VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.11.1] [DrPinkCake]

[felicemastronzo]

There have been 5 main girls established since the end of chapter 1 when we, the players were given summaries of our progress with Bella, Jill, Josy, Maya and Sage. in the following 6 chapters that has never changed so there is No Reason to think it will in the future* as to do so would violate established storytelling structure. It still amazes me that so many are unable to accept that the straight-forward story they're being presented with is real and not some Lost-esque mystery box to be solved.

* Until the story is completed, at which point, a Quinn path could be added as DLC but this is purely hypothetical as DPC has given zero indication that that might be a something they have planned

in AL there were 4 LIs, one of the 4 was fake and there was an ending for another character

that Quinn is an LI or not is not so important, what is important is if she will have an ending or not (she already has a path for now much more substantial than that of the other sidegirls)

I don't think so, but because I don't see a clean way out for her, something that will allow her to stay at BR at the end of the story

 

[PashafromRussia]

There have been 5 main girls established since the end of chapter 1 when we, the players were given summaries of our progress with Bella, Jill, Josy, Maya and Sage. in the following 6 chapters that has never changed so there is No Reason to think it will in the future* as to do so would violate established storytelling structure. It still amazes me that so many are unable to accept that the straight-forward story they're being presented with is real and not some Lost-esque mystery box to be solved.

* Until the story is completed, at which point, a Quinn path could be added as DLC but this is purely hypothetical as DPC has given zero indication that that might be a something they have planned

1) Quinn is present on the banner on the page of patreon
2) Perhaps a lot of work with the code is due to the fact that her progress needs to be added to the credits
3) In one of the status updates, he said that he was preparing something crazy, but he could not say what exactly would otherwise spoil the experience
4) Quinn is given more time than any of the side girls.

 

[always86]

I've said it before, but this makes no sense. If Quinn wanted to rob the DIK safe (which I agree she would be willing to do if necessary) then the Cluck does nothing but make that harder: getting access tot he laptop is no easier than getting access to the safe directly, and the typical party gave her much better cover that a houseful of alert, angry people hunting for clues.

I understand that Quinn is a lousy chessmaster, but this plan is bad even by her standards.

I disagree. We know the DIKs lock doors In the house when they don’t want people in certain areas. Which suggests if Rusty wasn’t in his room he may have locked the door. So she needs to get Rusty out of his room with the door unlocked. If he had Camilla on the bed he wouldn’t lock her in. So not only does the Cluck distract all the DIKs, it leaves Rusty’s room unguarded and unlocked.

It’s possible Quinn herself didn’t go to try and look in the safe and Camilla did it after Rusty left. We know right before this Quinn follows a pissed off Tommy into the corridor so potentially she’s right in place to step in. Of course if Camilla looked she may have been using Tommy as cover “it wasn’t me I was with Tommy”.

Could it have been Vinny/ Nick. Yes but you have to explain the safe. Could it have been Jade, yes, but you have to explain the safe. The safe is the key to the explanation.

 

[lemonfreak]

in AL there were 4 LIs, one of the 4 was fake and there was an ending for another character

that Quinn is an LI or not is not so important, what is important is if she will have an ending or not (she already has a path for now much more substantial than that of the other sidegirls)

I don't think so, but because I don't see a clean way out for her, something that will allow her to stay at BR at the end of the story

It'd probably help if I made it clear how I believe Quinn's 'path' differs from those of the established LIs; my assumptions are largely based around the way I would plan out these routes and therefore could be wrong but I believe they are consistent with what we've seen up to now.

For the LIs, I believe each has 3 routes (which we'll call good, neutral and bad), for simplicity I'll focus on Jill. The good route obviously leads to her being MC's girlfriend, the neutral route would see her remain single but learn that Tybalt has not only been lying to her but engaging in stalking behaviour. The bad route would see her remain ignorant of that and become his girlfriend

Maya's route similarly has her end up as MC's girlfriend (with Josy on the thruple route or without on her hypothetical solo route*). Neutral sees her and Josy remain a couple without Patrick's knowledge, the bad route sees her being forced to leave college after he withholds her student loan and never see Josy again

With Quinn, I believe her path is set in stone and cannot be affected by the MC's actions; we as the players can only control to what extent her actions affect him.


