VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.11.1] [DrPinkCake]

[Coinzell]

There are different definitons of antagonist. Most say that antagonist is a character who works against the main character, or protagonist, in some way.
But there also definitisons like this "A character or force against which another character struggles." or this " a person who is opposed to, struggles against, or competes with another; opponent; adversary." or this " a person who is strongly opposed to something or someone"

So by such definition Quinn can be antagonist in relation to Maya, maybe to Sage depending on her further actions, but not to the MC, to whom her most antagonistic action was participation in prank in the 1 chapter where he was going to steal panties from HOT's. But this wasn't even organized by her, but the DIK's, and while you do such things it's kinda expected that you can run into problems.
Did she had the plot armor? Oh yes. She has fucking plot bomb shelter by now. But why it makes her bad character? Her plot armor is that all the characters that can drown her, including MC, suddenly become stupid/silent. But that's a bad writing by DPC (and there are different examples of that through the story). If he makes all the characters unjustifiably stupid and silent, does it make character who benefits from that bad?

 

[Kellermann]

I can't help but think about what you wrote. The more I view this
View attachment 1122845

the more I see a painting and not an actual pair of boots. You might be on to something. Definitely the best theory out there so far imo

Yep, OFT absolutely nailed it. This one is now fact and no longer theory imo. The only thing that remains a mystery is who is the painting/picture of? Seems like the most likely possibilities would be: 1) James 2) Bella's child 3) Bella's father

 

[Holy Bacchus]

Come on...

if Neil seriously claimed not to remember Linette's surname he couldn't work on a building site and would have to be urgently admitted to some sanatorium

It's one thing to accept that details such as the exact dates are known, it's quite another not to know who the mother of his child is, the woman he had to mourn and bury.

then if the point is that MC does not care to know it, boh it seems to me also acceptable but I would not say reasonable... he may have been happy but the lack of his mother, if he did not feel it spontaneously, was made him feel it by the bullies of the school.

It's not for lack of memory that he won't have mentioned Lynette's surname, it's simply not been necessary. I'd say it's far more likely for Neil to have said something along the lines of, "Your mother's name was Lynette", than to say, "You mother's name was Lynette [surname]". Even for the MC, to ask after the first statement, "what was her last name?" does not seem like a natural follow-up. It's irrelevant information to a child who may also naturally assume that their parents were married and therefore shared the same last name.

I've known people who don't care to know much about estranged family members. An ex-gf was adopted and I asked her once about her real parents and she said she "couldn't give a flying fuck" who they were or where they were, and a friend who's Dad left when her Mom was pregnant said she had no interest to meet him or know who he was. Granted, the death of a parent is somewhat different, but the MC's been told by Neil about how Lynette's family disapproved of him and pretty much shunned her for running away with him, so I can see how, because of that, the MC doesn't care to know who these people are and therefore to know what her surname is.

Why not?
"The Blacklist" inspired me to the theory.
We know from Jade that Stephen cheated to get his doctorate. We don't know how. I'm also happy to accept another theory, with appropriate arguments.

This game is not The Blacklist. It's one of the furthest things that DPC could possibly gleam any inspiration for this game from. Stop using it as a reference point for theories.

I'm onboard this train. Besides, if Quinn were really the antagonist she would be neither out for the HOTS nor fuckable. Everything she has done has been motivated by keeping the HOTS funded. Her methods may be scrutable but anyone who says they wouldn't let her fuck them silly is lying. She is that kind of girl and guys like that. We're not talking serious relationship or marriage material here. We're talking she probably takes it in the ass and the face. She is the antithesis of, say, Jill.

Protagonists and antagonists having romantic or even just sexual relationships is not something new or unheard of. Batman fucks Catwoman on the regular and she's been considered an antagonist for most of her existence. Another most famous example is Gone with the Wind where Scarlett O'Hara (the protagonist) has a relationship with and even marries the antagonist Rhett Butler.

An antagonist is not always the same as a villain, they're just the character who pushes back against the protagonist, blocking them from certain things, and proving to be a veritable thorn in the protag's side. The antagonist's efforts to reach their goal can often determine the story’s path and the escalating conflict, and this description seems to fit Quinn perfectly.

 

[AchedCroissant]

I saw this image and I thought "What are the other requirements to be able to unlock this image in the game completely? Because there were 3 and I had only one completed

And I think I remember that DPC had published an image of the new phone where he had Cathy in the wallpaper

So if each girl has 3 requirements to complete, does that mean that each girl will have 2 events for this episode?

And can we unlock all the drawings in this chapter or just some girls?

