VN Ren'Py Intertwined [v0.13.2] [Nyx]

[valbitterb]

The guy is an absolute moron I hope there's an option to ditch him for good.

He really sucks as a friend and the way he treats the ladies is sad.

The MC needs more friends like Nathan in his life.

 

[valbitterb]

There is nothing to sort out. Cut him down to size is the only way.
That creep needs the boot.

That reckoning and beat down may come after Zach gets back from his family ski trip. Aside from the MC, I hope Val gets to cut him down to size.

 

[Ariostebaldo]

I feel that the Alexis/Erynn relationship is established well. They have been together since early childhood (the first flashback). They have been together for years (the annual tree picture). And numerous comments amongst the MC, Erynn, and Alexis show Erynn and Alexis are very close. The fact that we do not see them together so far is because Alexis has been romancing the MC despite knowing how Erynn feels about him. Out of guilt and shame, she avoids Erynn until it all comes to a head.

taking her friend's crush is one thing, taking her friend's crush and rubbing it in her face is dirty.
Erynn doesn't own the MC and Alexis doesn't need her permission to date him, but if Alexis knows that Erynn is in love with the MC that's a good reason not to make out with him in front of her.

I like to think that's why we don't see them spending time together in front of the MC. Or rather, why Lexi doesn't spend time with the MC in front of Erynn.
I'm team Lexi but it doesn't hurt to have a little consideration for her friend.

 

[Canto Forte]

Her own ma and MC ma are more concirned about making out in the pool drunk than tell Erynn.
That sets the tone about what other females close to her are supposed to and do around her: stay away.
Erynn drove everyone away and cast a wide shaddow over her life, we can read it in her interactions
with her ma, with MC, with Alex, whom she hates becasue the one guy blackmailing her and making her life shit
told her he had banged her, becasue sure the guy not able to love you but blackmailing you is right.

 

[Nurikabe]

taking her friend's crush is one thing, taking her friend's crush and rubbing it in her face is dirty.
Erynn doesn't own the MC and Alexis doesn't need her permission to date him, but if Alexis knows that Erynn is in love with the MC that's a good reason not to make out with him in front of her.

I like to think that's why we don't see them spending time together in front of the MC. Or rather, why Lexi doesn't spend time with the MC in front of Erynn.
I'm team Lexi but it doesn't hurt to have a little consideration for her friend.

Oh, I agree. If Alexis were written as a total cunt who shits all over her best friend and makes out with the MC to rub it in, there is no way I would be on Team Alexis. Not to mention, I would probably not follow the game, certainly not support it.

I think Alexis is respectful. I also think that Erynn has no claim to the MC until she makes it known and comes clean. The MC will always pine for her though. She was "the one." Will I have a path dedicated to Erynn only? Hell yes! Hopeless romantic and I want to see the young puppy love become real forever love. That is also what I love about Alexis. That went from screwing a hot guy that she knew as a kid to totally in love. Of course, I enjoy that path!

Her own ma and MC ma are more concirned about making out in the pool drunk than tell Erynn.
That sets the tone about what other females close to her are supposed to and do around her: stay away.
Erynn drove everyone away and cast a wide shaddow over her life, we can read it in her interactions
with her ma, with MC, with Alex, whom she hates becasue the one guy blackmailing her and making her life shit
told her he had banged her, becasue sure the guy not able to love you but blackmailing you is right.

Canto, I worry about replying to you. You say some crazy shit sometimes! Can't ever tell if you are serious or trolling.

Erynn did not chase anyone away. Ethan did. Live with a psychopath in your life and you get shit on everyone. That douche has his hooks in Erynn and she can't escape without some help. Don't worry. It's coming!

 

[NebulousShooter]

IMHO, Alexis' friendship with Erynn is conveyed terribly in this game. It's talked up a lot (especially early on), but they dont hang out, they don't talk, and they don't seem to have much idea what the other is doing. The *only* time we see them together is when they're fighting over the MC. If the MC never sleeps with Alexis, she and Erynn never interact; we don't even get references to them interacting off camera. You'd think pairing Erynn up with Alexis would be an easy call when the MC is off at camp, but nope, not even worth considering.

