VN Ren'Py Light of My Life [Ch.9 v0.9.1] [Naughty Road]

[Count Morado]

Not a question of control, it's a question of choices and agency...of which in reality there is none (aside from the side characters). Which is fine, it really is, even if naughty did get a little overly defensive. I still like this VN, still love Macy, just Denise annoys me personally (just a character thing). That we cannot avoid her is the way he wants to write his story and that's perfectly acceptable, one can either acept that or not.

There is a lot of agency. Just because there is one area which is integral to the basis of the story - which is the premise of the story - which is the whole plot device of the ENTIRE story - that you don't like is that the two girls are inseparable... that doesn't keep a player from using their agency.

It was stated since day one of development that there would be no repercussions from any relationships with anyone (at least until possibly final development) - so every player was free to have the MC be involved with anyone that was available to do so. The only restriction from day one was that Macy and Denise could not be separated. It was made clear, it was warned to players if they were about to make a decision to jeopardize that, and it's not like players couldn't make a decision on what they wanted to do.

You made the false accusation that this "may as well be a KN in reality." And you have to admit you were hyperbolic and exaggerated simply because you can't get everything you personally want.

In addition, players have the final agency to just say "fuck it, this game ain't for me. I'm out. There are 15,000 other games on F95 that I should be able to find one that is exactly what I want to play."

This game is nearly the absolute opposite of a KN and you know it.

The MC can have an intimate relationship with any combination of the following bullets:

• Denise and Macy
• Brooke
• Sierra
• Sarah
• Zara

Or they can choose to not have any with any of them. That's 32 different intimate relationship combinations throughout gameplay, on the simply binary of Yes=intimate, No=not. Within each of all the routes, there are choices which change how some scenes playout and what activities in future scenes come about based upon previous decisions. There are even multiple relationship endings, depending upon certain decisions in the game.

Look, it's one thing to not agree with a developer's choice on storyline and to have an opinion on how a story deals with character development, tension, conflict, interrelationships, and resolution --- but to use hyperbole or use blatant lies or just plain make up shit shows more about you than it does about any argument you have about their decisions.

 

[Maviarab]

There is a lot of agency. Just because there is one area which is integral to the basis of the story - which is the premise of the story - which is the whole plot device of the ENTIRE story - that you don't like is that the two girls are inseparable... that doesn't keep a player from using their agency.

It was stated since day one of development that there would be no repercussions from any relationships with anyone (at least until possibly final development) - so every player was free to have the MC be involved with anyone that was available to do so. The only restriction from day one was that Macy and Denise could not be separated. It was made clear, it was warned to players if they were about to make a decision to jeopardize that, and it's not like players couldn't make a decision on what they wanted to do.

You made the false accusation that this "may as well be a KN in reality." And you have to admit you were hyperbolic and exaggerated simply because you can't get everything you personally want.

In addition, players have the final agency to just say "fuck it, this game ain't for me. I'm out. There are 15,000 other games on F95 that I should be able to find one that is exactly what I want to play."

This game is nearly the absolute opposite of a KN and you know it.

The MC can have an intimate relationship with any combination of the following bullets:

• Denise and Macy
• Brooke
• Sierra
• Sarah
• Zara

Or they can choose to not have any with any of them. That's 32 different intimate relationship combinations throughout gameplay, on the simply binary of Yes=intimate, No=not. Within each of all the routes, there are choices which change how some scenes playout and what activities in future scenes come about based upon previous decisions. There are even multiple relationship endings, depending upon certain decisions in the game.

Look, it's one thing to not agree with a developer's choice on storyline and to have an opinion on how a story deals with character development, tension, conflict, interrelationships, and resolution --- but to use hyperbole or use blatant lies or just plain make up shit shows more about you than it does about any argument you have about their decisions.

*sighs*....

I don't personally want anything.....I've never asked for anything either....only an opinion. In fact, if you care to go through my post history, I don't recall ever specifically saying to a devloper I want something or specifically asking for something. I accept what is...and either continue with it or move on. You can still appreciate a story, the way wants to write it..and still have some issues with it. The two are not mutually exclusive.

Who's making up blatant shit now? Seems opinions are not actually as welcome as you like to make it seem they are.

 

[Count Morado]

*sighs*....

I don't personally want anything.....I've never asked for anything either....only an opinion.

Who's making up blatant shit now? Seems opinions are not actually as welcome as you like to make it seem they are.

You made it quite clear what you wanted by saying you "have to agree with all the above comments" and "may as well be a KN in reality." Now you're backtracking.

