Ren'Py Lessons in Love [v0.42.0] [Selebus]

[DeSkel15]

Guys if you go theorizing i'd rather appreciate it if you at least link the connecting events. Or not if it's too much work.
This is really going beyond wild, at least for me. You can throw so much spaghetti at a wall till there is no wallpaper anymore to be seen (or paint, don't know how you decorate your rooms).

You know that there's a twitter account related to the upside down house? And it might be related to Nodoka?
Would make things even wilder.

I wonder if Sel read Aldus Huxley's "The doors of perception". And if those are related. Because IF, were all screwed.

On another note
What was your first thought about the developer of this game (Sel ofc) first time you read it?

For what I mentioned for Tsuneyo: the "A walk through Hell" Main Event, and Tsuneyo's "Things like stairs", plus Yumi's "Loggerhead" for Todd's fate should suffice.. Also the first Happy event (which shows a lot of stuff) shows User2 with a bird (maybe Noodles), and a bowl of Ramen. Tsuneyo and User2 as well as things related to User2 also tend to mention trees, growing, and wires a bunch. So, maybe just replay the game since Tsuneyo showed up, for all that stuff.

For the upside down house and Nodoka stuff: Otoha's "Breathing in Unison", Nodoka's "I see everything" and "Beyond the reach of god", and Kirin's "Bye, bye, boner", are kind of must sees to get what's being talked about. I also think Sensei sees it in the "There is Nothing" main event, when you look at the tv.

I also thought Sel based off the game was the kind of an unfiltered somewhat depraved individual whose story and perception of the world within said story would be fun to experience. I mostly just thought finally something that has a soul and isn't chained by censorship or morality.

 

[DeSkel15]

Also for those interested in the Users: "There is Nothing", and "The word of the day" are both pretty important. You can type in the different Users in the user name, in "There is Nothing", and get different responses, while User2 talks to you in "The word of the day".

However, The Happy Event "Trinity p3 Non est deus" is perhaps the most important for understanding them all.
User3 actually shows up in that Happy Event to apparently save you. User 1 is the one in control of you during it, and User2 is trying to access you, but can't because you can't give it permission (you'll need audio).

User3 also notably shows up in Yumi's "Abyss" event, and Sana's "Ad infinitum" event where it says it's name is Pareidolia.

There's probably a lot more, but most of this is just based off memory and I haven't replayed the game in a bit.. so, sorry.

Overall, most disturbing stuff seems to be because of User1 who is likely Nozomu, the callous god, and strongest in summer, the computer-ish stuff is User2 who is likely the god of wires, the calm god, and strongest in winter, while User3 doesn't show up much unless needed to bring order, is Pareidolia, the concerned god, talks in lowercase, and has no season it's strongest in. User4 is reserved for someone/something and that's about all that's been said about it. There doesn't seem to be other users.

Oh, and Terminal 23 is likely Sensei or at least his mind.

 

[BlackDays]

For what I mentioned for Tsuneyo: the "A walk through Hell" Main Event, and Tsuneyo's "Things like stairs", plus Yumi's "Loggerhead" for Todd's fate should suffice.. Also the first Happy event (which shows a lot of stuff) shows User2 with a bird (maybe Noodles), and a bowl of Ramen. Tsuneyo and User2 as well as things related to User2 also tend to mention trees, growing, and wires a bunch. So, maybe just replay the game since Tsuneyo showed up, for all that stuff.

For the upside down house and Nodoka stuff: Otoha's "Breathing in Unison", Nodoka's "I see everything" and "Beyond the reach of god", and Kirin's "Bye, bye, boner", are kind of must sees to get what's being talked about. I also think Sensei sees it in the "There is Nothing" main event, when you look at the tv.

I also thought Sel based off the game was the kind of an unfiltered somewhat depraved individual whose story and perception of the world within said story would be fun to experience. I mostly just thought finally something that has a soul and isn't chained by censorship or morality.

Didn't really follow what you (people) are thinking about Tsuneyo. Whats the point here?

 

[DeSkel15]

Didn't really follow what you (people) are thinking about Tsuneyo. Whats the point here?

I just had a theory that Tsuneyo was the one who killed Todd, Ayane's chicken. That's about it.

As for why Todd matters, he goes missing before Ayane actually survives a reset, and is found dead after she does. It seems linked to the reason she can. Just a theory though.

