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Nobody032

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Sep 6, 2021
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So just went back to continuing my playthrough which was at loop 7 and was again wondering whether Reign's Aversion trait is actually supposed to make all chosen start with 1G angst? The wording of it makes it sound like it is not supposed to do that and having permanent 1G angst which equals +29 base damage and +5 ee generation(If chosen is pre broken) at day 1 seems a bit too broken.
Also Don't know if the bug which made devils get their Damage reduction from this 1G angst was fixed or not. Will have to check later.

Btw has anyone been able to get t4 breaks on her?(Other than the Innocence one).
Also Has anyone tested Propaganda item on her?(It gives 50% punisher progress to everyone per Truce day)
 

Nightclaw

Newbie
Jan 12, 2018
39
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143
From my experience of AversionReign (primarily from the current run), I can agree that the trait is likely the strongest of the options. I've also had Empty Vessel from loop 11, which I feel is the best item, but I still think it's the strongest in most scenarios.

Some of the other traits are more powerful for niche gameplans, especially in later loops when the Aversion trait has reduced usefulness with better built forsaken. Aversion is also the hardest to beat Reign in the final fight since her damage reduction and applicable T3 moves makes it hard to achieve.

Devils say they get the damage reduction from it but it definitely doesn't feel like they do, so that's presumably just a visual bug. Speaking of bugs, I do recall Propaganda was bugfixed a while back to no longer give full 50% progress on her.

I've found T4 breaks, other than CON, are easily achievable by the end of her 3rd fight (or earlier) but CON is really slow to raise since you only get 1 shot at it per day/fight and it will generally fire really early so you only gets a 3-4% per. Perhaps 2 chances with Hot Tag but I haven't tested that out.

I know I was only on track to break T4 CON on Reign in the Loop 28 fight, before she was auto-despair'd away from me.
 

Nobody032

Member
Sep 6, 2021
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From my experience of AversionReign (primarily from the current run), I can agree that the trait is likely the strongest of the options. I've also had Empty Vessel from loop 11, which I feel is the best item, but I still think it's the strongest in most scenarios.

Some of the other traits are more powerful for niche gameplans, especially in later loops when the Aversion trait has reduced usefulness with better built forsaken. Aversion is also the hardest to beat Reign in the final fight since her damage reduction and applicable T3 moves makes it hard to achieve.

Devils say they get the damage reduction from it but it definitely doesn't feel like they do, so that's presumably just a visual bug. Speaking of bugs, I do recall Propaganda was bugfixed a while back to no longer give full 50% progress on her.

I've found T4 breaks, other than CON, are easily achievable by the end of her 3rd fight (or earlier) but CON is really slow to raise since you only get 1 shot at it per day/fight and it will generally fire really early so you only gets a 3-4% per. Perhaps 2 chances with Hot Tag but I haven't tested that out.

I know I was only on track to break T4 CON on Reign in the Loop 28 fight, before she was auto-despair'd away from me.
I don't really think other traits of Reign can compare to how much use you can get out of the aversion one. If I had to rank them It would be :
Aversion>>Temptation>Despair>Rampage

Megalomaniac=Negotiation=Do they even have any use case?

Yeah I assumed the propaganda one would be fixed if it existed.

About the t4 breaks, I was wondering if they were possible at loop 7/14 without having the 200% requirement achievement. I know someone was able to get t4 Innocence break at loop 7 before, though I assume it requires stacking the Hypnosis achivement every loop.

For t4 Morality and Dignity is it better to go for quality or quantity? Like get high levels of hate/expo or try to do more of those at a lower level?

For t4 Confidence what strategy did you use? I think the best one would be to get a good Megalomaniac Forsaken and then spamming Manever after maximising the surrounds on the other two chosen. So not even touching Reign the whole round till you get high enough surrounds on the other chosens.

Since I got the second in command item at loop 9 I was thinking of maybe going back and letting Reign go to give it a shot since I won't have to deal with Splendor as second in command but I already played through loop 9 so I think I will just keep going for Mechanical chosen now.
 

