Ren'Py Big Brother: Another Story Rebuild [v0.06.01] [Aleksey90]

[ptahn]

What I meant is: Without a strong opponent who can be defeated, there can be no good feeling of victory.
And anyone who screams against an "Eric" may not be a challenge.

The translation program may have misrepresented something here. I have to have it translated because my English is not that good.

If Eric is so necessary to the game, how does the majority of the game occur after he is gone? Why create a game to continue the story? Is the victory in this game getting rid of Eric or the conquest of your family? I think the latter is possible without the former.

 

[ptahn]

So I am glad Eric is in the game.
I just want to be able to get rid of him hopefully with a baseball bat , meat grinder , wood chipper or shotgun blast to the face from 6''. Maybe some combination of those.

No, you have to get your mom or your aunt to get rid of him while you hide behind their skirts.

 

[Twelvemonkey]

But don't you think that if Eric is gone then this game makes no difference with any other vanilla games? basically you were the only guy in the game living with females family member, seduce them, blackmail, corrupting them and so on. That is the typical background story for most of these games. Eric is what makes this game stand out from any other. That's why i said it was easier to just leave the game and find something else to play with than trying so hard to alter the game's code just to make the guy disappear.

 

[maxbishup]

No, you have to get your mom or your aunt to get rid of him while you hide behind their skirts.

Well that was last time hopefully not this time. ( It was not my ideal ) Max should have bin allowed to kill Eric and hide or destroy the body. Maybe run him through meat grinder make hamburgers feed them to Ann.

 

[maxbishup]

But don't you think that if Eric is gone then this game makes no difference with any other vanilla games? basically you were the only guy in the game living with females family member, seduce them, blackmail, corrupting them and so on. That is the typical background story for most of these games. Eric is what makes this game stand out from any other. That's why i said it was easier to just leave the game and find something else to play with than trying so hard to alter the game's code just to make the guy disappear.

I do not have a problem with competition. But when someone come in the home takes over and overnight convinces mom to get rid off you if you step one foot out of line with him. while you are powerless to fight back. Then yes I have a problem with it. Thankfully I know now that I can get rid of him. If fare competition is placed in the game thin I am all for it. For those that like NTR I hope they are allowed to keep Eric in the game.

 

[DawnCry]

I don't agree. My experience has been that NTR haters say one of two things. 1) NTR, I hate. I will never play this game. 2) NTR, I hate it. Can you please make it avoidable? Once it is made avoidable, they don't continue to complain about it. Early in a game's development there will be constant calls for the content to be made avoidable, but that is because new people keep looking at the game. Usually the comments trail off to posters just asking if the content is avoidable so they can decide if they want to play it.

As I mentioned in my previous post, Eric could still be a challenge. Just make it possible to defeat Eric before he starts having sex with Ann (or Kira.) If that is too much of an issue for the developer to have two divergent paths for that long, then make it possible for those that don't want Eric to remove him earlier. Perhaps when Max asks what happens at work if you get into a fight? Ann decides that she needs her job and dating her boss would be a bad idea. Eric never enters the picture.

By reading the previous posts anyone can see that many people are leaving this game or not giving this game a chance because of Eric content. Financially it makes sense for the developer to offer a non-NTR path. I will commit right now that I will support this game if the NTR content is made avoidable. Eric can still be in the game, Max just has to have the opportunity to stop Eric before Eric starts a sexual relation with any of the women. My rash of posts started when someone complained after my post asking to have the value needed to trigger Eric's removal posted once it became possible do to so. I had not even asked for any content change.

Your experience with NTR haters is just that, your experience, overall depending on the side of the wall that you are you will see different things, I'm kind of neutral on NTR, I never play to lose, but I don't like easy victories and the haters I have seen aren't what you say, I have seen patreons public posts being bombarded with haters messages, developers telling that the haters don't stop messaging them, one of the most recent example is the developer of goddess saga: darkness, ask the developer if you want and if you want a list of games that suffered too much hate for it then I can make one of you, I still remember many games being heavily attacked for it.

This is something that happens a lot.

And here is something that you should understand, Ann and Eric is part of the storyline, that part should never be avoidable. It's what motivates the story, of course on the sisters case you are right, it should be avoidable based on choices and actions. Even more it's wrong to call that NTR, that the mother of the character gets a boyfriend.

But the main point is the following, what you are asking is exactly the opposite of what I think, you see the only thing I'm asking is for a challenge and difficulty that I can overcome, while what you ask is to absolutely separate them and make them into routes. The funny thing is that what I ask can actually give you the game you want, but what you ask is impossible to give it to me:

-If you divide the game in paths, it is based on direct options/choices, you kind of killed all the interaction you can have in the game and all actions that the characters can take. You choose the path so you get it from beginning to end.