To be clear, I have no knowledge of DPC's plans, I'm just basing this on what I know of storytelling structure and game design.

* Josy would have a bad and neutral path exclusive to this route; there would be comparable neutral and bad paths for Maya on the solo Josy route

 

[felicemastronzo]

It'd probably help if I made it clear how I believe Quinn's 'path' differs from those of the established LIs; my assumptions are largely based around the way I would plan out these routes and therefore could be wrong but I believe they are consistent with what we've seen up to now.

For the LIs, I believe each has 3 routes (which we'll call good, neutral and bad), for simplicity I'll focus on Jill. The good route obviously leads to her being MC's girlfriend, the neutral route would see her remain single but learn that Tybalt has not only been lying to her but engaging in stalking behaviour. The bad route would see her remain ignorant of that and become his girlfriend

Maya's route similarly has her end up as MC's girlfriend (with Josy on the thruple route or without on her hypothetical solo route*). Neutral sees her and Josy remain a couple without Patrick's knowledge, the bad route sees her being forced to leave college after he withholds her student loan and never see Josy again

With Quinn, I believe her path is set in stone and cannot be affected by the MC's actions; we as the players can only control to what extent her actions affect him.


To be clear, I have no knowledge of DPC's plans, I'm just basing this on what I know of storytelling structure and game design.

* Josy would have a bad and neutral path exclusive to this route; there would be comparable neutral and bad paths for Maya on the solo Josy route

for now it seems to be like this, where the scenes of her path are simply extra scenes. and i strongly suspect that it could remain like this for the whole game, to foresee that at some point the story will bifurcate with a damned Quinn on one side and a redeemed Quinn on the other seems too much effort, because in case of redemption who would take Quinn's place as "antagonist"?

but with a minimum of cynicism we could say that for now it is the same for the 5 LIs, in no way the behavior of MC makes a real difference, in fact for Bella it only makes a negative difference...

but we are not even half way through the game, so anything can really happen, we can't take anything for granted, not even that every LIs has an ending, or that the trouple does or that both Maya and Josy have a solo ending... let alone Quinn

 

[lemonfreak]

for now it seems to be like this, where the scenes of her path are simply extra scenes. and i strongly suspect that it could remain like this for the whole game, to foresee that at some point the story will bifurcate with a damned Quinn on one side and a redeemed Quinn on the other seems too much effort, because in case of redemption who would take Quinn's place as "antagonist"?

but with a minimum of cynicism we could say that for now it is the same for the 5 LIs, in no way the behavior of MC makes a real difference, in fact for Bella it only makes a negative difference...

but we are not even half way through the game, so anything can really happen, we can't take anything for granted, not even that every LIs has an ending, or that the trouple does or that both Maya and Josy have a solo ending... let alone Quinn

Assuming I'm on DPC's wavelength regarding routes (I have never interacted with him in any way) we already have a way to cut off the good ending for M+J and Bella (and are perilously close with Jill too, chapter 8 feels like it could be make or break for Dik Affinity players, especially those who looked after Sage when she was sick) but all that means is that we can only acchieve 2 of the possible endings with them; staying on their paths obviously doesn't prevent the bad ending from occurring and may in fact increase the likelyhood if we're on several paths.

You're right that we can't take anything for granted but ultimately we have to play the game we believe we're playing; (OT) this goes for real life too, when I got a vasectomy at age 30 I didn't know that, at age 40, I'd marry a trans woman

 

[felicemastronzo]

Assuming I'm on DPC's wavelength regarding routes (I have never interacted with him in any way) we already have a way to cut off the good ending for M+J and Bella (and are perilously close with Jill too, chapter 8 feels like it could be make or break for Dik Affinity players, especially those who looked after Sage when she was sick) but all that means is that we can only acchieve 2 of the possible endings with them; staying on their paths obviously doesn't prevent the bad ending from occurring and may in fact increase the likelyhood if we're on several paths.