Tsuneyo also seems linked to the resets which is a theory in of itself since User2 has power over resets (Helps you in the reset of "There is Nothing" while the other users don't seem able to, and In the main event "The Scary Room" User1 (presumably) pretends to be User2 so that it can pretend it's about to reset Maya, which scared Maya, implying she knows User2 could actually do that, which also implies that User2 is the thing that she asks to reset the world since it's the only thing that's been implied to have reset abilities besides Maya who asks something else to do it.), And Tsuneyo seems related to User2 (who had a bird that resembled Noodles, and a bowl of Ramen in the first Happy Event), and has a history of killing chickens. Tsuneyo also seems naturally aware of the loop as found out in "The bending of italics" main event, and apparently recalls events that are from the loops from before the Current Sensei showed up as implied in the "Gallows Edge" main event.

Overall; it's a theory based off theories.

 

[Bingoogus]

Didn't really follow what you (people) are thinking about Tsuneyo. Whats the point here?

Take a seat at my table brother, why do you think i hand out so many thinking reactions, i struggle to follow the game let alone some of the theories here and am constantly left either suddenly realising something i missed or... 10 times more confused

 

[BlackDays]

I just had a theory that Tsuneyo was the one who killed Todd, Ayane's chicken. That's about it.

As for why Todd matters, he goes missing before Ayane actually survives a reset, and is found dead after she does. It seems linked to the reason she can. Just a theory though.

Tsuneyo also seems linked to the resets which is a theory in of itself since User2 has power over resets (Helps you in the reset of "There is Nothing" while the other users don't seem able to, and In the main event "Scary Room" User1 (presumably) pretends to be User2 so that it can pretend it's about to reset Maya, which scared Maya, implying she knows User2 could actually do that, which also implies that User2 is the thing that she asks to reset the world since it's the only thing that's been implied to have reset abilities besides Maya who asks something else to do it.), And Tsuneyo seems related to User2 (who had a bird that resembled Noodles, and a bowl of Ramen in the first Happy Event), and has a history of killing chickens. Tsuneyo also seems naturally aware of the loop as found out in "The bending of italics" main event, and apparently recalls events that are from the loops from before the Current Sensei showed up as implied in the "Gallows Edge" main event.

Overall; it's a theory based off theories.

Question is: Why would Tsuneyo do this? I see no reason there besides: "Oh, free meat for our shop."
More reasonable seems to be (for me) that Ami killed Todd in a rage fit, because Ayane is getting way to comfortable with Akira.
Their conversation within dorm wars (3?) might have triggered that.
Didn't Ami tell Ayane she's fucking Akira?
Killing Todd is like mafia horse head in Ayanes bed.

I really think if this game had a main antagonist, it would be Ami and associates.

/e The conversation between Ami and Ayane i meant was in ch3 main event "The Way it Scatters" with the amifingered flag true which is omitted in replays.

 

[BlackDays]

Take a seat at my table brother, why do you think i hand out so many thinking reactions, i struggle to follow the game let alone some of the theories here and am constantly left either suddenly realising something i missed or... 10 times more confused

My friend, normally i can follow stuff. But lately?... As i said. It's like a complete spaghetti fiesta thing, where people throw the pasta around and see where it lands. Like 360°, while it should be only one direction. Like some people have to get some things out of their system.
I get that. Those things happen. But they should not all the time.

 

[DeSkel15]

Question is: Why would Tsuneyo do this? I see no reason there besides: "Oh, free meat for our shop."
More reasonable seems to be (for me) that Ami killed Todd in a rage fit, because Ayane is getting well to comfortable with Akira.
Their conversation within dorm wars (3?) might have triggered that.
Didn't Ami tell Ayane she's fucking Akira?
Killing Todd is like mafia horse head in Ayanes bed.

I really think if this game had a main antagonist, it would be Ami and associates.

To send Ayane to the roof, To serve her Father/god of wires, To one day end the loop, Because Sekai made her, Because Todd pissed her off, Because it felt like she should, Because User1/HOPE convinced her too, etc. The actual reason Todd died hasn't been revealed yet, so, who knows.

Fucking Ami is optional, and she loves Ayane. I don't see why she'd just kill Ayane's chicken. It's also not like Ami has actually hurt anything or anyone physically as far as has been revealed.

Honestly, I'm not entirely sure why some people think Ami is on a murder spree, beyond simply because she fits a trope.

 

[BlackDays]

To send Ayane to the roof, To serve her Father/god of wires, To one day end the loop, Because Sekai made her, Because Todd pissed her off, Because it felt like she should, Because User1/HOPE convinced her too, etc. The actual reason Todd died hasn't been revealed yet, so who knows.

Fucking Ami is optional, and she loves Ayane. I don't see why she'd just kill Ayane's chicken. It's also not like Ami has actually hurt anything or anyone physically as far as has been revealed.

