Others Corruption of Champions II [v0.7.37] [Savin/Salamander Studios]

[Kallisto]

Do you think someone like this would be remedied if PC was actually likable/not a fool? I am mostly asking cause I have a project planned, but I am not sure I'll have enough power to add branching paths and major choices for quest. I can understand how annoying it can be when you can control every aspect of the main character... except how they interact with others and what decisions they make, but I am simply gathering info on whether or not this type of narrative is a lost cause or can work with better writing, likable characters e.t.c.

I think it can work but its like Wrynn13 said: the player not having multiple branching paths and only being given one path to go down, is not the same as a writer telling the player how their character should feel. Tobs does both but it's probably the latter that pisses people off the most. And I honestly think simple dialogue choices for the player to react to what's happen wouldn't be a mountain of work to include. Like I'm not saying we need huge branching paths or anything.

Take the Gweyr example I used before. We're asked if we think Gweyr is a monster for choosing to kill the young cultists instead of doing literally anything else. It was stated that she was so much stronger than them, that killing them was trivial for her. To me, that says she had other options. Because if you're strong enough to swat people down like flies, you're strong enough to subdue them without killing them. Killing them was just easier. So the player gets two choices in the response: Yes or No. If you choose No, you say that you don't believe she's a monster, you believe she did what had to be done. If you choose yes, you somehow end up back to saying she did what had to be done. In this case Tobs gave us a false choice, because both choices lead us to say Gweyr was right. And in this story, Tobs wants to tell the tale of some badass psycho who was ultimately right all along and gets forgiven at the end. There's no room in his narrative for the player to disagree, so he doesn't give us the option to. If he had just had us say "Yes you're a monster, because you were strong enough to choose another way to deal with the situation, but you didn't. And now, even years later, you still believe you did the 'hard but right thing' that no one else had the balls to do, and you wonder why the village turned on you...for killing their loved ones."

I don't think that would add too much work. You would only need to use a more neutral tone for the player as you go forward, and then reference that variable when Gweyr gets back to town.

 

[Daken9]

Dude, Gweyr's quest is so laughable from a narrative perspective.

Could've been about a good person doing a bad thing and lying to herself about it ["No" option ---> She realizes her mistake, does NOT go back to her family but rather decides to stick to the wilds and redeem herself by helping travelers and the like (maybe sexy time with the PC), effectively the good ending].

Could've been about warrior too jaded to consider alternatives ["Yes" option ---> She goes back to her family but doesn't learn anything from her ordeal, hence the lukeworm reception she ends up receiving anyway from Gwyn and Garth, and maybe even ends up being a bad influence on Garrett or something, effectively the bad ending].

Could've been, y'know, actually complex characters and nuanced topics. Instead it's Jaime "i never really cared about the innocent" Lannister. Which, now that i think about it, yeah. Not many writers could have done a worse job with S8 of GoT, but with how convoluted yet utterly black&white his content actually is despite all the striving, i'd say Tobs is one of them.

 

[KloneZone]

Really I just wanted to fuck Gweyr that was the main thing I wanted to get from the whole questline.

 

[MSGTNP]

I kind of disagree here, IMO a good porn game is one that manages to blend the porn and the gameplay such that one leads into the other and vice versa. RPG's that have porn in them are a dime a dozen but the real gems are things like Karyn's prison, otherwise the best porn game would be Elden Ring but with Melania having nipples.

I do somewhat agree about CoC2 though, as an RPG it's very weak but TBH they've never really tried to court that crowd. From CoC to TiTs and now to CoC2 it's always been closer to a text adventure/VN than a DnD campaign, the combat is just there to fill the moment to moment stuff and provide an easy explanation for why anyone in universe cares about what the player character has to say (because they just kicked the crap out of their entire army).



It all comes down to your audience, but in general if you're giving players agency over character creation they'll probably expect more choices when it comes to the rest of the game. There's nothing wrong with a linear narative as long as it's consistant with itself and the game as a whole.

Fair enough, a porn game that can't blend both the gameplay and the porn itself well is just setting itself up for failure.

Even as a choose your own adventure VN, it's pretty god dam lacking in meaningful choices. I don't count being able to fuck dickgirl #32 or earth shattering breast girl #69 either. I've read better stuff on my phone honestly than COC II, granted, there not "adult" choose your adventure's VN's but they were still more interesting than this half ass plot they can't even be bothered to finish. At this point, I'm pretty sure most people on here could write a better plot than the dev's who seem more interested in adding half ass, barely fleshed out characters that get basically get abandoned as soon as there added. Fuck, whatever happened to QUALITY over quantity?