You're right that we can't take anything for granted but ultimately we have to play the game we believe we're playing; (OT) this goes for real life too, when I got a vasectomy at age 30 I didn't know that, at age 40, I'd marry a trans woman

actually we can't be sure of that either

in the sixth chapter we would have assumed that whoever wasn't fuckbuddy was excluded from Sage, and instead.....

 

[Darkdevil66]

I disagree. We know the DIKs lock doors In the house when they don’t want people in certain areas. Which suggests if Rusty wasn’t in his room he may have locked the door. So she needs to get Rusty out of his room with the door unlocked. If he had Camilla on the bed he wouldn’t lock her in. So not only does the Cluck distract all the DIKs, it leaves Rusty’s room unguarded and unlocked.

It’s possible Quinn herself didn’t go to try and look in the safe and Camilla did it after Rusty left. We know right before this Quinn follows a pissed off Tommy into the corridor so potentially she’s right in place to step in. Of course if Camilla looked she may have been using Tommy as cover “it wasn’t me I was with Tommy”.

Still, taking and posting a nude picture of Cathy just to make a small distraction is kinda far stretched and unnecessarily complex. There were easier ways. Quinn and Riona still thought they could make a durable deal with the preps, they weren't that desperate at this point. Furthermore, Riona has already expressed issues and reluctances with Quinn's methods. While she tends to be submissive I can't really see her being ok with screwing the DIKs so bad. Not to mention, it's kinda odd that neither Quinn, Riona or Camila has never mentioned their hypothetical robbery for 3 episodes, not even in private.

The cluck being a direct on the DIKs seems more plausible. Cathy was a mentor figure for Rusty and the most benevolent teacher toward the DIKs. It has almost destroyed their reputation, personally affected Rusty and removed a precious ally for the DIKs. There's maybe no connection but the fact someone sent old and recent pictures showing the DIKs banging Arieth and the Jade's video sent to Burke, seems to implied that someone has a regular access to DIK's folders.

 

[CSLysander]

Vinny is the nexus of so many of the concerns when thinking about what has happened. He is not seen, but does seem to be a chaotic individual that would be the mastermind to the conspiracy. Riona would not attack the DIKs, but Quinn would. Quinn seems like she would do anything for money, for whatever the reason is. That is where I think a lot of this is heading.

 

[Ennoch]

my assumptions are largely based around the way I would plan out these routes

Assuming I'm on DPC's wavelength regarding routes

I believe

To be clear, I have no knowledge of DPC's plans

It still amazes me that so many are unable to accept that the straight-forward story they're being presented with is real and not some Lost-esque mystery box to be solved.

So what you are saying is.. that you assume everything, based on how you'd be doing things, make this crystal clear... only to express amazement about people who basically do the exact same thing, simply because they assume stuff that doesn't suit your personal flavour

Now don't get me wrong. I do understand the ridiculous nature of some interpretations. But regarding the future? We just don't know. You don't know. None of these 'i know for sure' types know.

The only tangible proof we have regarding DPC's storytelling is AL. And to tell you the truth that proves, among many things, that DPC has different ideas when it comes to storytelling from yours. Not everything is foreshadowed and he is absolutely willing and able to throw boulders into ponds regardless how people brand that silly or nonsensical.

So, in the end.. fact is: Wild conspiracy theories have more solid, tangible evidence to support them than the realistic projections when it comes to projections regarding the future of this title. The fact that realism-fetishists can't stand the idea matters not one bit. This just the way it is. This is what actual evidence supports. OR the very least makes it a very real possibility. One that cannot be discarded. Like it or not.

The meantime this can end up being a perfectly normal story in the end but that is not the same as saying it will. Its a perfectly reasonable, and evidence supported, notion to say it may end up quite crazy.

Just not in a way people would prefer a Lost-esque story i'm afraid and more like BAM, another giant elephant barges into the story kinda way. But it most definitely CAN happen. Because it happened before.

The toilets are still watching by the way

 

[Pendrell]

With Quinn, I believe her path is set in stone and cannot be affected by the MC's actions; we as the players can only control to what extent her actions affect him.

To be clear, I have no knowledge of DPC's plans, I'm just basing this on what I know of storytelling structure and game design.

