VN Ren'Py Cosy Cafe [v0.13.1 EA] [Cosy Creator]

[Daermon420]

Personally I think it's two things. Firstly, there is the point of view thing I explained already. And secondly there is a fear that if too many people here hate on Rachel enough the dev will drop her which leads to him overcompensating.

Well if their fear is the dev dropping Rachel starting a flame war about her where it becomes very obvious many of us hate her, they aren't doing themselves any favors.

 

[QQP_Purple]

Well if their fear is the dev dropping Rachel starting a flame war about her where it becomes very obvious many of us hate her, they aren't doing themselves any favors.

Do wars ever go the way they are intended?

 

[jadepaladin]

Is Cozy even prone to changing story related things due to feedback, especially something as drastic as dropping a character? I can't remember anything like that happening before. From the time I spend in here, it seems like he has a story to tell and it's gonna be told the way he wants to tell it.

 

[LordDoh]

I'm more than half convinced that, as someone said before, this is trolling. But, if so, I have to admit it is at least creative trolling.

Perhaps doing some cannibal trolling will work?

Hey Guys! I played the game and I think the way MC treats Brian is terrible. Brian is under a lot of pressure and his mother and sister are terrible to him. His fiance also doesn't like him. If only MC love bombed him and gently took care of Brian's emotional needs Brian would be much better off.

That is why MC is cruel and that doesn't mesh well with the way he treat people like Lucy.

 

[jadepaladin]

Perhaps doing some cannibal trolling will work?

Hey Guys! I played the game and I think the way MC treats Brian is terrible. Brian is under a lot of pressure and his mother and sister are terrible to him. His fiance also doesn't like him. If only MC love bombed him and gently took care of Brian's emotional needs Brian would be much better off.

That is why MC is cruel and that doesn't mesh well with the way he treat people like Lucy.

Is this what we're doing now?

Justice for Mika. She's a bitch but it can be fixed with spankings and headpats. Why can't she get the same treatment as Lucy?

 

[Cosy Creator]

Is Cozy even prone to changing story related things due to feedback, especially something as drastic as dropping a character? I can't remember anything like that happening before. From the time I spend in here, it seems like he has a story to tell and it's gonna be told the way he wants to tell it.

Nope, don't worry, she won't be dropped! Ironically enough given the side I've taken in this particular discussion, I've spent the last few years arguing with people that do want me to drop her because I'm of the belief that she is actually redeemable, despite her horrible behaviour so far.

 

[Havik79]

She should be called Karen.

 

[Daermon420]

Nope, don't worry, she won't be dropped! Ironically enough given the side I've taken in this particular discussion, I've spent the last few years arguing with people that do want me to drop her because I'm of the belief that she is actually redeemable, despite her horrible behaviour so far.

Glad you're sticking to your own vision for the game. I also think Rachel is redeemable if you handle it well, despite how much I currently dislike her.

I just find anyone trying to paint her as a victim and the MC in the wrong because he stood up for himself and finally told her off absurd to the point of incredulity.

 

[Sekiryuuten]

Forgive me if I'm misremembering something, but from what I remember, she was not intentionally lying; she genuinely believed that he was harassing/assaulting these girls.

Sadly, the fact that she didn’t even apologize to Hannah after learning the truth doesn’t help her case.

She was not "trying to kill him" (I don't know where you are from, but in the U.S. rape isn't a death sentence nor would death be preferable); she was seeking justice (even though we know she was wrong).

The death wouldn’t come from the justice system — it would come from the other inmates.

She's just a misguided kid who needs to be sat down and talked to and told the gravity of her actions.
That being said, I don't like Rachel, but I do think the MC went too far.

She’s 18, man. And yeah, someone did need to talk to her — and the MC did exactly that.
It was harsh, sure, but it was the truth.

 

[ThaBoooB]

Well, I for one, have been waiting to give Rachel some tender care and spankings, since the first reales.
A lot of unnecessary bickering going on. You guys do know that ppl who are happy with how things are. Are usually quiet. And the angry few looks like they take up allot more space than they actually do.

