alex2011, geez, you really went all out.
They call it VISUAL novel for a reason. Delivery through visuals always supersedes and transcends delivery through text alone, that's just how out brains work, I believe. You add visual part and turnes into a visual medium.
It is a visual medium. Not in the same way movie is, or comic book/manga, but still. Visuals are as important as text. There are plenty information delivered through visuals alone, as well as through sounds and music (to a much lesser degree) in this very game. I'm not even talking about that "port number" or whatever it was. You gotta balance this things. And if so, then argument that there's "too much text in VN" is valid (not in this particular case as Selebus balance things right I feel, but in principle).
The reason they call it a visual novel is because it is a computerized novel with visual aids. It is a text medium with pictures, the text is ALWAYS the focus of the developer behind the novel except in instances where sex is thrown in just to have sex scenes. No, there is not plenty of information in the visuals, you could have a rape scene depicted and have the text say it was consensual. In this, admittedly very extreme, example, the act is not a rape scene because the text says she consented. The reverse is also possible, the visual looks consensual, but in the text she resists, so it is rape. A visual aid does not transform the medium. A physical novel, by which I mean an actual book, doesn't become a visual medium just because it was published with some pictures in it, so a visual novel doesn't either. There are plenty of physical novels that, yes, have pictures, usually an illustration at the beginning of a chapter if anything unless it is adapted from a film, in which case actual scenes from the film might be placed on inserted photo paper. Things are already balanced exactly as
Selebus wants, with the text taking priority. 'too much text' is NEVER a valid argument in anything short of a school assignment with a maximum word limit.
Yes that is games fault and it brakes the narrative for a player, it is hollow in game design sense because it is a cop out.
Game first needs to show player that his actions have consequences and in this game we have very little choice and even less consequences so it is no fault of a player to get surprised by this.
Nope, it is yours. You proceeded to have a sexual relationship with the girl she likes. You took an action that resulted in betraying her trust and you also failed to take actions in game, in this thread, and in all other media related to the game that would warn you of this betrayal. It is EXTREMELY common knowledge that this can occur and WILL under specific conditions. It is THE most talked about thing in this thread with another scene being a close second. It is fully intended to be as it is, life is not always clear on what is the right course of action and this game portrays that perfectly.
Yes, I agree. I'm not saying it's a bad thing. Just one of the tougher aspects of the game to deal with from a consequence standpoint.
It doesn't have to be anyone's "fault". It's just, you can't really hold a player responsible for breaking a promise that hadn't made yet and are forced to make to proceed after they'd already done the thing they said they wouldn't do.
In my case, I just went back to an old save and held off on Schadenfeude until after the beach event. Which is what I would have done in the first place if I knew that was going to happen.
It isn't the fault of the player that they broke the promise in that case, it is the fault of the player that they did things in a way so that they were unable to fulfill the promise before it was even made. Holding off on Schadenfreude is the best course of action as is restarting from a point before it if you fail to do so.
One who doesn't know the difference of "brakes" and "BREAKS" can't be taken seriously
They may know and just not pay specific attention to which they use. I'm usually an extreme grammar Nazi and have to hold back from correcting literally every spelling and grammar error I see or hear, but I am much more relaxed about it on here.
Loved the new update, though I stopped playing after the previous version for a tad due to the... events jumping to a new level (mainly Makoto), however this update has set my worries aside, apart from getting stuck a little in the latest happy event it was fun and great to see some festive cheer!
Also as a side note my personal theory of this being just a game/simulation of somekind seems to be getting some more grounding,
Please tell me that pun was not intended, those of you who have yet to play the game will know what I mean when you see it. The 'happy' event is actually extremely linear, but there is a main event right after that is not. If you mean the whole
terminal puzzle, that was actually part of
there is nothing. I'm starting to believe that theory of yours might be the case as well.
It's pretty much like life; there are situations that have consequences that one never knew/knows about. If one knew every consequence of every possible action, life would be pretty boring.
Exactly, boring, monotonous, dull. Words I don't want anything to do with unless I'm using them in a writing project. Life needs some adventure, some fun, some things that don't always go the way we want, and that is exactly how life is. The same can be said of this game. It would be extremely boring to be able to predict everything and just make decisions based on that knowledge that will get us the best outcome. No offense to
Selebus, of course.
Yes but if it were real life, I wouldn't HAVE to promise not to do something I've already done. I'd have the option to either not make the promise or admit then and there that it's too late.
Edit: Bottom line, I don't think it's fair to call it a betrayal by breaking a promise you haven't made yet.
It isn't about promising not to do something you already have, it's about not making decisions that bear the possibility of hurting people. Unlike this game, you don't have a game thread on a forum or a wiki telling you not to do something or you'll hurt somebody by doing it. You have to either take the chance with the risk or play it safe and potentially risk not getting what the former would get you with potentially zero information to help make that decision. The bottom line is you had the information readily available in multiple places and did not use it, you went ahead and began a sexual relationship with Chika before Rin got the chance to try and you hurt Rin in the process, badly.
Not fair to the player, fair to Sensei- who knowingly conceals his relationship with Chika from Rin if you pursue the former first.
To be fair, he basically coceals all his relationships. The only ones I can think of who know are Ayane, *looks over shoulder in fear of a knife wielding blonde*, Ami, *looks over shoulder again for a knife wielding redhead*, Maya, Rin, Yumi, Kirin, Makoto, Haruka, Sara, probably Sana because of the bar's acoustics, and Chika. I didn't get the feeling the rest were aware, though Chinami might suspect player Sensei and Chika, she seems a bit more intelligent than she lets on and more than average for her age or at least more attentive to such things, but she doesn't seem to know.
