VN Ren'Py Eternum [v0.8.5 Public] [Caribdis]

[Deleted member 4058859]

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Exhibit A: This is a stupid example. Everyone has fantasies.

Exhibit B: MC did not know Alex/Nova were in danger. For all he knew they were just chilling in a random server - from his perspective they were fully healed but were just teleported elsewhere. If you dont understand the difference between wanting to sleep with 2 women offering themselves to you for free (especially when you have no reason to think your companions were in danger) and taking someone else's gift that they have been saving for years to blow it all up on whores I dont know what else to tell you. In my original post I even said that I would have no problems with the scene if the MC came back later with his own money.

I would also have no problems with the scene if 1) MC lost all his eternals after that scene or 2) MC lost Annie's path. But this was a scene where you go through with a choice that will obviously hurt Annie without consequences. That is my problem here.

So yes I stand by what I said - neither of these scenes makes Orion look like an asshole.

 

[Yvier the Duck]

Orion can be a lot of good things, but above all of them he is horny as fuck, the man would be able to fuck a table if it had tits or ass. Of course he is gonna try the "Eternum experience" in his first time playing and of course he is gonna ravage the sexy and crazy egypt goddess for revenge. That's Orion, ladies a gentlemen, the hero of Eternum and the future CEO of Ulisses, a big and great pervert. If you don't like that... this is not your game.

 

[Deleted member 4058859]

Orion can be a lot of good things, but above all of them he is horny as fuck, the man would be able to fuck a table if it had tits or ass. Of course he is gonna try the "Eternum experience" in his first time playing and of course he is gonna ravage the sexy and crazy egypt goddess for revenge. That's Orion, ladies a gentlemen, the hero of Eternum and the future CEO of Ulisses, a big and great pervert. If you don't like that... this is not your game.

Again you are missing the point - it is not the inclusion of the scene itself that I have a problem with. It is the MC being inconsiderate and the lack of consequences for your choices. The scene itself and especially the conversation with Eva was quite good. If eternum was like you claim it is, the regina scene last update would have been very different. You would not break penny's heart and the game would have rewarded you instead for going for Regina. I personally think it is a case of the game evolving and getting a more clear direction for where it wants to go when it comes to the MC's character development as it progresses.

 

[Dorfnutter]

He is just walking through the first door he sees not even knowing what is behind it. He isn't even looking for a brothel. So yes, it is utterly random, period.

No, no one would have thought that, because the game doesn't do that outside of this one random scene.

Don't need to look for a brothel if the likelihood of entering one (or a stripclub or a bar) is high with the given setting (like I'd argue that there's only six types of stores in a Cyberpunk setting: a) sex-themed store (i.e. stripclub, bar (because watering holes more often than not have hookers that frequent them), brothel, futuristic sex toys shop), b) augmentation shop, c) weapons and armor store, d) drugs shop, e) hardware store (i.e. computer and hacking essentials), and f) ramen shop (or an eatery)). And more often than not the probability of stumbling on a sex-themed store is higher. Lot more so if the story happens to be a porn game.

 

[MrLKX]

About the thing with Alex and example B:
I think that served the following points in particular:

1. to remember that Orion is a horny goat.
2. comedic element. You're about to get laid? Sorry, we have to move on.
3. I don't even think Alex is mad at Orion. I think by that point Alex and Orion already know each other a bit and her reaction is more along the lines of "Nova and I end up on a dorky Disney server and have to escape while you end up on a server where you almost get laid? Typical Orion shenanigans."

I think one mistake one can make here is to take it too seriously. Caribdis definitely has a tendency towards somewhat silly slapstick humor.

 

[PervyParadox]

Again you are missing the point - it is not the inclusion of the scene itself that I have a problem with. It is the MC being inconsiderate and the lack of consequences for your choices. If eternum was like you claim it is, the regina scene last update would have been very different. You would not break penny's heart and the game would have rewarded you instead for going for Regina. I personally think it is a case of the game evolving and getting a more clear direction for where it wants to go when it comes to the MC's character development as it progresses.

