VN Ren'Py Cosy Cafe [v0.13.1 EA] [Cosy Creator]

[HiHaHo]

Really constructive addition to the discussion sir. /s

maybe there was a reason i only quoted a part off your message?

Yeah this is kinda the problem with this game, everyone is mandatory... girls you don't care about and even the ones you really don't like.

saying this in a Kinetic novel thread is comparable to walking into a steak house as a vegan complaining you don't like that there is meat on the menu. and that is the real problem.
you can try and mask or avoid addressing it further with this rachel thing but that doesn't seem to working really well now does it?
Cosy cafe being kinetic novel isn't a problem at all. its a problem for you! and i won't let you say "its kinda the problem with game" and i don't intend on being subtle about it.


so the rachel thing.
the whole bit about it all is that she is a confirmed main love intrest ,if cosy didn't already spoil that she is going to be part off the harem there would be no one bitching about it until it actually happend.

First impressions matter and rachel got it in a more negative way then others. but don't forget that Vicky was a bitch as well ,how many people would feel different about her if she (together with mika etc.) would've continued doing shit to lucy for a few more updates? how many would've "hated" that she'd join the harem then?
now obviously all this didn't happen and Vicky turned a leaf pretty quickly.

Cosy just is cooking a meal with the ingredient called rachel, some people (myself included) go like :"shit i don't really like the taste off that".
Cosy just keeps on cooking, now a little while later(some updates) you start to smell something,a whiff here there from the kitchen while you're eating other dishes.

That smell has gotten me at least curious about the meal. but cosy isn't done cooking yet so we've got no idea how its going to taste.
now i won't bitch about anyone who actually will try it and say they don't like it, i might even agree with them.
but anyone who gets up and leaves restaurant before trying a bite is a bitch in my books.

 

[netcov]

Cosy just is cooking a meal with the ingredient called rachel

Does it go well with pizza or is it only on applicable with spanking dishes?

 

[HiHaHo]

Does it go well with pizza or is it only on applicable with spanking dishes?

im unsure, haven't had a bite yet , ask again when its served.. chef Cosy Creator when is the rachel dish being served? sooner or later? is simple enough to avoid much spoiling

 

[Meabe37]

Cosy cafe being kinetic novel isn't a problem at all. its a problem for you!

If i walk into a a restaurant with 9 meals that i like and 1 that i found absolutely awful, should i not be allowed to be there?

But alright fair enough. Maybe it was put in a clumsy or in a bad way to express what i was trying to say but i can assure you that it's is not a problem for me. My english is a disaster no matter how hard i'm trying so it probably doesn’t help.

Maybe he should not cook that much with a shit ingredient(Rachel). Vicky was never anyway near as extreme as Rachel is and the way she was is much more easier to accept and understand than Rachel, it's not even close.

Staying in the metaphor: i don't like mushrooms or oysters but i have no problems imagining that some people would like it. But someone cooking and eating a cockroach for example.... probably not, definitively not. My point is: cooking shit end into cooked shit.

Also i never said i was not gonna try it. I said it felt likely that i will drop the game after it or kinda skip her screen time to some extent (because i don't think it's possible to redeem her at all and i know that i don't like cockroach, even cooked) or something like that. I would not be following this thread if i don't plan continuing playing it, at least for now.

I also said "maybe Cosy will pull it off...we'll see". I'm not here to hate or trash talk the game, who truly know maybe i'll find out that actually like "cooked cockroach", like you said. I was just giving my opinion about Rachel. That post you quoted was a clumsy tangent, reacting to the guy reacting to some of my rachel posts earlier, i guess...

Anyway i spent to much time talking about a character i don't like which is very much against my beliefs (cf: Don't waste time talking about anything gaming you don't like on internet forums, it's useless. Better talk about things you like) so i'm gonna stop here and drop a fat: Hannah and Cath best girls bye !

edit: I forgot ! Saying that we are not allowed to criticize her because MC isn't involved with her yet is pretty dumb if you ask me. And of course if she was hidden LI nobody would "bitch" about her (to much) because nobody, in their right mind, would believe for a second she should/would become one ever.