And, no, opinions have never been welcome... that is unless the person giving them understands that by going public with theirs, they make their opinions open for interpretation, response, and possible rebuttal.

It's one of those choices we all have - to use our agency with a little bit of common sense.

 

[TigerWolfe]

Not a question of control, it's a question of choices and agency...of which in reality there is none (aside from the side characters). Which is fine, it really is, even if naughty did get a little overly defensive. I still like this VN, still love Macy, just Denise annoys me personally (just a character thing). That we cannot avoid her is the way he wants to write his story and that's perfectly acceptable, one can either acept that or not.

Wanting choices is definitely not what I was talking about with my comment. Although I do definitely fall in the don't care if there are choices or not camp, I prefer to read them as stories with less extraneous clicking others prefer the old choose your own adventure style (those annoyed me as a kid too, nowhere near as good as a real ttrpg... But much more annoying to read than a normal book).

 

[Timodjin]

I also support lilsis

 

[naughtyroad]

Personally my only complaint about the story would be the unavoidable NTR, that should definitely be tagged at the very least since no matter what you do the sisters are going to be having sexual and romantic interactions in secret.

Oh, the infinitely pliable definition of NTR, that can be redefined to mean anything up to and including "if my love interest dares talk to or even look at anyone besides me the MC" and/or "if my love interest has ever had any form of sexual interaction at any point in her live with anyone other than me the MC prior to meeting the MC". Although you're not quite stretching it that far, thankfully.

In this case, whatever happens is clearly "within the harem", which is widely accepted to not be NTR. It is lesbian, and that is clearly tagged.

Frankly, I find the thought that any part of that might be defined as NTR quite ridiculous, as that fetish is by my best understanding (given the pliability of the tag) all about being in a competition for love interests. And in this case, it is quite the opposite, as it starts out with a plan by one LI to wingman the MC into landing the other LI.

As far as I'm concerned, this is just more of the ole "way am I is the MC not the center of every single event ever!?"

 

[clowns234]

Oh, the infinitely pliable definition of NTR, that can be redefined to mean anything up to and including "if my love interest dares talk to or even look at anyone besides me the MC" and/or "if my love interest has ever had any form of sexual interaction at any point in her live with anyone other than me the MC prior to meeting the MC". Although you're not quite stretching it that far, thankfully.

In this case, whatever happens is clearly "within the harem", which is widely accepted to not be NTR. It is lesbian, and that is clearly tagged.

Frankly, I find the thought that any part of that might be defined as NTR quite ridiculous, as that fetish is by my best understanding (given the pliability of the tag) all about being in a competition for love interests. And in this case, it is quite the opposite, as it starts out with a plan by one LI to wingman the MC into landing the other LI.

As far as I'm concerned, this is just more of the ole "way am I is the MC not the center of every single event ever!?"

Adding the NTR tag when the game has a lesbian tag along with the male protagonist tag would be very misleading. It would imply that the girls end up cheating on MC with someone else.

 

[Timodjin]

Another discussion around the definition of NTR is a waste of time, but in this case a NTR tag would give the wrong impression. Thats my opinion.

 

[Count Morado]

The definition of NTR to my knowledge is when a love interest has sexual interactions with another character where the MC isn't involved in the act. The girls going behind his back to have sex with each other and lying to him about it is pretty standard NTR stuff tbh and pretending like: "they're lesbians so that doesn't count as NTR!" is a comically dumb take and this happens pretty early in the story too before there is a harem so that excuse doesn't work either.

Like I said, I like the game, but as someone who doesn't like NTR its unavoidable nature in the narrative leaves a poor taste in my mouth. I'm just sharing my opinion on the content so I don't really understand why you're getting so snarky/salty about it.

The short answer is: Your knowledge of the definition is wrong.
The longer answer is: you are wrong when considering the definition of netorare (ntr) on this website.

Spoiler: The even longer answer is:

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Finally, this game is not for you.

EDIT: Since the discussion of tags are off-topic for game threads - if you want to continue this further, please feel free to start an off-topic thread to discuss. If you think a tag is missing, there is a REPORT button in the first post of the thread where you can request tag changes. Thanks.

 

[lnppo]

Finally, this game is not for you.

Like I said previously, I've played the game and like it. I just wish that it did not have LI's having sex behind the MC's back and lying to him about it (even if this doesn't exactly fit the NTR definition used here).
Not trying to argue with people, just joining in with my own personal gripe about the game since others were sharing theirs.