Let Cosy tell their story. If you can't play, simply just because you don't like a character. Just stop playing or skip past their story bits.

 

[Negan22]

I disagree. The MC and the world in general have given her plenty of cold hard proof already that she is wrong. The onus now is on her.

The reality is that she is not evil. She is doing what she does with good intentions. It's just that her world view is so beyond fucked up. And she needs to wake up and smell reality. If she is willing to do that. If she can get over her pride and change her world view. Than she can be redeemed. And only than does she deserve that redemption.

But this is a step she needs to take on her own. And nobody can do that for her.

I mean I am ok with her coming to MC and confessing that she made a terrible mistake actually I'd prefer this over what I suggested (because I thought it might be too out of character for her to come back and confess as compared to MC who is more sensible than her) but a redemption ark is necessary because she seems like a person whom if MC doesn't take into his care, she would either hurt herself or someone else other than the MC but she can be saved from going both paths.

 

[LordDoh]

Nothing says romantic entanglement quite like "you need to take care of her for the rest if your life because she'll start hurting people other than you otherwise".

On a related note, what about Sarah's sisters? Will they have their redemption arc before or after Brian?

 

[FRVN]

The death wouldn’t come from the justice system — it would come from the other inmates.

You have a "Hollywood" view of prison then, because murder is a very small percentage of deaths in prison, especially in the U.S. (roughly 2%). Although with how the MC acts towards people he doesn't get along with, I wouldn't be surprised if he pissed off the wrong person and ended up in that small percentage.

She’s 18, man. And yeah, someone did need to talk to her — and the MC did exactly that.
It was harsh, sure, but it was the truth.

She needs someone in a position of authority to sit her down and explain to her the dangers of what she is doing, not one of her peers (who is also the victim of her actions). If she continues in these actions, then she should face punishment (detention, eventually expulsion from the school).

 

[Daermon420]

Let Cosy tell their story. If you can't play, simply just because you don't like a character. Just stop playing or skip past their story bits.

This isn't people hating on the game because of Rachel. I personally love this game and even though I strongly dislike Rachel I'm confident Cosy Creator has a plan to redeem her. It's people calling out the absurdity of someone painting Rachel as a victim and the MC in the wrong. Even Cosy Creator chimed in on the conversation pointing out how twisted that persons take was.

I think the fact that you're willing to defend her falsely accusing him of being a rapist, even seeming to believe that it isn't a big deal because the legal system exists, while also believing that the MC telling her off for it is a huge problem, is pretty twisted!

 

[QQP_Purple]

I mean I am ok with her coming to MC and confessing that she made a terrible mistake actually I'd prefer this over what I suggested (because I thought it might be too out of character for her to come back and confess as compared to MC who is more sensible than her) but a redemption ark is necessary because she seems like a person whom if MC doesn't take into his care, she would either hurt herself or someone else other than the MC but she can be saved from going both paths.

It's not about her confessing or accepting that her particular actions in this particular case were a mistake. She has to come to a fundamental understanding that her entire view of reality is wrong. And if she does so, she will naturally understand that the things she did were wrong and be horrified by them. And this is the sort of thing that just can't come from the outside.

All the outside can do is give her evidence that she is wrong. But if she chooses to accept it or shut it out and become even more bitter is on her.

Basically right now Rachel is like a diehard skinhead racist who just met her first bunch of black jews and is struggling with the idea that they didn't try and steal her gold or throw spears at her. It has to go beyond her just agreeing that the MC is "the one good one". She has to accept all men are people too.

 

[LordDoh]

Basically right now Rachel is like a diehard skinhead racist who just met her first bunch of black jews and is struggling with the idea that they didn't try and steal her gold or throw spears at her. It has to go beyond her just agreeing that the MC is "the one good one". She has to accept all men are people too.

You know, now I really want a spin-off where Rachel was raised by Call of Duty/Xbox voice chat and 4chan instead of (presumably) a feminist. Then again I am easily amused.

Instead of telling you about how rape is against school rules she talks about Hollow Earth, the Moon Landing Hoax (tm) and proves the latter by explaining the earth is flat and gravity is an illusion created by said flat earth constantly accelerating upwards.

