Ren'Py Lessons in Love [v0.48.0] [Selebus]

[PhiloPhilo]

If it was Akira, then it'd make perfect sense for him to say "why did it have to be her?". Since Akira wishes he'd died in Sekai's place (and would have at the very least displeasure towards Nozomu, if not outright hatred). The most agreed upon interpretation of this scene is that it's Nozomu asking Sekai: "Oh, Sekai (World), in our final moments (both of them are dying), please answer me this: Why? Why did you sexually abuse and cheat on me/had a child with Akira?".

Spoiler: Car crash theories

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Another possibility is that everyone was in the car since:

Spoiler: Everyone was in the car configuration

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The issue with that, of course, is that Ami seems a lot less scared of cars than Akira. But that could be simply because she was a kid and maybe has hazier memories of the whole situation compared to him. I don't know how Akira "jumped" or how Niki even knew about it, maybe he jumped over the debris to get Sekai's body out? I have no clue, "jump" referring to this when he probably jumped to his death at a later date seems weird.

I could be missing something, and likely am, but for whatever reason in my head I picture Sekai and Nozomu coming home when they're hit, and Ami and Akira being at home seeing it. That's why Akira would be able to (uninjured) look down at Sekai and try to take metal off of her, and why neither were injured. It would also be awkward (although no less possible I suppose) for Akira to be in the car when Nozomu confronts Sekai, at least for it not coming up explicitly and being a thing before recently. I honestly have no idea what "you jumped" is supposed to mean, though. I'd agree that it means he jumped in fright or towards something, most likely, though. And I honestly don't think you can place Akira in the car and not Ami (or, you could, but don't need to.) Who's watching her? And if it's far-fetched for the crash to happen close to their home, where both would have seen it, Ami wouldn't have seen it either, only Akira who was in the car.

I have a slightly different take on the line "why did it have to be him" though. I still think it could easily be rhetorical or said in line with the poem that's clearly being referenced in differences scenes. I do think that it's most likely that Akira is using the phrase "O world" in most cases that come up, as a poetry reference, like I said. But I do think there's evidence that it's Nozomu saying this, and that this could be hinted at in, or he could be a narrator in the other scenes with these lines, speaking more-so as "himself" than potentially a user. I already had some loose/basic thoughts on it written down, so I'll paste them mostly unchanged.

At a basic level, besides Yasu's use, every mention of the term "O world" seems to be (possibly/most likely) from Akira, in a continuation of his inner-monologue or narration. Taken all together, we can assume that it is still Akira whenever the narrator uses the phrase "O world," or references whatever poem contains the phrase. It fits his speech, and flows within the dialogue enough be him, and with that many scenes it tracks that this is a phrase/reference he uses and is mostly unique to him. He even says "I speak to myself — O world-" in the event, O World, confirming that he uses this phrase/reference.

The other possibility is that it's not Akira using/referencing this phrase, but someone else — or, Akira and someone else that would both know of the poem, Akira's use of it, would be similar to Akira, etc. Someone who's potentially jumping in-between his monologues. This is the tinfoil hat theory.
Yasu also uses the phrase "O world." O World is also the name of the event in which Akira and Ami go to Nozomu and Sekai's grave. So who is associated with the user Yasu follows? And who would also refer to Akira with "Why did it have to be him?" Who perhaps feels guilty about what's happened to him in the past, and what he's going through? Or be angry at him? Who would know about Akira's reading/poetry, or perhaps even be similar enough to him to share those qualities/hobbies or use the same idioms/references?
Nozomu.

Spoiler: The other mentions of the phrase, for context

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[Azkled]

Hello, I don't want to interfere too much with the theory crafting going on, but I just want to point out that when Niki says "You jumped." she's just pointing out that Akira physically reacts to seeing the street where the accident happened. She's just wondering if seeing the street got him to remember something, not that he literally jumped back when it happened.

