VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.10.1] [DrPinkCake]

[Holy Bacchus]

The key difference in that case is that he felt personally betrayed by her actions. It wasn't just ditching the DIKs, it was the fact that she couldn't even be bothered to admit she was doing it.

That's the sort of thing I think it would take to turn Tommy's ambient assholeishness into a genuine hatred of the PC. But it can't happen until Tommy cares about the PC in the first case.

Tommy could go against the MC at any time, it doesn't have to be the result of him feeling betrayed after growing to care about him. It's far more likely that he'd go against the MC precisely because he doesn't care about him.

Tommy and the MC are still getting to know each other, sussing each other out, and whilst so far the MC has done/can have done things that might endear him to Tommy, there's a lot of potential for the MC to do things/have done things that get under Tommy's skin and piss him off because he's not the typical DIK (frat brother, not personality type). The whole situation with Rusty's Dad is a big thing, as it could see the MC take on a more important role and make Tommy feel like he's lost some power in the group, with everybody following the MC's lead and not his. This and other things could fuel Tommy's dislike of the MC as he'll see him as less of a "bro" and more of an interloper, a disruptor who's thrown his world upside down.

It's far easier to imagine Tommy doing something vindictive to try and hurt the MC because he doesn't like him, than it is to imagine Tommy getting his feelings hurt because he grew to care about him and would feel betrayed by him.

 

[ename144]

Tommy could go against the MC at any time, it doesn't have to be the result of him feeling betrayed after growing to care about him. It's far more likely that he'd go against the MC precisely because he doesn't care about him.

Tommy and the MC are still getting to know each other, sussing each other out, and whilst so far the MC has done/can have done things that might endear him to Tommy, there's a lot of potential for the MC to do things/have done things that get under Tommy's skin and piss him off because he's not the typical DIK (frat brother, not personality type). The whole situation with Rusty's Dad is a big thing, as it could see the MC take on a more important role and make Tommy feel like he's lost some power in the group, with everybody following the MC's lead and not his. This and other things could fuel Tommy's dislike of the MC as he'll see him as less of a "bro" and more of an interloper, a disruptor who's thrown his world upside down.

It's far easier to imagine Tommy doing something vindictive to try and hurt the MC because he doesn't like him, than it is to imagine Tommy getting his feelings hurt because he grew to care about him and would feel betrayed by him.

No, it really isn't.

Tommy just isn't this vindictive, driven antagonist you're making him out to be. He's a whiny asshole with simple urges and a short attention span. If the MC does something to piss him off, Tommy will yell about it. If the MC keeps pissing Tommy off, he'll keep yelling about it, and try to mock or belittle the MC when possible. And after the MC has stopped pissing him off, Tommy will sulk for a while then go snort, screw, or whine about something else.

Tommy far is lazier than he is vengeful.

 

[Cabin Fever]

By mid October I was saying 2nd half of October or 2nd week ish and by early I mean 1st week of October

That's an interesting way to count, because by any logical counting method, a month is 4 weeks + a few days, and the 2nd week of a month is always in the 1st half of the month.

 

[KomaFNinetyFive]

Loved playing this game, I enjoy the mini games, they're an interesting way to interact with the story! I couldn't sleep because I wanted to as far as I could. I'm so stuck in between choosing Josy, Maya, Jill, Bella, and Sage. I love them all.

 

[ename144]

Personally, I think this is how the affinity of each girl differentiates:

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That looks about right to me, though I'll be curious to see if Jill continues to accept those filthy neutrals as time goes on.

The only thing I'd disagree with is KRJ. I suspect she's on an entirely different axis that deals with noise and animals. Sadly, the MC doesn't get many opportunities to rack up points on that scale.

EDIT: Actually, one other potential change: I think Bella is likely more tolerant of mildly DIKish antics than it might first appear.

 

[Roelandt]

No, it really isn't.

Tommy just isn't this vindictive, driven antagonist you're making him out to be. He's a whiny asshole with simple urges and a short attention span. If the MC does something to piss him off, Tommy will yell about it. If the MC keeps pissing Tommy off, he'll keep yelling about it, and try to mock or belittle the MC when possible. And after the MC has stopped pissing him off, Tommy will sulk for a while then go snort, screw, or whine about something else.

Tommy far is lazier than he is vengeful.

Not sure I agree there, ename144.

How do you know "Tommy just isn't this vindictive, driven antagonist"?

Every indication so far is that he is. He's a petty, morally bankrupt, self-centered jerk. I see nothing to indicate he's a secretly friendly beneath the attitude with a short attention span (not sure where you got his attention deficit from...please clarify). Certainly none but negative traits you are ascribing to him have been displayed or hinted at anywhere in the story's clear depiction of the character as Doc has written into the story.