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[dalli_x]

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Even in 2D, Maya is hot!

 

[InfiniteIgnorance]

It's not for lack of memory that he won't have mentioned Lynette's surname, it's simply not been necessary. I'd say it's far more likely for Neil to have said something along the lines of, "Your mother's name was Lynette", than to say, "You mother's name was Lynette [surname]". Even for the MC, to ask after the first statement, "what was her last name?" does not seem like a natural follow-up. It's irrelevant information to a child who may also naturally assume that their parents were married and therefore shared the same last name.

I've known people who don't care to know much about estranged family members. An ex-gf was adopted and I asked her once about her real parents and she said she "couldn't give a flying fuck" who they were or where they were, and a friend who's Dad left when her Mom was pregnant said she had no interest to meet him or know who he was. Granted, the death of a parent is somewhat different, but the MC's been told by Neil about how Lynette's family disapproved of him and pretty much shunned her for running away with him, so I can see how, because of that, the MC doesn't care to know who these people are and therefore to know what her surname is.



This game is not The Blacklist. It's one of the furthest things that DPC could possibly gleam any inspiration for this game from. Stop using it as a reference point for theories.



Protagonists and antagonists having romantic or even just sexual relationships is not something new or unheard of. Batman fucks Catwoman on the regular and she's been considered an antagonist for most of her existence. Another most famous example is Gone with the Wind where Scarlett O'Hara (the protagonist) has a relationship with and even marries the antagonist Rhett Butler.

An antagonist is not always the same as a villain, they're just the character who pushes back against the protagonist, blocking them from certain things, and proving to be a veritable thorn in the protag's side. The antagonist's efforts to reach their goal can often determine the story’s path and the escalating conflict, and this description seems to fit Quinn perfectly.

Maybe you explained it better than I can how we see the same things differently. In Gone With The Wind, I considered Scarlett to be the antagonist. CatWoman also fucked with Batman's head just because she could. In that way I do see a lot of resemblance with Quinn, who does the same to certain parties just because she can. But even if we take DPC at face value that Quinn is an antagonist, even if not the primary antagonist, I'm more interested in the endgame. She obviously can't continue to fund the HOTS through specious means. It would be ridiculous to have the MC save both the DIKS and the HOTS.

 

[godkingxerxes]

I saw this image and I thought "What are the other requirements to be able to unlock this image in the game completely? Because there were 3 and I had only one completed

And I think I remember that DPC had published an image of the new phone where he had Cathy in the wallpaper

So if each girl has 3 requirements to complete, does that mean that each girl will have 2 events for this episode?

And can we unlock all the drawings in this chapter or just some girls?

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Probably fully unlocked chapter 8.

And assuming the unlocks go up in money so step 2 is 2 dollars and 3 is 3 dollars. Won't be able to unlock too many.

We also don't know the requirements, getting Jill's might be choosing Jill over Sage so you can't get both in one run.

 

[felicemastronzo]

It's not for lack of memory that he won't have mentioned Lynette's surname, it's simply not been necessary. I'd say it's far more likely for Neil to have said something along the lines of, "Your mother's name was Lynette", than to say, "You mother's name was Lynette [surname]". Even for the MC, to ask after the first statement, "what was her last name?" does not seem like a natural follow-up. It's irrelevant information to a child who may also naturally assume that their parents were married and therefore shared the same last name.

I've known people who don't care to know much about estranged family members. An ex-gf was adopted and I asked her once about her real parents and she said she "couldn't give a flying fuck" who they were or where they were, and a friend who's Dad left when her Mom was pregnant said she had no interest to meet him or know who he was. Granted, the death of a parent is somewhat different, but the MC's been told by Neil about how Lynette's family disapproved of him and pretty much shunned her for running away with him, so I can see how, because of that, the MC doesn't care to know who these people are and therefore to know what her surname is.

but this is not the case, Mc was not abandoned or given in adoption, he has no reason to have negative feelings towards his mother.

It may be OK that he has no interest in getting to know Linette's family directly (towards whom he may have negative feelings) but it would be normal for him to be as curious as possible about a person who was taken away from him too soon.

Curiosity that for example he shows as soon as he is given his mother's diaries.

until proven otherwise I take it for granted that MC knows his mother's surname, which is probably somehow also on the cheque he has just received. it simply has no narrative importance (at least for now, but anyway it is definitely neither a B nor an R)

 

[Lostanddamned]

What if Jamie is gay?
That, like Troy, he's sneaking out of the house?