 

[PhiloPhilo]

Hello, I don't want to interfere too much with the theory crafting going on, but I just want to point out that when Niki says "You jumped." she's just pointing out that Akira physically reacts to seeing the street where the accident happened. She's just wondering if seeing the street got him to remember something, not that he literally jumped back when it happened.

That's entirely possible. I hadn't reread the scene in game but I checked just now. It's not really clear, but I don't think it really affects the actual events either way, so I'm gonna keep it in that part of my brain that goes "eh."

 

[LoveRedHairedGirl]

Hello, I don't want to interfere too much with the theory crafting going on, but I just want to point out that when Niki says "You jumped." she's just pointing out that Akira physically reacts to seeing the street where the accident happened. She's just wondering if seeing the street got him to remember something, not that he literally jumped back when it happened.

Look, Selebus has created another fake account just to tell us "You're wrong".

 

[Azkled]

Look, Selebus has created another fake account just to tell us "You're wrong".

Nah I'm just a lurker who enjoys reading you guys' theories, I'm totally not Selebus no way that's crazy talk (please believe me).

 

[PhiloPhilo]

Bro made his account in Apr 2021, and his first post was to call MF and I dumb. I won't let that achievement be diminished. My boy's no Houston cuck.

 

[Lux Perpetua]

I don't know how Akira "jumped" or how Niki even knew about it, maybe he jumped over the debris to get Sekai's body out? I have no clue, "jump" referring to this when he probably jumped to his death at a later date seems weird.

I would have thought he jumped in front of a speeding car in a suicide attempt, but that seems overly dramatic

 

[DeSkel15]

Hello, I don't want to interfere too much with the theory crafting going on, but I just want to point out that when Niki says "You jumped." she's just pointing out that Akira physically reacts to seeing the street where the accident happened. She's just wondering if seeing the street got him to remember something, not that he literally jumped back when it happened.

Yeah, I pointed this out last year actually:

Spirit Sekai is just watching/involved in both scenes.

Also Niki is referring to how Sensei's body jumped, like he got surprised by remembering something.

Not sure why I felt compelled not to do so again. Human minds are weird.

Anyway, good catch.

 

[Azkled]

To actually add something to the conversation, specifically about this part from Moonflare's earlier post:

Who the hell crashed into them? Cause I was always working from the perspective of them hitting someone, likely to be Kaori's family since that's what makes more sense in how she got Sekai's organs. But if it was someone else... who the hell crashed into the Arakawa family and deeply regretted it in despair upon seeing either Nozomu or Akira in the car crash??

In an event I can't remember, Yuki talks about the accident that hospitalized Kaori. I think she says that her "family died in the same accident" or something along those lines. It's really vague wording but I guess it is possible Kaori and her family were in the other car?

On a related note, does Yuki ever say anything about her siblings? She's mention her parents before but nothing else I think. I'm just wondering if Kaori is a niece from her side of the family or from Yumi's dad.

Bro made his account in Apr 2021, and his first post was to call MF and I dumb. I won't let that achievement be diminished. My boy's no Houston cuck.

Well, gotta make my first post somewhere and might as well do it in a thread I've been lurking in for months. Could've maybe done it in a way that wasn't "well ackshully" during a discussion, I'll admit.

 

[Yarazin]

Will be slowly replaying the last update over the next few days and so far I want to say one thing:

Spoiler: .41

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[LessonsInDissonance]

I am containing myself so much

 

[Hario1225]

Bet you 50 bucks this game's gonna last longer than Genshin Impact (Btw the game's an absolute hot garbage now imo)
Seeing how Sel had a thing on Hoyoverse cosplays in halloween I think he should consider giving Wuthering Waves a try. It has been a BLAST so far at least for me.

 

[Hario1225]

I am containing myself so much

LessonsInDissonance:

 

[hernestojavier621]

Oh shit 3 days left, where did this month go? Could've sworn it was like the middle july yet.

 

[Moonflare]

To actually add something to the conversation, specifically about this part from Moonflare's earlier post:

In an event I can't remember, Yuki talks about the accident that hospitalized Kaori. I think she says that her "family died in the same accident" or something along those lines. It's really vague wording but I guess it is possible Kaori and her family were in the other car?