Mmmh not quite though, Regina is clearly a bitch to Penny so trying to fuck her is in fact a dick move. Eva haven't done anything bad to any of the girl, she's a fancy hooker in a virtual world. Trying to do Regina is punishable by torture and death, while having sex with Eva is just a bit of harmless fun. It's there because at that time Orion was not close enough to any of the LIs for something sexual to happen, and yes he is in fact a horndog even though he's nice (these are not mutually exclusive). Without that scene, people would have complained either about things going too fast with the girls OR the absence of any sex scene in the first update.

Anyway I don't know why you're complaining about it, you do know you are able to decline the scene right ? Right ?

...

I actually don't know I've never checked if we could decline.

You probably can though, so hypothetically there's nothing to complain about.

 

[Dorfnutter]

Exhibit A: This is a stupid example. Everyone has fantasies.

Exhibit B: MC did not know Alex/Nova were in danger. For all he knew they were just chilling in a random server - from his perspective they were fully healed but were just teleported elsewhere. If you dont understand the difference between wanting to sleep with 2 women offering themselves to you for free (especially when you have no reason to think your companions were in danger) and taking someone else's gift that they have been saving for years to blow it all up on whores I dont know what else to tell you. In my original post I even said that I would have no problems with the scene if the MC came back later with his own money.

/shrugs The examples still make him look bad, regardless if you think they're stupid or not.

And that's fine IMO. He's been portrayed as a horndog since day one, it's his number one character flaw at this point. I just find your idea of MC being this thoughtful guy who at first had second thoughts with Annie's cash gift suddenly spending them all on a hooker - when he already had a go signal from Annie prior to them separating that she's fine with whatever Orion wants to spend it on and Orion already committing to paying it back some day (which is what got us that Andromeda date in the first place) - as being out-of-character or making him look like a douche just weird really, especially given the stuff that's shown throughout the game of what he's willing to do or escalate just to get laid (the exception being Regina because every sign and event had made it abundantly clear that choosing her is an absolutely bad idea if you happen to be following Penny's path, which was never present with regards to Eva and Maat).

 

[Deleted member 4058859]

Mmmh not quite though, Regina is clearly a bitch to Penny so trying to fuck her is in fact a dick move. Eva haven't done anything bad to any of the girl, she's a fancy hooker in a virtual world. Trying to do Regina is punishable by torture and death, while having sex with Eva is just a bit of harmless fun. It's there because at that time Orion was not close enough to any of the LIs for something sexual to happen. Without it people would have complained either about things going too fast with the girls OR the absence of any sex scene in the first update.

Anyway I don't know why you're complaining about it, you do know you are able to decline the scene right ? Right ?

...

I actually don't know I've never checked if we could decline.
View attachment 2404612
You probably can though, so hypothetically there's nothing to complain about.

Its not the act of having sex with Eva (as I have said multiple times already) but the act of taking >1k of Annie's money that she has been saving for years and blowing it all up on hookers. Do you really think Annie would have been thrilled it see this? Especially given the context that the player is presented with before that scene?

Declining the scene is fine but accepting it should not be completely free of consequences. At the very least make the player lose money instead of having him walk away like nothing happened. And if you want to make the MC be a dick that's fine too but make it consistent - while I enjoy eternum more, character development of the MC and the inconsiderate/asshole choices is one of the places I feel like the other top rated game on this site Pale Carnations is vastly superior to eternum.

And criticism not being valid just because you can avoid it is a dumb argument. It is part of the game and as such it is something people can and should criticize. Whether or not it fits tonally, whether or not the characters feel consistent, if it has narrative significance, how it impacts characters are all valid avenues of discussion when looking at any choice in the game. If this was like >90% of the other games on this website it would not matter but because the game has such a high bar when it comes to quality, to me scenes that I feel are even slightly out of place stand out.

 

[Cherubin25]

Mmmh not quite though, Regina is clearly a bitch to Penny so trying to fuck her is in fact a dick move. Eva haven't done anything bad to any of the girl, she's a fancy hooker in a virtual world. Trying to do Regina is punishable by torture and death, while having sex with Eva is just a bit of harmless fun. It's there because at that time Orion was not close enough to any of the LIs for something sexual to happen, and yes he is in fact a horndog even though he's nice (these are not mutually exclusive). Without that scene, people would have complained either about things going too fast with the girls OR the absence of any sex scene in the first update.