Leon had to really talk Jamie into fucking Arieth. He has a feminist for a girlfriend. Maybe in the hope that he won't have to fuck his girlfriend so often. (Yes I know she thought she was pregnant).

Just a few thoughts.

Eh, it might be possible, but that's a stretch and we basically have no proof. It could have been anybody outside and I don't remember seeing anything different in the mansion to be able to claim that someone sneaked in.

So the more likely version is that someone with a DIK jacket is sneaking out at night to go somewhere and comes back from the same place.

 

[godkingxerxes]

What if Jamie is gay?
That, like Troy, he's sneaking out of the house?

Leon had to really talk Jamie into fucking Arieth. He has a feminist for a girlfriend. Maybe in the hope that he won't have to fuck his girlfriend so often. (Yes I know she thought she was pregnant).

Just a few thoughts.

Jamie being gay or straight or a woman or a ghost or whatever the fuck doesn't matter.


And this is not just you, but I think the community as a whole is making a massive deal out of a shadow.

People walking outside a house they live in, is not anything, FFS it's probably just Jakob taking a piss outside because somebody is in the bathroom.

 

[AchedCroissant]

Even in 2D, Maya is hot!

It makes me want to play an alternate version of this game with that drawing style

Probably fully unlocked chapter 8.

And assuming the unlocks go up in money so step 2 is 2 dollars and 3 is 3 dollars. Won't be able to unlock too many.

We also don't know the requirements, getting Jill's might be choosing Jill over Sage so you can't get both in one run.

Whenever there is a free-roam I try to get as much money as possible (But DPC always looks for a way to make us spend money on other things)

 

[InfiniteIgnorance]

but this is not the case, Mc was not abandoned or given in adoption, he has no reason to have negative feelings towards his mother.

It may be OK that he has no interest in getting to know Linette's family directly (towards whom he may have negative feelings) but it would be normal for him to be as curious as possible about a person who was taken away from him too soon.

Curiosity that for example he shows as soon as he is given his mother's diaries.

until proven otherwise I take it for granted that MC knows his mother's surname, which is probably somehow also on the cheque he has just received. it simply has no narrative importance (at least for now, but anyway it is definitely neither a B nor an R)

I think the entire Lynette thing is being overthought. There has been no mention of her since the prologue. There has been no mention of any of her family, even in passing. One would think there would at least be some reference to her side of the family, even at the funeral, if that was to be part of the story. If something about Lynette's past shows up in this story this far in, out of fuck all nowhere, it's not good writing. I have family I've never met at all but I know their names and can trace their lineage and could contact them if I so desired. The MC hasn't made the slightest effort to do any such thing nor has anyone from Lynette's family made any effort to contact him. It's not as though Neil could prevent that now, even if he was preventing it previously. So, if her family was any kind of royalty in this story they would have knowledge the MC was attending B&R and ways of contacting him. All of this nonsense would take the plot so far off course that it simply doesn't make any sense to include it. The name of the game is "Being A DIK", something Lynette obviously could never have done.

 

[felicemastronzo]

There are different definitons of antagonist. Most say that antagonist is a character who works against the main character, or protagonist, in some way.
But there also definitisons like this "A character or force against which another character struggles." or this " a person who is opposed to, struggles against, or competes with another; opponent; adversary." or this " a person who is strongly opposed to something or someone"

So by such definition Quinn can be antagonist in relation to Maya, maybe to Sage depending on her further actions, but not to the MC, to whom her most antagonistic action was participation in prank in the 1 chapter where he was going to steal panties from HOT's. But this wasn't even organized by her, but the DIK's, and while you do such things it's kinda expected that you can run into problems.
Did she had the plot armor? Oh yes. She has fucking plot bomb shelter by now. But why it makes her bad character? Her plot armor is that all the characters that can drown her, including MC, suddenly become stupid/silent. But that's a bad writing by DPC (and there are different examples of that through the story). If he makes all the characters unjustifiably stupid and silent, does it make character who benefits from that bad?

in the first part of the story he is also MC's antagonist. everything we are told about her is negative, she has to do with drugs, together with Tommy they conspire against their superiors, she always has a harsh attitude against poor Riona (who is the only one with whom she has an apparently more sincere relationship)...

it's MC who is stunned by the taser, Maya will have been humiliated in the occasion, but MC didn't go well either. apparently Quinn wants to make both of them her toys (with different aims)

then at a certain point Quinn is so busy with her own problems that she stops giving Maya problems too, she "neglects" her completely I'd say from chapter 3 onwards. she goes from wanting to involve her in the restaurant to not caring about her scavenger hunt leaving her free with Arieth

and it's there that her character remains in the balance without a determined role.

when there will be the clash with Sage we will see what will happen, will it be the return of the prodigal son, or will she be fallen into the abyss?