 

[packor]

It's not hard. It's just that you don't like it, doesn't mean other people don't. No need to make it complicated.

 

[Wolfeszorn]

Cosy just is cooking a meal with the ingredient called rachel, some people (myself included) go like :"shit i don't really like the taste off that".
Cosy just keeps on cooking, now a little while later(some updates) you start to smell something,a whiff here there from the kitchen while you're eating other dishes.

That smell has gotten me at least curious about the meal. but cosy isn't done cooking yet so we've got no idea how its going to taste.
now i won't bitch about anyone who actually will try it and say they don't like it, i might even agree with them.
but anyone who gets up and leaves restaurant before trying a bite is a bitch in my books.

Yeah, well.... I´m smelling something aswell. A character that, at least for me, is already burned to a crisp with no way to save it. Sure, you might be interested in the taste, but it´s going to stay burned, no matter what you do. You can glaze it, you can put spices on it, but it´s definitely not going to change the taste.
It would´ve been one thing if all the stuff would´ve been solved in one of the previous updates. Maybe then some of us would be fine with her, i don´t know. But with all the public accusations, trying to gaslight MC etc. the current Rachel meal has been cooked for so long, it´s beyond saving. And that´s never going to change for me.

Am i going to cancel my subscription because of it? Hell no. I´m just going to do everything in my power to simply avoid or skip her scenes.

 

[HiHaHo]

If i walk into a a restaurant with 9 meals that i like and 1 that i found absolutely awful, should i not be allowed to be there?

My english is a disaster no matter how hard i'm trying so it probably doesn’t help.

how nice off you to not address the point again but just dance around it whilst playing a classic victim card.

this:

Yeah this is kinda the problem with this game, everyone is mandatory... girls you don't care about and even the ones you really don't like.

translates to "9 meals that i like and 1 that i found absolutely awful" so the entire menu is awful.
its not a language barrier here, its a concept off idea's barrier that you seem be having.

It's not hard. It's just that you don't like it, doesn't mean other people don't. No need to make it complicated.

well in simplest terms: he said the game has a problem because he(and some others) can't deny playing through rachel content.
how to solve that problem? make it a choice!, aka make this kinetic novel a non-kinetic novel so i don't have to see something i don't want to see,

Yeah, well.... I´m smelling something aswell. A character that, at least for me, is already burned to a crisp with no way to save it. Sure, you might be interested in the taste, but it´s going to stay burned, no matter what you do. You can glaze it, you can put spices on it, but it´s definitely not going to change the taste.
It would´ve been one thing if all the stuff would´ve been solved in one of the previous updates. Maybe then some of us would be fine with her, i don´t know. But with all the public accusations, trying to gaslight MC etc. the current Rachel meal has been cooked for so long, it´s beyond saving. And that´s never going to change for me.

Am i going to cancel my subscription because of it? Hell no. I´m just going to do everything in my power to simply avoid or skip her scenes.

yeah this all good, you're not saying there is problem with the game because its on the menu and being served, you're just saying you won't like it,but will let it be served to enjoy the rest off the menu

 

[Meabe37]

edit: removed line (sorry about that, i got pissed off for a second, i should have not said that)

What i meant (or tied to) by : "The problem with this game" is : it's really hard to pull off, to make all the girls that the MC is involved with, really likeable. Because it's kinetic and they are no choices, as seen at what i said after it :

"To be able to really pull it off you would need to be insanely good at it, writing i mean (i'm not saying cosy is bad by any means)."

(then yes i tangented on saying some games that would be perfectly fine, in that department,as a kinetic aren't...which might i have been just a bit dumb from me here i agree, maybe)

Like i said earlier it was just wrote it in a bad and clumsy way. But i never meant to say this game shouldn't be kinetic or should be something else... as i also tried to explaining to you earlier.

I also adresed every single things you freaking said what are you talking about.

And top of that you are saying i'm playing the victim card (i'm not) when you clearly white knighting the game. (i can do it too see).