Anyway I don't know why you're complaining about it, you do know you are able to decline the scene right ? Right ?

...

I actually don't know I've never checked if we could decline.
View attachment 2404612
You probably can though, so hypothetically there's nothing to complain about.

Yes, you can avoid the prostitute in Eternum.

 

[Takkatakka]

Without that scene, people would have complained either about things going too fast with the girls OR the absence of any sex scene in the first update.

Yeah, that's what I mean with a "hook" scene. A lot of VNs are using something like this, often it is a memory or a dream or a fantasy etc. to have a sex scene early, without needing to build it up.

It is just a bit weird to see something like this in a game that otherwise takes massive amounts of time.

 

[Walter Victor]

Declining the scene is fine but accepting it should not be completely free of consequences. At the very least make the player lose money instead of having him walk away like nothing happened. And if you want to make the MC be a dick that's fine too but make it consistent - while I enjoy eternum more, character development of the MC and the inconsiderate/asshole choices is one of the places I feel like the other top rated game on this site Pale Carnations is vastly superior to eternum.

Well, since you accepted the scene, your consequence should be to self-flagellate with a cat-o-nine-tails every night for a week [broken glass optional]. Have fun!

Of course, you should also write a note of apology to Annie. You can give it to her the next time you meet her.

 

[PervyParadox]

Its not the act of having sex with Eva (as I have said multiple times already) but the act of taking >1k of Annie's money that she has been saving for years and blowing it all up on hookers. Do you really think Annie would have been thrilled it see this? Especially given the context that the player is presented with before that scene?

Declining the scene is fine but accepting it should not be completely free of consequences. At the very least make the player lose money instead of having him walk away like nothing happened. And if you want to make the MC be a dick that's fine too but make it consistent - while I enjoy eternum more, character development and the inconsiderate/asshole choices is one of the places I feel like the other top rated game on this site Pale Carnations is vastly superior to eternum.

Sure I get it, but it seems a bit harsh to punish the player for wanting to watch the only sex scene of the update, or saying Orion is a dick just because he think with his dick in that moment. Annie gives him the money so it belongs to him now, and Orion do tell her he'll repay her in some way in the future. Not only that, but he just came out of Chop-chop after he potentially bought something for Annie. So saying he's a dick or that he should suffer bad consequences because he choses to have sex with a virtual hooker who has done nothing wrong and for whom he has the money, considering that it is his first time and he is a horndog, is harsh.

I haven't played PC yet, but Eternum seems lighter in its tone so it all comes down to what your standards are. In this case there's no need for bad consequences because you can justify not getting them and still keep consistancy with both the world and the characters. Orion is a horndog so he uses his free time to have sex with Eva. Eva loved it so she doesn't want him to pay. End of story. No one will be none the wiser about it because that's her "job", and we can move on with the game, playing a guy who, despite the fact that he's nice with the girls, is still a horndog and sometimes can't help but think with his dick. Everything's justified, everything's consistant.

And if you can't see the consistancy, it's a you problem. You can then just decline the scene and move on.

Yes, you can avoid the prostitute in Eternum.

Thanks for the info

Yeah, that's what I mean with a "hook" scene. A lot of VNs are using something like this, often it is a memory or a dream or a fantasy etc. to have a sex scene early, without needing to build it up.

It is just a bit weird to see something like this in a game that otherwise takes massive amounts of time.

Doesn't seem weird to me, "au contraire". The game take massive amounts of time to build up the plot and the relationships with the LIs, so Eva is just the solution to add a sex scene to the first update without rushing into things. Hence why there's no consequences despite being justified and consistant within the world and the character.

Really people complaining about the lack of consistancy on things that actually has consistancy is kinda tiring. Note to self : stop entering these frays.

 

[Deleted member 4058859]

Well, since you accepted the scene, your consequence should be to self-flagellate with a cat-o-nine-tails every night for a week [broken glass optional]. Have fun!