The ending of Episode 5, along with other scenes earlier, suggests the possibility that Tommy might be a problem, not only for the MC, but the DIKs. While it is certainly possible that he will, as Rusty indicated, "come around," there is nothing from the narrative to suggest he will.

As we get closer to the end of the story...lets assume that Episode 6 is the kick off for the climax of the story (Doc did say 6 will be much longer than any other episode to date). If that's the case, then the "conflict" for the "protagonist" has to escalate for storytelling purposes. From a storytelling standpoint, adding Tommy to the MC's problems seems quite likely given that Doc has taken pains to paint the guy as an antagonist so far, as bad or worse than Quinn. Particularly since the main conflict for the character (Hell Week) is now over. That conflict is resolved. An offended Tommy, pissed at the upstart newbie MC trying to take his place, is a reasonable and likely replacement for the Hell Week conflict.

Tommy has never been in any way an ally of the MC. I expect him to be a problem. If not, that would be a missed storytelling opportunity.

 

[MyNameIsAssEater69]

That's an interesting way to count, because by any logical counting method, a month is 4 weeks + a few days, and the 2nd week of a month is always in the 1st half of the month.

You don’t gotta do me like that you know what I meant by 2nd week/half of October atleast

 

[felicemastronzo]

Not sure I agree there, ename144.

How do you know "Tommy just isn't this vindictive, driven antagonist"?

Every indication so far is that he is. He's a petty, morally bankrupt, self-centered jerk. I see nothing to indicate he's a secretly friendly beneath the attitude with a short attention span (not sure where you got his attention deficit from...please clarify). Certainly none but negative traits you are ascribing to him have been displayed or hinted at anywhere in the story's clear depiction of the character as Doc has written into the story.

The ending of Episode 5, along with other scenes earlier, suggests the possibility that Tommy might be a problem, not only for the MC, but the DIKs. While it is certainly possible that he will, as Rusty indicated, "come around," there is nothing from the narrative to suggest he will.

As we get closer to the end of the story...lets assume that Episode 6 is the kick off for the climax of the story (Doc did say 6 will be much longer than any other episode to date). If that's the case, then the "conflict" for the "protagonist" has to escalate for storytelling purposes. From a storytelling standpoint, adding Tommy to the MC's problems seems quite likely given that Doc has taken pains to paint the guy as an antagonist so far, as bad or worse than Quinn. Particularly since the main conflict for the character (Hell Week) is now over. That conflict is resolved. An offended Tommy, pissed at the upstart newbie MC trying to take his place, is a reasonable and likely replacement for the Hell Week conflict.

Tommy has never been in any way an ally of the MC. I expect him to be a problem. If not, that would be a missed storytelling opportunity.

the problem with Tommy is that almost everything he shows us is negative: he has a bad temper, he doesn't appear to be a good friend or a good deputy to Rusty, whom he only seems to take advantage of economically.

but in the end in the actions he has no great faults, he is a dog that barks but does not bite, he did it towards Josy for example, a lot of talk but in the end no action against his stepsister.
he has to do with Quinn, but there too a lot of chatter, a lot of private meetings, but in the end he is out of her business.

we are on the alert and expect the worst from him, but he may also continue to bark

 

[Tserriednich'sNen]

Not sure I agree there, ename144.

How do you know "Tommy just isn't this vindictive, driven antagonist"?

Every indication so far is that he is. He's a petty, morally bankrupt, self-centered jerk. I see nothing to indicate he's a secretly friendly beneath the attitude with a short attention span (not sure where you got his attention deficit from...please clarify). Certainly none but negative traits you are ascribing to him have been displayed or hinted at anywhere in the story's clear depiction of the character as Doc has written into the story.

The ending of Episode 5, along with other scenes earlier, suggests the possibility that Tommy might be a problem, not only for the MC, but the DIKs. While it is certainly possible that he will, as Rusty indicated, "come around," there is nothing from the narrative to suggest he will.

As we get closer to the end of the story...lets assume that Episode 6 is the kick off for the climax of the story (Doc did say 6 will be much longer than any other episode to date). If that's the case, then the "conflict" for the "protagonist" has to escalate for storytelling purposes. From a storytelling standpoint, adding Tommy to the MC's problems seems quite likely given that Doc has taken pains to paint the guy as an antagonist so far, as bad or worse than Quinn. Particularly since the main conflict for the character (Hell Week) is now over. That conflict is resolved. An offended Tommy, pissed at the upstart newbie MC trying to take his place, is a reasonable and likely replacement for the Hell Week conflict.

