normal map, No Bump, ....

Look at this one, no reflexion

L&P needs more time for his renders, a lot more.

I think DPC uses a lot: Maya/3dsMax/Blender and knows how to work well with it.

You have nice findings there. But I think DPC's method is more effective practically, considering his speedy updates. And you seem to find out his formula. How did you figure out DPC uses Maya/3dsMax/Blender?

 

[L&P's Father-in-Law]

Compare this two
View attachment 1447685

This one is Badik ep7
View attachment 1447686

Now play the game and see what an adult game actually is.

 

[nexer]

You have nice findings there. But I think DPC's method is more effective practically, considering his speedy updates. And you seem to find out his formula. How did you figure out DPC uses Maya/3dsMax/Blender?

This one, someone selected the character mesh and scaled it. He painted using a noise. Big diff between character resolution and the tennis wristbands resolution. If I buy a tennis wristbands I want a Normal Map too.

Here, these shadow peaks from place to place means that he used a low poly mesh.

 

[nexer]

DPC has launched 1 actual game and like more than half of the second while L&P has done what? 20% of his?
Comparing them is offensive to DPC. DPC is smart enough to realize going overboard on renders only a fraction of his members will care about is diminishing returns so he launches huge chapters at a nice pace while L&P is still picking which colored pigeon he's going to choose.

OK, maybe I can make a porn game with renders using Filament and who knows, make more money than DPC.
Good to know

 

[Leldorin]

Yes, most adult games and movies do share the same plot. But the problem here is, IMO, Do you need the same plot/theme shared with 3+ events? An example of this is Blackmail and Sex-Ed.

Blackmail:

1. Mr. Bennett - Using Dylan's grades to his advantage with Sophia.
2. Aiden - Threating Dylan to get what he wants out of Sophia.
3. Don Morello - Possible Blackmail, based on reader interruption, but L&P said this isn't Blackmail. I guess you can look at it as a debt payment.

Sex-Ed:

1. Dylan - The main plot to advance with Sophia.
2. Ellie - During the shower scene, Sophia explains her thoughts on finding the right partner with Ellie and teaches Ellie how to find "The Sweet Spot." She may use this going forward to advance the sexual side, like Dylan.
3. The 2nd Side Job - I'm not even going to touch this.

Old Men:

1. Postman: I don't know what's going to happen here... So far, he's been delivering the mail.
2. The 1st Side Job - Self-explanatory. Nursing Home.

The lesbian line is quite extensive as well. Again, I don't mind the different themes, but how many scenarios of the same themes do you need?

There’s a number of characters that could be “fused” in my opinion:
Alyssa/Amber
Sam/Zac
Vicky /Nathalie
Janitor/bennet
Oldmen/mail man
Subway thugs/homeless drunks
Carl/mr morello.
Etc, etc...

For example, what’s the point of Amber in the story? She’s not a love/sex interest for Sophia.
She’s just there for a side-storyline for Dylan when he comes back from boarding school every weekend (every 5 years in real life, at least...).

What is Zac, if not a subdued version of Sam?
Even their two last events were similar:
-Massaging Sophia shoulders
-A “what if” scenario
-Sophia in teasing mode

We even have a similar situation with Neil and Alyssa previous boyfriend of being 2 abusive people.

We could have the same situation that happens in the Neil event, but instead of nothing resulting of it (literally), here Amber/Alyssa would be in the event, witnessing what Neil did to Sophia. This would be the end of Neill as he would be kicked out of the house, ending in the same way where we’re at in the game right now:
-Neil was a one and only event and has been absent since then even narratively/plot wise speaking.
-Alyssa boyfriend was mostly a Neil that has been removed before the storyline.

Carl/don morello are basically rich guys that serves as plot devices that will help Sophia to get out of problematic situations.

The only interesting part of the janitor character was that he is a father that hasn’t seen is kids for four years and that Sophia empathized with him in that moment.
Instead of having 2 side characters, why not adding this background to Bennet, adding more depth to this character.


As you said we don’t need to explore the same theme/trope with slightly different characters.
In the same way that we don’t need 35 or I don’t know how many characters, to explore 35 themes/trope.

Not every character needs to be super profound with a deep backstory.
For example, I don’t need more background for Aiden than what has been given in the game to understand is attitude in life (basically feeling intouchable).

But some of the side-characters (and main ones) would benefit from being more fleshed out instead of being just kink/cliche/trope seen in every other corruption game and being transposed to the “realistic world” of awam.