At this stage in the game there isn't a definitive way for us to resolve the question of Quinn's status, only DPC knows what he intends. But I think at the very least it's ambiguous, and I've argued before that she's almost in a category of her own.

I take the point about end of episode summaries and RP etc, but in my view those things really aren't conclusive and they don't tell the whole story. You mention storytelling structure, but if anything the way DPC has structured things makes Quinn's place in the game even more uncertain, with polar opposite MC/Quinn relations depending on the choices you make (perhaps more so than any other character). Instead of trying to normalise interactions with her across all routes, the kind of thing that would happen if her story was on rails, DPC is actually leaning into the differences, creating hangouts and cutesy moments for those on her path, having Quinn basically ignore the MC if he isn't. And this isn't just about the effect on the MC, as you say above, it's about the effect on Quinn too - whether it's the reaction in the garden, or the hangout, or the kitchen scene. It's hard to believe there won't be any kind of pay-off for all that.

I also think it matters that a common reaction from new players who take an interest in Quinn (seen on this forum several times) is that they're surprised when they find out she isn't technically a "Main Girl". It doesn't fit with their actual experience of playing the game, wherein they've assumed she was. That's significant, because it's an unfiltered reaction and not one guided by knowledge of the technical parameters in the guide.

 

[lemonfreak]

At this stage in the game there isn't a definitive way for us to resolve the question of Quinn's status, only DPC knows what he intends. But I think at the very least it's ambiguous, and I've argued before that she's almost in a category of her own.

I take the point about end of episode summaries and RP etc, but in my view those things really aren't conclusive and they don't tell the whole story. You mention storytelling structure, but if anything the way DPC has structured things makes Quinn's place in the game even more uncertain, with polar opposite MC/Quinn relations depending on the choices you make (perhaps more so than any other character). Instead of trying to normalise interactions with her across all routes, the kind of thing that would happen if her story was on rails, DPC is actually leaning into the differences, creating hangouts and cutesy moments for those on her path, having Quinn basically ignore the MC if he isn't. And this isn't just about the effect on the MC, as you say above, it's about the effect on Quinn too - whether it's the reaction in the garden, or the hangout, or the kitchen scene. It's hard to believe there won't be any kind of pay-off for all that.

What I mean by Quinn's path being fixed is that the drug dealing and pimping will have consequences and there is nothing MC can do to prevent that. Let's say, for example, that she finds who took her money and asks him to accompany her when she confronts the guy. MC's choices would be to say no and leave her to her fate or go with her, in which case they arrive right before a police bust and MC either helps her get away or they get arrested alongside the thief. In all three hypothetical cases Quinn loses; it's just to what degree (and whether the MC goes down with her)

I also think it matters that a common reaction from new players who take an interest in Quinn (seen on this forum several times) is that they're surprised when they find out she isn't technically a "Main Girl". It doesn't fit with their actual experience of playing the game, wherein they've assumed she was. That's significant, because it's an unfiltered reaction and not one guided by knowledge of the technical parameters in the guide.

I have never once looked at the guide, I simply played chapter 1, saw the end cards and 'knew' who the main girls were based on that (plus the fact that she was clearly antagonistic towards Maya from their first conversation).

This is what I mean when I say it amazes me that people still think she'll become an LI; from that point on it has never once crossed my mind that she would.

1) Quinn is present on the banner on the page of patreon

Yes and Darth Vader is on the Star Wars poster

 

[PETERBADIK]

Vinny may have been the one who trashed the dik mansion and attacked Quinn . He is the antagonist in the dark.

 

[always86]

In fairness

Still, taking and posting a nude picture of Cathy just to make a small distraction is kinda far stretched and unnecessarily complex. There were easier ways. Quinn and Riona still thought they could make a durable deal with the preps, they weren't that desperate at this point. Furthermore, Riona has already expressed issues and reluctances with Quinn's methods. While she tends to be submissive I can't really see her being ok with screwing the DIKs so bad. Not to mention, it's kinda odd that neither Quinn, Riona or Camila has never mentioned their hypothetical robbery for 3 episodes, not even in private.