Tommy has never been in any way an ally of the MC. I expect him to be a problem. If not, that would be a missed storytelling opportunity.

If you truly think that then you haven't been paying attention to Tommy's character like at all. 5 episodes in and if there's just one thing Tommy genuinely gives a fuck about it's the DIK's and their traditions. We've been consistently shown that since episode 1. We're all aware of Tommy's endless list of reasons that him unlikable shit person but like the people who MC talks to says-Tommy getting upset and lashing out isn't anything new he'll get over it and come around like Rusty states, he doesn't have another choice and he knows that.

Tommy going against the MC and the rest of the DIK's wouldn't be a "missed storytelling opportunity." it'd be a bizzare plot hole that would go against his character.

I personally don't view Tommy as an antagonist like some do but more of an annoying thorn on MC's side.

 

[necrothef]

Tommy is to weak (emotional) to be an antagonist...

 

[BenMeiffert]

Loved playing this game, I enjoy the mini games, they're an interesting way to interact with the story! I couldn't sleep because I wanted to as far as I could. I'm so stuck in between choosing Josy, Maya, Jill, Bella, and Sage. I love them all.

Don't you love Quinn, Riona, Camilla, Mona, Sarah, Melanie, Heather, Elena, Jade, Cathy, Envy, Lily, Rose, Brandy, Arieth, Sally and KRJ ??? maybe I forget Dany, Minny and Wendy...

 

[KomaFNinetyFive]

Don't you love Quinn, Riona, Camilla, Mona, Sarah, Melanie, Heather, Elena, Jade, Cathy, Envy, Lily, Rose, Brandy, Arieth, Sally and KRJ ??? maybe I forget Dany, Minny and Wendy...

Haha I'm going through the game again and definitely love Riona, Camilla, Mona, Envy, Lily, Mona, Sarah, Mel.... there's so many of them to love!

 

[mpa71]

New Dr.PinkCake full avatar on Discord!

Previously (Post-EP5)

 

[felicemastronzo]

I'll say a blasphemy: but I like the close-ups that I find in the "Artwork" section more than the originals

 

[Arigon]

DPC
you have done an amazing job on this project. I liked your first project until the choices at the end. I am a total fan, but I am also concerned that you might take this project in a direction that might be too similar to Acting Lessons. Please do not reduce Bella to the same position as Leah. Please do not veer into incest on Jill. Granted Incest did not appear in AL, but you gave us the no good choice ending, basically forced. It is your project, your choice. I implore you to not take the paths I mentioned above.
Respectfully
Chuck

 

[lemonfreak]

Tommy is to weak (emotional) to be an antagonist...

Far from it, do you imagine only a Billy Big Bollocks could go to the college administrators with the footage of MC and Jade? That's a bitch move which is exactly what I expect someone tp Tommy to do.

I understand not everyone will have had that scene (or showed it if the did), the footage is just one example of what a weak antagonist would do.

 

[Ragnar]

Tommy is to weak (emotional) to be an antagonist...

He's an egomaniac and more importantly a junkie, junkies are unpredictable and dangerous.

 

[felicemastronzo]

Far from it, do you imagine only a Billy Big Bollocks could go to the college administrators with the footage of MC and Jade? That's a bitch move which is exactly what I expect someone tp Tommy to do.

I understand not everyone will have had that scene (or showed it if the did), the footage is just one example of what a weak antagonist would do.

his character weakness, let's call it insecurity, could become the reason why Tommy could do nonsense at MC's expense

for fear of losing the leadership of the DIKs for example (at this moment this seems to me the only possible area of conflict between the two, Josy would be more of a nuisance than anything else for Tommy)

 

[Cigar-Ferras]

He's an egomaniac and more importantly a junkie, junkies are unpredictable and dangerous.

Hmm, depends on how you define "Junkie". I've met plenty of people in my life that used various drugs of different classes and strengths that kept their lives and social circles together just fine. (I may not have agreed but it's their life) I'd be more inclined to say a Junkie is someone that would pretty much be willing to do just about anything to get their next fix. Tommy is volatile though which may make him unpredictable.

 

[Ragnar]

Hmm, depends on how you define "Junkie". I've met plenty of people in my life that used various drugs of different classes and strengths that kept their lives and social circles together just fine. (I may not have agreed but it's their life) I'd be more inclined to say a Junkie is someone that would pretty much be willing to do just about anything to get their next fix. Tommy is volatile though which may make him unpredictable.

So far we have seen him smoking pot and getting shots of some kind of injectable, so polydrug and hard drugs, he's not just taking some beers or smoking pot after work.
I think in the flashback he looks stronger or healthier, in the present timeline he looks like a short fuse junkie and that means problems.