SSkyfire

New Member
Aug 8, 2017
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142
I've been playing this off and on for years, and I really do like it, but I always get stressed out over the time limits as I'm not very good at the efficiency/order of operations gameplay part (and yet I prefer to kind of muddle my way through instead of following guides). Is there any chance for an "easy" mode that removes the time limit (basically, so it's always on the player to trigger the final battle when ready) but maybe disables achievements or something?
 

Nightclaw

Newbie
Jan 12, 2018
39
13
143
I don't really think other traits of Reign can compare to how much use you can get out of the aversion one. If I had to rank them It would be :
Aversion>>Temptation>Despair>Rampage

Megalomaniac=Negotiation=Do they even have any use case?
As an example for where other traits are better than Aversion, I had an earlier run that used Mobile Dungeon and spent 2 early loop days training an Aversion Undead to get a bunch of EE and something like 40-50G of angst on the chosen to set up for other forsaken to do the rest.

In that case, the Aversion trait is fairly pointless compared to the Megalomaniac one which gives double damage when only 1 chosen is surrounded (I believe the wiki still has that and the despair trait swapped) since getting chosen above 1G angst is achieved a different way.

Negotiation and Despair I can't really think of any uses that wouldn't likely just work out under one of the other traits but those are the easiest ways to permanently defeat Reign so maybe that's their use?

I can't remember if it was actually stated but I think that eventually the campaign will play out differently depending on how you corrupt Reign, among other decisions.

About the t4 breaks, I was wondering if they were possible at loop 7/14 without having the 200% requirement achievement. I know someone was able to get t4 Innocence break at loop 7 before, though I assume it requires stacking the Hypnosis achivement every loop.

For t4 Morality and Dignity is it better to go for quality or quantity? Like get high levels of hate/expo or try to do more of those at a lower level?

For t4 Confidence what strategy did you use? I think the best one would be to get a good Megalomaniac Forsaken and then spamming Manever after maximising the surrounds on the other two chosen. So not even touching Reign the whole round till you get high enough surrounds on the other chosens.
By loop 14, you'll generally have 400% base requirement (25 value of chosen breaks), unless you did all the loop skips, and a forsaken with reduced requirement punisher so getting to 300% or so isn't too horrible aside from confidence.

My usual go-to for Reign is to rarely let her use the T3 moves until the loop is won, and then use the remaining days on purposefully grinding up the tally. For MOR and DIG, I find quantity is better, staggering the chosen's surrounds so that only 1 is targeted each use of the move. That lets you get a decent number of uses each fight.

Confidence's Detonate move I haven't found an easy way to raise it other than waste days getting a tiny increase. I haven't thought of another option to get INJU up to a high level without using a commander that's susceptible to the move.
 

PlagueHouse

New Member
Apr 22, 2022
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not sure if this is a known thing or part of the new release but on the off chance it is I will detail my experience here:

the sequence of actions I followed is to load a game, immediately head to either purity or mirages profilen and then meet up with them. from there I strip them and then tie them up, then I molest them. and consistently whenever their pleasure reaches level 2 (be it through kissing, clit rubbing, ect... from "not really turned on" to "blushing and distracted") the option to execute the next turn appears greyed out... this happens *regardless* of if one of their barriers is about to be undone or if they are about to terminate the session from an anger overload and seems to be entirely unrelated.. but it is tied to pleasure (I realize the ropes might have been irrelevant info but I hear that when making a report like this it is good to be as detailed as possible).

if this ends up being a waste of time my sincerest apologies but hopefully this proves to be of some use evidence 1 for glitch.png evidence 2 for glitch.png
 

Nobody032

Member
Sep 6, 2021
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As an example for where other traits are better than Aversion, I had an earlier run that used Mobile Dungeon and spent 2 early loop days training an Aversion Undead to get a bunch of EE and something like 40-50G of angst on the chosen to set up for other forsaken to do the rest.