-If on the other hand follow what I propose the game itself would be more like a challenge and it would be easy to add a way out for those that dislike it, you just need an option like disable NTR and lock all stats that Eric has with the girls at 0. It would let you play the game without fear of NTR, albeit the experience would be more interesting if you tried and won.

Lastly about your financial point... it worked like that when the adult market started, but now... not so much. Overall this is something that happens a lot, first we go into games that try to offer a bit for everyone, but then when the number of games increase, people won't be able to support all of them, so they will only support those that give a concept that attracts them more, that has a biggest representation of their fetishes. Overall what truly matters is the concept and that people like it. Personally I'm the first one that dislikes pure unavoidable NTR from beginning to end, I can understand to use it at the beginning as a resource to motivate the story, but later on I only want it to exist in the avoidable version.

I do not have a problem with competition. But when someone come in the home takes over and overnight convinces mom to get rid off you if you step one foot out of line with him. while you are powerless to fight back. Then yes I have a problem with it. Thankfully I know now that I can get rid of him. If fare competition is placed in the game thin I am all for it. For those that like NTR I hope they are allowed to keep Eric in the game.

I totally agree with you, in fact the mother is kind of messed up to submit so fast. But well overall in the aspect of competition, I only ask for a competition that I can win, starting at an unfair point it makes it more sweet the victory.

If Eric is so necessary to the game, how does the majority of the game occur after he is gone? Why create a game to continue the story? Is the victory in this game getting rid of Eric or the conquest of your family? I think the latter is possible without the former.

About this part I suppose you didn't notice the quality drop in storyline, the incomplete parts because of a rushed kicking of Eric and how the game tried to generate a different antagonist by using Alice and forcing her character to evolve that way out of nowhere.

 

[armion82]

About this part I suppose you didn't notice the quality drop in storyline, the incomplete parts because of a rushed kicking of Eric and how the game tried to generate a different antagonist by using Alice and forcing her character to evolve that way out of nowhere.

Despite the fact that I realy like BB,I can say the game never have a real storyline.Just a bunch of events that delete the one before them.Each new update just replace all old activities you can do instead of adding more.
Not to mention how bad the dev menage to implement Eric in the game.
All females just lost like 50% of their intelligence,Ann almost 100%.
Like for real-Ann start talking about marriage on day 6-wtf.

 

[ptahn]

Your experience with NTR haters is just that, your experience, overall depending on the side of the wall that you are you will see different things, I'm kind of neutral on NTR, I never play to lose, but I don't like easy victories and the haters I have seen aren't what you say, I have seen patreons public posts being bombarded with haters messages, developers telling that the haters don't stop messaging them, one of the most recent example is the developer of goddess saga: darkness, ask the developer if you want and if you want a list of games that suffered too much hate for it then I can make one of you, I still remember many games being heavily attacked for it.

This is something that happens a lot.

And here is something that you should understand, Ann and Eric is part of the storyline, that part should never be avoidable. It's what motivates the story, of course on the sisters case you are right, it should be avoidable based on choices and actions. Even more it's wrong to call that NTR, that the mother of the character gets a boyfriend.

But the main point is the following, what you are asking is exactly the opposite of what I think, you see the only thing I'm asking is for a challenge and difficulty that I can overcome, while what you ask is to absolutely separate them and make them into routes. The funny thing is that what I ask can actually give you the game you want, but what you ask is impossible to give it to me:

-If you divide the game in paths, it is based on direct options/choices, you kind of killed all the interaction you can have in the game and all actions that the characters can take. You choose the path so you get it from beginning to end.

-If on the other hand follow what I propose the game itself would be more like a challenge and it would be easy to add a way out for those that dislike it, you just need an option like disable NTR and lock all stats that Eric has with the girls at 0. It would let you play the game without fear of NTR, albeit the experience would be more interesting if you tried and won.

Lastly about your financial point... it worked like that when the adult market started, but now... not so much. Overall this is something that happens a lot, first we go into games that try to offer a bit for everyone, but then when the number of games increase, people won't be able to support all of them, so they will only support those that give a concept that attracts them more, that has a biggest representation of their fetishes. Overall what truly matters is the concept and that people like it. Personally I'm the first one that dislikes pure unavoidable NTR from beginning to end, I can understand to use it at the beginning as a resource to motivate the story, but later on I only want it to exist in the avoidable version.



