VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.11.1] [DrPinkCake]

[Wizard_Shiryuu]

in fact it is a consolation ending.
I don't think a fan of another character (Jade, Riona, Quinn ...) would be really satisfied with a final render of MC and her girl watching the sunset ....

an ending without a route loses all its importance

Yeah, I agree. (Well, not a final one, at least a full scene or something ). But for now it seems there kind of is a route for some seconday girls, Camila, maybe Riona, Quinn... From there to a full route there isn't much left. Heck, even a Nicole route seems plausible at some point. Maybe thats going too wide, but damn that would be great.

 

[Malicre]

It would be great if the teachers get their own ending. Jade has more character development than Jill so far in my opinion.

100% agree.

I think Jade has had more of a relationship with the mc then any of the girls at this point and i like the way they are together. The scene with them in the bath relaxing and talking about life was one of the better relationship moments in the entire game.

 

[moskyx]

unfortunately that scene, although it is so important and is practically the closure of the first part of the story, does not always work.
it is fully consistent and credible only if Mc is involved with both girls and if he has the right affinity to see his proposal accepted

I try to explain myself:
1) if MC is only involved with one of the two girls everything they say is forced enough, for example if MC is only interested in Maya (and therefore does not stay with Josy to sleep after the date) it does not make sense to ask Josy to follow her heart and then eventually propose to be more than friends (a proposal that will rightly be rejected, but it shouldn't have been) at the limit Mc should have asked Maya to choose, and after Maya's refusal to accept to remain friends. but this situation is probably a problem for a very limited number of paths

2) supposing MC is involved with both girls, does it make sense that acceptance or rejection of his proposal is related to his affinity? the 2 girls like MC with that "affinity", but then that same affinity makes him unreliable and risky to continue a relationship.. (not considering that this affinity is determined by isolated gestures that have practically nothing to do with the two girls). there is a sort of moral judgment on MC, then strengthened by the fact that once his proposal is refused in many paths he will go to have sex with Jade, as if to show that the choice of the girls is correct .. this is instead a problem that many more players encounter

3) after the MC proposal is rejected, the "let's be friends" safety net goes on. but it's a kind of armed truce that none of the 3 believes, both Josy and Maya question her at the first opportunity

Not to mention that if your MC decides to be just friends, when Josy and Maya tell him later on they still have feelings for him, he starts to consider things again. Which in my opinion is the biggest flaw of all this game. If I've chosen to be friends is because that's the closest way to tell them to fuck off, but it seems that's impossible to do so far, even though this would have been a perfect point to allow it. So I guess they are too much important for the upcoming story and the MC can't part ways with them even in an amicable way, and in that case I would have preferred not to being able to make such a 'fake' decision which seemed quite important. Now, I understand this is still an early point of the story and maybe that choice is only the key to pursue 1 on 1 relationships with them. We'll see.

Regarding drama, bad endings and shit hitting the fan, just remember that, until Ep5, the only bad-smelling thing in AL was Melissa's abussive step-father. Besides that, it was a fairly light-hearted game, even the initial robbery was quickly forgotten as a potential source of conflict. I'll say it again, DPC's disclaimer the first time you run the game can't be there just for presenting us Jill. Things are gonna go south, probably affecting different characters in different ways according to our affinity with them. I guess we still don't know which would be the triggering event, but Quinn's shenanigans can easily be a source of serious problems for most of our LIs, even Jill as she's living in that frat house and could get caught in the crossed fire. Bella is the only one who I can't see fitting in that story arch, but she is misterious enough to not ruling her out completely.

 

[Malicre]

Not to mention that if your MC decides to be just friends, when Josy and Maya tell him later on they still have feelings for him, he starts to consider things again. Which in my opinion is the biggest flaw of all this game. If I've chosen to be friends is because that's the closest way to tell them to fuck off, but it seems that's impossible to do so far, even though this would have been a perfect point to allow it. So I guess they are too much important for the upcoming story and the MC can't part ways with them even in an amicable way, and in that case I would have preferred not to being able to make such a 'fake' decision which seemed quite important. Now, I understand this is still an early point of the story and maybe that choice is only the key to pursue 1 on 1 relationships with them. We'll see.

In my playthrough the mc and josey / maya were just friends, i rarely had any contact with them post breakup and that's usually only when i visit the HOT house to see someone else.

If you're still talking to them via phone/text/swyper or w/e then that's your fault.

