Is it even supposed to take this long ?

[GNVE]

Is there an alternative to Daz all together where I can import models from Daz but I can achieve better and faster results

Well you could wait a while for AI to mature to a point where it is easy to work with; they have figured out hands/faces/etc and it can deliver consistent output so it doesn't look like a mish mash of a dozen main characters/art styles/whatever.
Right now though no. You have to choose two of the following: cost, time and quality.

 

[143 others]

Sounds like CPU rendering to me. Youre sure its rendering on the GPU?

Can you share me your render settings if you can dm me it would be helpful

 

[143 others]

Well you could wait a while for AI to mature to a point where it is easy to work with; they have figured out hands/faces/etc and it can deliver consistent output so it doesn't look like a mish mash of a dozen main characters/art styles/whatever.
Right now though no. You have to choose two of the following: cost, time and quality.

By cost do you mean hiring someone ?

 

[TessaXYZ]

Can you share me your render settings if you can dm me it would be helpful

The settings change based on the scene, there's no one size fits all.

But check that you have CPU rendering disabled under Render Settings -> Advanced -> Uncheck CPU and uncheck Allow CPU Fallback.

This way, when you hit your 8GB VRAM limit, it will fail the render (black screen) and you'll know that you need to optimize your scene to get it to fit, or render in groups for splicing.

 

[khumak]

I have a RTX 3070 laptop and my render settings are what I have tried to understand through trial and error right now I am not going to enable denoiser and a much grainy render is provided as the result. I can send my scene file and render settings ss if someone wants it but it talking more than 10 minutes to render a single scene (some times upto 90% only) is that even supposed to happen

If you check the logs while you're rendering, if it's taking a lot longer than expected you'll probably find that you exceeded your card's VRAM and switched to CPU rendering. If that happens, your renders will take orders of magnitude longer. Potentially several hours or days per frame instead of minutes. But even if that doesn't happen you'll see a lot of variation depending on textures, how many objects are in the scene, how many lights, whether you have reflective surfaces, whether it's well lit or relatively dark, etc. I have a slow card so the fastest renders I can do are more like 20 minutes for a simple scene. Complex scenes can take longer than 8 hours even if I don't exceed my VRAM.

I haven't done much rendering in awhile so I don't know if DAZ's built in denoiser has improved since the last time I used it, but I found that I got better results if I rendered without the denoiser and then ran it through a denoiser manually after the render was done (outside of DAZ).

 

[GNVE]

By cost do you mean hiring someone ?

That or spending serious money on a rendering rig. $2000 for a 4090 would allow you to render scenes with a lot of characters. 10K and you might have a pro graphics card with 48GB of VRAM for even bigger scenes (though I don't know if pro cards work with Daz tbh). More memory/CPU power allows Daz to open larger files without slowing to a crawl.
As stated by others you can use Gen3 for larger scenes or render the scene in parts. I did that for a long time. It is not optimal and quality might suffer slightly. But where you are skill wise time will be a better investment then cost. You can make a lot more quality improvements by learning Daz (and photoshop). You don't start off with a Ferrari learning to drive.
IF you're okay with sacrificing quality and uniqueness than honeyselect 2 might also be worth looking into. While I haven't used it myself I'm guessing it is easier and faster to work with.

 

[coffeeaddicted]

That or spending serious money on a rendering rig. $2000 for a 4090 would allow you to render scenes with a lot of characters. 10K and you might have a pro graphics card with 48GB of VRAM for even bigger scenes (though I don't know if pro cards work with Daz tbh). More memory/CPU power allows Daz to open larger files without slowing to a crawl.
As stated by others you can use Gen3 for larger scenes or render the scene in parts. I did that for a long time. It is not optimal and quality might suffer slightly. But where you are skill wise time will be a better investment then cost. You can make a lot more quality improvements by learning Daz (and photoshop). You don't start off with a Ferrari learning to drive.
IF you're okay with sacrificing quality and uniqueness than honeyselect 2 might also be worth looking into. While I haven't used it myself I'm guessing it is easier and faster to work with.

Definitly.
HS2 renders in an instant.
Everything from DAZ applies to HS2 as well. Lights.
I actually like HS2 but it's huge. I installed it and it sucked up 400GB just for the installation.
Funny thing, you will find most DAZ environments in HS2 as well.

 

[Deleted member 2282952]

I've done a ton of research on this. I will assume that you don't have CPU fallback and properly optimized your scenes. RTX 3070 has 8GB VRAM, which is, to be honest, nothing in Daz3D terms. I work in Gen 9, and even rendering one figure goes above 8GB.

I will ignore all basic advice and will tell you the thing that has the biggest impact - subdivision levels. If you kill everything to the minimum SubD level, the scene will easily fit and will be quicker to render. The approach you typically take is put the SubD level of non-visible elements to a minimum, whether it is the skin under clothing, buildings, etc. Then you reduce the SubD of visible items to acceptable levels.

It's additional work, but I can now fit very complex and large scenes on my 12GB VRAM without CPU fallback in Gen 9 with multiple characters on the screen.

