cost more than tripleA games lol
- Thread starter TitDang
- Start date
- Aug 24, 2022
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TitDang are you Fizzz?
I don't understand why people say this game is a bait&switch paywall scam. The non-public release is patreon only, isn't that pretty standard? If someone pirates it then great but don't most games patreon-gate their content?
I would say this isn't really a game though either.. It's a pretty bare bones story - poorly translated and fundamentally is just dialogue scrolling through artwork still images.
DJComps is an amazing artist but I find it hard to believe anyone would pay 12 dollars a month on the off chance of seeing one new image..
I don't understand why people say this game is a bait&switch paywall scam. The non-public release is patreon only, isn't that pretty standard? If someone pirates it then great but don't most games patreon-gate their content?
I would say this isn't really a game though either.. It's a pretty bare bones story - poorly translated and fundamentally is just dialogue scrolling through artwork still images.
DJComps is an amazing artist but I find it hard to believe anyone would pay 12 dollars a month on the off chance of seeing one new image..
- Apr 11, 2018
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No. Fizzz is the main artist and we collaborated together on this game.
You can submit any specific feedback about our translation through the special form - the pencil button next to the skip button.
Because you've missed a key element: online DRM. Luna in the Tavern at least has an "online mode" to prevent you from pirating the backer version; having a paid version and a public version is becoming standard (I wouldn't say it is yet, but it's becoming more common arguably because japanese H-devs on ci-en do it and are VASTLY more generous than Patreon money gobblers), but having DRM built into the game is what people call out as crossing a line.
Long story short, they're allowed to charge for their content, sure, but 15 bucks a month is ABSURD beyond reason for the amount (or lack thereof) of content put out. I'm sure some backer with their head shoved up their ass will say "but you dun heff 2 pey lololol gotcha nerd", but my point is just that it's laughably overpriced compared to almost any other patreon dev (and that's comparing to blatant scams like FF, PO and CM).
- May 11, 2017
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I'm not going to get into the problem of making a game difficult to get money, that's already clear.
But the art, the art of this second game is quite bizarre, I can't say it's bad, because that's per person. But for me, the art got worse. For me, very very bad art. But it became more clear, thats a good detail.
- Aug 24, 2022
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But what do you do then..?
The game is purely dialogue boxes with a camera panning over a still image. Your updates seem to just be a few unanimated images with facial expression swaps.....
Like am I crazy..? There's no "game" here.
DJComps could just upload these images to his own patreon and charge for that with the same effect.
But you're billing 12.99 a month for a 2 drawing update essentially..?
That's an awesome business plan if it works! I'm jealous!
But doesn't that just mean your upset it can't be pirated easily?
There's no rule on F95 that their game has to be pirated, the public release offers all content it says it does.
Oh yea, I am totally shocked.
As a huge fan of Fizzz's work - this feels like a total rip off..
Personally I don't care what people do with their money but is it really that easy to make a buck on Patreon? TitDang seems to be quite successful just taking Fizzz art work and slapping it into a VR Novel Engine with some "barely-a-story" dialogue.
If I was Fizzz I'd cut out the middleman and do it all myself.
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- Apr 11, 2018
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Well... I persuaded Fizzz to draw art for the game. I'm a big fan of his works too and wanted to see a visual novel with his art many years ago.
You won't believe me how often I've suggested to artists to start making their own games. But when you start working by your own hands everything turns out to be more complicated. Although I too once thought it is merely a matter of "placing images beneath the barely-a-story dialogue".
- Jun 7, 2017
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Yeah, this looks like a Bimbofied version of the original character.
Surgically enhanced everything, which makes them look so much worse, just like when pornstars do it :'(
- Oct 6, 2018
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- May 26, 2017
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Imagine thinking coding all of these feature from scratch is simple.But what do you do then..?
The game is purely dialogue boxes with a camera panning over a still image. Your updates seem to just be a few unanimated images with facial expression swaps.....
Like am I crazy..? There's no "game" here.
DJComps could just upload these images to his own patreon and charge for that with the same effect.
But you're billing 12.99 a month for a 2 drawing update essentially..?
That's an awesome business plan if it works! I'm jealous!
But doesn't that just mean your upset it can't be pirated easily?
There's no rule on F95 that their game has to be pirated, the public release offers all content it says it does.
Oh yea, I am totally shocked.
As a huge fan of Fizzz's work - this feels like a total rip off..
Personally I don't care what people do with their money but is it really that easy to make a buck on Patreon? TitDang seems to be quite successful just taking Fizzz art work and slapping it into a VR Novel Engine with some "barely-a-story" dialogue.
If I was Fizzz I'd cut out the middleman and do it all myself.
You don't know anything. Peroid.
- May 8, 2019
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Finally someone appreciated my work... Thanks from the dev to the dev
- Aug 24, 2022
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I decided to go look at the games source code to see if you were right.
The entire game is written in NodeJS.
There seems to be a few ported functions / libraries from another game, and some leftover assets but otherwise..
