Sounds like a job for Marcus and Weiku.
- Thread starter N7
- Start date
- Nov 29, 2017
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oHH please yEEs
- Jul 21, 2017
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Sounds more like a job for anyone else but the MC.
Weiku is too busy with the MC's mom.
- Jan 10, 2018
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Well they might as well do that now with Sunny and have her gangbanged after on NTR route, she is already destroyed anyway as a romance interest on the other path and is just at best a fuck interest there if she is easy.Sounds more like a job for anyone else but the MC.
- Jun 30, 2018
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Once again people assuming that Alpha path players have even a bit of interest in what happens on the Beta path. Here Sunny has never slept with anyone on the island, so why should she be "destroyed"? (And yes, I had a peek at some gallery scenes. Nice "alternate universe", but not significant to my playthrough.)
- Jan 10, 2018
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They are the same character, some people will see them as different, for a lot they are the same whatever path you play. For those who see them as different a triple and gangbang will not matter anyway. For those who see them as same character and only your actions as MC stop her on the alpha path, she is a lost cause already as a love interest, so whatever happens to her from now on on NTR path will not matter anymore either.
So, based on your logic, no game can (or should) have multiple paths, as it risks what you state above. Or is your argument one of timing versus ultimate disposition, ie you don't care what becomes of the character just so long as your MC gets theirs first? I guess I am not understanding your point.
- Jan 10, 2018
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It has to do with the rules of more romantic games and what is important to a lot of players who play those games which very simply says that a LI should have a character that makes you want to be with her in a relation. Falling and letting yourself be fucked within minutes by the first player she meets and become his sex toy is not a great impression for that.
Now that goes especially if also have a NTR path and you have to make sure those girls are not NTRéd before those players connect to herNow Sunny would be redeemable for those possibly, but since the damage was done on the NTR path it would also have to be repaired on the NTR path, she would need to wake up, dump Marcus and no threat of NTR ever be close to her anymore since she was already fallen and redeemed. Now you can imagine what kind of shitstorm that would give with NTR players, so that will not happen and you can not ask for it either.
Devs made a bad choice on NTR path for the other path players that do care and that does have consequences on other path, but it has happened now, so too late to change or keep harping on. Sunny is lost for the more romantic path for a lot of players besides as a fast fuck and for those who do not care what happened on NTR path, more happening will not matter either.
I understand what you're saying. Sometimes you just can't separate them in your mind or once you've seen them one way, you can't see them any other way.
It's like when you like the lyrics to a song, then you see the video and realize they mean something completely different. And now you can't enjoy the song anymore because you don't like the new message.
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What I do to help with that is I strictly play one path at a time. I don't click the other choices "to see what happens" so that I don't spoil anything.
And I usually play the good / pure / love / romance paths first, because corruption / violence is sometime a little harder to unsee.
I have long contended that experience and opportunity shapes a character. Given no access to Marcus (and Marcus was given free access!), Sunny doesn't decide to indulge as the beta path shows. Maybe she does with another guy, who knows. But only Marcus is in the picture. Eliminate him and his malign influence, and Sunny is the same as she started. On the alpha path, send Marcus packing and you have unfettered access to Sunny, to shape as you will. The difference in writing on both paths make the separation easy for me. On the beta path, Sunny is exposed to more erotic things, and she is finding she likes it. She tells the MC that she will do as she pleases. On the alpha path, she is hanging out with the MC in ways a bit different from the past, and she is growing more comfortable. I am fully behind the dev in the relative timelines thus far.
- Jan 10, 2018
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You are and others feel different. There is no right or wrong at that just how you see a character. Just for a lot of romantic players they see a char as who she is and you as MC not interfering shows even more who she is really. For those Sunny is at best an easy lay now if she is willing and not to demanding. That is her character as she has shown it and a lousy LI.
You with a different view, can and may think different, but that is what devs also failed to see. It is not how they see the chars in their two routes, but how the players see them and how what happens in those two routes interacts for them.
Not how it does or should not according to devs or another player, they will still feel and see it as they feel about it.
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Me too. Experience, opportunity, events, etc should change every character as a story progresses. In fact, you could argue that the story itself cannot progress unless the characters change. Events happen in a story, but they're merely plot devices, catalysts. It's how those events change and influence the characters that is the heart of the tale.
But I also get that there are other people who believe that every character should stay static unless the player explicitly makes them change by making a choice. They want total, absolute control. Put another way, they want to BE THE story, not merely a character IN A story.
