"Lighthouse" early development forum

[KissKissStudio]

NTR with a strong protagonist? Well well well

What does that mean

 

[OGloc_420]

What does that mean

It's one of my favourite types of media! NTR is great because it creates so much drama. But so often the MC is weak and pathetic and lets the LIs walk all over him and cuck him, it's so lazy. Having a strong lead who is willing to take revenge is great.

Think "Silent War"

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[KissKissStudio]

It's one of my favourite types of media! NTR is great because it creates so much drama. But so often the MC is weak and pathetic and lets the LIs walk all over him and cuck him, it's so lazy. Having a strong lead who is willing to take revenge is great.

Think "Silent War"

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Well MC wont be a cuck and will only lead to bad decisions if you fuck up, trough gameplay. I will try to avoid choices that are so obvious which is which.

 

[KingWeWuz]

When I reached a certain point in Bright Lord, I realized that nothing really mattered anymore—because, in the end, the MC was going to sleep with all the girls anyway. Writing and creating harem games has become too monotonous. The player base often expects the girls to instantly fall to their knees after just a few interactions, and if a character resists or has her own values, they complain. It removes any sense of challenge or depth.

At this point, working on Bright Lord feels like a chore. I’m stuck finishing all the renders and story where the MC just moves from one conquest to the next. Honestly, I’ve outgrown the harem genre. It rarely offers a satisfying progression where you genuinely earn a character’s affection. And trying to justify why every girl is suddenly okay with sharing one protagonist always feels forced.

For The Lighthouse, harem will be an option, but not the default outcome. Some girls will be fine with sharing, while others won’t. The main love interests will have an antagonist system in place, making relationships more dynamic, realistic, and rewarding through gameplay.

One thing’s for sure—I won’t be doing another game centered around harem. Nor will I ever make a game where the MC is a weak, cuckold stereotype.

I actually support you being candid and admitting all this. I even encourage you to develop what you want. If you forced yourself to make a game you didn't want, there'd be no passion in it, obviously.

Having said that I really don't get what you're saying in this post beyond losing interest in the harem genre. I could expand on that, but I don't wanna bother you if you feel harassed by us harem fans.

Good luck!

 

[KissKissStudio]

I actually support you being candid and admitting all this. I even encourage you to develop what you want. If you forced yourself to make a game you didn't want, there'd be no passion in it, obviously.

Having said that I really don't get what you're saying in this post beyond losing interest in the harem genre. I could expand on that, but I don't wanna bother you if you feel harassed by us harem fans.

Good luck!

Which parts doesn't make sense for you btw?

 

[KingWeWuz]

Which parts doesn't make sense for you btw?

Since you asked...

You say you don't like it because it doesn't seem satisfying to you due to its progression just being going from one girl to the next, and that you felt the affection gained wasn't genuine. Effectively it's just one conquest after another and the whole "I'm ok with sharing" seems forced.

OK, well, you're the one who made a game where the main character gets a magical demon that gives him mind control powers to fuel his sexual conquests. The problem isn't the genre, it's that you wrote yourself in a corner that you didn't find satisfying. And I think you feel the only way out of this corner is optional ntr traps for the player to fall into or monotony.

Next when describing why you prefer a new situation, an "ntr antagonist would make the relationships more realistic, dynamic, and rewarding."

All things considered, I think ntr and harem fans will rarely mix. I don't think the relationships will be dynamic, I think the players will tend to go one way or the other on this rather than 50%. Of course, this part is just my personal opinion so I doubt it'll matter much.

I really don't know if players would feel like it's more "rewarding" in a sense. I can see where you're coming from though, the argument you're making is if it's harder to get the harem, you'll feel better having succeeded in the challenge, right? Well this is a visual novel. If it were an action game it would be different, but all players are gonna do is just look up a guide. Heck, even if it was an action game I'd just use cheat engine to cheat to get the results I'd want. Again, maybe I'm wrong, but if the challenge consists of me just clicking a few options and then rolling back or reloading if I accidentally do the wrong option, it's not really a challenge.

As far as realism is concerned, think about bright lord. We're being given powers from a magical mind control demon. The game's plot is unrealistic. Why put the suspension of disbelief on a lack of ntr antagonists?

Anyway, that's just what I didn't get from your post.

 

[KissKissStudio]

Since you asked...

You say you don't like it because it doesn't seem satisfying to you due to its progression just being going from one girl to the next, and that you felt the affection gained wasn't genuine. Effectively it's just one conquest after another and the whole "I'm ok with sharing" seems forced.

