Ren'Py Lessons in Love [v0.46.0] [Selebus]

[Moonflare]

I don't remember them kissing in spotless mind. I watched the replay and did not see it, maybe it cuts off early and I'm completely wrong idk. Also Akira says "Why would I recall something so small and insignificant at the end of Spotless mind.
The Character models look the same to me. The difference just seems to be casual vs more formal clothes because of Christmas? So I don't see why Spotless mind cant happen after Kyoto?

[...] at this point I really suggest you read our discussion on it a few pages back cause we're really just repeating the same things again to you.

We aren't even bringing up character models because we're trying to stick to what is said, rather than something that could be affected by the engine. But if you were to compare, Kyoto's models are older, you can see it in Akira's longer hair. Also from the fact that Sekai says he already looks like a man, and in spotless mind they're clearly kids.

Also it's not that spotless mind is cut off, but rather that you're not watching the following event in which Niki explains what the memory was, as zuko recalls: "Me without you", in which Niki meets him at the hotel lobby.

 

[Apollo259]

[...] at this point I really suggest you read our discussion on it a few pages back cause we're really just repeating the same things again to you.

We aren't even bringing up character models because we're trying to stick to what is said, rather than something that could be affected by the engine. But if you were to compare, Kyoto's models are older, you can see it in Akira's longer hair. Also from the fact that Sekai says he already looks like a man, and in spotless mind they're clearly kids.

Also it's not that spotless mind is cut off, but rather that you're not watching the following event in which Niki explains what the memory was, as zuko recalls: "Me without you", in which Niki meets him at the hotel lobby.

Yea I noticed after I posted that. I must have missed some of the specifics when skimming past the random arguments people were having.

Someone give me a dunce hat.

 

[Fire Lord Zuko]

If there was tampering, for sure there wasn't on the fact that Noriko was downstairs. It would have to be some next level masterplan to include little bits about Noriko on these events just to eventually be like "yeah, no, Niki never had a sister"

Yeah man, I know it’s a reach. But to be fair, none of us have much to work with.

I’m personally gonna wait and see if we get more insight on this timeline in a future update, but I do still wonder one thing:

Why did USER2 allow Akira to see that memory? Whether it’s false or completely genuine? What are his intentions with that? Is it merely to get Akira to trust him maybe?

Edit: By the way, I wasn’t implying Noriko doesn’t exist at all. Just that she wasn’t born yet at the time of Spotless Mind.

 

[Moonflare]

Yeah man, I know it’s a reach. But to be fair, none of us have much to work with.

I’m personally gonna wait and see if we get more insight on this timeline in a future update, but I do still wonder one thing:

Why did USER2 allow Akira to see that memory? Whether it’s false or completely genuine? What are his intentions with that? Is it merely to get Akira to trust him maybe?

Edit: By the way, I wasn’t implying Noriko doesn’t exist at all. Just that she wasn’t born yet at the time of Spotless Mind.

I mean, if the ultimate goal is to ride around in Akira's body, Wires is the only one going about it the right way. Dishing out favors, asking for nothing in return, always asking for permission...

It's hard to imagine HOPE ever going into Akira's mind and it not being a hostile takeover. It's just, I don't really think that's the goal... and furthermore, what even are the requirements? Can they go inside Kaori because Sekai was fucked up enough in the head through their meddling? Or can they go because Sekai allows it/entered an understanding with them in order to also be hosted by Kaori?

Just grooming people to serve as hosts for sure can't be the whole picture as there are so many things that have nothing to do with it.

Edit: Additionally, I get the feeling that Akira could have pushed Pareidolia out any moment he wanted. Pareidolia kind of hints at this when he says that he had to serve a function that Akira unconsciously asked for. The moment Akira solved his own issues, Pareidolia'd be out, possibly kind of the same for HOPE and Yasu.

Which btw is insane to me, because our true bro Pareidolia tells Akira many times how to stop needing him. "accept yourself" and stuff, well, if he did, wouldn't Pareidolia just be bereft of function? He literally tells Akira during his reset that he will end up like his father, and during this reset he doubles down saying that he will end up like Kaori, and that it's too late to revert it now. He's been telling Akira a lot of stuff that works against his interests (?) since the start.

 

[Fire Lord Zuko]

Which btw is insane to me, because our true bro Pareidolia tells Akira many times how to stop needing him. "accept yourself" and stuff, well, if he did, wouldn't Pareidolia just be bereft of function? He literally tells Akira during his reset that he will end up like his father, and during this reset he doubles down saying that he will end up like Kaori, and that it's too late to revert it now. He's been telling Akira a lot of stuff that works against his interests (?) since the start.