 

[felicemastronzo]

Not to mention that if your MC decides to be just friends, when Josy and Maya tell him later on they still have feelings for him, he starts to consider things again. Which in my opinion is the biggest flaw of all this game. If I've chosen to be friends is because that's the closest way to tell them to fuck off, but it seems that's impossible to do so far, even though this would have been a perfect point to allow it. So I guess they are too much important for the upcoming story and the MC can't part ways with them even in an amicable way, and in that case I would have preferred not to being able to make such a 'fake' decision which seemed quite important. Now, I understand this is still an early point of the story and maybe that choice is only the key to pursue 1 on 1 relationships with them. We'll see.

Josy's words are a stab in the back ..

in a game called Being a DIK that you can't tell someone to fuck off it's a serious lack ...

 

[Wizard_Shiryuu]

Not to mention that if your MC decides to be just friends, when Josy and Maya tell him later on they still have feelings for him, he starts to consider things again. Which in my opinion is the biggest flaw of all this game. If I've chosen to be friends is because that's the closest way to tell them to fuck off, but it seems that's impossible to do so far, even though this would have been a perfect point to allow it. So I guess they are too much important for the upcoming story and the MC can't part ways with them even in an amicable way, and in that case I would have preferred not to being able to make such a 'fake' decision which seemed quite important. Now, I understand this is still an early point of the story and maybe that choice is only the key to pursue 1 on 1 relationships with them. We'll see.

Regarding drama, bad endings and shit hitting the fan, just remember that, until Ep5, the only bad-smelling thing in AL was Melissa's abussive step-father. Besides that, it was a fairly light-hearted game, even the initial robbery was quickly forgotten as a potential source of conflict. I'll say it again, DPC's disclaimer the first time you run the game can't be there just for presenting us Jill. Things are gonna go south, probably affecting different characters in different ways according to our affinity with them. I guess we still don't know which would be the triggering event, but Quinn's shenanigans can easily be a source of serious problems for most of our LIs, even Jill as she's living in that frat house and could get caught in the crossed fire. Bella is the only one who I can't see fitting in that story arch, but she is misterious enough to not ruling her out completely.

It looks like M&J are too central with the story and will always be there, one way or another. It is a problem, specially considering how low they end up in polls, Maya in particular (the girl with the most exposure and character development right now). I don't think DPC expected them to be that unpopular, if lots of people don't care about them they don't percieve the story as it's intended. It's like people who didn't like Megan in AL, it felt too forced for them... And they are going to be central in future plotlines too. Quinn's for example.

 

[felicemastronzo]

In my playthrough the mc and josey / maya were just friends, i rarely had any contact with them post breakup and that's usually only when i visit the HOT house to see someone else.

If you're still talking to them via phone/text/swyper or w/e then that's your fault.

what are you referring to with BREAK UP?
on Josy's arrival or at the meeting in the library?


at the preps party how do you avoid them?

 

[moskyx]

In my playthrough the mc and josey / maya were just friends, i rarely had any contact with them post breakup and that's usually only when i visit the HOT house to see someone else.

If you're still talking to them via phone/text/swyper or w/e then that's your fault.

Yeah, my fault is that I want to keep things friendly just as I've told them in the library scene, not to be a moron. But after that scene I only met them at the party and helped Josy with her father because I thought it could be a tough moment for her. Considering she was punished for inviting a boy home, and that I haven't done anything with her, I thought I should explain myself to her father. But things went smoothly and I found myself 'trapped' with her confessing she only agreed to be friends because she felt forced to do so

 

[felicemastronzo]

It looks like M&J are too central with the story and will always be there, one way or another. It is a problem, specially considering how low they end up in polls, Maya in particular (the girl with the most exposure and character development right now). I don't think DPC expected them to be that unpopular, if lots of people don't care about them they don't percieve the story as it's intended. It's like people who didn't like Megan in AL, it felt too forced for them... And they are going to be central in future plotlines too. Quinn's for example.

Maya's character is not developed, but is overexposed. she is often on stage, but to always do the same thing
she deserves the chance for a ransom

if it is low in the polls it is the fault of DPC, not of the players

 

[Malicre]

Yeah, my fault is that I want to keep things friendly just as I've told them in the library scene, not to be a moron. But after that scene I only met them at the party and helped Josy with her father because I thought it could be a tough moment for her. Considering she was punished for inviting a boy home, and that I haven't done anything with her, I thought I should explain myself to her father. But things went smoothly and I found myself 'trapped' with her confessing she only agreed to be friends because she felt forced to do so

There's a reason there's a saying that a man and a women can't be friends you know?

what are you referring to with BREAK UP?
on Josy's arrival or at the meeting in the library?


at the preps party how do you avoid them?