Of course we all know the reason why is that Erynn is 'supposed' to be mad at Lexi by then, but that only applies to runs when Alexis 'stole' the MC. It would have been a big help to the narrative to flesh out the friendship on runs that don't date Alexis. Similarly, Alexis ought to be looking for Erynn on her own without the MC needing to guilt her into it. (Actually, that would be a nice opportunity to give her some screentime with MCs that turned her down.)

Yeah, as far as I remember from my runs, the only time we see them interact as friends is on Layla's route, on one specific variation of the jacuzzi scene.

Zach is certainly on that path. I'd rather help get him sorted out (once and for all) than exact some sort of revenge, though. But something has to happen, and soon. Zach's antics were already wearing thing before he slugged the MC for the lulz.

While I'm not opposed to offering the retribution path to those that want it, I'm apathetic to the guy, just want to never interact with him again, ignore any kind of apology he might have and forget he ever existed.

You know, usually his type of character are at least played for humor, but in here he is just creepy and obnoxious, no redeeming qualities what so ever other than the nostalgia of 'we used to be buds'.

 

[ename144]

They do interact with each other when you aren't on the Alexis path. There's even a scene with the both of them having fun.

When? I don't remember them interacting at all (outisde the flashbacks, obviously).

I feel that the Alexis/Erynn relationship is established well. They have been together since early childhood (the first flashback). They have been together for years (the annual tree picture). And numerous comments amongst the MC, Erynn, and Alexis show Erynn and Alexis are very close. The fact that we do not see them together so far is because Alexis has been romancing the MC despite knowing how Erynn feels about him. Out of guilt and shame, she avoids Erynn until it all comes to a head.

I also feel positive about Erynn and Alexis. So I know that plays into how a player views each character. Generally, if a player does not like Erynn, they will comment on her lack of scenes or her lack of claim to the MC. For Alexis, the fact that she is hiding her relationship with the MC from Erynn, that she has lied to both of them, is the reason most discussed.

But, we know that Alexis takes her fight with Erynn very personally (and vice versa). We know Alexis drops everything to search for Erynn at the end of Ep. 9. And we see the MC working to bring the two back together. He comments on how important they are to each other. This is a matter of speculation, but I think will soon see that they need each other and how Alexis helps Erynn out of the upcoming situation.

I think it is the result of how chapters are released and us viewing a preview of a work-in-progress. If we were to get a chapter-by-chapter preview of a Stephen King release, we would be asking a ton of questions and frustrated that we are only seeing a piece of the puzzle at each release. Any movie released the same way, any series we watch with cliffhanger endings to each episode. We give the series/show/book a bit of trust and faith that the story will be told in time. This visual novel is no different.

Right, but what about when Alexis isn't romancing the MC? Then she has no reason to quarrel with Erynn, but the two still act as if they are quarreling. She doesn't drop by Erynn to visit, she doesn't look in on her while the MC is at camp, and she doesn't help look for Erynn when she's (presumably) lying behind a dumpster. My whole point is that the relationship between Erynn and Alexis should seem very different if the MC turns Alexis down, but it doesn't.

Yeah, as far as I remember from my runs, the only time we see them interact as friends is on Layla's route, on one specific variation of the jacuzzi scene.

Hang on, is this on the 'secret' path? The one so convoluted you need a walkthrough to know it exists (much less find it)?

While I'm not opposed to offering the retribution path to those that want it, I'm apathetic to the guy, just want to never interact with him again, ignore any kind of apology he might have and forget he ever existed.

You know, usually his type of character are at least played for humor, but in here he is just creepy and obnoxious, no redeeming qualities what so ever other than the nostalgia of 'we used to be buds'.

Yeah, Zach is all negative characteristics with no actual positives. Previously it at least seemed like he was a loyal friend, but after he flipped out he doesn't even have that going for him. I'm not sure what Nyx was going for here, because I'm pretty sure at this point most player just want Zach gone.