Yeah…

Pareidolia = Akira’s coping device, quite honestly.

That’s why I have a feeling that, depending on how Part 2 of the Reset goes, the ‘senseisad’ variable will finally be turned off after being introduced way back in 0.36. Pareidolia’s gone. Akira has no need of him anymore. Or at least, he doesn’t need to rely on him as heavily.

That begs another question, though: who tf did Pareidolia sacrifice himself to? What other entity is taking his place as the god of Spring? Because this has never happened in the game before.

Is it Sekai’s Ghost? It seems almost too easy, right? But like… who else makes sense? Especially with the Cherry Blossom references linked directly to Sekai (and Spring) being foreshadowed ever since Chapter 1?

Spoiler

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[Bingoogus]

Someone give me a dunce hat.

Welcome brother!

 

[Apollo259]

Here is a random thought I had after reading the information we got from Pareidolia. I'm wondering if a similar thing had crossed anyone else's mind.

I thought that maybe Ami could be causing the resets through her insane love for Akira. She could be doing it intentionally given how often she seems to know more than she should, maybe she has indeed survived form the start. But I'm actually leaning towards it being unintentional. Perhaps sometimes she has managed to survive them multiple times in a row but inevitably ends up resetting herself as well. I'm thinking of it as something along the lines of an ability she initially cant control and doesn't even know she has, but every reset she goes down a path that either leads to her triggering it unintentionally or to remembering things that inevitably lead to her triggering it intentionally for whatever reasons.

If Ami can hear all the Gods Like Sekai supposedly could. Maybe even the Gods have to manipulate her into causing the reset in ways that suit them. I have no evidence for this, it's just something that crossed my mind after what Pareidolia said about the nature of the Gods and then thinking about the way Ami has been acting.

 

[LessonsInDissonance]

I just think that WIRES is very cool and whatever he did is justified and we should thank him for being a good friend

 

[Dc345]

Today is Noodle Warrior's birthday. Happy Birthday Tsuneyo!

 

[Moonflare]

Today is Noodle Warrior's birthday. Happy Birthday Tsuneyo!

I don't remember who made the joke, but everytime I see Tsuneyo's name in the thread now, I imagine her leaking the update and yelling to Selebus "get leaked, bro!"

 

[Fire Lord Zuko]

Spoiler: Uta Bathhouse Spying

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[anothersilo]

Echoing what aramaug said, there have been a lot of posts about this already. But in a few words: Noriko's age isn't a matter about a toddler being able to sneak in or not, but that the whole thing makes no sense.

In spotless mind she was old enough to be considered a kid, and Kyoto takes place after it. Even if we assume she was just born in spotless mind, it's already bordering on impossibility for her to be in the same class as Ami.

If we take what would be probable, both from her being classified as a kid, as she herself saying she imprinted on Akira when she was 3 - then the events of Spotless Mind would make her 3, she'd be at least 4 during kyoto, which would make her almost 5 years older than Ami.

Noriko would be a 20 year old, which would make her an actual Imani pretending to be a freshman in highschool.

So...if Noriko was 3 or older in spotless mind, that would mean it took place when Akira was 19. Or older. Which is pretty bizarre since they both seemed like they were 12-14ish in that event.

Also, that would make Akira at a minimum 20 in Kyoto (which is also weird because he would be an adult and shouldn't be worrying about what people would think seeing him and Sekai together).

Also also, Nikki specifically said she was surprised Akria remembered the kiss since they "didn't get together until way later". Which means he probably didn't immediately jump to intimate-but-no-sex. Which means, for things to really make sense, Kyoto probably took place several years after Spotless mind.

 

[YOUDIDIT]

It would make a lot of sense for Ami to not be real, or rather her being there is very convenient to the forces that would be able to put a fake in her place. Because, really, she's what keeps Akira from killing himself. She's the first one he sees when the cycle starts, she's the one that "goes insane", she's the one that shows up during all sorts of happy events, she's the avatar of the xeonon, she's the substitute of the flower that Akira sought refuge in, she's her mother's stand-in, she's the oh so perfect little girl... At some point, we should probably start a tierlist on the likelyhood of characters not being real, cause this is getting interesting.

I had the idea early in the game that Ami was dead - she died in the same disaster as Sekai.
During resets we often can see "broken Ami" - who is she?
Her place is sometimes taken by NAO - why is it Ami? How is Ami different from the others?
Then I forgot about this idea.

However, regarding Ami's ability to survive resets - in 2 resets we see Ami dying.

Spoiler: There is Nothing

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And yes, at the end of the last event we see TWO Mayas.
This is going to be fun.