I totally agree with you, in fact the mother is kind of messed up to submit so fast. But well overall in the aspect of competition, I only ask for a competition that I can win, starting at an unfair point it makes it more sweet the victory.



About this part I suppose you didn't notice the quality drop in storyline, the incomplete parts because of a rushed kicking of Eric and how the game tried to generate a different antagonist by using Alice and forcing her character to evolve that way out of nowhere.

I hear that the Patreon posts get ugly, I am just speaking about what I see here.

You say that the story line gets weaker by making Alice the antagonist but then agree that the mother was messed up at the beginning. I say both story lines are weak, you are just willing to overlook the flaws at the beginning of the story.

WVM is as far from NTR as you can get and still have more than one male character in the game. The game has been out since the end of August and already brings in close to $7000/month. Are his renders the best? There really good but not the best. Is the story the most compelling? No, only six game days have occurred so far. Why is he so successful? No NTr, almost all the women are virgins. Romance will guilt free sex with many partners. He gives the paying audience what it wants.

 

[DawnCry]

I hear that the Patreon posts get ugly, I am just speaking about what I see here.

You say that the story line gets weaker by making Alice the antagonist but then agree that the mother was messed up at the beginning. I say both story lines are weak, you are just willing to overlook the flaws at the beginning of the story.

WVM is as far from NTR as you can get and still have more than one male character in the game. The game has been out since the end of August and already brings in close to $7000/month. Are his renders the best? There really good but not the best. Is the story the most compelling? No, only six game days have occurred so far. Why is he so successful? No NTr, almost all the women are virgins. Romance will guilt free sex with many partners. He gives the paying audience what it wants.

I actually do wonder if you read me, mainly because reading you the only thing that comes to my head is "I didn't say that!", what I did say was:

-I critic how the mother developed the relationship, I critic too how the developer did try to force Alice to suddenly become the antagonist. I'm not defending the storyline or how we got here, what I do say is that I prefer an interactive gameplay rather than one based on routes. Overall I talked about gameplay compared to story, it isn't a contradiction.

-Here you won't see the same as in patreon because we have mods that are quite good at it. If the conversation derails too much they usually stop it and even delete posts.

-Again, what I said is that the games are related to the concept and that people support the thing that is nearest to it. You are saying it "it gives what his paying audience wants", this sentence is exactly what I mean, I'm not saying that all games should have x or y which is what you imply in the message.

Mate I'm not singing the virtues of big brother, however I do defend that the original concept was an interactive gameplay in which opportunities could end up badly and that it required something else than following just a storyline.

 

[maxbishup]

Your experience with NTR haters is just that, your experience, overall depending on the side of the wall that you are you will see different things, I'm kind of neutral on NTR, I never play to lose, but I don't like easy victories and the haters I have seen aren't what you say, I have seen patreons public posts being bombarded with haters messages, developers telling that the haters don't stop messaging them, one of the most recent example is the developer of goddess saga: darkness, ask the developer if you want and if you want a list of games that suffered too much hate for it then I can make one of you, I still remember many games being heavily attacked for it.

This is something that happens a lot.

And here is something that you should understand, Ann and Eric is part of the storyline, that part should never be avoidable. It's what motivates the story, of course on the sisters case you are right, it should be avoidable based on choices and actions. Even more it's wrong to call that NTR, that the mother of the character gets a boyfriend.

But the main point is the following, what you are asking is exactly the opposite of what I think, you see the only thing I'm asking is for a challenge and difficulty that I can overcome, while what you ask is to absolutely separate them and make them into routes. The funny thing is that what I ask can actually give you the game you want, but what you ask is impossible to give it to me:

-If you divide the game in paths, it is based on direct options/choices, you kind of killed all the interaction you can have in the game and all actions that the characters can take. You choose the path so you get it from beginning to end.

-If on the other hand follow what I propose the game itself would be more like a challenge and it would be easy to add a way out for those that dislike it, you just need an option like disable NTR and lock all stats that Eric has with the girls at 0. It would let you play the game without fear of NTR, albeit the experience would be more interesting if you tried and won.

Lastly about your financial point... it worked like that when the adult market started, but now... not so much. Overall this is something that happens a lot, first we go into games that try to offer a bit for everyone, but then when the number of games increase, people won't be able to support all of them, so they will only support those that give a concept that attracts them more, that has a biggest representation of their fetishes. Overall what truly matters is the concept and that people like it. Personally I'm the first one that dislikes pure unavoidable NTR from beginning to end, I can understand to use it at the beginning as a resource to motivate the story, but later on I only want it to exist in the avoidable version.



