Unity Heart of the Tower [Dev Thread]

[kinrean]

if your game is about game play, you need to let people try to play it to get the feel, if is about story well then you need to able to tell the story well with drawing or animation , voice and music .

focus on what you trying to sell, and make your next game better .

 

[mibc9394]

View attachment 5604317
View attachment 5603194 View attachment 5603198

the platforms normal maps seem to work best when theyre downscaled/subtle like this.
ill try to round the edges of the stone platforms via shader.
maybe i should do triplanar so it scales independent of objects uv

i like the heavy outline skull armor enemies, makes them more visible. i should try with more painterly style though if i go with the with the anime style. or just treat them like the anime characters would make the most sense...

still cant decide pixel or anime style for in game characters.

some styles ideas:
View attachment 5603370
^ this 2d grid tile levels and pixel style would be fastest for level design at the trade off of rigid/repetitive level design, but its not ideal for my platformer though.

thinking of going with no image texture just albedo color and normal maps as texture for things like my stone platforms in the example above. uhg idk its not feeling cohesive.
View attachment 5603215
^ better for turn based combat, but does work for well for 2.5D billboard workflow
View attachment 5602963
^ 2d anime puppet rig, more painterly environment style
View attachment 5603403
^ more painterly environment to match the modern anime style i was aiming for. more effort maybe, so far this is how my level design is leaning.


still havent decided if ill change the story. i had some alternative ideas but they change the game entirely. like a 3rd person mech pilot and fps ninja. i just cant let go of HOTT original story ^ ^;

for music im thinking electronic / synths, heavy guitar for combat and soft flute and piano synth for ambient exploration. like cyberpunk meets c418 vibes.

Spoiler: worries rn

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Spoiler: thoughts on how to use AI for art

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---- after a day of debating this post, clarity (def not the smartest/fastest method but yolo)
okay so lockn in.

i will keep my HOTT story, I will use modern anime style for characters AND enemies. ill have a campaign mode story mode and a d2 / arcade mode with challenge quests.

Character + enemy workflow:
ai concept / ref pose > loose sketch / trace > vector outline > flat color > ai depth shadow high light / greyscale depth > normal map > per key frame > photoshop parts for 2D puppet rig > unity 2D puppet rig > my hlsl shader

environment = painterly, paint brush textures blends, soft edges, no lines, normal maps

figure out a way to make sprites fake 3D by shell layer techniques or something

time budget:
View attachment 5603979

my kokoro:
View attachment 5603983

most likely:
View attachment 5603997

If you want want round edges, it might be better and easier to just bevel the edges of the mesh for a few reason. One of them is that an round edge shader can potentially be expensive in the pixel shader if you are going to apply it everywhere. Having that extra geometry won't make too much of a difference in performance if your objects are culled properly.

For triplanar mapping, it's not necessary to do it in a shader. You can also just have a triplanar UV for the meshes. Then you can save a lot of performance

 

[mibc9394]

If you have a sprite and want to add some depth to it, you can also try parallax mapping. Just need to make a depth map from the sprite. AI can help. Or, maybe, just make a 3D mesh directly from the sprite lol. IDK

 

[Sentinel Sparrow]

if your game is about game play, you need to let people try to play it to get the feel, if is about story well then you need to able to tell the story well with drawing or animation , voice and music .

focus on what you trying to sell, and make your next game better .

yeah thats exactly it, knowing what you want and scoping it right and making exactly that.
for me its easier said then done my friend ^ ^; despite my lengthy planing lol i need to build it to see it... i think i did that for almost every option along the way. learning coding, shaders, physx, modelling, art workflows... like my goodness, not having constraints is my double edge sword. yet my vision is coming together!

If you want want round edges, it might be better and easier to just bevel the edges of the mesh for a few reason. One of them is that an round edge shader can potentially be expensive in the pixel shader if you are going to apply it everywhere. Having that extra geometry won't make too much of a difference in performance if your objects are culled properly.

For triplanar mapping, it's not necessary to do it in a shader. You can also just have a triplanar UV for the meshes. Then you can save a lot of performance

dude why are you not making a 3D game lol you know so much
you took smart route and limited your technical dept choosing renpy and focused on what sells; eye candy + story

triplanars can be baked into the UV's of a model but when scaled again it loses the proportions of the UV unless a shader is used. my goal is to reuse one cube and scale it any which way having the texture be procedural.