 

[fasoaga]

This is very amusing

Fuck japanese vn in general. They are pretentious as fuck, taking any of them in literature sense is retarted. Also you are replying to a person looking for fight(not gonna use the word troll, these morons do not know the glory of trolling of 2009-2017). I would suggest to simply ignore Princess, this thread is derailed from main topic(and hey, why do i get my comments deleted for off-top, but not him? Oppression) enough already

What the hell happened in 2017 that decreased the quality of trolls?

 

[fasoaga]

I know this question has been asked on this thread a dozen times already, but I haven't seen an answer I actually like yet. Are there any games out there that match this game's quality? It doesn't have to be like LiL plotwise in literally any way. But despite all of his (many) flaws, Selebus clearly puts his soul into this game. There are reveals now that have clearly been planned out for years. And the characters just feel so. so. human. And when I go from LiL to playing literally any other game on this site, they all just feel so bland and one-dimensional in comparison. I just want a game that doesn't feel like an immediate downgrade. Something I can immerse myself in, with characters I'll genuinely care about. Something I'll actually think about after I'm done playing it.

It's going to be a month until the next update, and I really want another game to play while I'm waiting. Anyone have any suggestions?

I can't say anything about plot points that are planned for years, but if you are looking for characters acting like human rather than set/story pieces i can recommend "corporate culture". It doesn't make you theory crafting like lost, game of thrones or lil but i believe you will care about the characters in it.

 

[Antosha]

I had the idea early in the game that Ami was dead - she died in the same disaster as Sekai.
During resets we often can see "broken Ami" - who is she?
Her place is sometimes taken by NAO - why is it Ami? How is Ami different from the others?
Then I forgot about this idea.

However, regarding Ami's ability to survive resets - in 2 resets we see Ami dying.

Spoiler: There is Nothing

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And yes, at the end of the last event we see TWO Mayas.
This is going to be fun.

I mean, it’s occurred to me many times that the entire cast are dead. Look at the unrelenting level of trauma.

I think I’ve mentioned this before, but the whole situation could be reminiscent of the old science fiction/metaphysical flick

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.

 

[Bingoogus]

I mean, it’s occurred to me many times that the entire cast are dead. Look at the unrelenting level of trauma.

I think I’ve mentioned this before, but the whole situation could be reminiscent of the old science fiction/metaphysical flick

You must be registered to see the links

.

I'd forgotten all about that movie until you mentioned it, i remember watching it as a kid when staying at my Oma's, she had an entire room full, wall to wall, with VHS tapes and i probably watched more than half of them. That final scene really stands out though, soon as i googled the name i was immediately like "ooooooh that movie!".

 

[Antosha]

I'd forgotten all about that movie until you mentioned it, i remember watching it as a kid when staying at my Oma's, she had an entire room full, wall to wall, with VHS tapes and i probably watched more than half of them. That final scene really stands out though, soon as i googled the name i was immediately like "ooooooh that movie!".

Yeah. THAT movie.

Your gramma sounds like she was an interesting lady!

 

[chronox42]

General thoughts / notes / questions about installment 44:

Spoiler: Pre-Game

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Spoiler: The Party

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Spoiler: Nao-chan and the Lake

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Spoiler: The Roof

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Spoiler: The Quest

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Take and hypotheses about the culmination:

Spoiler: Kyoto

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Spoiler: The Orb

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A stab at theory-crafting:

Spoiler: Controversial Suggestion: Sekai

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Spoiler: Controversial Suggestion: Noriko

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This was a good update, lots to think about, and it's been a while since I've anticipated the next installment so much. It really is amazing that this story has been going strong, fueling so much genuine interest, for so long. It's the only thing I've ever read that has almost felt like another life.

Spoiler: PS: VN recs

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[Bingoogus]

I'm still completely on the fence about the timeline issues being an error. As has been said numerous times, it's possible, but Selly strikes me as the kind of writer that has booklet or large diagram mapping out each and every specific detail about the time before the game starts... i just don't see how is ego could leave room for such critique and ridicule for making that kind of mistake, the revelation of the past is such a critical component of his magnum opus that i can't help but picture him spending many many hours poring over it and ensuring everything lines up as you have to do that before you can then start to twist it around and into itself for the story, you need to know what you're leaving breadcrumbs for before you can properly leave them out. To me, these inconsistencies are simply clues, that once enough have been collected the truth will suddenly jump out like a stereoscopic image. Sekai, Ami, Maya, the Nakayamas, Himawari's suggestions, arguments and claims, they all go together to paint something, but we're not there yet.