OK, well, you're the one who made a game where the main character gets a magical demon that gives him mind control powers to fuel his sexual conquests. The problem isn't the genre, it's that you wrote yourself in a corner that you didn't find satisfying. And I think you feel the only way out of this corner is optional ntr traps for the player to fall into or monotony.

Next when describing why you prefer a new situation, an "ntr antagonist would make the relationships more realistic, dynamic, and rewarding."

All things considered, I think ntr and harem fans will rarely mix. I don't think the relationships will be dynamic, I think the players will tend to go one way or the other on this rather than 50%. Of course, this part is just my personal opinion so I doubt it'll matter much.

I really don't know if players would feel like it's more "rewarding" in a sense. I can see where you're coming from though, the argument you're making is if it's harder to get the harem, you'll feel better having succeeded in the challenge, right? Well this is a visual novel. If it were an action game it would be different, but all players are gonna do is just look up a guide. Heck, even if it was an action game I'd just use cheat engine to cheat to get the results I'd want. Again, maybe I'm wrong, but if the challenge consists of me just clicking a few options and then rolling back or reloading if I accidentally do the wrong option, it's not really a challenge.

As far as realism is concerned, think about bright lord. We're being given powers from a magical mind control demon. The game's plot is unrealistic. Why put the suspension of disbelief on a lack of ntr antagonists?

Anyway, that's just what I didn't get from your post.

About the supernatural stuff—I completely agree with you. I put myself in that position, and honestly, it was a rookie mistake. I assumed it would be easy to write porn around it, so I jumped into it without much thought. In hindsight, supernatural powers should never have been the main driving force of the story. I’ve learned that lesson. I've noticed how much more positively people react to scenes with the Landlady where there are no powers involved.

I feel the same way about harem content too. You end up boxing yourself into a corner where there’s very little room to grow or evolve the story. The girl can’t die—because it’s harem. The girl can’t truly fall in love—because it’s harem. She can’t have any meaningful relationships outside the MC—because again, harem. The genre restricts you so much. And on top of that, you always need to explain why multiple girls are totally fine sharing one love interest, and honestly, it just ends up feeling... bland.

My next game will actually include gameplay and management mechanics. There will be plenty of engaging content to keep the players dick hard both on NTR and Romance—so it’s not just mindless clicking between scenes. If you’re the type of player who just uses cheats to get to the scenes, then you’re probably not the target audience I’m designing this for—and that’s completely fine. But the days of me making a game where you’re just picking between two options and nothing really changes? Those are over.

As for NTR—it evokes strong emotions, especially for players who are deeply attached to their love interests. If I’m going to include NTR, I want to do it right—for the people who actually enjoy the genre. I don’t want to throw in some half-baked "bad end" just to check a box.

And regarding your comment about rolling back choices—that’s really not on me. If you can't take an L and move on, that’s your problem as a player. Even then, a single bad choice doesn’t instantly throw you into the NTR route. What you wrote to me made no sense—just like my opinion probably made no sense to you

 

[KingWeWuz]

And regarding your comment about rolling back choices—that’s really not on me. If you can't take an L and move on, that’s your problem as a player. Even then, a single bad choice doesn’t instantly throw you into the NTR route. What you wrote to me made no sense—just like my opinion probably made no sense to you

It's not me alone here. I'm just saying there's going to be guys pursuing the ntr route and the harem route. Depending on their fetish. As far as I understand there's going to be very few harem guys who go, "well, I lost my love interest. Guess I'll continue to watch her have sex with that other guy as opposed to just reloading." Just the same I'd imagine those interested in both ntr and harem, will just make seperate playthroughs. Effectively what I'm saying here is that you might as well create two games one that only has harem and another that only has ntr, because that's probably what the playerbase will play it as. Again, this is just my assumption so feel free to ignore it if you think it's wrong.

And have you considered permutation hell here? Assuming you got 6 girls, the different possibilities are 1 ntr 2 not ntr. Which would mean you'd have 2^6 different situations you need to consider based on where the player is. 64 possible permutations.

 

[KissKissStudio]

It's not me alone here. I'm just saying there's going to be guys pursuing the ntr route and the harem route. Depending on their fetish. As far as I understand there's going to be very few harem guys who go, "well, I lost my love interest. Guess I'll continue to watch her have sex with that other guy as opposed to just reloading." Just the same I'd imagine those interested in both ntr and harem, will just make seperate playthroughs. Effectively what I'm saying here is that you might as well create two games one that only has harem and another that only has ntr, because that's probably what the playerbase will play it as.