If you have a sprite and want to add some depth to it, you can also try parallax mapping. Just need to make a depth map from the sprite. AI can help. Or, maybe, just make a 3D mesh directly from the sprite lol. IDK

yo this is the first thing i tried parallax occlusion mapping does work! but its like thin and expensive! and it broke my materials compatibility with the sprite renderer. but that was with shader graph, i might be able to try again though i have a feeling the shell effect fade will work better. im excited to test this out :3

Spoiler: POM shader test

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3D from sprite is sooo valid.... trying to calculate how long it will take me; 1-2 day per frame? o-o" unless i pose them with ai


despite my repetitive indecision and glazing you still help me out ^ ^;;
so thanks for the feedback, its always good hearing from you guys

 

[mibc9394]

yeah thats exactly it, knowing what you want and scoping it right and making exactly that.
for me its easier said then done my friend ^ ^; despite my lengthy planing lol i need to build it to see it... i think i did that for almost every option along the way. learning coding, shaders, physx, modelling, art workflows... like my goodness, not having constraints is my double edge sword. yet my vision is coming together!



dude why are you not making a 3D game lol you know so much
you took smart route and limited your technical dept choosing renpy and focused on what sells; eye candy + story

triplanars can be baked into the UV's of a model but when scaled again it loses the proportions of the UV unless a shader is used. my goal is to reuse one cube and scale it any which way having the texture be procedural.


yo this is the first thing i tried parallax occlusion mapping does work! but its like thin and expensive! and it broke my materials compatibility with the sprite renderer. but that was with shader graph, i might be able to try again though i have a feeling the shell effect fade will work better. im excited to test this out :3

Spoiler: POM shader test

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3D from sprite is sooo valid.... trying to calculate how long it will take me; 1-2 day per frame? o-o" unless i pose them with ai


despite my repetitive indecision and glazing you still help me out ^ ^;;
so thanks for the feedback, its always good hearing from you guys

just don't have enough time to make a 3D game at the moment lol. If I turn the game I'm making now into a proper 3D game the time needed will probably be tripled

 

[Sentinel Sparrow]

okay it works for all of em except for cubes fak lol


just those dam hard edges


accursed fkn cube bend to my will!

 

[kinrean]

okay it works for all of em except for cubes fak lol

the cubes hard edge is because of the normal, i don't know unity, but you need to import a cube with a smooth normal.

 

[Sentinel Sparrow]

the cubes hard edge is because of the normal, i don't know unity, but you need to import a cube with a smooth normal.

you are a fkn genius! thank you
im having troubles starting the clipping closer to the edge so i added transparency.
how do they look?

 

[mibc9394]

View attachment 5608583 you are a fkn genius! thank you View attachment 5608591 View attachment 5608575
im having troubles starting the clipping closer to the edge so i added transparency.
how do they look?

What's the look are you looking for?

 

[Sentinel Sparrow]

What's the look are you looking for?

ruin temples, clouds; the environment will be painterly like. i dont plan on having any drawn textures, only normal maps. the dithering is the only pixelation (which will be used on all things transparent)

 

[mibc9394]

ruin temples, clouds; the environment will be painterly like. i dont plan on having any drawn textures, only normal maps. the dithering is the only pixelation (which will be used on all things transparent)

It looks still quite far away from the tower concept in your first post.

The stone building (as well as the landscape) in that tower concept painting don't actually have broken silhouettes. The structures and silhouettes of the objects in that painting are actually well defined. So I feel your shader on those primitive shapes is not really capturing that at the moment (if that's your goal.)

What you need is probably meshes with higher definition, especially at the edges, as your building modules. So that you can capture the shapes from your concept better. Then, you may just want to use a very simple diffuse shader (no specular, no normal map) for your models. Your tower concept is all diffuse lighting on the tower, and the surface details on the tower are just color variations instead of bump, so to reproduce that you just do the same thing in the shader.

You can try to make a custom shader with an unlit shader and add directional light, point light, and a basic bounce light (basically to make the shadow area not in pitch black) for the environment 3D models. Then rely on making good base color textures to convey the details (and rely on good 3D models to convey the primary and secondary shapes). Hand paint all colors and AO with a little bit of shadow baked in in the base color textures.


(super tired when writing this so hopefully it's some answers you're looking for)

 

[Sentinel Sparrow]

It looks still quite far away from the tower concept in your first post.