 

[Count Morado]

I just wish that it did not have LI's having sex behind the MC's back and lying to him about it

This can be understandable.

For your consideration: You're seeing the events unfold from the nearly omniscience role of the reader (at least what the author wishes to divulge as necessary, when necessary). You know what is going on with all three - but Macy and the main character are nearly blind to what's going on.

It is beneficial to remember that Denise isn't divulging everything until what she sees as the right time to have the trio enjoy each other, together. Eventually, everyone knows "everything." She's the only one who knows what is happening throughout the entire story between the three and is the mastermind of getting everyone together, in the end. Telling either the main character or Macy too soon might jeopardize her whole goal. Obviously her hiding details is not to harm either of the others, but to keep harm from coming to them while they make their journey toward each other.

And as for Macy, she's both embarrassed for what she is doing with Denise (to some extent) and not wanting to hurt the main character (or put in harms way the nearly impossible possibility - in her mind - of the main character and her having a full relationship). She wants the main character but thinks he doesn't want her - and he doesn't really let on fully (nor does he even know, himself), either, until very late in the story. Macy isn't aware she's a romantic interest and, in fact, neither is the main character aware she is until he is finally aware.

So it's not lying to keep it hidden for nefarious purposes - but Denise has her machinations for why she isn't fully forthcoming of the activities with both of them to both of them. If Denise was 100% forthcoming from the first moment, there would be no story. There would be no relationship between Denise and the main character (except as caretaker/ward), between Denise and Macy (except as big buddy/little buddy), nor between Macy and the main character (except as caretaker/ward). There would be no such thing as "Light of My Life."

(This wasn't meant to be a wall, but it is).

 

[Miðgarðsormr]

The Problem with some of the post here is not that their "Opinion" isn't valid or wrong, as "Opinions" are never right or wrong otherwise we would call them "facts"

But the way they are presented in this thread. Some like one character but dislike another. No one can like everyone so i totally understand this. BUT(T) and this is the important part. Most of the people coming in this thread dislike a certain person which is part of the main story, main plot, basically a key element of the entire thing. And at this point and time in the thread and going by how long this thread already exists. These discussions become tiring.

Why is this an issue? Macy and Denise are two polar opposites. One is shy, scared and in dire need of help and mental stability. The other is outgoing, brave and doesn't want help and is mentally unstable.
They go through the stages of grief but also portray them as two personas instead of one. Two sides of the same coin. They comfort each other, they represent each other, they are one another in a symbolic way.

By removing one of them you had to rewrite and redo the entire game. It would not work anymore. Be it from a story/plot telling point of view or the entire symbolic actions of it.
The story itself is about love, loss, grief and what it does to people, what it does to a family, to friends, to children growing up, to adults who need to keep going to act strong while they crumble inside as they are hurt and seek kindred spirits to ease the pain.

Many times did i write and explain why this game portrays the five stages of grief so perfectly that it could be used to teach psychology. (aside from all the NSFW stuff) But here i go again.

The five stages of grief are.
Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression and Acceptance.

If we watch Macy and Denise we will see the following as established inside the story.

Macy = She represents the stages of Anger and Denial, Anything she does or say show that she doesn't want to face it. She does not want to talk about it and she sure as shit will be loud and visible about all of it.

Denise = She represents the Bargaining and the Depression. She asks alot of questions, tries to understand both sides of Macy and the MC and tries to fix what seems broken. Her family. She also is very depressed about it and suffers visibly from it throughout the story. She is hurt, fragile and shows it.

Finally when the story progresses and both reach the point of opening up about their grief they switch sides. Macy becomes the shy, scared one while denise becomes the loud and brave one.
When the story reaches a certain point in which both can accept who they are to one another, to the mc and towards their grief they show a different kind of personality that stops being hurt, griefing, scared and angry all the time.
Those two as well as the MC go through the grief to find each other and start to become whole again instead of broken, hurt and angry.
The story about lot and his daughters are just a cherry on top to bring the sexual tension into the story but that is also done in a subtle non forced way. It all feels natural if you invest yourself in the story.

Of course people can still dislike Denise but like Macy and vice versa but they will have to accept that in my and many others this sounds like "i like skydiving but man do i hate parachutes"

While that is a valid opinion to have (as i said) and no one can deny this. It is also valid to state that the character of macy that some people seem to like more than denise, can not work or be portrayed the way she is portrayed for people to like her once you get rid of denise!