 

[Fiz1247]

Really I just wanted to fuck Gweyr that was the main thing I wanted to get from the whole questline.

It's implied that her husband has been cheating on her and has children from various women but when it comes to the player getting Gweyr oh no no can't have the power fantasy there instead like a good boy you will return her to her husband after solving her problems. Maybe if this was CoC1 you could have cucked Garth via a corruption check. Either way it's the same shit as Kinu and should be added in the mods plan as potential content as I want the wolf mama for myself

 

[Skandranon]

It's implied that her husband has been cheating on her and has children from various women but when it comes to the player getting Gweyr oh no no can't have the power fantasy there instead like a good boy you will return her to her husband after solving her problems. Maybe if this was CoC1 you could have cucked Garth via a corruption check. Either way it's the same shit as Kinu and should be added in the mods plan as potential content as I want the wolf mama for myself

As far as I know he was beaten and raped by an orc in one case, and the other one involved a love potion he tested on himself he was trying to buy for Gweyr.

Garth is good peoples.

And as far as I can remember, actual cheating content has never happened in all three games.

 

[muschi26]

the other one involved a love potion he tested on himself he was trying to buy for Gweyr

Isn't cheating under the effects of drugs/alcohol still be considered cheating? Then again, the rules might be different with a fantasy love potion.

 

[Raf-Raf]

Isn't cheating under the effects of drugs/alcohol still be considered cheating? Then again, the rules might be different with a fantasy love potion.

Ah yes, the perfect excuse.
Alcohol, It wasn't me it was the alcohol.

 

[KloneZone]

the other one involved a love potion he tested on himself he was trying to buy for Gweyr.

Why did he test the love potion on himself? What made him think that was a good idea?

 

[Skandranon]

Why did he test the love potion on himself? What made him think that was a good idea?

Well...it was from Evergreen.
He went to a weird, creepy possibly immortal literal witch in a castle in the woods who gave him a mysterious potion.

Making sure it wasn't going to kill the woman he wanted to marry was probably the goal.

 

[Coaxmetal]

Aileh is such a breath of fresh air. Brienne got a serious competitor for #1.

I'm carefully dosing her content to make exploring the fucking awful glacier somewhat tolerable. Still dreading the actual quest there.

 

[KloneZone]

Well...it was from Evergreen.
He went to a weird, creepy possibly immortal literal witch in a castle in the woods who gave him a mysterious potion.

Making sure it wasn't going to kill the woman he wanted to marry was probably the goal.

Wait this was before they got married? If that's the case wouldn't be better to make sure that she loves you for real instead of using a love potion?

 

[Skandranon]

Wait this was before they got married? If that's the case wouldn't be better to make sure that she loves you for real instead of using a love potion?

Probably, but he was young and dumb and in love at the time, according to him. Made some stupid decisions.

 

[M0nte]

That still sounds like he was going to drug her which is not the best look, to say the least.... Can anyone post the actual text?

 

[Raf-Raf]

So basically Garth cucked the guy she's probably going to love for real with his damn potion.

 

[Skandranon]

Actually I was wrong as to the context, it was after he was married, and he was trying to get her to come home with hi while she was in the wild.

Been a while, sorry.

Gweyr's words:

"It's... well, all about the context. I understand the orc thing wasn't really his fault given that he did it under duress, and as for the other one... well, that love potion he stupidly drank was meant for me in a bid to try and convince me to come home with him one of those years. That he ended up feeling guilty about it and was bamboozled into downing the thing himself... well, I prefer that he felt guilty about the idea of drugging me rather than not feeling guilty about it, to be sure.

 

[KloneZone]

Actually I was wrong as to the context, it was after he was married, and he was trying to get her to come home with hi while she was in the wild.

Been a while, sorry.

Gweyr's words:

"It's... well, all about the context. I understand the orc thing wasn't really his fault given that he did it under duress, and as for the other one... well, that love potion he stupidly drank was meant for me in a bid to try and convince me to come home with him one of those years. That he ended up feeling guilty about it and was bamboozled into downing the thing himself... well, I prefer that he felt guilty about the idea of drugging me rather than not feeling guilty about it, to be sure.

Ok that makes a bit more sense. I mean I still want to fuck Gweyr either way.

 

[Raf-Raf]

Guess not, that's one way to convince her to come home.

 

[Skandranon]

So basically Garth cucked the guy she's probably going to love for real with his damn potion.

She never actually took it, he scrapped the idea after it made him do something he didn't want to do, ie make a baby with Evergreen (Senja).

 

[Skandranon]

Ok that makes a bit more sense. I mean I still want to fuck Gweyr either way.

You can bang a ghost that looks almost exactly like her!