 

[Hildegardt]

Right, but what about when Alexis isn't romancing the MC? Then she has no reason to quarrel with Erynn, but the two still act as if they are quarreling. She doesn't drop by Erynn to visit, she doesn't look in on her while the MC is at camp, and she doesn't help look for Erynn when she's (presumably) lying behind a dumpster. My whole point is that the relationship between Erynn and Alexis should seem very different if the MC turns Alexis down, but it doesn't.

My guess is that this is a technical issue, rather than a writing issue. I think Alexis is very absent, if you're not on her path, because she's very present, if you are on her path.
It seems to me that Alexis' path is the most fleshed out, so removing her from the game leaves a very big gap. Filling this gap with additional non-romance scenes of her would probably be too much effort, especially since the players not on her path probably aren't interested in her anyway.

 

[ename144]

My guess is that this is a technical issue, rather than a writing issue. I think Alexis is very absent, if you're not on her path, because she's very present, if you are on her path.
It seems to me that Alexis' path is the most fleshed out, so removing her from the game leaves a very big gap. Filling this gap with additional non-romance scenes of her would probably be too much effort, especially since the players not on her path probably aren't interested in her anyway.

I think the opposite. We don't need extended scenes or special animations to show Erynn and Alexis interacting, we just need a few static renders and some altered dialog every now and then. That's a relatively minor investment. It's not like this might interfere with Alexis' non-romance content, because she has none.

To me, this speaks more to a lack of imagination than to technical limitations. As you say, the game is clearly written on the assumption the MC hooked up with Alexis and the other paths are secondary. I don't think it's occurred to Nyx that they represent a way to illustrate what the Erynn/Alexis relationship was like before the MC inadvertently came between them. Similarly, I don't think she realizes that NOT showing that difference undermines their supposed friendship (in much the same way the Worf Effect makes Worf look weak rather than the alien of the week look strong).

I suppose you could argue Nyx is worried the contrast might be depressing or paint the MC/Alexis in a bad light, but I find that unlikely given the Episode 9 cliffhanger.

 

[The Senior Perv]

They do interact with each other when you aren't on the Alexis path. There's even a scene with the both of them having fun.

The "secret path" other users had to tell us about because we wouldn't have find that out on our own probably. Aside of that, the other times they interact is during flashbacks and when Erynn confronts Alexis after discovering she lied to her.

 

[Avaron1974]

Yeah, Zach is all negative characteristics with no actual positives. Previously it at least seemed like he was a loyal friend, but after he flipped out he doesn't even have that going for him. I'm not sure what Nyx was going for here, because I'm pretty sure at this point most player just want Zach gone.

He's been an annoying prick since his very first scene.

I've never seen a point to his being there other to make the MC look good by being a complete and utter jackass in every scene. Now I see his purpose was to be a dick to the very end.

It's weird because most "best friend" characters are usually likeable or at least amusing but Zach is neither. He's a moron and a creep.

 

[cxx]

zach deserves to be thrown to wolves since he is idiot.

 

[Nurikabe]

Right, but what about when Alexis isn't romancing the MC? Then she has no reason to quarrel with Erynn, but the two still act as if they are quarreling. She doesn't drop by Erynn to visit, she doesn't look in on her while the MC is at camp, and she doesn't help look for Erynn when she's (presumably) lying behind a dumpster. My whole point is that the relationship between Erynn and Alexis should seem very different if the MC turns Alexis down, but it doesn't.

There are certain scenes that would take place "behind the scenes" that we don't get to see. Every interaction between characters is not possible. Conventions we make as we are reading, assumptions. If they are best friends, then we must assume that Alexis does visit her, call her, text, etc. we are simply not privy to those interactions.

If the MC is not pursuing Alexis, why doesn't Alexis look for her at the end of Ep. 9? My best answer would be so that we can see some of the other characters in action — John or Valeria. I do not think it was an oversight or an attempt to illustrate a problem between Erynn and Alexis. After all, if you were playing an Erynn route only, you would not "know" anything about the relationship between Alexis and Erynn other than they are best friends.

There are limits imposed by amounts of coding, rendering, storytelling, releasing frequency, etc. that restrict how much content can realistically be added. The story is not about Erynn and Alexis. Why would the author focus so much attention on that relationship outside of how it involves the MC?

He's been an annoying prick since his very first scene.