 

[coffeeaddicted]

I think Gen9 isn't meant to be used with a low level card like mine which is a RTX3060. Even if i have 12GB of VRAM.
So you can do some tricks to make it work.
I like the SubD trickery.
It certainly helps.
Though, i think you have to master scenes a little more. It took me really a long time to get to the point where i load a scene and had to learn to really make renders quicker i needed an Iray Cam.
Of course you can lower every texture to make it more easier for you but i think that have DAZ really only render what is in your view helps a lot.
Nowadays, i like to play a lot with tonemapping. It's really fun to do.
Now, i don't make a game but if i did, i would make my scenes in a way that they render fast without to much loss in quality.
But if anyone is serious doing that, you probably have a better card than i have. Some may think i already have a good card, but it isn't. Especially if you want to use the latest figures.

At the moment i play with Gen3. Such fun to do.

 

[Deleted member 2282952]

I think Gen9 isn't meant to be used with a low level card like mine which is a RTX3060. Even if i have 12GB of VRAM.
So you can do some tricks to make it work.
I like the SubD trickery.
It certainly helps.
Though, i think you have to master scenes a little more. It took me really a long time to get to the point where i load a scene and had to learn to really make renders quicker i needed an Iray Cam.
Of course you can lower every texture to make it more easier for you but i think that have DAZ really only render what is in your view helps a lot.
Nowadays, i like to play a lot with tonemapping. It's really fun to do.
Now, i don't make a game but if i did, i would make my scenes in a way that they render fast without to much loss in quality.
But if anyone is serious doing that, you probably have a better card than i have. Some may think i already have a good card, but it isn't. Especially if you want to use the latest figures.

At the moment i play with Gen3. Such fun to do.

Yeah, mostly a money question. If you can put in multiple 12 GB RTX cards as SLI, and get to around 24-36 GB, you can render anything and don't have to rely on trickery. It requires $10k so def not something you want to just throw money in.

SubD levels, lights, camera optimization, etc. - all things you have to master and setup for each scene properly. More work, but worth it, and pretty quick after you learn the quickest ways to do it

 

[coffeeaddicted]

I wonder who has such money.
There must be some DAZ gods that made it big time. I am sure of it. I try to imagine how fast that would be with no optimization.

 

[GNVE]

I wonder who has such money.
There must be some DAZ gods that made it big time. I am sure of it. I try to imagine how fast that would be with no optimization.

If it's your job a 10K rig or more can be worth it. You write it off over a couple of years and get it (partly) compensated with the tax amount you have to pay. I doubt pro's are using Daz though...

 

[MissFortune]

If it's your job a 10K rig or more can be worth it. You write it off over a couple of years and get it (partly) compensated with the tax amount you have to pay. I doubt pro's are using Daz though...

I think it kind of depends on what your baseline for 'pro' is. You can look at the guys behind FlippedNormals, who usually talk about use Daz figures as bases. It's also not uncommon to see Daz being used as a prototyping/character designer in some studios (oft smaller.). Or even those who use Daz assets and transfer them to Blender (though I do question the commercial legality of that.

But there's guys like DPC with BaD and Oppai with Freshwomen, which are likely pulling in $50k/month just on Patreon alone. I don't know how apt either are with something like Blender or Unreal, or something of the like, but it's hard not to call them pros given the success.

 

[GNVE]

I think it kind of depends on what your baseline for 'pro' is. You can look at the guys behind FlippedNormals, who usually talk about use Daz figures as bases. It's also not uncommon to see Daz being used as a prototyping/character designer in some studios (oft smaller.). Or even those who use Daz assets and transfer them to Blender (though I do question the commercial legality of that.

But there's guys like DPC with BaD and Oppai with Freshwomen, which are likely pulling in $50k/month just on Patreon alone. I don't know how apt either are with something like Blender or Unreal, or something of the like, but it's hard not to call them pros given the success.

You are right. I sometimes forget that tools I am half decent at can still be used professionally . I always think oh serious people use Blender or Maya or whatever. But it's the easy to learn hard to master thing.
But at $50K/Month or $600K a year with ~247 working days a year you earn $5,06 a minute. If you consider replacing the rig every 3 years you'd need to save a little over two minutes a day to make a 10K rig over an 2K rig worth it. (If I didn't make a mistake in my back of napkin calculations somewhere).

 

[Deleted member 2282952]

You are right. I sometimes forget that tools I am half decent at can still be used professionally . I always think oh serious people use Blender or Maya or whatever. But it's the easy to learn hard to master thing.
But at $50K/Month or $600K a year with ~247 working days a year you earn $5,06 a minute. If you consider replacing the rig every 3 years you'd need to save a little over two minutes a day to make a 10K rig over an 2K rig worth it. (If I didn't make a mistake in my back of napkin calculations somewhere).

Lol, I relate hard to this message. Despite working in Daz3D most of the time for any 3D things, there is always a thought in my head "must use Blender to be more professional". Then I use Blender and the next thought appears "must use Zbrush to be more professional".