 

[Deleted member 2528490]

I think the entire Lynette thing is being overthought. There has been no mention of her since the prologue. There has been no mention of any of her family, even in passing. One would think there would at least be some reference to her side of the family, even at the funeral, if that was to be part of the story. If something about Lynette's past shows up in this story this far in, out of fuck all nowhere, it's not good writing. I have family I've never met at all but I know their names and can trace their lineage and could contact them if I so desired. The MC hasn't made the slightest effort to do any such thing nor has anyone from Lynette's family made any effort to contact him. It's not as though Neil could prevent that now, even if he was preventing it previously. So, if her family was any kind of royalty in this story they would have knowledge the MC was attending B&R and ways of contacting him. All of this nonsense would take the plot so far off course that it simply doesn't make any sense to include it. The name of the game is "Being A DIK", something Lynette obviously could never have done.

In regards to MC not making the effort to contact his extended family, some people are just like that. Being Indian, I have a huge extended family. I could not tell you a single name or how I'm related to any of them. I don't even know my mother's sisters' children's names. When they have no direct impact or presence in your life... for some people, there's no desire to go find out. Your attention is on the things within your immediaite grasp.

So I don't see that as a bad writing thing.

 

[felicemastronzo]

I think the entire Lynette thing is being overthought. There has been no mention of her since the prologue. There has been no mention of any of her family, even in passing. One would think there would at least be some reference to her side of the family, even at the funeral, if that was to be part of the story. If something about Lynette's past shows up in this story this far in, out of fuck all nowhere, it's not good writing. I have family I've never met at all but I know their names and can trace their lineage and could contact them if I so desired. The MC hasn't made the slightest effort to do any such thing nor has anyone from Lynette's family made any effort to contact him. It's not as though Neil could prevent that now, even if he was preventing it previously. So, if her family was any kind of royalty in this story they would have knowledge the MC was attending B&R and ways of contacting him. All of this nonsense would take the plot so far off course that it simply doesn't make any sense to include it. The name of the game is "Being A DIK", something Lynette obviously could never have done.

I think the mistake is to expect it to be an important and determining aspect of the plot.

it seemed that the letter should reveal who knows what, for now it has been worse useless than the game of D&G.

somewhere there are MC's rich relatives, maybe at some point they will intervene in the story, but i wouldn't hold my breath waiting for them. maybe they could be the deus ex machina to save MC if he finds himself in big trouble (financial or legal)

let's imagine he ended up involved in a trial accused of something serious, then journalists would quickly dig into his past and intervening for his emblazoned relatives would become a must.
(this is not a theory, just to give a scenario in which it would make sense for them to intervene).

I repeat, until proven otherwise for me MC knows the name and surname of his mother, as he will also know that of all the other BR students, which have not been revealed to us

 

[Abhishek_tanwar]

Ah, Quinn getting more popular in the main thread yet again, it's been a while
I feel like this thread is going in circles trying to 'study Quinn's character' and her 'villainous intent' every time there is an update coming in a few weeks
View attachment 1123208
If you don't hype Quinn up before the release, no one will, so all I can say to you guys is View attachment 1123207

Gotta love her !

 

[dalli_x]

In regards to MC not making the effort to contact his extended family, some people are just like that. Being Indian, I have a huge extended family. I could not tell you a single name or how I'm related to any of them. I don't even know my mother's sisters' children's names. When they have no direct impact or presence in your life... for some people, there's no desire to go find out. Your attention is on the things within your immediaite grasp.

So I don't see that as a bad writing thing.

I agree.

But someone wants MC to track down his family, otherwise he wouldn't have gotten the diary.
The question is from whom and why at this time?
Because of MC birthday? I don't think so.
Someone definitely knows MC past.

 

[Coinzell]

in the first part of the story he is also MC's antagonist. everything we are told about her is negative, she has to do with drugs, together with Tommy they conspire against their superiors, she always has a harsh attitude against poor Riona (who is the only one with whom she has an apparently more sincere relationship)...

it's MC who is stunned by the taser, Maya will have been humiliated in the occasion, but MC didn't go well either. apparently Quinn wants to make both of them her toys (with different aims)

then at a certain point Quinn is so busy with her own problems that she stops giving Maya problems too, she "neglects" her completely I'd say from chapter 3 onwards. she goes from wanting to involve her in the restaurant to not caring about her scavenger hunt leaving her free with Arieth

and it's there that her character remains in the balance without a determined role.

when there will be the clash with Sage we will see what will happen, will it be the return of the prodigal son, or will she be fallen into the abyss?