The cluck being a direct on the DIKs seems more plausible. Cathy was a mentor figure for Rusty and the most benevolent teacher toward the DIKs. It has almost destroyed their reputation, personally affected Rusty and removed a precious ally for the DIKs. There's maybe no connection but the fact someone sent old and recent pictures showing the DIKs banging Arieth and the Jade's video sent to Burke, seems to implied that someone has a regular access to DIK's folders.

The lack of conversation from a meta POV would most likely be due to DPC not wanting to reveal the answer to the audience. Riona is sat outside the library feeling down about something, I don’t think it is a massive leap to connect this to the cluck. Again a little thing like hurting her friends isn’t going to be a problem for someone like Quinn. I like Quinn as a character, I like her personality, but she isn’t a ‘good’ person. She’s making choices that are at best morally questionable, and at worst criminal. She might have a valid motivation, but we don’t know that yet. I see her story turning out to be a tragedy.

I understand the argument for it being an attack on the DIKs and Rusty, however we still need to explain why the safe is exposed under these circumstances. The safe is part of the puzzle.

The Jade video definitely indicates there is a mole in the DIKs, but I don’t think this is necessarily connected to the Cathy situation. There is some evidence that Quinn is connected to the blackmail as one of her candy canes can be found on the floor of the Janitors closet, which appears after the first time we go in there but before the blackmail pictures are sent. Why she would do it is unclear, but then again why would anyone?

 

[Oliver Wendell Homely]

What I mean by Quinn's path being fixed is that the drug dealing and pimping will have consequences and there is nothing MC can do to prevent that. Let's say, for example, that she finds who took her money and asks him to accompany her when she confronts the guy. MC's choices would be to say no and leave her to her fate or go with her, in which case they arrive right before a police bust and MC either helps her get away or they get arrested alongside the thief. In all three hypothetical cases Quinn loses; it's just to what degree (and whether the MC goes down with her)


I have never once looked at the guide, I simply played chapter 1, saw the end cards and 'knew' who the main girls were based on that (plus the fact that she was clearly antagonistic towards Maya from their first conversation).

This is what I mean when I say it amazes me that people still think she'll become an LI; from that point on it has never once crossed my mind that she would.

Yes and Darth Vader is on the Star Wars poster

Quinn was not originally on the LI board for the game and she is the only LI for whom we do not gain or lose RPs (relationship points). Progression in her story is based on whether you "eat at her restaurant," having DIK affinity, and doing other things she likes. So I think lemonfreak is right. The strong positive reactions to Quinn's character encouraged DPC to adjust her development and create opportunities to romance her, but she was not one of the original LIs.

 

[lemonfreak]

to add another into the "wild theories that make no sense" bin


leave good guy nick alone! it's rusty who posts the cluck! he's getting painted as too much of a good guy, it's suspicious!

he has access to the laptop at all times and it was the easiest for him to do.

he's finishing college soon and he is aware the fraternity is screwed without him/his family financing it. once he's out of there, he/his family won't pay ridiculous amounts of money for something that is in the end - his playtoy
so he, with some family pressure about the money the fraternity spends, decides to simply cut all ties and get the fraternity shut down. he uses cathy's pic for it.
after the trashing of the mansion, MC starts preaching about fraternity needing to pull his own weight and rusty sees there's another way and starts helping the guys with it.

or, who knows, maybe he gets blackmailed about drugs being dealt at their parties and needs to shut the fraternity down.

whatever. it's rusty!

Rusty is a junior so he has the rest of this year and next before graduating

 

[nyrek]

Rusty is a junior so he has the rest of this year and next before graduating

I said it doesn't make sense! dpc will make sense of it. I'm sticking to IT'S RUSTY

 

[ename144]

I disagree. We know the DIKs lock doors In the house when they don’t want people in certain areas. Which suggests if Rusty wasn’t in his room he may have locked the door. So she needs to get Rusty out of his room with the door unlocked. If he had Camilla on the bed he wouldn’t lock her in. So not only does the Cluck distract all the DIKs, it leaves Rusty’s room unguarded and unlocked.