On a related note, does Yuki ever say anything about her siblings? She's mention her parents before but nothing else I think. I'm just wondering if Kaori is a niece from her side of the family or from Yumi's dad.


Well, gotta make my first post somewhere and might as well do it in a thread I've been lurking in for months. Could've maybe done it in a way that wasn't "well ackshully" during a discussion, I'll admit.

I have wondered about that as well, and I'd say it's more likely that Kaori's family was related to Yuki. That's because the hospital tells Kaori everyone is dead, and even though the Yakuza is the Yakuza, I very much doubt they'd leave family behind.

It'd make more sense that the hospital tried to contact a next of kin and if the next of kin was Yuki, she was missing from her junkie days, thus "there was no one else" = everyone is dead.

Tragically, that would also mean Yuki has abandoned two potential daughters instead of one (she'd have become Kaori's legal guardian as well if she was around at the time).

 

[barglenarglezous]

Spoiler: My take on First contact and the narrator

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"O world" is a common poetic device, usually addressing an absent party that isn't the reader. Usually, it's God, or the gods, or some higher power. In this case, I think Sel is doing a play on the translation of Sekai (Sekai = World), and this can be interpreted as "Oh, Sekai, in our final moment together, please tell me why. Why did it have to be Nozomu?"

Now whether this is meant to mean "why did you marry him" or "why are you dying alongside him and not me" is debatable. I suspect it's the latter, that his anguish over living without Sekai in his life is so great he would have rather died in the crash in lieu of his brother.

As O World is a poetic device, the other candidates for narrators invoking it would be Sekai (a poet) or Ami (a developing poet learning through study of her mother's work), as well as Akira himself. Yasu using it to invoke her gods/the gods also makes a lot of sense.

But in this specific instance, Akira is speaking to Sekai herself through this poetic device.

 

[Bingoogus]

You know, something about Sekai i've never really understood is how she stuck with Akira as he grew up, from everything we know about her and her writing, she saw in him an opportunity to finally satisfy her pedophilic appetite... but she was still with him into adulthood... you'd think things would've gradually faded as he moved out of her interest range, the fact we know she first started lusting for him when he was less than 9 months old should suggest her interests were fully in the prepubescent zone so why didn't she groom a new victim? It's not like her appetite would go away even if she could still find satisfaction in adult Akira, she'd still lust for young boys... i feel like i could throw several arguments or hypothetical explanations in to plug the gaps but it's all just conjecture and again, regardless of what argument i use, she's still a pedo, she should still have pedo lusts that would be going unquenched and after having had years of that hunger being fed... could she really go on without looking for another?

In that regard i feel Sekai is underdeveloped as a character, she works in the story only as a mechanism to explain Akira and his pedophilic grooming behaviour, as a consequence she comes across as more of an Akira-sexual than a common pedo.

 

[Riolol]

You know, something about Sekai i've never really understood is how she stuck with Akira as he grew up, from everything we know about her and her writing, she saw in him an opportunity to finally satisfy her pedophilic appetite... but she was still with him into adulthood... you'd think things would've gradually faded as he moved out of her interest range, the fact we know she first started lusting for him when he was less than 9 months old should suggest her interests were fully in the prepubescent zone so why didn't she groom a new victim? It's not like her appetite would go away even if she could still find satisfaction in adult Akira, she'd still lust for young boys... i feel like i could throw several arguments or hypothetical explanations in to plug the gaps but it's all just conjecture and again, regardless of what argument i use, she's still a pedo, she should still have pedo lusts that would be going unquenched and after having had years of that hunger being fed... could she really go on without looking for another?

In that regard i feel Sekai is underdeveloped as a character, she works in the story only as a mechanism to explain Akira and his pedophilic grooming behaviour, as a consequence she comes across as more of an Akira-sexual than a common pedo.

My guess is she viewed him as her twisted work of art, she groomed him for years until he was as fucked as she was, now he's doing the same to others. That would probably be satisfaction enough for her. Also we don't know she didn't have other boys on the side.