The entire game is "coded" like this:
Code:
"2": {
"background": "static/images/backgrounds/Enter.webp",
"effect": "static/images/interface/rec_frame.webp",
"scene_name": "Intro",
"dialog": [
{
"id": 6,
"name": "Reporter",
"text": "...and we will continue to watch the situation unfold and keep you updated right from the thick of it!",
"sprites": {
"talking reporter_left": "static/images/sprite/emotions/ReporterDone/Reporter.webp",
"game_scene0 disappear_slow": "static/images/backgrounds/picks.webp"
}
},
{
"id": 7,
"name": "Reporter",
"text": "Behind my back are none other than the grand gates leading to the valley where a battle of the Ancients is about to unfold!",
"sprites": {
"talking reporter_left": "static/images/sprite/emotions/ReporterDone/Reporter.webp"
}
},The entire game is made up of a Dialogue Box, Background Image and two left - right sprites with
Every "content" patch though is just a bunch of JSON dialogue added to this file though.. Is that *Really* a lot of work?
Copy and Pasting This over and over again?
"name": "Reporter",
"text": "Are you asleep or something?!",
"sprites": {
"talking reporter_left": "static/images/sprite/emotions/ReporterDone/ReporterCamera.webp"
}
How long does it take to do this? What am I not understanding?
I feel like Fizzz is doing 95% of the work here.
EDIT
These json blocks are literally defining the dialogue line spoke alongside an inserted background image & sprite image overlays.
If I had to guess, I bet your team has a scene-maker tool that auto generates those json entries right?
So it is 100% that. You were right!
SECOND EDIT
Code:
},
"author": "Flamie",
"license": "CC0-1.0",
"devDependencies": {
"electron": "^9.2.0"
}
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- Apr 11, 2018
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You revealed us. We just click "Generate the game" button and get a new update every month. You are free to try it too, just don't tell other artists this secret.
I decided to go look at the games source code to see if you were right.
The entire game is written in NodeJS.
There seems to be a few ported functions / libraries from another game, and some leftover assets but otherwise..
The entire game is "coded" like this:
---Code:"2": { "background": "static/images/backgrounds/Enter.webp", "effect": "static/images/interface/rec_frame.webp", "scene_name": "Intro", "dialog": [ { "id": 6, "name": "Reporter", "text": "...and we will continue to watch the situation unfold and keep you updated right from the thick of it!", "sprites": { "talking reporter_left": "static/images/sprite/emotions/ReporterDone/Reporter.webp", "game_scene0 disappear_slow": "static/images/backgrounds/picks.webp" } }, { "id": 7, "name": "Reporter", "text": "Behind my back are none other than the grand gates leading to the valley where a battle of the Ancients is about to unfold!", "sprites": { "talking reporter_left": "static/images/sprite/emotions/ReporterDone/Reporter.webp" } },
The entire game is made up of a Dialogue Box, Background Image and two left - right sprites withswapping facial expressions(They actually create unique sprites and hyperlink to them for every facial animation, it's not even an overlay) and a few transition effects as a baseline framework.
Every "content" patch though is just a bunch of JSON dialogue added to this file though.. Is that *Really* a lot of work?
Copy and Pasting This over and over again?
"name": "Reporter",
"text": "Are you asleep or something?!",
"sprites": {
"talking reporter_left": "static/images/sprite/emotions/ReporterDone/ReporterCamera.webp"
}
How long does it take to do this? What am I not understanding?
I feel like Fizzz is doing 95% of the work here.
EDIT
These json blocks are literally defining the dialogue line spoke alongside an inserted background image & sprite image overlays.
If I had to guess, I bet your team has a scene-maker tool that auto generates those json entries right?
So it is 100% that. You were right!
- Aug 24, 2022
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I am being 100% serious - I honestly didn't know people would pay for something like this.
I might take your advice!
TitDang does Flamie do work on all your games or are you running the patreon and then farming out sub-projects to other developers then paying Fizz for commissions on all of them?
- Apr 11, 2018
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I'm just figuring out new paywalls.I am being 100% serious - I honestly didn't know people would pay for something like this.
I might take your advice!
TitDang does Flamie do work on all your games or are you running the patreon and then farming out sub-projects to other developers then paying Fizz for commissions on all of them?
- Aug 24, 2022
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Yea Flamie is listed as the only author on Luna In The Tavern as well - was that mistake?
Fizzz does the art, Flamie writes the code.. Do you just run the patreon and troll post on F95 or..?
- Apr 11, 2018
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I'm also counting donation alerts.
- Feb 16, 2019
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It never ceases to amaze me how quickly people leap at the opportunity for a quick "gotcha" quip on the internetBut doesn't that just mean your upset it can't be pirated easily?
There's no rule on F95 that their game has to be pirated, the public release offers all content it says it does.
But no, I've downloaded this on a couple different occasions (that is, waited for the paid content to just become free) and it only reinforced exactly what I said. I would sooner guess we probably have the exact same opinion on this: what's there is enjoyable and the art is absolutely praiseworthy, but the price is just too steep. Imo, if this were 3-5 bucks a month tops, it'd be worth it; while I'm sure the devs would disagree (and who wouldn't, it's their paycheck after all), that's just what I think is fair for what's being given.
In fact, you took the words out of my mouth in wishing that you could make so much money for so little, and anyone who's being honest with themselves has to recognize a bit of jealousy/envy at the fact that, while TitDang (imo) is wildly overcharging for what they're doing, I can't say I wouldn't pick coomers as a "deserving" demographic to be grifted. Then again, I suppose one of the hardest things to reconcile about game development of any kind is that costs scale up incredibly quickly, and the price demanded by "necessary expenses" will naturally diverge further and further from what a player would consider a fair cost of entry.
As an aside, I really feel as though the art "downgrade" (which I agree it looks worse than Luna in the Tavern) looks like a "bimbofied" version of Luna; strongly reminds me of the designs of SubSupreme, if anyone knows that dev.