Forgot about taser. Remembering first chapters... yeah, you are right, she can be considered MC's antagonist in first two, maybe even three chapters (depending on how much you involved in Maya stuff). But after that not really

 

[shazba]

I think the mistake is to expect it to be an important and determining aspect of the plot.

it seemed that the letter should reveal who knows what, for now it has been worse useless than the game of D&G.

somewhere there are MC's rich relatives, maybe at some point they will intervene in the story, but i wouldn't hold my breath waiting for them. maybe they could be the deus ex machina to save MC if he finds himself in big trouble (financial or legal)

let's imagine he ended up involved in a trial accused of something serious, then journalists would quickly dig into his past and intervening for his emblazoned relatives would become a must.
(this is not a theory, just to give a scenario in which it would make sense for them to intervene).

I repeat, until proven otherwise for me MC knows the name and surname of his mother, as he will also know that of all the other BR students, which have not been revealed to us

I agree that just because we don’t know something it doesn’t mean the MC doesn’t, and we could be attributing something important to something that is not.

The obsession some people have with the mc’s ancestry could very well be completely misplaced.

From what we’ve been exposed to in the story, Lynette had no siblings, so there won’t be any surprises.

If it turns out that the MC doesn’t know his mom’s maiden name and it’s something significant to the plot, I’d find that rather idiotic.

Sure, Neil’s story telling ability lacks finesse, which the MC laments did not allow him to build a rapport with his mom’s memory (via his dad), but to not even know her name... I knew my mom’s maiden name before I was around 5...

And while Neil’s story telling isn’t the greatest, the guy hasn’t got dementia, it’s not like he doesn’t even recall important details (like her name).

I’m not going to be adamant that the MC’s ancestry is really no longer of much consequence, my gut feeling is that it isn’t.

 

[drakken]

In general I don't like the way DPC handles the theroic antagonists. As much as I find him great in making the different characters interesting, on the villains of the story I always feel he lacks measure and focus.

Quinn has two problems:
1) the contradiction between being the nemesis, at least of the first part of the story, but continually suffering setbacks, failing at every attempt to achieve something. which makes her more like the Beagle Boys than a serious threat
2) the will to make us feel empathy for her anyway, among the secondary girls she is the one with whom MC can share more important sexual and emotional moments

all these claims on a single character make her generically out of focus, you should fear her, pity her and love her, but all together it's not possible

If Quinn was supposed to be the main villain for S1, then she was the worst villain in the history of worst villains. The problem is DPC established her as a villain, selling drugs and forcing girls to prostitution, but then decided to bank on the popular villain-to-hero trope, by trying to build a sad story for the said villain and possibly add a redemption arc in the future. It worked, but it also forced his hand to change her character and that combined with him making her incompetent by failing at everything, makes her even worse.

Personally, I feel no empathy towards Quinn, everything that happened to her she brought upon herself and only has herself to blame for it.

She is not a villain. Never was. But antagonist come in different forms. And as apparent either you like her, hate her, or both. But u feel something for her.

If Quinn had really been an unscrupulous villain, and had really made Maya do something irreparable, the condemnation towards her would have been without appeal. instead so it's all suspended

Quinn makes the girls prostitute themselves, it's true, but in the end the girls do what they want and with whom they want.

I think that the fact that the syringes have disappeared compared to the first scenes, depends also on the fact that they don't want the issue of drugs to appear too serious, in the end if we talk about joints in college the sentence is not so inflexible, now we'll see what will happen to those unsold doses (where moreover reference is made to a specific drug)

all these contradictions make the character hard to pin down (and overall "wrong") but still interesting, Quinn could really do anything at any time, from the worst crime to the unexpected altruistic gesture

if I had to choose between spending time with Camilla (but the same goes for some LIs) and with Quinn, with the former we all know what to expect, with the latter it would still be a surprise

Quinn makes the girls do nothing, its just part of the deal. They decide if their going to take the deal. What the girls do is their choice. Mona is an example of this.
Maya did what she did of her own free will. She still forgets that even with the deal, it comes down to "if you meet a certain criteria". Did quinn push her buttons yea. But Maya could of backed out at any time and even considered, but instead of listening to her head she jumped headfirst into something she's not willing to do.
As far as pinning down quinn (would be fun) she's not that hard to figure out, complicated? Yes, especially if you go by her facade or mask. But that's just it, you have what she chooses to show and whats inside that she doesn't show(except for mc unintentionally because she can't help herself)