I totally agree with you, in fact the mother is kind of messed up to submit so fast. But well overall in the aspect of competition, I only ask for a competition that I can win, starting at an unfair point it makes it more sweet the victory.



About this part I suppose you didn't notice the quality drop in storyline, the incomplete parts because of a rushed kicking of Eric and how the game tried to generate a different antagonist by using Alice and forcing her character to evolve that way out of nowhere.

Well if you played BB you would know that Eric would have stole the family home kicked everyone out and Max would have bin in the military. Eric did not care about Ann or the girls. He had a wife or girl friend. His plan was to get the house then go back to her.

 

[DawnCry]

Well if you played BB you would know that Eric would have stole the family home kicked everyone out and Max would have bin in the military. Eric did not care about Ann or the girls. He had a wife or girl friend. His plan was to get the house then go back to her.

And I hope this game doesn't copy the original.

 

[ptahn]

I actually do wonder if you read me, mainly because reading you the only thing that comes to my head is "I didn't say that!", what I did say was:

-I critic how the mother developed the relationship, I critic too how the developer did try to force Alice to suddenly become the antagonist. I'm not defending the storyline or how we got here, what I do say is that I prefer an interactive gameplay rather than one based on routes. Overall I talked about gameplay compared to story, it isn't a contradiction.

-Here you won't see the same as in patreon because we have mods that are quite good at it. If the conversation derails too much they usually stop it and even delete posts.

-Again, what I said is that the games are related to the concept and that people support the thing that is nearest to it. You are saying it "it gives what his paying audience wants", this sentence is exactly what I mean, I'm not saying that all games should have x or y which is what you imply in the message.

Mate I'm not singing the virtues of big brother, however I do defend that the original concept was an interactive gameplay in which opportunities could end up badly and that it required something else than following just a storyline.

Sorry if I misunderstood you, but you did say there was a decline in the story line and not that you disliked the change in game play.

I am not saying that all games should have X or not have Y. I said that games that have X and not Y make more money. As a general rule games (especially new games) make more money and do it faster if they do not have unavoidable NTR (or NTR-ish) content. If the game were moderately successful and got to the point were it was making a little over $3000/month; would a developer add a non-NTR path if it meant another $1000/month? Is Eric's role worth $12,000 over a year. The dev is already talking about moving more quickly with the removal of Eric. Getting rid of Eric quicker will not make the non-NTR people happy. For them the damage has already been done. Quite frankly if the developer is not going to make the content avoidable he may as well keep Eric as long as he wants. Although the faster he gets rid of Eric, the faster a Mod can be made to remove him immediately; as happened in the original. However as a developer, would you really want to have someone have to create a Mod to "fix" your game. I put "fix" in quotation marks to indicate that only some people would see this as a fix.

 

[troll822]

To be fair... so far Eric doesn't appear to be a butthole. No "I will fuck all your family and you can do nothing to stop it", yet. So far, he's a man in his 40s and goes for Ann. Nothing bad in that.

 

[DawnCry]

Sorry if I misunderstood you, but you did say there was a decline in the story line and not that you disliked the change in game play.

I am not saying that all games should have X or not have Y. I said that games that have X and not Y make more money. As a general rule games (especially new games) make more money and do it faster if they do not have unavoidable NTR (or NTR-ish) content. If the game were moderately successful and got to the point were it was making a little over $3000/month; would a developer add a non-NTR path if it meant another $1000/month? Is Eric's role worth $12,000 over a year. The dev is already talking about moving more quickly with the removal of Eric. Getting rid of Eric quicker will not make the non-NTR people happy. For them the damage has already been done. Quite frankly if the developer is not going to make the content avoidable he may as well keep Eric as long as he wants. Although the faster he gets rid of Eric, the faster a Mod can be made to remove him immediately; as happened in the original. However as a developer, would you really want to have someone have to create a Mod to "fix" your game. I put "fix" in quotation marks to indicate that only some people would see this as a fix.

No problem mate, but yeah perhaps saying decline shouldn't be the word. Overall I get what you mean and I do agree with most of it.

But as I said before it's a question of concepts, here is the interesting thing, in big brother concept Eric is important and it was expected to be the antagonist, not something that you kick in a question of seconds, what happened with the original big brother is mostly what you said but in the double reality it has:

-People that hate NTR weren't happy that Eric was in the game, even if they could kick him fast they weren't satisfied

-People that like NTR weren't happy with how fast Eric got kicked, they felt betrayed for that.