No it's definitely valid criticism and I get why you'd think that way, but it doesn't mean I'm going to instantly change an intent I had as a creator. If I so easily bent to things like that, everyone would be pregnant and/or have a penis right now.
There's plenty of feedback I've taken and made changes for- Hell, that's what the entire next update is. Improvements for older content that I don't think hold up over time or fixing directorial mistakes I may have made. But what you're suggesting I do now is antithetical to the way I look at this project. I want people to fail. I want to make it hell to achieve a "perfect" route. The most canonical path for Sensei is being a "bad homie" and I'm not going to backtrack and rework that just because someone interpreted said intent as inconsistency.
I wouldn't want it any other way than yours. Challenge accepted, by the way. I'm going to get that perfect run no matter the cost.
I think a lot of people that see it as a "gotcha" should read this post:
I keep forgetting about that one, can't wait to see what the dark routes have in store. Do your worst, Selebus. I'll take anything and everything you throw at me.
I'll be honest, despite having to wind it back (may even start over again at another date cause man am I drained and its gonna take forever to redo) I do like the fact that it really does punish you if even for no good reason because sometimes life does just drop that shit. For me it was that dread that I already was all up on Chika when Rin was saying this and that I was wondering when all the shit was gonna come crashing down, and feeling bad when I saw it fall around me. In the same way that trying to ahve a certain niece call me by a certain name.
It's startling, wrenching, and disturbingly sweet to feel that kind of emotional whiplash in a genre dominated by "You are the protag, everything is yours for the taking"
We're the villain We're along for the ride and we're seeing where our innocuous choices may lead, and maybe that's to destroying everyone one by one with our 'ignorant acts'
Indeed, there aren't many games where the choices truly matter. Some may say the choices matter, but this is one of the few that bear grave consequences for even the tiniest mistake, just like life itself. That feeling when you've already gone too far with Chika and Rin asks you not to, that feeling when you know you've already screwed up before even getting a chance, you can't beat that. The feeling you get when you know, but do it anyway. Even that doesn't hold a candle to the dread of the 'oh shit' realization that dawns when you're already finger blasting Chika when Rin asks you to hold back for a while. It was a brilliant move by Selebus, really. Now, I will admit that my case was different. There was no promise at the time I started relations at that level with Chika, it hadn't been added yet, but the result is the same. I had still already done what Rin asked me not to. That dread still persists in me now. I actually didn't expect her to react as she did, she burned me for it, but I was fully resigned to getting chewed out by a VERY irate Rin. I was expecting her to be pissed, I was expecting her to yell at me, to beat me to a pulp, something out of anger, but she didn't. She showed incredible restraint in the aftermath. Personally, I am a full blown pacifist that would only ever use violence when there was no other option, but even I don't have the restraint in me she showed. In fact, the fact that she didn't is even worse now that I think about it. She blew right passed reacting out of anger. She was so angry that her calmness in the aftermath did all her talking for her. She might have said she wasn't angry, I honestly forgot her exact words, but I do remember the general scene and you can tell that isn't true. That calm anger is the absolute worst. If a girl is perfectly calm after you do something this severe, it's time to leave the freaking planet for your own safety. Calm anger is when they are at their angriest and it won't be pretty if you let it boil over. Luckily, she didn't seem to boil over after. As for 'destroying everyone,' I can't, I just can't. Go ahead, HOPE-Sama, force me to do it, but I refuse to do it of my own accord.
I don't think you should change things like that as i mention problem wasn't the choice but how choice was presented.
I don't mind picking wrong options but I got stuck with gameplay loop not knowing how to progress further caused me to
do everything even events I don't want to. So it stung when I realised I was on right track and the fact that I didn't even know it was possible for events to crossover didn't help.
Just after that I get stuck again just to find out NOW you have to do every event to proceed over, and I had to use guide to find this out. It really made me feel like a donkey for trying to be smart about my event order.
All events not counted as lust events are important to progression. There are multiple events with other events needed to see them. If you cannot progress, raise affection with each girl. If something doesn't trigger automatically, use the weekends and the call and invite options to see if it is a scene that only triggers by your interaction. That said, only events that serve as prerequisites are necessary before the event that needs them. Events like Schadenfreude don't need to be done in any specific order as long as they are done at some point. You have to do them to progress, but the order is entirely your decision with any event that isn't a prerequisite or any event that doesn't have prerequisites besides affection level.
Just gonna quote this bit, cause that's the one part I'm thinking about right now.. With how the game is, how sensei is, and how actions have consequences (all the Rin/Chika drama that keeps showing up in the thread), I just KNOW that the final true ending will NOT be a happy ending. I've played Acting Lessons, Kimi Ga Nozomu Ein and Clannad before. I'm pretty sure LiL will turn out to be an Utsuge in the end. Well, not totally, since there'll be a purity route, but yeah..
That's almost guaranteed in this genre. I'm not sure it will become an Utsuge, but the true ending probably won't be a positive ending. Selebus seems to be going more of the Denpa route, but either way, positive isn't likely.
Well, if you intend to leave it that way, it's okay, I can see how it could work. I didn't go through that option myself, but does it emphasize how Sensei could confess right now and probably hurting Rin a lot more than now in the future but lol who the fuck wants to bother, let's just delay and lie, that will never backfire?
For those of us considered bad homies, it already has backfired, spectacularly at that.
Hopefully the purity routes will at least be happy
Maybe, maybe not. The genre of VN this pulls from doesn't bode well, but we might get a little happiness thrown our way.