In that case, the Aversion trait is fairly pointless compared to the Megalomaniac one which gives double damage when only 1 chosen is surrounded (I believe the wiki still has that and the despair trait swapped) since getting chosen above 1G angst is achieved a different way.
I personally prefer having bonuses which don't have a particular conditions for there uses (In your example you need to have Mobile dungeon). With Aversoon trait you get:
-Starting base damage bonus which also helps with Devil chosen.
-Starting energy bonus if you get pre-broken chosen(Pretty common). Even more helpful if you don't sacrifice forsaken or don't have low cost undead forsaken to start things off.
-Free negotiations in every loop as long you get the breaks.
-Helps with keeping up ee generation against Angel chosen in case you are having trouble with that.

Well in the end I think we both agree on this though. In most normal playthroughs with item rng it's better to pick the most consistent buff. Unless you are going for some role playing.


Negotiation and Despair I can't really think of any uses that wouldn't likely just work out under one of the other traits but those are the easiest ways to permanently defeat Reign so maybe that's their use?

I can't remember if it was actually stated but I think that eventually the campaign will play out differently depending on how you corrupt Reign, among other decisions.
I think the despair trait might have been made for the old despair condition. Weird that it hasn't been reworked. Tbh as long as you get a t3 break first most distortions are easy to trigger. T3 Innocence for Temptation. T3 Morality for both Rampage and Aversion.Megalmaniac just requires you to get conditions then break her partners instead.

Reign is kinda weird to me. She is supposed to be a reoccurring boss but because of how she works it's much more easier to just get her loop 7.
Before her description used to say that she would need level 2 in a circumstance to do t3 action which made sense because I thought you weren't supposed to beat her this early but now because she does it at level 1 it's actually even easier to beat her with a distortion at loop 7 while getting like 5 breaks + distortion. Hopefully you will get a really good bonus for beating her on her last appearance but would you even need it at that point?

My usual go-to for Reign is to rarely let her use the T3 moves until the loop is won, and then use the remaining days on purposefully grinding up the tally. For MOR and DIG, I find quantity is better, staggering the chosen's surrounds so that only 1 is targeted each use of the move. That lets you get a decent number of uses each fight.

Confidence's Detonate move I haven't found an easy way to raise it other than waste days getting a tiny increase. I haven't thought of another option to get INJU up to a high level without using a commander that's susceptible to the move.
It might be because I just forgot to maneuver once and she didn't get level 1 hate but I remember that Reign didn't use her Slaughter when only one chosen was surrounded and only used it when both were. Could be wrong here though.

Okay I am kinda dumb. I forgot that her detonate trigger conditon is inju level 1 and not "x turn till detonate" which means no maneuvering allowed with Inju in combat style. Seems like getting a t4 confidence break at loop 7 is probably impossible. Though if you can somehow get enough breaks in only loop 7 then it might be possible to get more than 3% a day increase in loop 14.
 

Nightclaw

Newbie
Jan 12, 2018
39
13
143
Well in the end I think we both agree on this though. In most normal playthroughs with item rng it's better to pick the most consistent buff. Unless you are going for some role playing.
Yeah, I agree that the Aversion trait is the most useful trait in the majority of cases. And in the other cases, I'd say Megalomaniac is best.

In theory you could lock in Aversion for early loops and swap to Megalomaniac in loop 21 but that would require going T2 INN (to break out of Aversion and allow the swap) then T3 INN and then Megalomaniac distortion. Not the easiest thing to do at that stage of the game, but potentially possible.
Reign is kinda weird to me. She is supposed to be a reoccurring boss but because of how she works it's much more easier to just get her loop 7.
Before her description used to say that she would need level 2 in a circumstance to do t3 action which made sense because I thought you weren't supposed to beat her this early but now because she does it at level 1 it's actually even easier to beat her with a distortion at loop 7 while getting like 5 breaks + distortion. Hopefully you will get a really good bonus for beating her on her last appearance but would you even need it at that point?
I think the main reward for beating her in Loop 35 would be to actually win the campaign, but yes it's been said before that she's currently in a temporary state that will change when work on the campaign ending/routes happens.

