Dear God Please End This Intro Thread

[P_S_Y_C_H_O]

People are different. Some people don't like porn games at all. So these porn games are not created for them. They don't play them. They watch porn movies. Or do what-the-fuck-ever.
Thanks god they don't even visit this site and rant about how they don't like porn games.
There is a Ctrl key to skip what YOU don't like. Leave it to others, who like it. You can still keep your dick in left hand, release your mouse, and press it with your right hand. In options - if it's Ren'Py game - you can choose to skip even unseen text. I can't believe you're too lazy for that, but not too lazy to start this discussion.

you've ruined your game and I'm done.

The most important moment in this shit - stop thinking that it's a big deal. Don't exaggerate your sense of self-esteem. Don't be egocentric.
If you try to introduce characters while they fuck altogether - you'll ruin it for others. There is a huge load of hot stuff to be shown/told that may get you boners. And it's better than showing closeup of plastic digital dick penetrating plastic digital vagina of plastic digital characters, especially in DAZ. They are of poor quality nowadays.
You get better boner if you care about characters. And you have to know them first.
I'm sure your rant was caused by some particular game, where there were too many words, that didn't make sense to you because you just wanted to jerk off quickly. But it didn't deliver because of the wrong planets location in the sky at that moment.
Hats off to you, sir, for not leaving this rant on the game's page to make the dev little bit upset.
It wouldn't change anything except the update being postponed for a few minutes.

 

[Avaron1974]

This is another case of someone on the internet not reading what someone else said and arguing against some opponent they've made up in their head.

Except your own OP is all over the place.

This is a porn game. I literally have my dick in my hand. I appreciate that you have a story to tell me, great... tell me the story IN THE GAME if you feel the need to tell it. Not with 28 minutes of narration. That's not even good design in a normal piece of media where the audience isn't literally holding their dicks in their hands.

Firstly I wasn't arguing, arguing would suggest I expected a rebuttal, I didn't. I corrected you on your use of porn game which I see a lot around here. Sure there are plenty of games aimed solely at porn but those with exposition and story aren't them.

Then you proceed to tell us you have your dick in your hand which would suggest you're looking to fap straight away.

Then you say "if they need to tell it" which comes across like you'd rather it not be there then mention dick holding again.

As more than one person missed your point maybe let go of your dick long enough to make it clearer then you'd probably get the discussion you want.

I don't have a dick myself so don't know how much fun it would be to just sit there holding it but I would imagine it not being very productive.

 

[recreation]

I don't have a dick myself so don't know how much fun it would be to just sit there holding it but I would imagine it not being very productiv

I guess it's as much fun as if you stick a finger in and don't move it.

 

[Silver]

I literally have my dick in my hand

 

[HopesGaming]

The OP has a really valid point. But he formulated and explained it in a very ineffective way. And it came off as being a bit aggressive (negative feeling) which in turn makes people go in the offensive (negative feeling) instead of creating a healthy debate.

When a new game/movie/book spends too much time on explaining the story/lore/world in the first few scenes with huge wall of texts (or just lots and lots of dialogues) it is called info dumping (as @Duke Greene mentioned) and is one of the biggest sins any author can do. Be that movie or game stories authors.
The first thing you always learn when searching for writing techniques/guides/tips is- never to info dumps.
Not only do you make your audience feel like they're stupid since you're explaining every little detail but it also removes any suspense a story can have if it all given in the first 5-10 mins. Lastly, and probably most importantly- info dumps are boring.

 

[megaplayboy10k]

5 boxes of text, or about a page of double spaced lines on a screen, is probably sufficient to lay things out. I actually find it more annoying when you get into the game, you meet a character and then there's this long expository exchange which goes on for a while. It's a visual medium, and you're turning it into "My Dinner with Andre".
My advice is to just write like you would for a film or tv show--show, not tell; keep the dialogue short, believable, and mostly to the point; and move it along.
Fun fact: Average man speaks about 7000 words per day. Average woman, 20,000 words per day. Do I want to read 300 boxes of text per day of game play? Probably not. Do you really want to do that much writing? Probably not.
Exposition, Rising Action, Climax(hurr durr), Falling Action, Denouement. Sometimes throw in a prologue and epilogue. But too much exposition can kill a story AND a game, because you just gave the reader literally TMI. They won't remember all that shit. But if you show rather than tell, and when you do tell get to the point, they will remember more easily.