You need both to understand both. Get rid of one of them and as the viewer/reader/player the Macy you started to like no longer exists. The way this story is portrayed or written is having an effect on almost everyone who played it. If you like, dislike, hate, love a character is up to you.

But the moment you change anything about those 2 characters the entire thing falls apart. Thats why discussions about this topic are making many of us tired.

PS: If anyone feels attacked by this post (which is not my intention) try the following. Replay the game. Invest yourself in the story. Read and do not skip a single sentence. See if you can understand the viewpoint i tried to explain. Realize how many hours and work went into this and be a bit more respectful of someones project he literally sunk thousands of hours into. Thanks.

 

[Ali ibn Hassan]

Meanwhile deep in the woods some inhabitants are trying out a new business venture

 

[Fuukboi35]

Just finished chapter 7.

All I have to say is, common Naughty Road W.

Can't wait for the next one.

 

[Rokrik]

Anyone has a save from chapter 5 or maybe 6?

 

[Count Morado]

Anyone has a save from chapter 5 or maybe 6?

No. You're gonna have to play it... (again, if you have once already and lost your own saves). See link in OP:

 

[Heml0ck]

I stand by my original statement, made 4 or so years ago, that the production quality is extremely high compared to the competition. The latest chapter was very good by all accounts. Anyway, I have some constructive thoughts.

Spoiler

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[karumi56]

I stand by my original statement, made 4 or so years ago, that the production quality is extremely high compared to the competition. The latest chapter was very good by all accounts. Anyway, I have some constructive thoughts.

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I've been waiting a bit to replay the latest chapter, but my initial thoughts were similar. The pacing and progression that had been slowly building seemed to be thrown out the window. For example with the youngest "ward", the shower (and kitchen table) scenes had been progressing steadily, with the previous chapter ending in almost, but not quite backdoor action. I expected that to "climax" in this chapter, with her preserving her other "virginity" for after marriage. Instead, bang

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...and ridiculous scenes like the Ferris wheel rolled along.

The total change in pacing and style in this chapter made it seem like any outline of what was supposed to happen was discarded, and events spiraled into the rather bizarre result that we ended up getting. My initial reaction to the update was extremely negative. I found it rather absurd and silly, and really a let down after such a long delay in production. I'm hoping after a bit of time and a second play through it will come across differently.

Previously the chapters have been either really great or just good for me, almost alternating every other release. I loved chapter 6. I'm hoping chapter 8 will rebound the game to greatness..but I honestly don't know where it can go from here.

 

[naughtyroad]

I stand by my original statement, made 4 or so years ago, that the production quality is extremely high compared to the competition. The latest chapter was very good by all accounts. Anyway, I have some constructive thoughts.

Spoiler

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Cheers and thanks for that feedback. I think you make some valid points. I'd like to offer some counterpoints to some of those.

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[Knight_of_the_lance]

Rather than say that the MC is a plaything, I view it more like him being either the new guy in the relationship or the one with much more experience that want his partners to go at their own pace.

I see it more as the MC letting the girls lead for those first experiences. Yes they go fast, but like Naughty said once a certain threshold is met people let go of their inhibitions and simply go for it all the way. If you have been taken aback by how forward the girls have been, imagine the MC, he does not benefit from the third person view of the reader. So it might be even more of a shock for him than for you. that way it might feel like he is a leaf to the wind simply going along with the flow. An other perspective which is not incompatible with the first, is that he already went through the motion with Charlotte, so he know all about the dance before Denise and Macy attempt it. Preferring letting them take the lead to go at their own pace. Pace that might have been faster than he thought. I can easily see in the next chapter, or the one after if Naughty bless us with one, the MC taking the lead and a more active role in the action.

Sex is also an intimate moment. An intense one, I admit, but that does not exclude more tender moment in the future or that sex will always have to be this intense performance sport, it can also be a tender and calm moment simply pleasuring one an other. Eating pop corn while watching a movie while leaning on one an other or a deep and intimate discution while on the road from work will still happen. those moment can not have an ulterior motive or be sensual and raise sexual tension in the air. That is for the player to choose I suppose with how much Naughty let us make.

I like that the MC felt like he was lead on in that chapter, as if the events unfolding were overwhelming, because as a reader it is a bit how I felt. We don't always feel in control in our own lives, for once it was not a bad thing. There will be moments where as the MC we will feel more of that control and where the other characters will rely on us. It takes maturity to assume that responsibility when it falls on us, but also, and sometime it is harder, to let go of that responsibility.


Now I am hyped for the next chapter even if it is really early in development.