I believe she's not going to be possible to beat early in her 'true' form, probably due to timey-wimey shenanigans based on her story and stats page.
It might be because I just forgot to maneuver once and she didn't get level 1 hate but I remember that Reign didn't use her Slaughter when only one chosen was surrounded and only used it when both were. Could be wrong here though.
To be honest, I can't actually remember if Reign acts differently with Slaughter but that's what I remember doing back in the MegaloReign run which was 6+ months ago.
 

fenyx

Member
Jun 16, 2017
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so, most of my loops ends at day 20...what is the treshold for despairing when that happens? Impossible?
 

Nobody032

Member
Sep 6, 2021
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So I am not exactly sure if this is the intended modifier or not but seems a bit weird to go from 50 day deadline at loop 10 to having 20 day deadline at loop 11 when I have also flipped the city modifier trait of Splendor.

1000321390.png

Also I remember I asked about if Rampage logic was changed or not a while back. This is a screenshot from that time, don't know if it was/is intended but Stigma here didn't do Rampage downtime. Haven't really seen it again.

1000321389.png


so, most of my loops ends at day 20...what is the treshold for despairing when that happens? Impossible?
You need level 3 despair achievement to start getting despair in 20 days loop. You will need to do it in 5 days with it.
 

fenyx

Member
Jun 16, 2017
241
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So I am not exactly sure if this is the intended modifier or not but seems a bit weird to go from 50 day deadline at loop 10 to having 20 day deadline at loop 11 when I have also flipped the city modifier trait of Splendor.

View attachment 5213252

Also I remember I asked about if Rampage logic was changed or not a while back. This is a screenshot from that time, don't know if it was/is intended but Stigma here didn't do Rampage downtime. Haven't really seen it again.

View attachment 5213254



You need level 3 despair achievement to start getting despair in 20 days loop. You will need to do it in 5 days with it.
OOOh so since I didnt despair anyone in my current playtrought I locked myself out of despairing

Im at loop 31 or 32 and wanted to despair some mechanicals (I have one of each already except for normal that i got 2,despair and second in command, that I got none)
 

xBlackPearlx

New Member
Sep 17, 2024
10
1
13
Most of my male forsaken have Anal Wombs, how do I make the Chosen impregnate them?

I do have forsaken of different fighting styles, and each in a position (Stud, Hypnotist, Harvester and Publicist). I already went through multiple loops (I already defeated Splendor, and I am going to fight Victory), but I dont believe I ever saw any option related to that.
 

Quiet Days

New Member
Jun 12, 2021
13
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100
Yeah, I agree that the Aversion trait is the most useful trait in the majority of cases. And in the other cases, I'd say Megalomaniac is best.

In theory you could lock in Aversion for early loops and swap to Megalomaniac in loop 21 but that would require going T2 INN (to break out of Aversion and allow the swap) then T3 INN and then Megalomaniac distortion. Not the easiest thing to do at that stage of the game, but potentially possible.

I think the main reward for beating her in Loop 35 would be to actually win the campaign, but yes it's been said before that she's currently in a temporary state that will change when work on the campaign ending/routes happens.

I believe she's not going to be possible to beat early in her 'true' form, probably due to timey-wimey shenanigans based on her story and stats page.

To be honest, I can't actually remember if Reign acts differently with Slaughter but that's what I remember doing back in the MegaloReign run which was 6+ months ago.
Aversion is definitely usually better than the others, but I think rampage/temptation can overshadow megalomaniac most of the time.

Megalomaniac with 150 EE on 50 EE events definitely has use, but I find that the hardest part of the run is getting everyone ready for distortions early without breaking the wrong vulnerability. By the time I get a T4 downtime the run is basically already a victory.