 

[anne O'nymous]

You are missing the point entirely.

Difficult to miss your point when you said, in underlined bold, that you literally have your dick in your hand. Difficult also to believe that you effectively care about the story when you empathize this much on the fact that your sole intent when you started the game was to fap on it. And finally, difficult to see you as someone effectively wanting a serious discussion when you answer to (almost) everyone that disagree with you, like if this person was an idiot ; especially since most of the time it's clearly you who didn't understood what was answered to you.
The sad part being that in the end, it make your whole argument fall back like a bad cheese soufflé. This while you aren't wrong, and mostly the people who answered you, me included, share the same concern regarding nowadays games introduction.

Like @DarthSeduction said, there's effectively a problem with the introduction of too many games, but it's not the amount of text, it's their interest. They fill us with raw information, "you are [this], she's your [something], you now do [that], on your mark, get set, go", that most of the time are in fact useless.
An introduction should make us live the facts, like The Deluca Family or Seraphim Academy by example, or even better it can make us smartly search for them, like in Heavy Five. The player must be involved since the start. The introduction should trigger our curiosity, make us want to know more, and make us have our first feelings for the characters.
But instead of this, most of the time we are presented some kind of, "previously in this game that just start and don't have past", thing. It's not only boring and useless most of the time, but it also tend to be the mark of a really poorly wrote game. If the author felt so few involved in the writing of his introduction, how can we expect him to be more involved in the rest of the story ?

 

[DarthSeduction]

Fun fact: Average man speaks about 7000 words per day. Average woman, 20,000 words per day. Do I want to read 300 boxes of text per day of game play?

Yeah... I'mma need a citation on that.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Yeah... I'mma need a citation on that.

You can find dozen of them

You must be registered to see the links

. But, as you'll discover quickly, the whole purpose of the article is to debunk this assertion ; "Many real-world studies of gender differences in language use indicate that men and women are about equally talkative".
But what are many studies, when you need just one to confirm what you already want to believe.

 

[Buddawg]

Its a pretty simple trick for these kinds of games.
Story plot explained in the front, doesnt need a lot of real skills at writing a story into the game with mechanics and pictures/animations.
It the cheapest, fastest and easiest way to do it.

So thats why its there. Too many inexperienced programmers/writers. Maybe with a mix of reluctance to make deeper plots.

Honestly, its how porn works across most of its spectres. All story added at the beginning, if any. Then progress to the fucking (fun part). And maybe then an outro (often just cumshot finito, some add a short interview, a surprise twist, but mostly just the big bang cumshot finito.)
This works in fap works. Short story works, vids, and games made only for fast fapping.
For actual adult games, you need more in my eyes. And things like this figures into how i rate the game.
I play games for immersion, not for fap.
Just as i stay away from gonzo vids even when just fapping.
For me, believing or feeling hooked only comes with story, not with the fetish. So i play games far outside my fetish ranges, because they might have the story immersion/game play. And i skip a FUCKTON of games tailored to my fetishes, because they dont have any immersion or storyline at all.

But all in all, what you want in a game is personal. And it really differs alot.
So i just try to find those that match my tastes, and leave reviews that will help those with my tastes to find out of its a game for them.

 

[W65]

Hold up. Are we talking about VNs or about real games?

 

[DarthSeduction]

Hold up. Are we talking about VNs or about real games?

You can try to separate them all you want, but they are one in the same. Moreover, since I'm the only one who's actually given an example, and it wasn't a VN, I'm gonna say it's all of the above, for your purposes.

 

[vir_cotto]

OK, I only want to know: is the dick OK? I mean, you're clearly neglecting him while writing all of this. Think about little fella! Give him love, a place he can call cumdump of his own... A little pat on his back. Don't spend your time on this thread, don't prolong his suffering! He'll be very grateful to you when you get old...