Honestly, I'm not entirely sure why people think Ami is on a murder spree, beyond simply because she fits a trope.

No one said murder "spree". But from what i got good uncle leads to the same weird Ami persona anyway.

 

[DeSkel15]

No one said murder "spree". But from what i got good uncle leads to the same weird Ami persona anyway.

You didn't. Others have in the past. Still, you should get what I'm saying.

"Good Uncle" Ami is way more sexually frustrated. Neither version is actually violent though. However, GU Ami does seem more likely to drug rape Sensei.

Also meant to mention, Ayane doesn't find out Ami could be sleeping with Sensei until after she's already survived a reset and after Todd had gone missing. So, Ami knowing Ayane knows about her and Sensei being a reason to make Todd disappear, doesn't really work.

 

[hcguy]

If he was actually apathetic he'd have, feel, and show no interest in sex or the girls, etc. He'd be more like an Asexual. He acts Apathetic because he thinks it's cool though. Hence why some of girls make fun of him for it.

I disagree - one does not have to be apathetic about everything. I can be apathetic about where the group decides to go for dinner but I can still want to eat. I think it's a better description than submissive of a person where the times he actually does what someone tells him to do or doesn't do what someone tells him not to do are the exceptions. When he does go along, it's usually because a) he doesn't care, or b) he has actually started to care enough about someone that their happiness matters to him more than his apathy.

 

[KnowNoHope]

I just had a theory that Tsuneyo was the one who killed Todd, Ayane's chicken. That's about it.

As for why Todd matters, he goes missing before Ayane actually survives a reset, and is found dead after she does. It seems linked to the reason she can. Just a theory though.

Tsuneyo also seems linked to the resets which is a theory in of itself since User2 has power over resets (Helps you in the reset of "There is Nothing" while the other users don't seem able to, and In the main event "The Scary Room" User1 (presumably) pretends to be User2 so that it can pretend it's about to reset Maya, which scared Maya, implying she knows User2 could actually do that, which also implies that User2 is the thing that she asks to reset the world since it's the only thing that's been implied to have reset abilities besides Maya who asks something else to do it.), And Tsuneyo seems related to User2 (who had a bird that resembled Noodles, and a bowl of Ramen in the first Happy Event), and has a history of killing chickens. Tsuneyo also seems naturally aware of the loop as found out in "The bending of italics" main event, and apparently recalls events that are from the loops from before the Current Sensei showed up as implied in the "Gallows Edge" main event.

Overall; it's a theory based off theories.

i thought todd went missing after she survived her first reset... after the night of screaming outside ami's window about being pregnant. the reset that followed that event was the first one ayane survived. You dont see ayane again till you are in your office mid reset. first time she made it to the roof top she didnt survive. she vanished while hugging akira and maya

Question is: Why would Tsuneyo do this? I see no reason there besides: "Oh, free meat for our shop."
More reasonable seems to be (for me) that Ami killed Todd in a rage fit, because Ayane is getting way to comfortable with Akira.
Their conversation within dorm wars (3?) might have triggered that.
Didn't Ami tell Ayane she's fucking Akira?
Killing Todd is like mafia horse head in Ayanes bed.

I really think if this game had a main antagonist, it would be Ami and associates.

yep my money is on ami being the main character and kiling people and maybe one lone chicken so far

 

[BlackDays]

So, i had a feeling that the whole walled of city stuff was ringing a bell, or three or more .
(Besides, it also connects to my main/backup theory, where the city is inside someones mind/brain (this town has two halves), so the walls are the skull or the limits of someones mind.)
I already knew where from but i just looked into it now.
Besides what i will be pointing out though it still rings another bell somehow, somewhere. Just don't know what it might be.
Anyway.

Dark City 1998 Movie

Spoiler: Dark City small summary

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So i wonder if Sel took some inspiration from that movie or it's origin, or the origin of it's origin somewhere down the line.

Oh and this is more like a loose "what if", if someone has more insight, cool. If not, we don't have to go down that pasta route.

 

[DeSkel15]

i thought todd went missing after she survived her first reset... after the night of screaming outside ami's window about being pregnant. the reset that followed that event was the first one ayane survived. You dont see ayane again till you are in your office mid reset. first time she made it to the roof top she didnt survive. she vanished while hugging akira and maya


yep my money is on ami being the main character and kiling people and maybe one lone chicken so far

Technically, I'd assume he went missing during the reset that Ayane ends up surviving, since everything alive seems to disappear. Todd wasn't actually said to not have came back yet until after she actually survived a reset though.