Sure i met her/them at specific places on campus (like the library/hot/prep houses) but that never progressed the relationship. The only way you can even remotely progress that relationship is if you try to help them and/or seek them out on your own.

When i said i had very little encounters with Josey/Maya in my current playthrough i ment it. I think iv only ran into 1 or the other a hand full of times since the breakup event which was josey's arrival at the dorm.

 

[felicemastronzo]

There's a reason there's a saying that a man and a women can't be friends you know?



Sure i met her/them at specific places on campus (like the library/hot/prep houses) but that never progressed their relationship. The only way you can even remotely progress that relationship is if you try to help them and/or seek them out on your own.

even if the girls accept the MC proposal, in the end they don't meet MC many times more, 3 times if I'm not mistaken

the same evening in the dorm room, when they can join the beds (no sex of course), by phone when MC is with Bella after talking to Cathe and the final picnic

 

[Malicre]

even if the girls accept the MC proposal, in the end they don't meet MC many times more, 3 times if I'm not mistaken

the same evening in the dorm room, when they can join the beds (no sex of course), by phone when MC is with Bella after talking to Cathe and the final picnic

Then im not understanding the arguement, how is that forced? You're not going to not run into people on a college campus, especially a smaller one that only has a few frat houses. It wouldn't make sense if Josey/Maya just disappeared, they go to school there too.

You go the the hot house to see Sage, you go to the prep house for the hot/prep party and you go to the library for Bella, you never go to any of those locations to see josey and maya and theres literally no way to progress the relationship that way unless you want too.

 

[felicemastronzo]

Then im not understanding the arguement, how is that forced? You're not going to not run into people on a college campus, especially a smaller one that only has a few frat houses. It wouldn't make sense if Josey/Maya just disappeared, they go to school there too.

it was my consideration, I didn't mean to speak for Moskyx.


in the end the difference between being part of the relationship of Maya and Josy and being only friends, lies in those 3 scenes (in addition to the sex with what MC will follow after the preps party)

however the post party scene is still a sign that MC is still in their orbit (and DPC seems to encourage you to try again).

we'll see what happens

 

[Wizard_Shiryuu]

Maya's character is not developed, but is overexposed. she is often on stage, but to always do the same thing
she deserves the chance for a ransom

if it is low in the polls it is the fault of DPC, not of the players

I think we are on the same page there, but I think she's developed. We know a lot about her, motivations and personality. The thing is most people didn't like how she is (and for good reasons imo). I don't think she can be redeemed without doing a 180º that would feel out of character.

it was my consideration, I didn't mean to speak for Moskyx.


in the end the difference between being part of the relationship of Maya and Josy and being only friends, lies in those 3 scenes (in addition to the sex with what MC will follow after the preps party)

however the post party scene is still a sign that MC is still in their orbit (and DPC seems to encourage you to try again).

we'll see what happens

Episode 5 seems the start of the solo path for both of them. That's my bet. It's not getting back or DPC giving us another chance at them, it's a different solo path (I hope).

 

[felicemastronzo]

I think we are on the same page there, but I think she's developed. We know a lot about her, motivations and personality. The thing is most people didn't like how she is (and for good reasons imo). I don't think she can be redeemed without doing a 180º that would feel out of character.

we know that Maya's father has hampered her affair with Josy (how?), and that he does not accept his daughter's homosexuality, little else.

absurdly, Maya with the questions she asked MC on their first lunch date, I think she knows MC better than MC knows her ...

Maya plays a very passive, punching bag, role

a girl who spends the evenings of her first university weeks watching movies on her cell phone in the dark in her room, in my opinion has a lot more to show and demonstrate.
or at least I hope for her

 

[Holy Bacchus]

It looks like M&J are too central with the story and will always be there, one way or another. It is a problem, specially considering how low they end up in polls, Maya in particular (the girl with the most exposure and character development right now). I don't think DPC expected them to be that unpopular, if lots of people don't care about them they don't percieve the story as it's intended. It's like people who didn't like Megan in AL, it felt too forced for them... And they are going to be central in future plotlines too. Quinn's for example.

Are we talking about polls posted here or official polls on Patreon and Discord? Because oftentimes the views of patrons and F95ers differ wildly and I know that polls and tiermakers that are posted here often place Maya lower on ths scale but haven't seen or heard much about patrons views, so I'm curious to know of the origin of these polls you speak of.

 

[Donettes]

Episode 5 seems the start of the solo path for both of them. That's my bet. It's not getting back or DPC giving us another chance at them, it's a different solo path (I hope).

