Ren'Py Lessons in Love [v0.48.0] [Selebus]

[NicolasL4D]

Never in a sexual manner towards Akira. "I'm thinking about you all the time. And I don't mean it in a sexual manner. We're friends". Also, concern doesn't mean a good person. I can be concerned that I don't even have a season and it's all been between Wires and HOPE for hundreds of years. Yasu constantly says that HOPE isn't callous either. It's a matter of perception.

However, if your theory is that USER3 isn't Pareidolia, then there isn't much we can say on that front.

True but each represent their concept.

Callous is obviously callous, focusing on desires, etc.

But that seems to be what USER3/Pariadoelia does, which is confusing to hell. It also just doesn't make sense with what we've SEEN Concern do prior to ch3. For example, the whole Yumi situation where it blatantly stopped Akira.

 

[Bingoogus]

Speaking of Kitty Hawk...

Spoiler: Watermelon Maya

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[Breadtaker]

Edit: For what it's worth, I will say that the "miss" option to Io's event is beautiful and uplifting.

For me, this is one of the reasons this decision casts doubt onto the greenpath moreso than others. Usually when you miss something, it quickly fades to black, you go home and nothing happens. And while the "leave" option is still short in Io's event, I feel like it does a lot narratively.

 

[crustlord12]

That's fair. I think we're of the same mind on the matter. Perhaps some of us have triggered that reaction from other people by focusing so much on the so called green path, that they somehow felt they had to justify not following it. More power to them if that's the case. I hope people play however they want to play.

Edit: For what it's worth, I will say that the "miss" option to Io's event is beautiful and uplifting.

I wouldn't put that on anyone, I don't think people doing a green path or 100% are wrong or even encouraging people to play differently. I just find it interesting how we think about things. I worry about missing context and information too so I usually replay a choice with a backup save. I don't want to put people down for playing a game a certain way, more like talk about why we might think the way we do and encourage people to find out if what they're doing is for them.

I have to agree on Io's recent event, though. I feel like, understandably, the miss option hasn't been talked about much because of how impactful/provocative the optional scene is. The miss dialogue and implications are equally as important though, I feel.

Spoiler: Io event

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I get what you're both saying, but I think the strongest "argument" for going green path is that it's clearly the story Selebus wants to tell. I guess I'd equate red events to reading a book and skipping over a section you just don't enjoy. The author is going to end up telling their story regardless and while you can alter some things to avoid feeling bad, you end up getting an inferior version of the story

 

[peef]

I feel like it does a lot narratively.

Selebus could start putting effort into branching paths, there's a first time for everything. I wouldn't get my hopes up though

 

[ccxvidonaferens]

Selebus could start putting effort into branching paths, there's a first time for everything. I wouldn't get my hopes up though

If anything I would more likely expect some sort of dick move from way out of left field from Selebus about four or five updates down the line just to really troll us.

 

[BlackDays]

Another thing to add to the green/red path discussion.

No one knows if Sel isn't going to punish people not going the green way.
And while it would be a precedent, he could just soft/hardlock people from progress in one of the next updates, like in three or so. Someone needs to wash their hair?
A precedent because he has never gone this far afair but also because of the red/missed event.
Now, it is at least technically possible for him to revert/replace that red event.

Also i think that the whole destroy her event, is a precedent.
The way Sel made it, it's different from everything i can remember.
What i thought was, the only thing that would make it clearer what Sel was trying to do here, if that was really his goal, would have been to add that red? basecap into the room or even make Akira wear one.

I just read later that there was some figure in the Noriko event/s wearing a purple basecap?
That totally escaped me.

 

[Bingoogus]

If anything I would more likely expect some sort of dick move from way out of left field from Selebus about four or five updates down the line just to really troll us.

Won't work, we've got my beloved URM to 'fix' anything he tries.

 

[ccxvidonaferens]

Won't work, we've got my beloved URM to 'fix' anything he tries.

Hey. I never said he'd succeed. I mean he hasn't yet.

 

[ratmanirl]

I wouldn't put that on anyone, I don't think people doing a green path or 100% are wrong or even encouraging people to play differently. I just find it interesting how we think about things. I worry about missing context and information too so I usually replay a choice with a backup save. I don't want to put people down for playing a game a certain way, more like talk about why we might think the way we do and encourage people to find out if what they're doing is for them.

I have to agree on Io's recent event, though. I feel like, understandably, the miss option hasn't been talked about much because of how impactful/provocative the optional scene is. The miss dialogue and implications are equally as important though, I feel.

Spoiler: Io event

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Honestly the whole thing feels like a sense check. Ignoring what happened with Maya, this is quite possibly the most disgusting scene in the entire game so far. There's a quote from the VN from way earlier, which is like "you don't applaud someone who breaks everything for leaving one thing unbroken", and it's kinda the same here. I'm sure some people feel proud of Akira (if they chose the non-evil option) but like, are we really applauding a guy for not taking advantage of a sexual abuse victim?

But in terms of overall themes, relating back to other visual novels, usually the sex scene is used for the culmination of a route, used to bring closer the heroine and the MC and almost in a way transfer the problems of the heroine onto the MC (for example, a common thing is like the heroine finds the bravery to confront her problems after consumating her relationship with the MC). Here, it's pretty bluntly subverted to show how horrible it can be, kinda mocking the idea of it being a magic tool to fix the problems of the heroines. Though, this has already been a sort of reoccurring theme: Makoto still killed herself, Futaba still hates how she looks, etc.