Her character would still feel roughly the same, sanity-wise, IMO.

 

[Negan22]

It's not about her confessing or accepting that her particular actions in this particular case were a mistake. She has to come to a fundamental understanding that her entire view of reality is wrong. And if she does so, she will naturally understand that the things she did were wrong and be horrified by them. And this is the sort of thing that just can't come from the outside.

All the outside can do is give her evidence that she is wrong. But if she chooses to accept it or shut it out and become even more bitter is on her.

Basically right now Rachel is like a diehard skinhead racist who just met her first bunch of black jews and is struggling with the idea that they didn't try and steal her gold or throw spears at her. It has to go beyond her just agreeing that the MC is "the one good one". She has to accept all men are people too.

I think we shouldn't argue on this if this is your view on people like her in real life.

even if in real life I would have used her real crimes in combination with the power of a founding family leader to absolutely make her regret the day she thought she could take me on. Like, I would not even drive he to suicide. I would drive her to wish she could suicide but not daring because of the consequences to her self and those (if any) she cares about if she tried.

Enjoying her being fucked in the head or being suicidal won't be a problem for you in this game so we shouldn't argue on this any further.

But still just to clarify what I meant by "confessing" is her admitting that what she did, her thought process everything that led to what she did was wrong, not just "what she did was wrong" so I am kinda with you on this already.

 

[hameleona]

So, I did a bit of research, and if the MC and his gang were really out to punish Rachel, she has done enough to serve between 2 and 6 years in jail, even in european countries with lenient punishments like mine. Also the picture she took is enough to get her on most sex-offender registers. Even with an extremely lenient sentencing she would still get a criminal conviction.
And she should be glad everyone is 18+, cause otherwise that picture goes in to much more terrible sentencing and criminal charges. And yes, people have been sentenced for such things. And yes, women too.

The fact that her intentions might have been good doesn't excuse her a bit. A lot of terrorists think they have god intentions, doesn't excuse them.

Like, ok, I'm all for alternative character interpretations, but if you feel sorry for Rachiel, you should feel sorry for everyone from Brain to Gloria. And yes, I can drop you a couple of paragraphs of ways to make her sympathetic.

Edit: Actually, I am more sympathetic to Gloria, then Rachel, atm, and I wish I was joking

 

[Negan22]

So, I did a bit of research, and if the MC and his gang were really out to punish Rachel, she has done enough to serve between 2 and 6 years in jail, even in european countries with lenient punishments like mine. Also the picture she took is enough to get her on most sex-offender registers. Even with an extremely lenient sentencing she would still get a criminal conviction.
And she should be glad everyone is 18+, cause otherwise that picture goes in to much more terrible sentencing and criminal charges. And yes, people have been sentenced for such things. And yes, women too.

The fact that her intentions might have been good doesn't excuse her a bit. A lot of terrorists think they have god intentions, doesn't excuse them.

Like, ok, I'm all for alternative character interpretations, but if you feel sorry for Rachiel, you should feel sorry for everyone from Brain to Gloria. And yes, I can drop you a couple of paragraphs of ways to make her sympathetic.

Edit: Actually, I am more sympathetic to Gloria, then Rachel, atm, and I wish I was joking

It's not what MC can do with his power to make her life hell, it's about MC using his power to make her a better person.

Takes like this from common people like you are the reason powerful people like Diddy never gets what they deserve as punishment because they know people respect power more than what is right and wrong so they'd just leave the matter saying "he's powerful so can pull it off".

Also comparing Rachel with terrorists right after saying MC can use his gang to influence her punishment is kinda diabolical.

 

[LordDoh]

It's not what MC can do with his power to make her life hell, it's about MC using his power to make her a better person.

He did. He told her the truth.

Subtly, at first, asking "are you willing to admit you did something wrong?" before just laying it out very plainly when Rachel didn't bother listening. Now she listened. Kudos to MC.

Edit: also, complaining about comparisons between Rachel and terrorists while saying "people like you are the reason people like Diddy go free" is fucking nuts.

Can we take the temperature down like a hundred degrees?