True. In friends/rejected path when you talk with Derek in the kitchen and he asks if your feelings for both of them are gone "just like that", game gives you 3 options where 2 flags come into play: feelingsForJosy and feelingsForMaya. And that's where you can choose if you want to pursue Josy or Maya or neither of them in the next episodes

 

[Wizard_Shiryuu]

Are we talking about polls posted here or official polls on Patreon and Discord? Because oftentimes the views of patrons and F95ers differ wildly and I know that polls and tiermakers that are posted here often place Maya lower on ths scale but haven't seen or heard much about patrons views, so I'm curious to know of the origin of these polls you speak of.

I meant the ones in Discord, but I've never seen them myself so I'm speaking about what others report here. From what I remember she usually finish last from the 5 LI and some side girls sometimes end up higher. But I could be wrong, I'm not on that Discord, I'm speaking from memory. If you have data feel free.

 

[moskyx]

Then im not understanding the arguement, how is that forced? You're not going to not run into people on a college campus, especially a smaller one that only has a few frat houses. It wouldn't make sense if Josey/Maya just disappeared, they go to school there too.

You go the the hot house to see Sage, you go to the prep house for the hot/prep party and you go to the library for Bella, you never go to any of those locations to see josey and maya and theres literally no way to progress the relationship that way unless you want too.

I tried to avoid Josy as much as possible since day 1, after she told me she's in a relationship. So I'm forced against my will to go on a date with her when I went home for a weekend, but OK, I accept that. I didn't do anything else with her, since she hasn't solved her situation yet. By then I was pursuing Maya so I can understand she becoming attached to me, and I can understand Josy's feeling something for me too even if I don't want anything with her, because I'm being nice and supportive and all. Then Josy comes to the dorm and we discover their relationship. At this point MC storms out of the room. If I'm not mistaken, I don't meet them again (appart from casual and logical encounters at the school) until DIK's party when we have that conversation at the DIK's library. I choose to be friends, they are OK with that. We won't meet again until prep's party, we share a friendly talk and Josy tells us her dad is coming.

As a friend who may have play a part on all that mess with her father, I agree to go with her, hoping I will be able to explain myself and tell her dad that nothing happened between us on that night. But this is not neccesary as the man is there just to fix things with her daughter. Nice. I escort her to the dorm like a friend would do and then she tells me out of the blue that she'd only agreed to a friendship because she felt forced to do so, and my MC, who is acting just as a supportive friend (what DPC has allowed us to be, a position I'm happy with) starts to consider his feelings for her. NO! At this point I don't have any romantic feelings for her. I'm forced to feel that way. And if I choose to stay with Maya instead of helping Josy with her father, she more or less says something similar.

And after that I don't get any more scenes with them (I can't recall where did I sleep that night, but I'm sure nothing funny happens with any of them, and of course I don't get the picnic scene). But I'm sure my MC haven't ruled out any romantic relationship with them (at least with the one I choose to stay with when Josy's dad came to the party), and that's frustrating because I really want to do so.

True. In friends/rejected path when you talk with Derek in the kitchen and he asks if your feelings for both of them are gone "just like that", game gives you 3 options where 2 flags come into play: feelingsForJosy and feelingsForMaya. And that's where you can choose if you want to pursue Josy or Maya or neither of them in the next episodes

I really hope you are right

Edit - TL;DR: My point is that, even when we decide to be just friends, we end this chapter suspecting that decission is not being taken into account. Maybe in the future we'll see a clear friendship path thanks to that decision but as for now we don't, and that's not a sign of 'good game-writting'. Some minor variations on the script would have been enough to avoid this frustrating feeling, but they just aren't there

 

[ExDeath730]

Are we talking about polls posted here or official polls on Patreon and Discord? Because oftentimes the views of patrons and F95ers differ wildly and I know that polls and tiermakers that are posted here often place Maya lower on ths scale but haven't seen or heard much about patrons views, so I'm curious to know of the origin of these polls you speak of.

I think he is talking about Patreon polls. Because in F95, even if her fandom has taken a beating since episode 4, it is still one of the strongest ones. But in Patreon she usually gets destroyed, if i remember she and Quinn were the only ones without bonus images because of that. They even had a losers bracket before episode 5, that's why there are Maya renders, she won against Quinn when there were just the two of them competing.

But anyway, this is complicated for Maya fans, since the patreon polls are the ones who matter, even if i think DPC likes the characters. I imagine that the reaction to her was not what he was expecting.