 

[PhiloPhilo]

I get what you're both saying, but I think the strongest "argument" for going green path is that it's clearly the story Selebus wants to tell. I guess I'd equate red events to reading a book and skipping over a section you just don't enjoy. The author is going to end up telling their story regardless and while you can alter some things to avoid feeling bad, you end up getting an inferior version of the story

I don't know if I can get on board with that in its entirety, or at least in every case. I think Sel wants to tell a story in which there are multiple options. He may want you to pick one possible path or see it as the more likely/favorable one, and some of those options may even be traps (like the shampoo,) but at the same time, the choices are there for a reason. They're also not there far more often than they are, and the story simply happens, and your role as the reader is to accept it. The story is also being told in Ren'py with those branches added in — it's not a book, and aside from choose-your-own-adventure books, books don't give you control over a character and ask "Do you want to go home or perform x?" In CYOA books, both options have an outcome — some lead to instant death, or a worse ending, or missing elements, but that's the point. I've already written about how I don't feel that missing a scene = skipping plot. It's a different plot, so those potential scenes don't happen, they're coded in for if you choose otherwise. It's not the reader altering or omitting the content, but the author creating a multitude.
I do agree that there are seemingly favorable options and options you're encouraged to choose, even more logical and fitting options. There may even be "canonical" paths, at least when the game is finished, and that's fine. I just disagree that any option is actually "losing out" so to say, and that there is no return or other gain given. And it's all still what the author decided to write and put in the game, unless retconned. Even if the purpose is to be able to fuck up the story, I think it's fitting with the story itself, one in which we constantly fuck up regardless.
Feel like I should reiterate that this is just how I feel about the story and stories with branching narratives in general, and my opinion, and doesn't equate to me saying anyone or their playthrough is wrong or that I won't be completely hardlocked out of the game in 15 months.

 

[PhiloPhilo]

Honestly the whole thing feels like a sense check. Ignoring what happened with Maya, this is quite possibly the most disgusting scene in the entire game so far. There's a quote from the VN from way earlier, which is like "you don't applaud someone who breaks everything for leaving one thing unbroken", and it's kinda the same here. I'm sure some people feel proud of Akira (if they chose the non-evil option) but like, are we really applauding a guy for not taking advantage of a sexual abuse victim?

But in terms of overall themes, relating back to other visual novels, usually the sex scene is used for the culmination of a route, used to bring closer the heroine and the MC and almost in a way transfer the problems of the heroine onto the MC (for example, a common thing is like the heroine finds the bravery to confront her problems after consumating her relationship with the MC). Here, it's pretty bluntly subverted to show how horrible it can be, kinda mocking the idea of it being a magic tool to fix the problems of the heroines. Though, this has already been a sort of reoccurring theme: Makoto still killed herself, Futaba still hates how she looks, etc.

You're 100% right, and I think that Akira trying to change or grapple with himself despite still being scummy has been the case for a while. I believe Io was the one to say something to the effect of "Wow, you're really trying to be a good person now, magically?" And Makoto did the same thing after her father died. It's also been the case that not only does sex not actually help the girls in most cases, it doesn't help him, either. He acknowledges that it's all he knows how to do, a distraction, and ultimately harmful. In some cases even, the desire of deific beings that he's opposed to. The disgust and the fallout is really the centerfold

 

[JelF547]

View attachment 3801662

Special watermelon delivery

 

[Kitty Hawk]

View attachment 3801662

It didn't fit in the pussy

 

[derekthered56]

Honestly I think the choices are just there because clicking "destroy her" is much more impactful than just reading the next line. Everything else is just easter eggs.

Which is a shame, because I also think red path Io would have been a really interesting direction to explore. Certainly fresher than another round of Akira backsliding and Io wallowing in misery.

 

[Bingoogus]

Special watermelon delivery

The idea of eating a Maya assmelon is giving me the weirdest boner i've ever had... like, i know i'm a freak with a major ass fetish, but i've never been into scat... so then why am i getting turned on by the idea of a non-poop pooped food fresh from a cute girl's butt...

 

[JelF547]

The idea of eating a Maya assmelon is giving me the weirdest boner i've ever had... like, i know i'm a freak with a major ass fetish, but i've never been into scat... so then why am i getting turned on by the idea of a non-poop pooped food fresh from a cute girl's butt...

View attachment 3802075

Do you want to eat it with rind?

 

[corsair101]

The anti drm is only the gui, the script you have to use the latest one, it was on that post as backup for people who had theirs deleted.

Thank you! Major facepalm for not thinking of that myself, what happens when I try to debug things at 3AM in this weather while playing Factorio I suppose.

 

[Moonflare]

Honestly I think the choices are just there because clicking "destroy her" is much more impactful than just reading the next line. Everything else is just easter eggs.

Which is a shame, because I also think red path Io would have been a really interesting direction to explore. Certainly fresher than another round of Akira backsliding and Io wallowing in misery.

I agree completely - I read it as "feel bad player! muahaha". And I got that memo as early as "this town has two halves". If there is a choice, that choice has been made long ago. And there is hardly anything that Selebus can do that will convince me that I the player am somehow a deciding force in what happens.

There are some games that have the "urge" storyline, where the main character has to endure some kind of recurring temptation to do something. And it might be cool if by the end of the game there was a hidden counter related to "how many times Akira tried to be a better person when he had a choice" that led to a different ending.

Alas, to me, LiL is a book that its creator insists in transforming into a game with bad design. I keep hoping for the best, but expecting nothing outside of one good story.

 

[Bingoogus]

Do you want to eat it with rind?

No... but the two points of focus that are getting a positive signal sent back from my animal brain are 'warmed by her' and 'was inside her'.