 

[W65]

You can try to separate them all you want, but they are one in the same. Moreover, since I'm the only one who's actually given an example, and it wasn't a VN, I'm gonna say it's all of the above, for your purposes.

Well, I think they kinda have to be different things, especially in the context of a "there's too much text up front" thread. Someone reading a VN is going to have totally different--should have totally different expectations for how much text they're going to have to hack through before they get to the first choice than someone playing an RPG.

 

[P_S_Y_C_H_O]

Well, I think they kinda have to be different things, especially in the context of a "there's too much text up front" thread. Someone reading a VN is going to have totally different--should have totally different expectations for how much text they're going to have to hack through before they get to the first choice than someone playing an RPG.

Well, then it's just a matter of tastes, and it's the most ridiculous 'type of criticism' people invented. They used to call it criticism - to gain little bit more weight to their personal tastes.
The other possibility - that the dev didn't really manage to make it interesting. In this case one should not create the thread to ask people their opinion on all long intros out there. One should torture the dev, appear in their dreams. And then m ybe even try to create smth interesting for EVERYONE by themselves.

 

[DarthSeduction]

Well, I think they kinda have to be different things, especially in the context of a "there's too much text up front" thread. Someone reading a VN is going to have totally different--should have totally different expectations for how much text they're going to have to hack through before they get to the first choice than someone playing an RPG.

My favorite RPGs are incredibly dialogue heavy. So I don't really agree with you. Plus, have you played an Elder Scrolls or Fallout Title? Those always need a fucking mod so that on your 956th playthrough you don't wake up in a cart/cell/doctor's house, and spend an hour doing mundane shit.

 

[megaplayboy10k]

Yeah... I'mma need a citation on that.

some say the numbers are closer to about 15k each, but my point was that nobody wants to READ 15k words of dialogue per day.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Plus, have you played an Elder Scrolls or Fallout Title? Those always need a fucking mod so that on your 956th playthrough you don't wake up in a cart/cell/doctor's house, and spend an hour doing mundane shit.

Those are introductions. Few words for the world description, then you live by yourself, while learning how to play, who you are, where you are, and why your life will change, letting you wandering. In the same time it let you build the character, and I don't just talk about the characteristic selection, but also how he'll be in your own mind.
Take Fallout 3 by example. I'm sure that the future of the shelter 101 is decided during the introduction. When the player come back later and have to decide if they quit, keep the gate open, or stay door closed, everything he built in his mind during the introduction come back and influence his decision.

some say the numbers are closer to about 15k each, but my point was that nobody wants to READ 15k words of dialogue per day.

You made a typo. You wrote "nobody" instead of "me and perhaps other persons don't".
I read at least a book/week since more that thirty years, so I don't care reading 15k words of dialogue per day, if they make sense.

 

[megaplayboy10k]

Those are introductions. Few words for the world description, then you live by yourself, while learning how to play, who you are, where you are, and why your life will change, letting you wandering. In the same time it let you build the character, and I don't just talk about the characteristic selection, but also how he'll be in your own mind.
Take Fallout 3 by example. I'm sure that the future of the shelter 101 is decided during the introduction. When the player come back later and have to decide if they quit, keep the gate open, or stay door closed, everything he built in his mind during the introduction come back and influence his decision.




You made a typo. You wrote "nobody" instead of "me and perhaps other persons don't".
I read at least a book/week since more that thirty years, so I don't care reading 15k words of dialogue per day, if they make sense.

No, my error was not adding "...per game day in a multimedia game." Seriously, it's an audiovisual medium that is supposed to be interactive. Reading 300 blocks of text per game day sounds like whatever the opposite of "interactive multimedia game" would be.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Reading 300 blocks of text per game day sounds like whatever the opposite of "interactive multimedia game" would be.

According to your definition of "interactive multimedia game", not necessarily to anyone definition of it. I don't say that being verbose is mandatory for a game, but it's not because it's a game that it can't be verbose if it make sense at this moment and/or for this game.