It’s possible Quinn herself didn’t go to try and look in the safe and Camilla did it after Rusty left. We know right before this Quinn follows a pissed off Tommy into the corridor so potentially she’s right in place to step in. Of course if Camilla looked she may have been using Tommy as cover “it wasn’t me I was with Tommy”.

Could it have been Vinny/ Nick. Yes but you have to explain the safe. Could it have been Jade, yes, but you have to explain the safe. The safe is the key to the explanation.

You say the safe is the key, yet it's practically an afterthought in this scenario. How does the cluck get Quinn access to the safe? She already needs access to Rusty's room to make the Camila gambit work, and after the cluck was discovered Rusty is camped out in his room running damage control. So in the end at most the cluck buys Quinn a few minutes when Rusty isn't there, but maximizes the odds that she would be discovered tampering with the safe once those minutes are up.

Compare that to the same scenario without the cluck. Quinn can either attempt to crack the safe while Rusty is "distracted" or hope he'll fall asleep in post-coital bliss. Eitehr of those scenarios seem more likely to succeed than the cluck, while also having far less collateral damage.

It'd probably help if I made it clear how I believe Quinn's 'path' differs from those of the established LIs; my assumptions are largely based around the way I would plan out these routes and therefore could be wrong but I believe they are consistent with what we've seen up to now.

For the LIs, I believe each has 3 routes (which we'll call good, neutral and bad), for simplicity I'll focus on Jill. The good route obviously leads to her being MC's girlfriend, the neutral route would see her remain single but learn that Tybalt has not only been lying to her but engaging in stalking behaviour. The bad route would see her remain ignorant of that and become his girlfriend

Maya's route similarly has her end up as MC's girlfriend (with Josy on the thruple route or without on her hypothetical solo route*). Neutral sees her and Josy remain a couple without Patrick's knowledge, the bad route sees her being forced to leave college after he withholds her student loan and never see Josy again

With Quinn, I believe her path is set in stone and cannot be affected by the MC's actions; we as the players can only control to what extent her actions affect him.


To be clear, I have no knowledge of DPC's plans, I'm just basing this on what I know of storytelling structure and game design.

* Josy would have a bad and neutral path exclusive to this route; there would be comparable neutral and bad paths for Maya on the solo Josy route

One thing I've been wondering is if the other side girls will be getting their own hangouts, and Quinn is just ahead of the curve. The interactions with Riona, Lily and Jade in Episode 7 seem to hint that might be possible. It would certainly be an interesting idea.

 

[Pendrell]

Quinn was not originally on the LI board for the game and she is the only LI for whom we do not gain or lose RPs (relationship points). Progression in her story is based on whether you "eat at her restaurant," having DIK affinity, and doing other things she likes. So I think lemonfreak is right. The strong positive reactions to Quinn's character encouraged DPC to adjust her development and create opportunities to romance her, but she was not one of the original LIs.

Well I won't speak for him but I don't think that is what lemon is arguing, in fact I think he's arguing the opposite - that Quinn isn't an LI and that she was, is and forever will be the antagonist...

This is what I mean when I say it amazes me that people still think she'll become an LI; from that point on it has never once crossed my mind that she would.

What I don't understand from you lemon is what, materially, you think is different in the game between how DPC treats Quinn and how he treats the Main Girls. Not RP, not end cards, but story-wise. What LI facet does Maya have, for example, that you think is lacking in Quinn's story?

 

[lemonfreak]

Well I won't speak for him but I don't think that is what lemon is arguing, in fact I think he's arguing the opposite - that Quinn isn't an LI and that she was, is and forever will be the antagonist...

Pretty much

What I don't understand from you lemon is what, materially, you think is different in the game between how DPC treats Quinn and how he treats the Main Girls. Not RP, not end cards, but story-wise. What LI facet does Maya have, for example, that you think is lacking in Quinn's story?

My hypothesis is that the MC can still have a positive effect on the LIs he doesn't pursue. If, for example, he doesn't continue to be a good friend to Maya in upcoming episodes then Patrick will find out that she's still seeing Josy and take away her college funds.
Sage might remain obsessed with Chad and blow her dissertation/continue to let Quinn run the HOTs causing the sority to be disbanded.
Jill might end up dating Tybalt.
etc