I've never seen a point to his being there other to make the MC look good by being a complete and utter jackass in every scene. Now I see his purpose was to be a dick to the very end.

It's weird because most "best friend" characters are usually likeable or at least amusing but Zach is neither. He's a moron and a creep.

I never saw Zach that way, as a creep or moron. Growing up in high school, one of my best friends was the guy who never had a girl but always desired every girl that walked past him. He would follow each new girl around like a puppy for days until he got tired of us mocking him. Nobody thought he was a creep or a moron. He just wasn't the guy anyone dated.

I am not so sure Nyx wrote Zach as the "best friend" character. He was the guy we used to be friends with. The player has the choice to recognize and be nice to him throughout the VN. Alternatively, the player can choose not to recognize him and really never be nice to him throughout.

I am glad to see that Nyx does not write all her characters like "the usual VN characters." Oh, and in the end, turns out that best friend of mine was a really late bloomer. By 25 he was the envy of a lot of guys, but the typical douchebag guy that girls fall for and then run away cursing men.

 

[H2R]

Will Emily be a LI at some point or is it the teasing, borderline bs content with her?

 

[Avaron1974]

Will Emily be a LI at some point or is it the teasing, borderline bs content with her?

Just teasing, no incest.

 

[H2R]

Just teasing, no incest.

thanks well another shit choice I hate when they do teasing but have no route for them, is the teasing minor and very infrequent at least?

 

[nyrek]

you can look at her boobs/turn your head away once (pool scene)
you can peek on her naked from the back/don't peek (while looking for a towel for the beach)
and you have that last episode scene where MC wakes up palming her boob if you choose to sleep with her and not on the couch

think that's about it.
idk why nyx even put that last scene into the 9th episode. I mean, I get it, she's trolling the incest lovers but even I (I don't like incest in games) think it was lame
almost as lame as naming the hottest chick in the game as herself

 

[Avaron1974]

I never saw Zach that way, as a creep or moron. Growing up in high school, one of my best friends was the guy who never had a girl but always desired every girl that walked past him. He would follow each new girl around like a puppy for days until he got tired of us mocking him. Nobody thought he was a creep or a moron. He just wasn't the guy anyone dated.

As a girl that has been on the recieving end of that kind of thing, it's creepy as fuck.

 

[MrD812]

There are certain scenes that would take place "behind the scenes" that we don't get to see. Every interaction between characters is not possible. Conventions we make as we are reading, assumptions. If they are best friends, then we must assume that Alexis does visit her, call her, text, etc. we are simply not privy to those interactions.

If the MC is not pursuing Alexis, why doesn't Alexis look for her at the end of Ep. 9? My best answer would be so that we can see some of the other characters in action — John or Valeria. I do not think it was an oversight or an attempt to illustrate a problem between Erynn and Alexis. After all, if you were playing an Erynn route only, you would not "know" anything about the relationship between Alexis and Erynn other than they are best friends.

There are limits imposed by amounts of coding, rendering, storytelling, releasing frequency, etc. that restrict how much content can realistically be added. The story is not about Erynn and Alexis. Why would the author focus so much attention on that relationship outside of how it involves the MC?

Adding to view, consider the source(Nyx).
If doing everything on her own, that's Alot of composition for extra content(computing power even aside).
Time and resource for all of the above.

Nyx strength not in consistence should be no supersize and equal to all Nyx has done well.
May be able to get paint-thinner out of an orange but We're not going to get Harry Potter out of an Apple.
Relax and Enjoy.

EDIT: p.s.- don't go finding apple-carving pictures of Harry Potter

 

[Nikki Klein]

He just wasn't the guy anyone dated

That's the point here. That's not a reason Zach is the way he is. That's a consequence of what he really is. He's a personification of what a guy shouldn't be. And it's not that he's an ordinary loser who tries to learn from his own mistakes. He's so bad that he doesn't even try to change for the better and take advice of much more experienced mates.

He's got a chance 'to start over' now since the MC's back and could be a pretty good role model for him to follow, but... Zach is incorrigible. There's no excuse for what he is. But he still has a chance to fix some things, I suppose.