 

[Moonflare]

You know, something about Sekai i've never really understood is how she stuck with Akira as he grew up, from everything we know about her and her writing, she saw in him an opportunity to finally satisfy her pedophilic appetite... but she was still with him into adulthood... you'd think things would've gradually faded as he moved out of her interest range, the fact we know she first started lusting for him when he was less than 9 months old should suggest her interests were fully in the prepubescent zone so why didn't she groom a new victim? It's not like her appetite would go away even if she could still find satisfaction in adult Akira, she'd still lust for young boys... i feel like i could throw several arguments or hypothetical explanations in to plug the gaps but it's all just conjecture and again, regardless of what argument i use, she's still a pedo, she should still have pedo lusts that would be going unquenched and after having had years of that hunger being fed... could she really go on without looking for another?

In that regard i feel Sekai is underdeveloped as a character, she works in the story only as a mechanism to explain Akira and his pedophilic grooming behaviour, as a consequence she comes across as more of an Akira-sexual than a common pedo.

Well, that's the big question, isn't it? Sekai was a pedophile (in the truest sense of the word), but we don't know enough to say she was just a pedophile. She clearly came from a broken family and was never able to find happiness before Akira (see "Something everyone knows and ignores"). If it ended there it'd be one thing, but she was also happy and even loved Ami more than him. That seems to suggest that there is a possibility she truly loved Akira, and if that is true, then it was also her first love.

That's enough to theorize why she'd have stuck with him, out of genuine care and affection (albeit in a twisted and unhealthy way), or from a more perverse "keeping up with her project and solo-focused in her pedophilia/grooming him into another Sekai". We just don't know enough about her, and at the moment I don't believe in her affection tbh (even though she says if Akira had grown up she'd have left with him to go around the world - presumably leaving Nozomu - which I really don't believe).

Edit: In regards to Riolol, I don't believe she had anyone else while she was with Akira (other than Nozomu). That's half of the reason he was special to her, and would have become doubly so being the father of her child (the thing she loved most in the world). Might have been planning to have him become a Sekai by abusing Ami, and calling it love, wouldn't put it past her.

Edit2: NAO also says that both Sekai and Akira called what they felt "love" (see "Mother's milk"). And if NAO knows what she's saying, and if we take Akira as a measure for Sekai, then Sekai truly believed she loved him (which would indicate that maybe she wasn't acting perverse out of satisfaction for being perverse, but more so that she was twisted enough to feel she was doing a good thing, even though rationally she probably understood she wasn't, hence only preying on Akira, who she had more control over) - cause Akira truly thinks he loved her (even though rationally he's able to deduce why he shouldn't - see "Stomachache").

 

[apostolodieros]

You know, something about Sekai i've never really understood is how she stuck with Akira as he grew up, from everything we know about her and her writing, she saw in him an opportunity to finally satisfy her pedophilic appetite... but she was still with him into adulthood... you'd think things would've gradually faded as he moved out of her interest range, the fact we know she first started lusting for him when he was less than 9 months old should suggest her interests were fully in the prepubescent zone so why didn't she groom a new victim? It's not like her appetite would go away even if she could still find satisfaction in adult Akira, she'd still lust for young boys... i feel like i could throw several arguments or hypothetical explanations in to plug the gaps but it's all just conjecture and again, regardless of what argument i use, she's still a pedo, she should still have pedo lusts that would be going unquenched and after having had years of that hunger being fed... could she really go on without looking for another?

In that regard i feel Sekai is underdeveloped as a character, she works in the story only as a mechanism to explain Akira and his pedophilic grooming behaviour, as a consequence she comes across as more of an Akira-sexual than a common pedo.

If we base ourselves on the writing "lolita" the protagonist was not a simple pedophile, in fact he was only interested in Dolores because she reminded him of the girl he had lost at a young age. For all we know there may be a deeper reason why Sekai was interested in Akira.
but mine is just an idea.