 

[packor]

well in simplest terms: he said the game has a problem because he(and some others) can't deny playing through rachel content.
how to solve that problem? make it a choice!, aka make this kinetic novel a non-kinetic novel so i don't have to see something i don't want to see,

you completely missed My point. I don't care about that at all. Both You and he doesn't like Rachel, etc... other people Do. I don't care about that "kinetic" $%^& in the first place because I don't have a problem with the content.

 

[HiHaHo]

Gosh your dense dude.

What i meant (or tied to) by : "The problem with this game" is : it's really hard to pull off, to make all the girls that the MC is involved with, really likeable. Because it's kinetic and they are no choices, as seen at what i said after it :

"To be able to really pull it off you would need to be insanely good at it, writing i mean (i'm not saying cosy is bad by any means)."

(then yes i tangented on saying some games that would be perfectly fine, in that department,as a kinetic aren't...which might i have been just a bit dumb from me here i agree, maybe)

Like i said earlier it was just wrote it in a bad and clumsy way. But i never meant to say this game shouldn't be kinetic or should be something else... as i also tried to explaining to you earlier.

I also adresed every single things you freaking said what are you talking about.

And top of that you are saying i'm playing the victim card (i'm not) when you clearly white knighting the game. (i can do it too see).

right so.. were in a kinetic novel where choices don't change the story

a guy says "i wish i could avoid rachel and change the story"

you say "this a problem with this game"(you don't have a choice to change the story) "i could be ok with it if written
perfectly in way i like"

i say "you're told upfront that story changing choices aren't possible"

you go "bro you're not helping my narrative""i'm actually ok with not having choices in the story, i just want the choice to not see stuff i don't like"

i go "then why say not having a choice to change the story is a problem" "also rachels story isn't done yet,i didn't like her myself initially now im curious due to developments"

you say " i like 90% off the game , i just don't like 10% off this game am i now a bad person""maybe cosy will make like the 10% later on i'm not sure"

i ask again "stop being stupid and answer:why say not having a choice to change the story is a problem"

you say "you're dense. i never said i have a issue with not having a story changing choice" "i clearly ment you have to be a good writer to make unlikeable character into a likeable one" "you're just being mean because i said something negative about a character in game you like"

somebody (not meabe) please tell me i got trolled and actually am dense.

 

[HiHaHo]

you completely missed My point. I don't care about that at all. Both You and he doesn't like Rachel, etc... other people Do. I don't care about that "kinetic" $%^& in the first place because I don't have a problem with the content.

tbh im on the fence with rachel since last few updates, cosy teased a few possible scenario's that caught my curiosity.

 

[Konrad Simon]

There is something about the types of fans you get in a game.
* The casual player: They are looking for an experience, an escape, a quick fap, whatever, then they go away.
* The niche player: They are looking for a specific kink or type of game which to get off.
* The story player: They are looking for a deep, meaningful story, which triggers their imagination.
* The fan player: They are looking to dissect every word to try and figure out what is going to happen next. This is a subset of the story player, as they get hooked by a specific story and game, and will debate endlessly.

I am more of a story player, but will play games as a casual/niche player at times to suit a mood/purpose. I try not to become too much of a fan player, but have for a few games, because of the story.

Very good and useful distinctions.

 

[justlooking2]

tbh im on the fence with rachel since last few updates, cosy teased a few possible scenario's that caught my curiosity.

Spanking and cuddles will fix her right up. GUARANTEED or your money back!

 

[HiHaHo]

Spanking and cuddles will fix her right up. GUARANTEED or your money back!

spanking in CC is like getting to first base IRL
something just sparked my curiosity that Vicky isn't going to be the biggest freak in the bedroom.

 

[packor]

somebody (not meabe) please tell me i got trolled and actually am dense.

okay. People generally don't like every, single thing about a product. There's usually some things that they wished were different. Meabe is expressing what they don't like. But there's a difference between thinking about it, and asking for it. Meabe is expressing that they internally wished some things were different, but he is not actually Asking for the option. Yes, you picked up that they wanted something different, but the difference is that they are not trying to demand it.