Overall as you said the damage is already done and nothing that happens will solve it. So the question is, can you accept that Eric got to have sex with Ann? if you can then it is more than acceptable to ask for a way to avoid stuff between Eric and the sisters, but what doesn't make sense is kind of hoping that it gets remade and Eric disappears. Overall I proposed a way trying to make most of the people happy:

-Interactive fight with Eric for those that like NTR or just enjoy to have a challenge.
-Locking all stats related to Eric to 0 so that the game won't let any event related to NTR happen.

 

[ptahn]

No problem mate, but yeah perhaps saying decline shouldn't be the word. Overall I get what you mean and I do agree with most of it.

But as I said before it's a question of concepts, here is the interesting thing, in big brother concept Eric is important and it was expected to be the antagonist, not something that you kick in a question of seconds, what happened with the original big brother is mostly what you said but in the double reality it has:

-People that hate NTR weren't happy that Eric was in the game, even if they could kick him fast they weren't satisfied

-People that like NTR weren't happy with how fast Eric got kicked, they felt betrayed for that.

Overall as you said the damage is already done and nothing that happens will solve it. So the question is, can you accept that Eric got to have sex with Ann? if you can then it is more than acceptable to ask for a way to avoid stuff between Eric and the sisters, but what doesn't make sense is kind of hoping that it gets remade and Eric disappears. Overall I proposed a way trying to make most of the people happy:

-Interactive fight with Eric for those that like NTR or just enjoy to have a challenge.
-Locking all stats related to Eric to 0 so that the game won't let any event related to NTR happen.

I don't want Eric to have sex with Ann. There are other choices. Max could talk Ann out of ever having a relationship with Eric; not a good idea to be dating the boss or (more fitting to the other manners of removing Eric) file an anonymous sexual harassment claim at their workplace (Ann works there two days, gets a promotion and immediately starts dating the boss. I am sure that someone at the office would have a problem with that.) Ann's and Eric's relationship could proceed at a reasonable pace (Eric doesn't move in and start sleeping with Ann in a week's time) giving Max time to do battle with Eric before Eric starts having sex with Ann.

 

[DawnCry]

I don't want Eric to have sex with Ann. There are other choices. Max could talk Ann out of ever having a relationship with Eric; not a good idea to be dating the boss or (more fitting to the other manners of removing Eric) file an anonymous sexual harassment claim at their workplace (Ann works there two days, gets a promotion and immediately starts dating the boss. I am sure that someone at the office would have a problem with that.) Ann's and Eric's relationship could proceed at a reasonable pace (Eric doesn't move in and start sleeping with Ann in a week's time) giving Max time to do battle with Eric before Eric starts having sex with Ann.

I'm just saying that what you say here I do agree with it, but that I wouldn't count on something that already got added to the game to be reworked to make more sense. Overall if I was free to choose the setting I would have made it that:

-Ann has been dating Eric for a year
-The house is property of Eric
-You all go there because their relationship is strong enough already.

Overall this would be my option, you for example I suppose that you would prefer that Ann starts dating Eric at most but you can sabotage their relationship so that they don't have sex and break up.

However personally I like to get Eric in the house for the interactive part of fighting him off and protecting the sisters, compared to just Ann.

 

[maxbishup]

To be fair... so far Eric doesn't appear to be a butthole. No "I will fuck all your family and you can do nothing to stop it", yet. So far, he's a man in his 40s and goes for Ann. Nothing bad in that.

I must agree with you on that I just hope that it will stay like that. If he is only after Ann and dose not try to take the house from her or go after the girls I will be in no rush to get rid of him. But I would still like to take a baseball bat to his head.
Maybe if I could find tweezers small enough to hold it out and cut off his dick with rusty razer blade. Just saying

 

[ptahn]

I must agree with you on that I just hope that it will stay like that. If he is only after Ann and dose not try to take the house from her or go after the girls I will be in no rush to get rid of him. But I would still like to take a baseball bat to his head.
Maybe if I could find tweezers small enough to hold it out and cut off his dick with rusty razer blade. Just saying

Have you played the original? I'm positive Eric is not and will not be a nice guy.

 

[DawnCry]

Have you played the original? I'm positive Eric is not and will not be a nice guy.

We are hoping that he isn't such a dick. Overall I do hope he tries to get the sisters and we can stop him, but Eric I didn't like that he was such an asshole.

 

[maxbishup]

Have you played the original? I'm positive Eric is not and will not be a nice guy.

Yes I have and I agree why do you think I want to hit him with a baseball bat and cut his dick off. I only agreed that so far in this game he has not told Max that he plans to fuck all the girls. He told max this on his first day in BB. I am certain Eric is up to no good in this game as well.