The stone building (as well as the landscape) in that tower concept painting don't actually have broken silhouettes. The structures and silhouettes of the objects in that painting are actually well defined. So I feel your shader on those primitive shapes is not really capturing that at the moment (if that's your goal.)

What you need is probably meshes with higher definition, especially at the edges, as your building modules. So that you can capture the shapes from your concept better. Then, you may just want to use a very simple diffuse shader (no specular, no normal map) for your models. Your tower concept is all diffuse lighting on the tower, and the surface details on the tower are just color variations instead of bump, so to reproduce that you just do the same thing in the shader.

You can try to make a custom shader with an unlit shader and add directional light, point light, and a basic bounce light (basically to make the shadow area not in pitch black) for the environment 3D models. Then rely on making good base color textures to convey the details (and rely on good 3D models to convey the primary and secondary shapes). Hand paint all colors and AO with a little bit of shadow baked in in the base color textures.


(super tired when writing this so hopefully it's some answers you're looking for)

hey take it easy no pressure lol, do gets some rest! these msg's aint going anywhere XD i always get new ideas and think things through bc of your help, so no worries . the nice thing abt this forum is you dont have to be perfect ;D

the level im working on is more related to the heavenly hub world sanctuary, testing the scale fog and materials. its stuff ill be using in most levels.

yeah the tower concept is not a 1:1 of my vision. it will be more fragmented and floating parts akin to my currently level but with the darker atmosphere of the concept (not 100% sure yet). The shader you suggested is what im doing, ill let the normals be the details from the lighting - nod nod - and smoothing groups like kinrean showed me

these are the refs i used for the fog and painterly style ^ ^

<thats actually 3D <,<"


i totally agree i need more mesh detail xD but im trying to be a little lazy and let the shader do some heavy lifting . i'll need to eventually for accent pieces like the tower walls and arches.. gotta dig up some asset packs, seen one with a spline generated stone wall. ill also need a grass floating island shader which i might be able to work into the current stone shader -nod nod-

Modular asset list:
- stairs
- pillars
- arches
- walls
- entrances
- island / rock fragments (triangular)? or be lazy and stick with me cubes xD

- vines
- chains
- water fall / lava / rainbow

- fairy pfx like OoT

Materials / shader list
- sky
- fog
- clouds
- water

- stone
- grass
- metal
- wood?
- tree trunk
- tree foliage / bushes

- sprite 2D


working on levels is fun ^-^

the sky box hasnt been made yet but i do like the bright color ^ ^ , probably will be a gradient with a mesh dome parallax cloud shader.

 

[mibc9394]

hey take it easy no pressure lol, do gets some rest! these msg's aint going anywhere XD i always get new ideas and think things through bc of your help, so no worries . the nice thing abt this forum is you dont have to be perfect ;D

the level im working on is more related to the heavenly hub world sanctuary, testing the scale fog and materials. its stuff ill be using in most levels.

yeah the tower concept is not a 1:1 of my vision. it will be more fragmented and floating parts akin to my currently level but with the darker atmosphere of the concept (not 100% sure yet). The shader you suggested is what im doing, ill let the normals be the details from the lighting - nod nod - and smoothing groups like kinrean showed me

these are the refs i used for the fog and painterly style ^ ^

<thats actually 3D <,<"


i totally agree i need more mesh detail xD but im trying to be a little lazy and let the shader do some heavy lifting . i'll need to eventually for accent pieces like the tower walls and arches.. gotta dig up some asset packs, seen one with a spline generated stone wall. ill also need a grass floating island shader which i might be able to work into the current stone shader -nod nod-

Modular asset list:
- stairs
- pillars
- arches
- walls
- entrances
- island / rock fragments (triangular)? or be lazy and stick with me cubes xD

- vines
- chains
- water fall / lava / rainbow

- fairy pfx like OoT

Materials / shader list
- sky
- fog
- clouds
- water

- stone
- grass
- metal
- wood?
- tree trunk
- tree foliage / bushes

- sprite 2D


working on levels is fun ^-^

the sky box hasnt been made yet but i do like the bright color ^ ^ , probably will be a gradient with a mesh dome parallax cloud shader.

I think you can easily generate textured 3D models with AI based on this concept. Then you can quickly have a bunch of modular assets to build up your level and test your shader. Those generated assets may as well be used in the game after decimation.

Grasses are essentially many intersecting planes (or camera facing planes) with grass textures and have their normals always facing the camera btw. May also be with some vertex color to darken the bottom part a little bit