She survived her first reset at the end of chapter 2 "Utinam"(long ass name) and mentions Todd hasn't come back in Chapter 3's "A Walk through hell", where Tsuneyo mentions she has a history of killing chickens. Later on he is found dead in Yumi's "Loggerhead" Event soon before the most recent reset where Tsuneyo seems unaffected by the reset while Maya, Yumi, and Ayane go Tshaped in "Dec 28 2020".

Unless she mentioned he went missing before Maya asked her if she was pregnant, but I can't seem to recall that.

Also Ayane said she wasn't pregnant when Maya asked the night before she survived, while Ami was being turned inside out in her room, during "The light of last summer". She wasn't screaming that she was pregnant, because only the first time she made it to the roof and didn't survive, did she actually seem to be pregnant.

 

[DeSkel15]

I disagree - one does not have to be apathetic about everything. I can be apathetic about where the group decides to go for dinner but I can still want to eat. I think it's a better description than submissive of a person where the times he actually does what someone tells him to do or doesn't do what someone tells him not to do are the exceptions. When he does go along, it's usually because a) he doesn't care, or b) he has actually started to care enough about someone that their happiness matters to him more than his apathy.

I didn't say everything. I said sex and the girls, who tend to tell him what to do, which is where he can be submissive in.

Apathy and Submissiveness are similar but apathy means "no interest" meaning he'd have no reason to actually do what they want. In other words, he'd ignore them. Submissive means he tends to be obedient to the will of others. If you "don't care", but still do something for someone, you're not actually being apathetic, you're being submissive. If you don't care and walk away, that's more in line for being apathetic.

Like when Maya asked him to carry a box and not to open it in Maya's "Secrets worth keeping" event. Apathetic would mean he'd just ignore her. Submissive would mean he'd take the box, even if he finds it heavy, and express interest in opening it, but still wouldn't because he is told not to, then would carry that box to the school on her orders... which is what he did. This:

Spoiler

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doesn't strike me as apathetic. Just Submissive.

I'm not sure why Sensei being pointed out to be submissive at times seems to rub some people the wrong way.

 

[DeSkel15]

I've forgotten how Anti-Chicken Tsuneyo is:

Spoiler

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Event: Kaori's recent "Wither" event.

 

[hcguy]

I'm not sure why Sensei being pointed out to be submissive at times seems to rub some people the wrong way.

And I'm not sure why occasionally going along with what someone else wants is considered "submissive".

 

[barglenarglezous]

Not a big fan of birds, but I wouldn't be surprised if a Cuckoo shows up.

Apparently it symbolizes unrequited love, spring, and cuckoldry, as well as being favored by the likes of Hera, queen of the gods in Greek myth.

With Sekai around, the apparent relation to spring, her husband being a "god", and her relationship with Sensei where she'd fuck his brother and ended up ditching their kid with Sensei.. well unrequited love and cuckoldry seems to fit.

I think the cuckoo is already here, and it's more a literal cuckoo than a symbolic one.

The cuckoo lays its eggs in the nest of another bird, and it's eggs hatch earlier. The hatchling tricks the mother of the nest to care for it as its own child, going so far as to shove the other eggs out of the nest before they can hatch so that the mother cares only for her.

We are literally watching Ami try to shove the other girls out of Akira's nest (apartment) so that he loves only her. She's a cuckoo.

 

[DeSkel15]

And I'm not sure why occasionally going along with what someone else wants is considered "submissive".

I think it's far more than occasionally. His whole life seems to be based around doing things for 15 year old girls so that they'll event let him fuck them. Even then I've said he's submissive at times. Even if those times seem to be most of the time, like being Rin's back up date, paying for a rich idol's food, doing as Ami commands (besides having sex with her if you're a GU), coming over and helping Wakana in the kitchen, throwing away his money at Uta-Chan, letting Touka and Tsubasa cover his face and take him wherever, most of the dorm wars stuff, etc.

I mean there's a reason he's not exactly considered dangerous even though most people consider him a predator. Wakana and Yuki even seem to tease him about it.

 

[DeSkel15]

I think the cuckoo is already here, and it's more a literal cuckoo than a symbolic one.

The cuckoo lays its eggs in the nest of another bird, and it's eggs hatch earlier. The hatchling tricks the mother of the nest to care for it as its own child, going so far as to shove the other eggs out of the nest before they can hatch so that the mother cares only for her.

We are literally watching Ami try to shove the other girls out of Akira's nest (apartment) so that he loves only her. She's a cuckoo.

Interesting, I can see where you're coming from. That'd fit my Sekai analogy as well since she'd be a Cuckoo that left her egg in Sensei's nest which became the Ami we know.