 

[Fatalmasterpiece]

To OP. There are ways to speed up your renders. You need to learn how to optimize your settings and scenes. Either way, there is no way you're going to quickly render eight Gen 8 figures in one frame. At best, you render them separately and photoshop them together. You're likely hitting the vram limit on your card.
Things you need to focus on are; correct settings (no "quality" for render, just do somewhere around 500-1500 passes), Iray Section Plane Nodes (look up "Camera Cutaway") and "Scene Optimizer". There is a big learning curve to Daz. The more you learn the faster you can make your renders. FYI, denoiser is your friend. Either use built in, Mcj or Topazlabs.

 

[GNVE]

To OP. There are ways to speed up your renders. You need to learn how to optimize your settings and scenes. Either way, there is no way you're going to quickly render eight Gen 8 figures in one frame. At best, you render them separately and photoshop them together. You're likely hitting the vram limit on your card.
Things you need to focus on are; correct settings (no "quality" for render, just do somewhere around 500-1500 passes), Iray Section Plane Nodes (look up "Camera Cutaway") and "Scene Optimizer". There is a big learning curve to Daz. The more you learn the faster you can make your renders. FYI, denoiser is your friend. Either use built in, Mcj or Topazlabs.

Welllll.... Technically a XX90 with 24GB of VRAM can load 8 characters, an environment and a few clothing items. And while one can debate about if it rendered fast it sure was a lot faster then CPU rendering for days. The Christmas scene below has at least 7 characters loaded. The 7th's hair is just visible behind the redhead standing. (Yes I know lighting could/should be better. but reasons).

Most I did was 10 though I did lower Sub-D levels used the same character multiple times but in different poses, same hair, same clothing items (in the hope assets would not have to be loaded several times) etc. this for the scene below:

 

[coffeeaddicted]

I think it kind of depends on what your baseline for 'pro' is. You can look at the guys behind FlippedNormals, who usually talk about use Daz figures as bases. It's also not uncommon to see Daz being used as a prototyping/character designer in some studios (oft smaller.). Or even those who use Daz assets and transfer them to Blender (though I do question the commercial legality of that.

But there's guys like DPC with BaD and Oppai with Freshwomen, which are likely pulling in $50k/month just on Patreon alone. I don't know how apt either are with something like Blender or Unreal, or something of the like, but it's hard not to call them pros given the success.

My gut tells me that they don't invest that money necessarily in a new equipment. Probably invested in a house or Ferrari. I mean you wanna live the live of you characters afterall. They probably invested in new equipment early on but now it's just going in their pockets.

With that income you can hire professionals that make development ultra fast but they sometimes monetize it on other platforms as well. So they make probably more of 100K a month.
I don't even know software like Maja or Autodesk but i have the feeling that sticking with DAZ is probably easier. But then again, if you have that income you surely can afford to pay someone to do all that for you and produce something worth of AAA title.

 

[GNVE]

My gut tells me that they don't invest that money necessarily in a new equipment. Probably invested in a house or Ferrari. I mean you wanna live the live of you characters afterall. They probably invested in new equipment early on but now it's just going in their pockets.

With that income you can hire professionals that make development ultra fast but they sometimes monetize it on other platforms as well. So they make probably more of 100K a month.
I don't even know software like Maja or Autodesk but i have the feeling that sticking with DAZ is probably easier. But then again, if you have that income you surely can afford to pay someone to do all that for you and produce something worth of AAA title.

Eh a AAA title has hundreds of people working on it. Even with an income of 100K a month you are looking at only a small team (10-20 depending on what the market rate salary is and other overhead.) Yes it would speed up development but I doubt it would be ultra fast. Also expanding a team makes every individual slightly less efficient and there is a possibility of feature creep that slows things down.
If I had that amount of income I would also divert some money into developing tools to make future development easier. (Which would hopefully be a source of income later on as well).

 

[coffeeaddicted]

Eh a AAA title has hundreds of people working on it. Even with an income of 100K a month you are looking at only a small team (10-20 depending on what the market rate salary is and other overhead.) Yes it would speed up development but I doubt it would be ultra fast. Also expanding a team makes every individual slightly less efficient and there is a possibility of feature creep that slows things down.
If I had that amount of income I would also divert some money into developing tools to make future development easier. (Which would hopefully be a source of income later on as well).

Lol..

Well, what i meant was not a farm of people working together but more like having a couple of people that do things where you are bad in. Maybe coding, or writing...
Though AAA maybe a stretch. Most games look more B titles. There are titles that are A but not AAA. I don't even know what an AAA title in this regard would look like.
I just observe mostly and the money that get's thrown to the dev should translate to something that pleases the crowd. Though more often than not, i have the opposite feeling.
It's just me as i would probably never pay for it. Maybe on Steam or a one time donation if i get a complete game.
I just cannot fathom to spend X amount every month. I would rather donate to end slavery, which i did.
So if someone makes that much money each month, i truly wonder what they do with it. I just can't think that is going into development. There isn't any transparency with this kind of business.