Temptation I think is mostly for unaltered commander setups (demon pepper builds) since it is basically free evil energy off of the cost or free extra turns, which never hurts to have. It also lets you make plays for early breaks sooner since you can stretch out those initial fights more which is actually hard to do before angel forsaken let you create huge extermination requirements, or you have an item setup to force the situation

Rampage is probably... for rampage builds, funny enough. Rampage is the one I usually induce early to stock up on EE. The initial 100 EE injection is great, and 30 EE per day is also really nice. That % damage is very good and can let you stockpile the buff when things start getting hairy in the later loops and skipping to the end is dangerous. Extra scaling methods are always something worth collecting, especially when it's something you collect anyways. I do wonder though if that buff applies to itself like reality sealing. That would make it quite strong

Reign is also definitely not going to remain in this state forever, I was discussing her despair buff not working for me a few updates ago (I was building a setup for an absolutely brutal day 1) when the dev told me that her defeat stuff is effectively a placeholder and won't be complete until the end of campaign mode is ready. I think that was update 64 so... that happened somewhere around page 290-300.
 

Nightclaw

Newbie
Jan 12, 2018
39
13
143
Aversion is definitely usually better than the others, but I think rampage/temptation can overshadow megalomaniac most of the time.

Megalomaniac with 150 EE on 50 EE events definitely has use, but I find that the hardest part of the run is getting everyone ready for distortions early without breaking the wrong vulnerability. By the time I get a T4 downtime the run is basically already a victory.
When I say Megalomaniac for Reign here, I'm referring to the in-game effect and not the one listed on the wiki. That is "When only one chosen is surrounded/captured, they take double damage."

It became very noticeably useful in the later loops when damage reduction was really stacking up. For the initial parts of each fight when the chosen are trickling in and the first doesn't have the EXPO damage buff.

Unless that's changed since then, of course, but I preface my assessment being based off a run with her distorted that way which was a while back.
 

Quiet Days

New Member
Jun 12, 2021
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When I say Megalomaniac for Reign here, I'm referring to the in-game effect and not the one listed on the wiki. That is "When only one chosen is surrounded/captured, they take double damage."

It became very noticeably useful in the later loops when damage reduction was really stacking up. For the initial parts of each fight when the chosen are trickling in and the first doesn't have the EXPO damage buff.

Unless that's changed since then, of course, but I preface my assessment being based off a run with her distorted that way which was a while back.
Ah, okay, that's what it says for despair lol. Yeah that double damage seemed really helpful. sadly I didn't get to try it, since I thought it came with a different distortion. Maybe I'll give it another shot this next campaign for v68.
 
Mar 27, 2018
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This is a weird question/bug, but I've been experimenting with size limits for the Chosen, and it seems to me that specifically for breast sizes it's impossible for it to ever generate the "outer limit" sizes (the numbers on the edges of whatever you set). So, for example, if you leave it on no limits (0-5), then the game will never generate 0 (flat chest) or 5 (enormous breasts), you'll only get sizes 1, 2, 3, or 4. If you change the limits to 1-3, then it'll be unable to generate sizes 1 or 3, so all of the Chosen will have breast size 2 ("pert breasts"). The only way to ever get sizes 0 or 5 is to disallow all other sizes (setting the limits to 0-0, or 5-5), which means all Chosen will have the same size (flat chest or enormous breasts).

It's kind of a petty complaint, but I do like variety. Please give us the full range of tiddies!
 

fenyx

Member
Jun 16, 2017
241
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bug report
You cant aproach anybody with the current body of the demon

By the way, if you are interested, CSDEV, this is how a bunch of forsaken looks like if you almost NEVER train them in 30 something loops, and sacrifice anyone that you consider "useless", also, how devils leave your most useful and favourite forsaken.
This is probably how a bad at math person plays your game haha

I decided to start the game again and choose different things, after finding out I cant currently despair anyone
 
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