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It is a valid insight to note that some people struggle to distinguish characters between paths in a game or that they can't unsee something afterwards. But I don't think that's the developers' fault - it's just how some peoples' brain works.You with a different view, can and may think different, but that is what devs also failed to see. It is not how they see the chars in their two routes, but how the players see them and how what happens in those two routes interacts for them.
I think it's very unfair to the devs to try to tell them that they're making the game wrong. They were open and upfront from the beginning that this game is going to have both harem and NTR routes.
It's like ordering Peas and Carrots then complaining to the chef because a pea touched a carrot.
- Jan 10, 2018
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Here I disagree with you. If devs want to make a game that has both NTR and romantic path, you also have to take into account the rules and way those romantic players play or you deliver a subpar experience to them. For myself I am less extreme, but it is clear many of them are not and it destroyed the game for them.
Why else do you think the romantic path has only a 2-3 star rating max while the beta path is rated 4-5 stars by the players who like that? It is not like devs are suddenly way worse renderers and such on the more romantic path or deliver way less content. Yes there is the slow burn effect but most romantic players actually like that, even if I am for myself not a fan of it and prefer more natural feeling burns.
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- Jan 10, 2018
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Here we partly agree and disagree actually. Yes a character should have a basic personality and way he/she perceives live in a game, their own motivation for things that happen and yes that character should change and grow based upon what happens in game, but the way that character reacts to certain things while that happens is canon for how that person reacts to those things.
That is exactly what destroyed Sunny, since she is now shown she will be easily seduced by any player coming along and can be turned into his mindless sex toy if MC forgets to give her some attention or does not save her from that hellish fate. Now that makes her a bad LI. Now instead of her being a sex addict (I might put it strongly to put my point accross
), you would have found out she had or could easily get a gambling addiction unless you watch her 24/7 and was quite likely to rack up ten of thousands of gambling debts while living with her putting both of you into debt. Would you still think she was great wifey material or to big of a risk?Well that is the thing, for those who see the character as the same on both paths, you know how she will react now unless you watch her like a hawk and interfere all the time and you better not ever have a job that makes you have to spend two weeks away from her.
Edit: What goes for Sunny goes in a way for every girl that already fell and were made into their toys by Marcus or Weiku in the NTR path, just Sunny grates even more since for a lot of players she was one of the two main prizes to go for in the game. The problem is there as well though for the other women in game before MC even could connect with them. Basically there are not that many romantic interests left for those who see them as same character on both paths, just fuck interests.
It is not for nothing that combining NTR paths and romantic paths in one game is one of the hardest things to pull off and keep all intended players happy, since the needs and wants of the one are kind of opposite of the other and it is very hard to write believable ways for a woman to fall into the NTR trap and have her enjoy that and still be believable as future wive material. (Except maybe for magic, mind control and rape that the female chars hate, which have their own problems with believable or subject matter). I am pretty sure I could not do it if I tried.
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- Jan 10, 2018
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That's valid. It's important to consider your audience(s).
I haven't looked at the ratings, but that's another helpful observation. Suggests that something is off with the romantic path. In my mind this speaks to fundamental problems. I can think of two off the top of my head: where the dev's passion is, and player expectations.
I think King's true passion lies on the beta/NTR path. He built the game around Tracy and Sunny getting corrupted. But because a single path is really just a VN, King tried to build a multi-path game. That's cool, but I think his passion shines through in the NTR renders. That's why I always say that an artist should make what inspires them, not what others want. Making your passion rather than what others want is like the difference between art and engineering.
Luxee said the same thing in his interview about Parental Love (
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):Player expectations are another issue. Clearly Tracy and Sunny are the key girls in the story and each set of players wants them. I think some players of either path expect the good/bad, romance/NTR, pure/corrupt path pairs to essentially be mirror images of each other. For example, some players seem to expect that if on day 6 beta path Tracy sleeps with Lucas, then on day 6 alpha Philip will sleep with Tracy. They want the same progression timeline on both paths. I can understand that, but I think it's an unfortunate expectation. I think it limits the storytelling options and means that both stories suffer in quality as a result.
You're absolutely right, because they are so opposite. That's why I often say that it's really two different stories told in the same game engine. It's also why I strictly play one path at a time, because that helps me to separate the two in my mind and maintain the right perspective on the characters.
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