And have you considered permutation hell here? Assuming you got 6 girls, the different possibilities are 1 ntr 2 not ntr. Which would mean you'd have 2^6 different situations you need to consider based on where the player is. 64 possible permutations.

What is so bad about playing just harem path. And if you don't mind just play both routes which both have their own unique path.

And I don't get about the permutation hell here? You fuck up your harem route there is no harem route. The harem ending will be just the ending. I am not creating a full-blown game harem that starts from day 1. And even then the harem is not even the main focus of the game. True love route/Ntr will be the main focus. Harem will be just a decision you made thought the game that leads in your total domination.

I do enjoy talking with you and appreciate your point of view but for now it just feels like you are super anti NTR

 

[KingWeWuz]

What is so bad about playing just harem path. And if you don't mind just play both routes which both have their own unique path.

And I don't get about the permutation hell here? You fuck up your harem route there is no harem route. The harem ending will be just the ending. I am not creating a full-blown game harem that starts from day 1. And even then the harem is not even the main focus of the game. True love route/Ntr will be the main focus. Harem will be just a decision you made thought the game that leads in your total domination.

I do enjoy talking with you and appreciate your point of view but for now it just feels like you are super anti NTR

That's what I said. People will play the path that appeals to them the most. And that's why I feel like no matter how dynamic the game is, it'll be static for most. The monogomy guys will pursue monogomy, harem will pursue harem, and ntr will pursue ntr. I don't think you'll see much inbetween, but I imagine those want to pursue each path would create new save files.

Oh I thought it was each girl having their own possible case of being with you or not, that's what I meant by permutation.

It's fine if you wanna characterize me that way. If you think I'm making you uncomfortable just let me know and I'll leave the thread.

 

[KissKissStudio]

That's what I said. People will play the path that appeals to them the most. And that's why I feel like no matter how dynamic the game is, it'll be static for most. The monogomy guys will pursue monogomy, harem will pursue harem, and ntr will pursue ntr. I don't think you'll see much inbetween, but I imagine those want to pursue each path would create new save files.

Oh I thought it was each girl having their own possible case of being with you or not, that's what I meant by permutation.

It's fine if you wanna characterize me that way. If you think I'm making you uncomfortable just let me know and I'll leave the thread.

If I don't have the Permutation the game can end quite fast. I already did a vote where patrons voted for the most popular girls which will have the main content made.

Bright Lord has very little choices and changes and I got a lot of hate so now I move away from the almost Kinetic novel style I get hate too. So I really don't get what I can do more. Bright Lord format doesn't let me do heavy choices while LH will have it made easier for me to do these type of things. I am not aiming for player to do 8 playthroughs to do get it all but at least 2-3 playthroughs is not a bad thing.

I am fine with what you are writing here and I don't feel bad about it but it doest feel like your claims has any ground.

 

[KissKissStudio]

 

[RedPillBlues]

What is so bad about playing just harem path. And if you don't mind just play both routes which both have their own unique path.

And I don't get about the permutation hell here? You fuck up your harem route there is no harem route. The harem ending will be just the ending. I am not creating a full-blown game harem that starts from day 1. And even then the harem is not even the main focus of the game. True love route/Ntr will be the main focus. Harem will be just a decision you made thought the game that leads in your total domination.

I do enjoy talking with you and appreciate your point of view but for now it just feels like you are super anti NTR

I was under the impression that NTR was while part of the game was not a main focus and was used as more of a consequence. Is this instead more akin to something like The Tyrant and more of a half and half game?

 

[KissKissStudio]

I was under the impression that NTR was while part of the game was not a main focus and was used as more of a consequence. Is this instead more akin to something like The Tyrant and more of a half and half game?

Well it might be like the tyrant, but not so cucky

 

[RedPillBlues]

Well it might be like the tyrant, but not so cucky

But similar in terms of content split?

 

[KissKissStudio]

But similar in terms of content split?

Well there will be a huge work put in to Romance/Dating and huge work in NTR system. And about harem option it would be just the ending

 

[RedPillBlues]

Well there will be a huge work put in to Romance/Dating and huge work in NTR system. And about harem option it would be just the ending

Gotcha. Well hey, I can at least enjoy the last Bright Lord update.