Of course, you should also write a note of apology to Annie. You can give it to her the next time you meet her.

We are discussing the game in what I hope is a respectful conversation.

Stop demanding that every thread/game you like be a circlejerk. If you cannot be civil about it then put me on ignore. It is a discussion forum and if you think no criticism should ever be made about any game you like you are delusional.

 

[Walter Victor]

We are discussing the game in what I hope is a respectful conversation.

Stop demanding that every thread/game you like be a circlejerk. If you cannot be civil about it then put me on ignore. It is a discussion forum and if you think no criticism should ever be made about any game you like you are delusional.

Okay. You have convinced me. That is the worst scene in the history of AVNs. Caribdis should be severely punished for releasing such utter trash. I suggest he be sentenced to a an entire weekend of listening to you critique his game. That'll teach him.

 

[Deleted member 4058859]

Okay. You have convinced me. That is the worst scene in the history of AVNs. Caribdis should be severely punished for releasing such utter trash. I suggest he be sentenced to a an entire weekend of listening to you critique his game. That'll teach him.

When did I say the scene was trash? I just felt like it was a step down from all the other sex scenes in the game (with the exception of peeping on Dalia). It is definitely not worth going back and changing anything and the conversation with eva about the nature of eternum was great. But when I compare it to literally every other sex scene (and I am also including the build up to that scene here) I find that the others are just a lot better. And the only reason this stands out to me is because I think the rest of the game is excellent. To me this is a near perfect VN and because of that any scene that I feel is a 6-7/10 as opposed to a 9-10/10 stands out. You may of course disagree.

 

[SerHawkes]

So gonna wager over reacting thin skinned twits who are bitching about some scene and wishing for laughable recourse is the theme of late...


I got better things to be interested in.

 

[HardcoreCuddler]

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[HardcoreCuddler]

The way I see it, patreon is a way for people to fund development. You are not buying a product. This game is made using HoneySelect so it is and always will be free because of legal reasons - it is why the game is not on steam for example. The only way for the dev to make a living from this is if people help support its development.

As for it getting completed, I dont think there is reason to worry here. The dev already has a completed game under his belt and based on the few interactions I have had with him on his Discord, I genuinely think this game will be completed - I dont think it will be stuck in development limbo like many other games. I feel like the Caribdis's approach to development is to get things done and move on as opposed to being stuck in a loop of analysis paralysis which is a very refreshing thing to see.

I dont know much about HoneySelect but I would imagine that assets are limited. For a game like this where you need custom assets to build bizzare worlds and characters. I think funding really helps - it can help the dev get additional help, have custom assets, hire artists (we had the voice acting from the logs in 0.4, the comic in 0.5 etc) and just make this a better game.

If monthly donations are too much for you consider doing one-off donations if you can when the game updates. I am sure the dev will appreciate it.

You kinda do need to make custom assets if you plan to use honey select, but at the same time not really. I can identify most of the clothing as being either default built-into BetterRepack or from mods. Take Annie's shirt for example, it's a stock clothing piece with some colored patterns which you can create in...minutes, including finding it and customising it.

But not all clothing sets are the same. You'd expect the fancy ones being the most custom but not really, I think some of the more casual outfits are the fully custom ones because I don't recognise them.

What I personally think takes most time in Eternum's process is the posing, because messing with IK and FK and getting it as right as Caribdis gets it isn't hard, but it's annoying as hell.

Donating a one-off is exactly what I plan btw, it's not relevant that the game will never officialy be a paid product.

 

[dolfe67]

This is a small issue with novels with choices compared to kinetic novels : sometimes one choice might feel out of character. But if that's the case, just choose the option you feel is the best for the character you imagine, I don't see the problem. Or are you triggered because it's an option? Same energy as people who whine about optional ntr, just don't click on that option.

Though we all know the sex with the virtual hooker in the first release was made for the fappers who couldn't wait

 

[SerHawkes]

sex with the virtual hooker

Wait till she shows up in RL and gushes in front of Annie about our wonderous time...