 

[HiHaHo]

okay. People generally don't like every, single thing about a product. There's usually some things that they wished were different. Meabe is expressing what they don't like. But there's a difference between thinking about it, and asking for it. Meabe is expressing that they internally wished some things were different, but he is not actually Asking for the option. Yes, you picked up that they wanted something different, but the difference is that they are not trying to demand it.

thanks i was really convinced that not having a option to change the story in a kinetic novel was a common accepted fact. when one plays one.

now i know im dense and its actually pretty normal to say its a problem that you don't have to option to change a story in a kinetic novel. and everyone understands that means they don't actually want what they say,they just wish it wasn't so.

the next time a game won't start i won't address it as a problem because for dense guys like me "problem = issue that should(needs) be resolved".

thanks packor & Meabe37 now i learned that "problem = i wish it wasn't so,no need to do anything about it".
this has been educational

 

[jI11jaCksjAkk]

the problem with this game

No. The problem is with you.

The story is an artistic work by someone creative enough and dedicated enough to produce it. If you don't like it that's fine (although nobody cares but you) - go play something else that you like better because you'll probably be happier. There are lots of games out there for everybody to find ones they like - certainly more than enough to make whinging about one's you don't like pointless and unnecessary (and in very poor taste).

It's not a "problem with this game" that the way the creator tells HIS story isn't exactly.what you want. Feel free to go make your own game if what you want is different. Art is subjective. You can go to the Louvre and decide you like this painting and dislike another, but you don't ever hear anyone say "This artist was wrong to paint his painting this way - I know better how he/she should have done it." Because that's just dumb.

 

[shitass1001]

Now thats out of everyones systems, who else is excited for the lunch date with Misaki? you guys think they will go straight to bone town? or is that reserved for date two?

Also, who do you guys think got number 5 in the kings game? my guess is Lucy, and because she doesn't have a phone yet she is going to have to get creative to complete the dare, like leaving class during the day to find MC then stripping for him, or using someone else' phone.

 

[packor]

now i know im dense and its actually pretty normal to say its a problem that you don't have to option to change a story in a kinetic novel. and everyone understands that means they don't actually want what they say,they just wish it wasn't so.

the next time a game won't start i won't address it as a problem because for dense guys like me "problem = issue that should(needs) be resolved".

sounds like you really didn't like my interpretation because they said the word "problem". I believe that they just aren't that good at expressing themselves. Would you stop feeling offended if they took back the word "problem" and said that they just personally didn't like it? They would probably be willing to do so.

 

[Cosy Creator]

Just to throw my two cents in: I'm not surprised or upset that people hate Rachel, I deliberately wrote her to be hated. Some of the LIs start out being unlikeable, and then slowly grow into different people; it's a recurrent theme with a number of them, though Rachel is the most extreme example. It may be hard to believe now that she's the most popular, but early on people hated Sarah and wanted me to get rid of her. Same with Catherine, Vicky, and Hannah. Go back far enough in this thread and you'll find pages and pages of people hating Hannah.

So I'm not gonna remove Rachel, or change my plans for her. I might not be able to redeem her in the eyes of her most ardent haters, perhaps I'm not a talented enough writer to pull it off, but I'm certainly gonna try, as that was why I created the character in the first place.

As for significant choices, such as being able to choose characters: they're simply not possible with how I write the story. Granted, I haven't actually read a ton of other AVNs, but the ones I have tend to keep the storylines of the individual girls somewhat separated to get around the need to rewrite a completely alternate universe after every player decision.

Just imagine, as an example, if the player had the option to reject Lucy. With how integrated she is into every event, every story beat, every piece of character development that happens in the MC and the other girls as a consequence of knowing her - all of that would be gone. Their entire character arcs and personalities would have to change to account for her absence. The same is true of each LI after Lucy, as they get more and more integrated into the story and the lives of the other characters; and eventually it would be the same for Rachel, too.